Joe Dumars?

#31
I don't know if anyone has posted this or not, but we do have to give credit where credit is due.

Dumars became the Pistons' president of basketball operations prior to the start of the 2000–01 season.[3] He was voted the league's Executive of the Year for the 2002–03 season and quietly went on to build the team that won the 2004 NBA championship. With the win, Dumars became the first African-American executive to lead a team to an NBA championship.[4][5] During the 2005–06 season, the Pistons had its best regular season record in franchise history (64–18).[6] The Pistons made it to the Eastern Conference Finals six straight years (2003–2008) under Dumars' watch.[7] This streak would come to an end in the 2008–09 season when the Pistons were swept in the first round by the Cleveland Cavaliers.[8]

Now he may have made a few mistakes along the way, but we can't discard all the great moves he made. No one is perfect
Agreed. I'm done with taking a "flyer" on inexperienced GM's (thinking outside the "box"). Give me someone with experience and know-how of the NBA and someone with respect from other GM's and agents and the Kings may be able to get into some deals that help improve the team.

Other teams were probably trying to avoid working with Vlade and PDA during theses years, because they didn't know what they were doing. How many salary dumps deals and three team deals passed us by all these summers? Having a respected GM running the FO should help the Kings broker some deals and that hopefully improve the Kings. NBA agents also respect and have relationships with Joe Dumars, so that would help getting some talent through the doors..
 
#32
I would like to see Dumars with a significant role. Until I start seeing his face more than Peja's, or reading a quote from Dumars then this may just be a shuffling of titles as a PR move to make it seem like the team is taking action.
 
#33
The real gm link has a total of four sentences. It doesn't say more than 'increased role', which is obviously very vague. It does say he has a trust and synergy with Divac, so doubtful he is a second Brandon Williams who seemed to go behind Vlade's/ DJ's back at least once. I don't pay for the Athletic and imagine there is some form of content there.

If he does have more influence here, cool. I really liked the Pistons of the mid 2000's. He made good free agent signings (e.g. Billups) and trades (e.g. Stackhouse for Rip, nobody for Sheed) to assemble that team. Also, looking at his draft history, based on a pretty reasonable sample size, the majority of his picks outperform their draft position in win shares. Upwards.
There now a second Real GM article. To me this one also appears to be public relations spin.

Link---> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/259143/Kings-Expected-To-Retain-Vlade-Divac

For those of you voicing support for Dumars and all the things he will do, keep this in mind. The Kings hired him in June of 2019.

Link---> https://bleacherreport.com/articles...ded-to-front-office-as-adviser-to-vlade-divac

Prior to being hired by the Kings Dumars was President of Independent Sports which represents ball players including DMC.

Dumars has been here a year or so. What has he done?
 
#34
Just bring Hinkie in and tear it all down. We need massive roster reconstruction, take a few years, acquire assets, hopefully have a several year playoff run after rebuilding.

Hopefully most of ya'll saw the outcome of bringing in overpaid vets, trying to push etc.

We are probably going to be bottom 2-3 in the West anyways next season.
 
#35
Just bring Hinkie in and tear it all down. We need massive roster reconstruction, take a few years, acquire assets, hopefully have a several year playoff run after rebuilding.

Hopefully most of ya'll saw the outcome of bringing in overpaid vets, trying to push etc.

We are probably going to be bottom 2-3 in the West anyways next season.
Unfortunately I don't think most on this board saw this outcome. Hopefully the people that have been label "haters" for foreseeing this outcome are still around on kingsfans.com
 
#36
I say send a boatload of cash jerry west’s way as an advisor role. He did it for the lakers, he did it for the grizz, and he did it for the clippers. Vlade keeps his title as puppet gm but gets advice from someone who knows what they’re doing and I believe he respects. Last I heard, his only advice to the kings was to hire some coach named Mike Malone.
 
#37
Having read the Athletics article on the Kings and Amick mentioned that teams are starting to add to their GM roles with another guy involved to supplement the decision making. Clippers are already doing it and maybe Dumars is also assisting.....maybe Brandon Williams was that guy too.

For me, I’m not sure I’d want Dumars and Vlade together. Look what Marks has done in Brooklyn. He was a new voice and IIRC, it was his first time as the head guy there. Instead of just going with the convenient guy in Dumars, the Kings should be exploring options for a More modern guy, a fresh voice and perspective.
 
#39
Just bring Hinkie in and tear it all down. We need massive roster reconstruction, take a few years, acquire assets, hopefully have a several year playoff run after rebuilding.

Hopefully most of ya'll saw the outcome of bringing in overpaid vets, trying to push etc.

We are probably going to be bottom 2-3 in the West anyways next season.
Yep. The thing is, if we went for it this off-season, we could really expedite the process, while already having a 22 year old franchise cornerstone. Between Bjelica, Holmes, Buddy, Bogi (RFA S&T) can get 1st round picks or some valuable rebuilding assets. We have the 12th pick coming this year, and 3 more 2nd round picks. Suck for a few years, manage our cap space to acquire rebuilding assets and build this thing right.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#40
There now a second Real GM article. To me this one also appears to be public relations spin.

Link---> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/259143/Kings-Expected-To-Retain-Vlade-Divac

For those of you voicing support for Dumars and all the things he will do, keep this in mind. The Kings hired him in June of 2019.

Link---> https://bleacherreport.com/articles...ded-to-front-office-as-adviser-to-vlade-divac

Prior to being hired by the Kings Dumars was President of Independent Sports which represents ball players including DMC.

Dumars has been here a year or so. What has he done?
Vivek was a minority owner of the Warriors, and was there when the Warriors brought in Jerry West as an advisor. We all saw the result of that. It appears that Dumars was brought in, in a similar capacity. Meaning he was asked to observe, make suggestions. He wasn't given any role of authority, at least not officially. That could all change, or not. But it's ridiculous to criticize him for not doing anything, when he probably wasn't in an official position of authority.
 
#41
The truly scary thing is, the truly innovative FOs are going to be feasting on dinosaur FOs like the Kings this year. Shortened college hoops season, covid, a lack of star power in the draft. Instead of taking (high risk) players (that require a fair amount of projection), can totally see Vlade and company trading for middle of the road vets. Get ready for the Kings trading their first and seconds for Julius Randle and Joe Harris while the Spurs and Warriors draft future Draymonds and Kawahis.
 
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SLAB

Hall of Famer
#42
The truly scary thing is, the truly innovative FOs are going to be feasting on dinosaur FOs like the Kings this year. Shortened college hoops season, covid, a lack of star power in the draft. Instead of taking (high risk) players (that require a fair amount of projection), can totally see Vlade and company trading for middle of the road vets. Get ready for the Kings trading their first and seconds for Julius Randle and Joe Harris while the Spurs and Warriors draft future Draymonds and Kawahis.
Dude, we’re good. I’m sure Vlade has eyes dead set on another PapaG.
 
#43
The truly scary thing is, the truly innovative FOs are going to be feasting on dinosaur FOs like the Kings this year. Shortened college hoops season, covid, a lack of star power in the draft. Instead of taking (high risk) players (that require a fair amount of projection), can totally see Vlade and company trading for middle of the road vets. Get ready for the Kings trading their first and seconds for Julius Randle and Joe Harris while the Spurs and Warriors draft future Draymonds and Kawahis.
What's sad is that route is probably better for the Kings long-term rather than relying on Vlade's draft record. At least Joe Harris and Julius Randle are good players; he's 1/8 in 1st round picks during his tenure.
 
#44
Just came in here with a friendly reminder: Dumars was 2003 Executive of the year and quietly built the 2004 Championship team. And the Pistons team had gone to the Eastern Conference Finals six straight years (2003–2008) under Dumars' watch.

Not trying to change anyone's mind on Dumars because I can't say I'm convinced either. But just for what's worth since so many of you had brought up his mistakes. Fair is fair.
 
#45
Just came in here with a friendly reminder: Dumars was 2003 Executive of the year and quietly built the 2004 Championship team. And the Pistons team had gone to the Eastern Conference Finals six straight years (2003–2008) under Dumars' watch.

Not trying to change anyone's mind on Dumars because I can't say I'm convinced either. But just for what's worth since so many of you had brought up his mistakes. Fair is fair.
It sure was a long, long time ago and that worries me.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#46
The truly scary thing is, the truly innovative FOs are going to be feasting on dinosaur FOs like the Kings this year. Shortened college hoops season, covid, a lack of star power in the draft. Instead of taking (high risk) players (that require a fair amount of projection), can totally see Vlade and company trading for middle of the road vets. Get ready for the Kings trading their first and seconds for Julius Randle and Joe Harris while the Spurs and Warriors draft future Draymonds and Kawahis.
I have no idea how the Kings look at Randle, who is a good basketball player on the right team. But Joe Harris, who I love by the way, is an unrestricted free agent at the end of this season. So if you want him you'll have sign him, not trade for him.
 
#47
Vivek was a minority owner of the Warriors, and was there when the Warriors brought in Jerry West as an advisor. We all saw the result of that. It appears that Dumars was brought in, in a similar capacity. Meaning he was asked to observe, make suggestions. He wasn't given any role of authority, at least not officially. That could all change, or not. But it's ridiculous to criticize him for not doing anything, when he probably wasn't in an official position of authority.
Did I criticize him:) I will say when I looked at his draft picks I was not impressed. He must have made some good trades and signings because his Pistons teams could rumble with the best of them.

To be honest I prefer a younger GM with some front office experience.
 
#48
Did I criticize him:) I will say when I looked at his draft picks I was not impressed. He must have made some good trades and signings because his Pistons teams could rumble with the best of them.

To be honest I prefer a younger GM with some front office experience.
If you look at the link in the first post more than half of his picks out performed their position based on win shares. I am sure he had some misses as you would expect with someone who has several years of experience.

If your criteria is young with front office experience then you should be at least half pleased as he ticks one of those boxes :)
 
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#49


The Kings have vacillated between being a hard-luck franchise to one that was subject to all the jokes and ridicule befitting of one without banners or respect, missing the playoffs the last 14 seasons. They need credibility, experience and savvy in the worst way.

Continue reading...
 
#52


The Kings have vacillated between being a hard-luck franchise to one that was subject to all the jokes and ridicule befitting of one without banners or respect, missing the playoffs the last 14 seasons. They need credibility, experience and savvy in the worst way.

Continue reading...
IMHO, I think Joe Dumars would be the best choice for GM for the Kings. He has experience and has built a championship team in a small/mid market town. His teams made the Eastern Conference Title series for six straight years (2003-2008). He knows how to build a team from the ground up and keep them in contention for a very long time.

Seeing that he has been around the Kings this season and going into a very strange and condensed free agency period and draft, he will know the Kings roster strengths and weaknesses better than anyone that would be brought in this late in the game.

For all the Harry Giles fans, I think that Dumars would be the most likely GM to try and bring Giles back to the Kings. Giles stats don't jump out at you and to know his value to the team and the city's fans, you have to have been around the team this year. Otherwise, any new GM would likely cast Giles aside to try and lure bigger names in free agency.

Dumars has connections to other GMs and player agents and is a known commodity in the NBA. That alone will get him a seat or a phone call on potential deals and trades, that Vlade and PDA would never have gotten. The chances of the Kings attracting a more qualified GM to replace Vlade is pretty slim. I'm done with taking flyers on inexperienced GM's like PDA and Vlade, give me some NBA know-how and acumen.
 
#53
His free agent signings record is pretty poor. Trying to put Josh Smith at SF and Greg Monroe at PF doesn't inspire hope for his ability to adjust to today's nba.

His experience is theoretically an upgrade on Vlade, but we have to hope that he has adapted his views as the NBA has changed. Which means we have to hope Joe Dumars will GM unlike Joe Dumars.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#54
Did I criticize him:) I will say when I looked at his draft picks I was not impressed. He must have made some good trades and signings because his Pistons teams could rumble with the best of them.

To be honest I prefer a younger GM with some front office experience.
Not to nit pick, but here is your quote: "Dumars has been here a year or so. What has he done?"
 
#56


The Kings have vacillated between being a hard-luck franchise to one that was subject to all the jokes and ridicule befitting of one without banners or respect, missing the playoffs the last 14 seasons. They need credibility, experience and savvy in the worst way.

Continue reading...
So the only person who is in the same category as Dumars is Jerry West. That’s some distortion. But will be happy to eat crow if he ends bing worthy of being compared to West.
 
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#57
IMHO, I think Joe Dumars would be the best choice for GM for the Kings. He has experience and has built a championship team in a small/mid market town. His teams made the Eastern Conference Title series for six straight years (2003-2008). He knows how to build a team from the ground up and keep them in contention for a very long time.

Seeing that he has been around the Kings this season and going into a very strange and condensed free agency period and draft, he will know the Kings roster strengths and weaknesses better than anyone that would be brought in this late in the game.

For all the Harry Giles fans, I think that Dumars would be the most likely GM to try and bring Giles back to the Kings. Giles stats don't jump out at you and to know his value to the team and the city's fans, you have to have been around the team this year. Otherwise, any new GM would likely cast Giles aside to try and lure bigger names in free agency.

Dumars has connections to other GMs and player agents and is a known commodity in the NBA. That alone will get him a seat or a phone call on potential deals and trades, that Vlade and PDA would never have gotten. The chances of the Kings attracting a more qualified GM to replace Vlade is pretty slim. I'm done with taking flyers on inexperienced GM's like PDA and Vlade, give me some NBA know-how and acumen.
This team is largely built at this point and it's foundational core is still fairly young or really young. The right GM and coach at this point is dictated by what's already here. Dumars or anyone better paint a very clear picture as to how this works and it better look like nothing we've seen in this bubble. Vivek can't choose anyone who thinks of basketball in any pure sense. The only question is how you turn this core into stars.

One concern I'm seeing is one I kind of alluded to with not hiring a Hinkie type. Dumars might take all next year to look at things. Really? C'mon man, you're probably being scammed again Vivek, wake up. Don't let someone sweet talk you into another 5 year contract just so they can get 4 years paid without even being here. LOL. This is basically the same thing Vlade did except at the start I think he honestly didn't want to be GM but once that ball is rolling under anyone, it's kind of impossible to jump off that moving train. If you want different be different. If Joe or anyone is "interim" consider the route you're taking and move on. The biggest issue with this organization is actually probably the various departments. From media, to management, to ESPECIALLY scouting. That's where you can fix things regardless of who is GM.
 
#58
So the only person who is in the same category as Dumars is Jerry West. That’s some distortion. But will be happy to eat crow if he ends bing worthy of being compared to West.
Well, this will be Dumars real proving ground. Just like Walton, now the real test begins. Fail that and you've cemented your legacy. Jerry West has proven worthy in more than one franchise. In fact, he's been great wherever he's gone for the most part. Joe could be a one hit wonder with that Pistons team. When it came to building his own vision he did an even worse job than Vlade so.... we shall see. He does have a history of GM'ing a ring out of it though so that's something. In the end it could very well be like comparing an outhouse to the Taj Mahal. Sure, technically their buildings but one is specifically used for a purpose that nobody is proud of.