Jimmer

[dustnroses]

I'm a Suns fan, lived in Arizona almost all of my life, but I went to high school in Sacramento (Franklin HS in Elk Grove) and enjoyed watching the Kings a lot when I was there....they became my second favorite team, even though they're in the same division as PHX.

Anyways, I was super excited when they got Jimmer, as I'd watched a lot of him at BYU and felt like he definitely had NBA range, and was such a great shooter/scorer that even though his size/build wasn't perfect for the NBA game, he would survive because of his amazing BBall smarts, and skills.

It's been so frustrating to see how Keith Smart uses him, though. He has made Jimmer adjust his game, making Jimmer adapt to the kings (smart's) style....and then fans wonder why Jimmer isn't doing well, and criticize him....it's so stupid, and really makes me question Keith Smart's 'smarts'. He has one of the best shooters in the league, arguably. Someone who can create his own shot. But watching the Kings play, it's clear that he doesn't let jimmer BE JIMMER. What do you guys think? I always check the box scores, and he's getting like, 5 minutes or less per game. He didn't get ANY playing time tonight! (against the Pacers.) Do you guys like Jimmer? If not, why? Do you think he just "sucks", or do you have any real reasons? Do any of you agree that Keith Smart just isn't using him the right way?

I think if he gets traded or winds up playing for another team, and they use him the right way, he can be a 20 ppg guy in this league, I really believe that.

 

[VF21]

Welcome to KF. There are tons of threads about Jimmer, what we think of him, how we think he's been used, etc. In fact, the topic has been constant since the day we traded down our draft pick to get him.

Jimmer could easily be one of those NBA players who, despite lighting it up in college, just never make it in the NBA. I wanted to like him - hell, I even bought one of his jerseys - but as yet he hasn't shown me much...

 

[DesertFox]

Jimmer hasn't been able to consistently create his own shot, and has been average at best as a shooter. He has been worse than advertised as a ball handler (would rather have JT take it up court), and as expected on defense (lots of effort no results).

Smart has issues, but Jimmer wouldn't solve any of them. If Jimmer was a great shooter I could see some use next to Reke, but he has not been. Jimmer has done better dribbling to shoot rather than catch and shoot, not what this team needs.

 

[tyreeeke]

I'm a Suns fan, lived in Arizona almost all of my life, but I went to high school in Sacramento (Franklin HS in Elk Grove) and enjoyed watching the Kings a lot when I was there....they became my second favorite team, even though they're in the same division as PHX.

Anyways, I was super excited when they got Jimmer, as I'd watched a lot of him at BYU and felt like he definitely had NBA range, and was such a great shooter/scorer that even though his size/build wasn't perfect for the NBA game, he would survive because of his amazing BBall smarts, and skills.

It's been so frustrating to see how Keith Smart uses him, though. He has made Jimmer adjust his game, making Jimmer adapt to the kings (smart's) style....and then fans wonder why Jimmer isn't doing well, and criticize him....it's so stupid, and really makes me question Keith Smart's 'smarts'. He has one of the best shooters in the league, arguably. Someone who can create his own shot. But watching the Kings play, it's clear that he doesn't let jimmer BE JIMMER. What do you guys think? I always check the box scores, and he's getting like, 5 minutes or less per game. He didn't get ANY playing time tonight! (against the Pacers.) Do you guys like Jimmer? If not, why? Do you think he just "sucks", or do you have any real reasons? Do any of you agree that Keith Smart just isn't using him the right way?

I think if he gets traded or winds up playing for another team, and they use him the right way, he can be a 20 ppg guy in this league, I really believe that.

I agree 100%, I too truly believe Jimmer is a great talent wasting away in Sacramento. I hope one day he gets a real opportunity to shine, not just an opportunity for a few minutes here and there. Jimmer, like most players, needs free reign without looking over his shoulder worrying about being benched. I truly believe Jimmer is the 3rd best player on this team behind Reke and Cuz but he is being blackballed by the team, IMO. Cousins will flatout refuse to give him the ball at times. I think he's the only white player on the team and definitely the only one that ever plays. I don't know what to think.

 

[tyreeeke]

Welcome to KF. There are tons of threads about Jimmer, what we think of him, how we think he's been used, etc. In fact, the topic has been constant since the day we traded down our draft pick to get him.

Jimmer could easily be one of those NBA players who, despite lighting it up in college, just never make it in the NBA. I wanted to like him - hell, I even bought one of his jerseys - but as yet he hasn't shown me much...

Jimmer can't show you anything sitting on the bench or playing sporadic limited minutes.

 

[rexb_kings]

was it Keith Smart that benched Jeremy Lin in Warriors?

 

[VF21]

Jimmer can't show you anything sitting on the bench or playing sporadic limited minutes.

No, and he's obviously not doing much in practice or we'd be hearing about it. Sorry, but he has failed to impress almost every single time he's been on the court. I was really hopeful that he would pan out but it just might not be in the cards. He's a good kid and I like him but I just don't think he has much longer to turn it around. And, contrary to what you and other Jimmer fans think, it's on HIM. The hungry ones find a way to get onto the court.

 

[VF21]

I agree 100%, I too truly believe Jimmer is a great talent wasting away in Sacramento. I hope one day he gets a real opportunity to shine, not just an opportunity for a few minutes here and there. Jimmer, like most players, needs free reign without looking over his shoulder worrying about being benched. I truly believe Jimmer is the 3rd best player on this team behind Reke and Cuz but he is being blackballed by the team, IMO. Cousins will flatout refuse to give him the ball at times. I think he's the only white player on the team and definitely the only one that ever plays. I don't know what to think.

Please do not even think about making this about race. It's not true, it's not cool and it's not acceptable around here.

 

[mac]

I agree 100%, I too truly believe Jimmer is a great talent wasting away in Sacramento. I hope one day he gets a real opportunity to shine, not just an opportunity for a few minutes here and there. Jimmer, like most players, needs free reign without looking over his shoulder worrying about being benched. I truly believe Jimmer is the 3rd best player on this team behind Reke and Cuz but he is being blackballed by the team, IMO. Cousins will flatout refuse to give him the ball at times. I think he's the only white player on the team and definitely the only one that ever plays. I don't know what to think.

Welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Bricklayer]

I had generally assumed that the Jimmermania balloon had been punctured and we weren't going to see any more of these threads. It does so fill me with heartwarming joy to see that I was mistaken.

 

[bajaden]

I had generally assumed that the Jimmermania balloon had been punctured and we weren't going to see any more of these threads. It does so fill me with heartwarming joy to see that I was mistaken.

So, you do have a heart!

 

[UK_King]

Some of the conspiracy theories that these jimmer only fans have are getting increasingly wild, and increasingly silly.

 

[pshn80]

Jimmer can't show you anything sitting on the bench or playing sporadic limited minutes.

.....and the team can't afford to play him the minutes he needs to score. His foot speed or lack thereof is a fact that puts a damper on a full useful career. On a very good team he could be a good spot scorer but too slow for more. Good luck Jimmer.

 

[allrightythen]

.....and the team can't afford to play him the minutes he needs to score. His foot speed or lack thereof is a fact that puts a damper on a full useful career. On a very good team he could be a good spot scorer but too slow for more. Good luck Jimmer.

Seriously, they'd be 0-3 right now with Jimmer out there.

 

[baller13]

Jimmer can play offense, i have no doubt about this. The problem is while he has improved he is still not a very good defender. As you have seen our defense had been very good thus year and jimmer does not fit in with that. I would like to see him get a few minutes though just so he stays in rhythm but at this point he only about a 10 min guy at best.

 

[tyreeeke]

Players who were labeled bad 'individual' defenders...(team defense is what wins titles)

Magic Johnson (He himself said he was)

Nash (Two time MVP)

Dirk (MVP, finals MVP, etc)

Tony Parker

Mike Bibby (your very own)

POINT BEING, defense is a team concept. Offense is a team concept. If someone has to cover for Jimmer if he is beaten defensively...SO WHAT. Jimmer has the skills to cover for the horrible offensive players on this team. This is a TEAM game. They cover him. He covers them. See how that works?

 

[ESP47]

Players who were labeled bad 'individual' defenders...(team defense is what wins titles)

Magic Johnson (He himself said he was)

Nash (Two time MVP)

Dirk (MVP, finals MVP, etc)

Tony Parker

Mike Bibby (your very own)

POINT BEING, defense is a team concept. Offense is a team concept. If someone has to cover for Jimmer if he is beaten defensively...SO WHAT. Jimmer has the skills to cover for the horrible offensive players on this team. This is a TEAM game. They cover him. He covers them. See how that works?

The offense of those players was/is miles beyond what their defense lacked. Jimmer's defense at this point is so bad that he needs to have an above average offensive game just to break even with how bad he defense is. Problem is, he hardly ever has above average offensive games.

 

[tyreeeke]

Interesting take on why Jimmer isn't playing...

"I have no idea why he chooses not to play Jimmer but it may have something to do with Steve Alford. Twenty-five years ago, Smart had to subordinate his own high-flying college career to Alford, a good-looking, articulate, popular white kid (can I say that?) who could really shoot. Smart may have hit the NCAA tournament winning shot but Alford was the reason that Indiana was even in the game and he was a media darling who then had a mediocre pro career. I don't think Smart can let go of Steve Alford and Jimmer will sit on the bench until either he is traded or Smart is fired--that simple."

 

[Singhisking]

Players who were labeled bad 'individual' defenders...(team defense is what wins titles)

Magic Johnson (He himself said he was)

Nash (Two time MVP)

Dirk (MVP, finals MVP, etc)

Tony Parker

Mike Bibby (your very own)

POINT BEING, defense is a team concept. Offense is a team concept. If someone has to cover for Jimmer if he is beaten defensively...SO WHAT. Jimmer has the skills to cover for the horrible offensive players on this team. This is a TEAM game. They cover him. He covers them. See how that works?

How dare you compare Jimmer with these great, proven HOF caliber players. Try to better Isaih Thomas, The 60th pick first.

 

[Padrino]

Interesting take on why Jimmer isn't playing...

"I have no idea why he chooses not to play Jimmer but it may have something to do with Steve Alford. Twenty-five years ago, Smart had to subordinate his own high-flying college career to Alford, a good-looking, articulate, popular white kid (can I say that?) who could really shoot. Smart may have hit the NCAA tournament winning shot but Alford was the reason that Indiana was even in the game and he was a media darling who then had a mediocre pro career. I don't think Smart can let go of Steve Alford and Jimmer will sit on the bench until either he is traded or Smart is fired--that simple."

while i am certainly no defender of keith smart's gameplan thus far in his sacramento tenure, i just love that people would actually accuse a black coach of reverse racism in defense of a deep bench scrub like jimmer...

its just... well, its... i can't...

if jimmer were truly the great white hope, if he were, say, the second coming of john stockton, it'd be one thing. but he's not. and he probably never will be. i'll say it again, in a guard rotation that already includes tyreke evans, marcus thornton, aaron brooks, and isaiah thomas, jimmer is the odd man out, and its not even close. you wanna blame someone for jimmer's playing time? blame the maloofs and geoff petrie, who crowded the kings backcourt with players who were always gonna rise well above jimmer in the pecking order, stifling his opportunity to grow...

 

[Hadlowe]

Interesting take on why Jimmer isn't playing...

"I have no idea why he chooses not to play Jimmer but it may have something to do with Steve Alford. Twenty-five years ago, Smart had to subordinate his own high-flying college career to Alford, a good-looking, articulate, popular white kid (can I say that?) who could really shoot. Smart may have hit the NCAA tournament winning shot but Alford was the reason that Indiana was even in the game and he was a media darling who then had a mediocre pro career. I don't think Smart can let go of Steve Alford and Jimmer will sit on the bench until either he is traded or Smart is fired--that simple."

That's not an interesting take, that's pure hogwash. There isn't some psychological grudge match between Smart and "random white guy". Smart is a coach who specializes in suspect rotations and making poor use of his personnel. Does the fact that Tyreke is struggling under Smart mean that Smart has it in for U of Memphis graduates? No, it has to do with Tyreke being played out of position and having the ball out of his hands.

I am as big a Jimmer fan (and apologist) as exists on this board. I wouldn't have started watching Kings basketball if they hadn't drafted him. But Jimmer has been less than stellar. He isn't as bad as most people make him out to be, but his over-the-top fans do him no favors by insisting that the coach hates him.

Very simply, Smart has no idea what to do with any of his personnel and it shows in his rotations and play-calling. Hayes as the tallest man on the court? Cousins shooting threes? Evans waiting in a corner? Thornton guarding Tayshaun Prince? James Johnson iso plays out of a time-out? T-Rob 18 foot jumpers? Installing a triangle offense without a 3-point shooting small forward? That Smart has no idea how to utilize Jimmer is hardly surprising.

 

[rainmaker]

Wow.

A Jimmer troll posted the same blurb last year as well, about Smart not playing him because Jimmer's white. It's unbelievable. So instead of looking objectively at Jimmer's poor production since he's been drafted, we're now looking for excuses beyond the basketball court, and looking at skin color?

This crap from Jimmer fanboys does nothing to help Jimmer. Just like last year when his brother blasted Smart on twitter and Jimmer ended up having to apologize to the team for it. I actually feel sorry for Jimmer. Just let him concentrate on improving his game. His fanbase is absolutely ridiculous and can't make his transition to the NBA game any easier.

Coming on here and acting like this team would be playoff caliber if we only started Jimmer and played him 30+ per night is not only loony, but it's the crap much of his fanbase seems to think. Then making it a racial situation, as if that's the problem, is even worse.

It's pretty damn simple. Jimmer has a fair amount of work to do to become an NBA rotation player. I think his best bet if playing off the ball in spurts, as he simply can't handle the pressure opposing PG's put on him. If Tyreeeeke didn't see the way teams scouted him last year, and pressed the hell out of him to where he struggled to even bring the ball past halfcourt, let alone set up and run the offense, and instead are saying he's not good, but a great ballhandler, there's really nothing to talk about. Then when you bring race into it, I've lost any and all respect for you.

BTW, do you think any of us don't want Jimmer to succeed? To be a better player? It would only either a) make our team better or b) increase his value and bring us more in return if we trade him.

 

[Spike]

BTW, do you think any of us don't want Jimmer to succeed? To be a better player? It would only either a) make our team better or b) increase his value and bring us more in return if we trade him.

Testify. Ultimately, what we care about is wins. Anyone who can get us there is golden. Simply put, if Jimmer would show what we need of him given his minutes, he would earn more minutes. As it stands, IT is looking like he might lose some minutes. There's the opening Jimmer needs, but he needs to deliver.

 

[tyreeeke]

while i am certainly no defender of keith smart's gameplan thus far in his sacramento tenure, i just love that people would actually accuse a black coach of reverse racism in defense of a deep bench scrub like jimmer...

its just... well, its... i can't...

if jimmer were truly the great white hope, if he were, say, the second coming of john stockton, it'd be one thing. but he's not. and he probably never will be. i'll say it again, in a guard rotation that already includes tyreke evans, marcus thornton, aaron brooks, and isaiah thomas, jimmer is the odd man out, and its not even close. you wanna blame someone for jimmer's playing time? blame the maloofs and geoff petrie, who crowded the kings backcourt with players who were always gonna rise well above jimmer in the pecking order, stifling his opportunity to grow...

I like the videos, quite funny lol. However, you lost me when you stated the Jimmer's not even close to the other point guards on this team...that is laughable and it seems like a troll attempt. The PG play has been poor, be realistic.

 

[tyreeeke]

That's not an interesting take, that's pure hogwash. There isn't some psychological grudge match between Smart and "random white guy". Smart is a coach who specializes in suspect rotations and making poor use of his personnel. Does the fact that Tyreke is struggling under Smart mean that Smart has it in for U of Memphis graduates? No, it has to do with Tyreke being played out of position and having the ball out of his hands.

I am as big a Jimmer fan (and apologist) as exists on this board. I wouldn't have started watching Kings basketball if they hadn't drafted him. But Jimmer has been less than stellar. He isn't as bad as most people make him out to be, but his over-the-top fans do him no favors by insisting that the coach hates him.

Very simply, Smart has no idea what to do with any of his personnel and it shows in his rotations and play-calling. Hayes as the tallest man on the court? Cousins shooting threes? Evans waiting in a corner? Thornton guarding Tayshaun Prince? James Johnson iso plays out of a time-out? T-Rob 18 foot jumpers? Installing a triangle offense without a 3-point shooting small forward? That Smart has no idea how to utilize Jimmer is hardly surprising.

Fair enough. Good post.

 

[Gliesian]

If only Beno was black... sigh.
In all seriousness though, I kind of agree that Jimmer didn't get a a large number of chances to showcase himself, but enough was enough. It was painful to watch. The team also did seem to stand around when Jimmer had the ball relative to the other guards, but maybe it's because he was bad. That being said, it's not going to happen until Jimmer plays perfectly and consistently coming off the bench.

 

[dustnroses]

No, and he's obviously not doing much in practice or we'd be hearing about it. Sorry, but he has failed to impress almost every single time he's been on the court. I was really hopeful that he would pan out but it just might not be in the cards. He's a good kid and I like him but I just don't think he has much longer to turn it around. And, contrary to what you and other Jimmer fans think, it's on HIM. The hungry ones find a way to get onto the court.

I think the reason for this is that he is worried about being benched, and that's making him play with a constant fear, that if he misses a shot he'll get taken out. I really believe that if coach Smart let him start, or made him 6th man, telling him it doesn't matter what his FG% is, he won't be taken out if he misses a few shots, that he'd play a lot better....but it would be hard for anyone to play well if they were constantly worried about being yanked off the floor for not being perfect.

 

[sdballer]

I think the reason for this is that he is worried about being benched, and that's making him play with a constant fear, that if he misses a shot he'll get taken out. I really believe that if coach Smart let him start, or made him 6th man, telling him it doesn't matter what his FG% is, he won't be taken out if he misses a few shots, that he'd play a lot better....but it would be hard for anyone to play well if they were constantly worried about being yanked off the floor for not being perfect.

Here is the problem: he is awful at defense, can't dribble and doesn't pass well. You can't just give him a green light and tell him
Not to worry about missed shots when he is also bad at everything else.

 

[jdbraver]

Here is the problem: he is awful at defense, can't dribble and doesn't pass well. You can't just give him a green light and tell him
Not to worry about missed shots when he is also bad at everything else.

You are right, at most he will only be able to function in catch and shoot situations. But his defense and ball handling are beyond awful. How many times does hw leave his feet without a clue where he is going. It's like watching aau.

 

[dustnroses]

You are right, at most he will only be able to function in catch and shoot situations. But his defense and ball handling are beyond awful. How many times does hw leave his feet without a clue where he is going. It's like watching aau.

That's true, I hate when he does that...I, as well as many others I'm sure, was taught at a young age to never leave my feet unless I was going to shoot, or knew what my next move was....this is something that is hammered into kids heads at a very young age....but Jimmer's not the only one I see do it at the NBA level...in fact I was watching the Suns/Heat game tonight and Dragic did it...he was out at the corner 3, got the ball, ran in baseline and around the hoop he jumped up in the air, and THEN looked for a pass...he ended up throwing it back towards the free throw line but there was no one in the immediate area and it resulted in a turnover. But back on topic, i think it IS necessary to give him the green light, like sdballer said, without fear of retribution from the coach, in order for him to do well...I have no doubt in my mind that the reason he's playing poorly (MOST of the time...can't say all the time...sometimes people just have bad nights..) is because he's afraid of making coach mad, losing playing time, etc.