Isaiah Thomas
- Thread starter VF21
- Start date
king4life89
G-League
really steping his game up lets keep him starting he keeps the ball moving and finds players open all the time..i just dont understand why kieth smart keeep salmons in the crunch time he needs to keep the starting unit put jt bak in salmons takes energy outa all our other players sit his as down!as for thomas i love the little fella
Dime Dropper
All-Star
Big shame we lost this one. Thomas deserved the win tonight for a great game. He is fearless and has the mentality of a winner. He's a keeper for certain and he makes his teammates better, which is all you can ask for. Feel really sorry for him tonight because he deserved the victory.
KevinSalvadori
Bench
IT= the sleeper. As in the sleeper pick the league overlooks who later excels.
KevinSalvadori
Bench
Amen. And our assists evaporated when Reke went back to running point in the mid 3rd-early 4th. Total assists during that time? 0.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
This hasn't been about IT vs. Reke, althouh the prevailing dumbness will make it that. Its been about IT vs. Salmons, the man he replaced. And there its obviosuly a huge gain in passing/ballhandling. Just a question of the cost in touches to the other guys.
UK_King
Starter
If we're winning it really shouldn't matter about "touches" (i know we're losing so it becomes relevant) But hypothetically if we persevere with I.T and we start to pick up wins (let's face it we've been close) I really don't care that Tyreke/MT get 6 less touches a game. Basketball is about winning. It's down to the coach to put the ball in the hands of the people that will help us win.
If I.T is that man, then so be it.
If I.T is that man, then so be it.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
The argument obviously would be that not enough touches to go around = no chance to consistently win, now or in the future.
IT really is built like a 6th man. He comes in and he thinks the game is about him. And that's great for a 6th man. Comes in and immediately just tries to muscle the game as an impact guy. But you can only have so many of those guys on the court at once. Its the same constant need for roleplayers we always have. Guys willing and able to step back and contribute without the ball. That's not IT. We don't go from needing roleplayers around Reke, Thornton and Cousins, to sticking in a guy who might be even more aggressive and ball dominant. And the thing is, to the degree its not long term, its kind of disruptive to our growth together. There is so much IT in the mix that the slow steady hard work of developing chemistry between Reke, Thornton and Cousins gets disrupted. Everyone gets on Reke about reps for his jumper. Well its the same thing for reps as a team. That's why the old expereinced teams who have played together are always so much more efficent. Done it 1000 times.
And that's not anti-IT. Barring an epic collapse, with a performance like this last one he should have guaranteed his future as a top bencher at least. Its just, as always, about mix and chemistry in lineups. We were getting better. Being held back by Salmons, and the bench more than anything else. Worst SF and least effective bench in the league.
J
jdbraver
Guest
10+ assists and the games about him? I think on a decent team he's 6th man too,but come on.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Yes, 10+ assists and the game's about him.
Actually the irony of many people's "ball dominant" complaints is that PGs are basically ALL ball dominators anyway, even the passing ones, which IT is not (his overall Ast and TO% are almost identical to Reke). Steve Nash is one of the most ball dominant players in the league. He could not be Steve Nash if he weren't. But Isiah is particulalry heavy about it, expecially as we were using him. We went through stretches where every single play involved him, inside and out, as a passer and shooter. FAR more ball/usage heavy than we had Salmons being by the end of his starting stints., who was jsut staying out of the way.
When IT comes in he plays at his pace, he is the guy on the ball, he is the guy making all the decisions. Its his pace, his rhythm, not anybody else's. If he does that at a triple double pace, well ok, althoguh even then with nobody else going we again score 92 on 38% shooting and lose. But its a huge strain on an already strained system. We already have three guys taking 60% of our shots and probably controlling the ball 60% of the time. If you have IT playing this huge a role, it becomes dicey. Until late int he game, when he became more of a passer, nobody could get into any rhtyhm except Isiah.
And again note: many/most PGs would have some of that same issue. And there is nothing inherently wrong with playing that way. But it needs the right situation. Too many cooks and all that.
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Kingster
Hall of Famer
What a great player for this team. We haven't seen these kind of passes since Vlade, but these passes are done while on the move. He's the best passer I've ever seen on the Kings. He's making his teamates better. Now his teamates must start moving without the ball rather than standing and watching his magical moves on the court. When they move without the ball on a regular basis, he's going to start finding them more, and they'll start winning more.
There is going to be an adjustment period for the coach and the players. IT is like a big boulder that has been dropped into the pond. There are some major ripple effects because of his new role as the primary ballhandler. It may be painful for some, but at the end of the day it's going to be all good.
There is going to be an adjustment period for the coach and the players. IT is like a big boulder that has been dropped into the pond. There are some major ripple effects because of his new role as the primary ballhandler. It may be painful for some, but at the end of the day it's going to be all good.
UK_King
Starter
And it all comes down to team construction.
Lets face it Isaiah is way ahead of schedule, and he's been forced to be, because no one else on our team has the skills 'run' a team.
If all your players need the ball to get "in rhythm" then there's a problem.
we hardly ever swing the ball, just to do it. If you watch a team like the Celtics (I know, stuffed full of vets) they will just swing the ball and let a play emerge, our plays are generally I.T to Cuz or I.T to Tyreke/M.T on a curve before a shot. It's better than pounding the ball but it's still extremely limited.
A lot of the time last night, I.T was forced to be ball dominent, because nothing was happening in front of him, and thats been a knock on Tyreke too. Sometimes it is their fault for being blinkered but the majority of the time it's that or a shot clock violation. At least in the short term lets celebrate that we've picked up a nice, talented guard with 60th pick who can give us a scoring punch, some assists and a bit of leadership. The rest is up to coach smart and Geoff to make it work long term.
Lets face it Isaiah is way ahead of schedule, and he's been forced to be, because no one else on our team has the skills 'run' a team.
If all your players need the ball to get "in rhythm" then there's a problem.
we hardly ever swing the ball, just to do it. If you watch a team like the Celtics (I know, stuffed full of vets) they will just swing the ball and let a play emerge, our plays are generally I.T to Cuz or I.T to Tyreke/M.T on a curve before a shot. It's better than pounding the ball but it's still extremely limited.
A lot of the time last night, I.T was forced to be ball dominent, because nothing was happening in front of him, and thats been a knock on Tyreke too. Sometimes it is their fault for being blinkered but the majority of the time it's that or a shot clock violation. At least in the short term lets celebrate that we've picked up a nice, talented guard with 60th pick who can give us a scoring punch, some assists and a bit of leadership. The rest is up to coach smart and Geoff to make it work long term.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
It's not going to be that big of a deal. First, the players need to move without the ball more. That will get them all involved. (I don't believe for a second that the players we have can't move without the ball). Second, IT has the skill to run a pick and role with Cousins. Third, IT can get the ball to Cousins where he can best utilize it. It's an offense centered around a creative point guard and an up and coming center. It's not unconventional and it can have great success over time. We saw a lot of this last night, except for the time that IT was inexplicably sent to the corner of the court (at which time the offense went down the tubes).
yeesh.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
You need to relax or you're going to end up disappointed. Everyone is excited about the great play of Isaiah but you're putting him on a pedastal, he hasn't achieved anything yet. Some of the things you're saying are way, way premature and that's putting it conservatively.
kingsnation
All-Star
I love the kid. My third favorite player on the team. But this statement can't be serious.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
It's only been two games. You may want to hold off on naming him the second coming for a few more weeks.
gunks
Hall of Famer
THIIIIISSSSS!!!!
Reke/IT/Donte/JT/Cuz would get stuff done! MT off the bench as a sparkplug and second unit offense. Smart needs to do this. But I fear our starting five will just get smaller and smaller.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Too much dissapointment already. IT is the bright spot, along with Cousins. He's not an All-Star, but he's an exceptional point guard for a rookie. I'll take the risk of dissapointment.
steelevt
All-Star
From Mike Prada of Bullets Forever. He was in the locker room after the game and askedIT about that double tech on him and johnwall.
“Me and John are good friends, and we were just going back and forth. He said, ‘Get somebody out there to stop me,’ and I said, ‘OK, wait until I come back in the second half.’ So we were going back and forth. He’s a great player. He’s so hard to guard because he’s going so damn fast.”
Gotta love the kid. Won't back down from the #1 pick from his year or any year.
“Me and John are good friends, and we were just going back and forth. He said, ‘Get somebody out there to stop me,’ and I said, ‘OK, wait until I come back in the second half.’ So we were going back and forth. He’s a great player. He’s so hard to guard because he’s going so damn fast.”
Gotta love the kid. Won't back down from the #1 pick from his year or any year.
Mass
Starter
In his 4 games started, these are the stats for IT, compared with (Irving) and [Rubio]
19.5 PPG (18.1) [11.3]
34.5 MIN (31.0) [34.9]
50.9% FG,% (47.6%) [37.5%]
45.0% 3FG% (41.5%) [35.4%]
92.9% FT% (85.7%) [81.2%]
4.3 REB (3.5) [4.3]
6.3 AST (5.1) [8.4]
0.5 STL (0.8) [2.4]
0.3 BLK (0.6) [0.2]
2.3 TO (3.1) [3.4]
I know it's just 4 games, not enough to have an accurate idea based on numbers. But it's not bad for a 60th pick.
Let's say IT keeps starting and keeps putting up numbers like these until the end of the season. Do you think he still has a shot at ROY, or is it too late? How amazing would be to se a 60th pick be ROY? Personally, I think it will never happen, Rubio and Irving have too much media attention, but this could be the greatest story after Linsanity.
19.5 PPG (18.1) [11.3]
34.5 MIN (31.0) [34.9]
50.9% FG,% (47.6%) [37.5%]
45.0% 3FG% (41.5%) [35.4%]
92.9% FT% (85.7%) [81.2%]
4.3 REB (3.5) [4.3]
6.3 AST (5.1) [8.4]
0.5 STL (0.8) [2.4]
0.3 BLK (0.6) [0.2]
2.3 TO (3.1) [3.4]
I know it's just 4 games, not enough to have an accurate idea based on numbers. But it's not bad for a 60th pick.
Let's say IT keeps starting and keeps putting up numbers like these until the end of the season. Do you think he still has a shot at ROY, or is it too late? How amazing would be to se a 60th pick be ROY? Personally, I think it will never happen, Rubio and Irving have too much media attention, but this could be the greatest story after Linsanity.
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