What do you guys think? I say he has a chance to really develop into a legit NBA starter. He has the drive and heart that alot of players don't have. While he is short, he plays much bigger than he actually is. Has the quickness and strength to be a very pesky pg on defense. Has solid jumpshot form, now just needs to continue to work on his 3pt shot. And most importantly seems to be a natural leader, something this team lacks. A great leader as your starting pg is just about the best leader you can have.
Is Isaiah Thomas a long term starter?
- Thread starter jcwkings
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Thomas is and is going to be defensive liability at the NBA level no question, but to his credit has shown better D so far after handful of games than fellow rookie Fredette. For that reason, I doubt he'll ever be a long term starter but he could be little spark plug that gets big productive minutes, and most importantly crunch time play if match up is favorable. I'd put my long term bet on Fredette as a starter eventually at 6'2 over 5'9 Thomas but it would not surprise me if both evolve into more 6th man special types. You can have a long and lucrative $ career as such. Just ask Francisco Garcia. I vote WAY too soon to tell.
Looking at the pre-draft measurements on draftexpress.com and IT is listed at 5'9" in bare feet and 5'10 1/2" with shoes... most of the smaller players always bump up and round up their height, i.e 5'10 or 5'11" for IT...
does he keep the 5'9" to lull the opponent into thinking that a little guy can't take them? or can he have the league start listing him at 5'10" or 5'11"...
a starting point guard at 5'11" or even 5'10" sounds a little more average size than a starting 5'9" PG???
I would vote too early too tell, but he has a definite place in the league!!!
does he keep the 5'9" to lull the opponent into thinking that a little guy can't take them? or can he have the league start listing him at 5'10" or 5'11"...
a starting point guard at 5'11" or even 5'10" sounds a little more average size than a starting 5'9" PG???
I would vote too early too tell, but he has a definite place in the league!!!
We'll have to see how he reacts once teams react to him and start trying to take advantage. Saw a little of that in Miami, but then again not everybody has Miami's personnel. And we'll have to see how it goes on defense. One of the problems of a 5'9" starter is that you can't play any games with it -- he HAS to guard the opposing PG. There's no way you can try to hide him on a SG or SF, so no matter how good your defenders at those positions are, IT will have to take care of his own matchup even if its Derek Rose. And that same issue arises the other way, as not only will teams with the right personnel try to post him, but they will get him involved in the pick and roll figuring an NBA big rolling to the hoop with a 5'9" guy on him is an automatic score. And then of course we have to see how he holds up physically. A 5'9" guy has no room for error -- any falloff in his game at all for whatever reason instantly reflects on the court.
And the other thing of course is just sustainability. I remember during Omri's rookie year he went on a burst early in the season where he went for a couple of weeks scoring 20 every night, and we know how that worked out. This feels different though. Do I believe IT is going to average 20? Of course not. But even after the inevitable readjustment/settling period its hard to see IT not being a significant contributor. Maybe a starter, maybe not depending how badly teams punish us for using him as such -- not many really good teams I can recall wiht a 5'9" starter. But even if the shooting comes back to Earth, he does a lot of things for you and has an attitude you have to love. He and Thornton both actually -- I wouldn't trade either given their feistiness and comepetitiveness.
And the other thing of course is just sustainability. I remember during Omri's rookie year he went on a burst early in the season where he went for a couple of weeks scoring 20 every night, and we know how that worked out. This feels different though. Do I believe IT is going to average 20? Of course not. But even after the inevitable readjustment/settling period its hard to see IT not being a significant contributor. Maybe a starter, maybe not depending how badly teams punish us for using him as such -- not many really good teams I can recall wiht a 5'9" starter. But even if the shooting comes back to Earth, he does a lot of things for you and has an attitude you have to love. He and Thornton both actually -- I wouldn't trade either given their feistiness and comepetitiveness.
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As far as I can tell, the league does not oversee player height listings. This falls to the team, much like the DMV doesn't certify your height, it just publishes it. Case in point: tyreke and harden measured out almost identically in just about every physical and athletic test (except for reke's wingspan). How did harden come to be listed at 6'5 while tyreke at 6'6? My guess is the Maloofs found the ring of a 6'6 point guard to be better than 6'5. For 6'6 guards invoke MJ, Kobe, Roy, etc. 6'5 gives you Richmond, Elie, Raja Bell thoughts. Do I have any evidence? None. But I wouldn't put something like this past the Maloofs, as thy seemed more interested in marketing than winning during 20-5-5.
Is Isaiah Thomas a long term starter?
If we are content on building a mediocre team and we don't have the aspiration to become a championship team, then by all means let us annoint IT now as our future starter at 1.
Or, we can surround him with Kobe, Lebron, Griffin, and Howard and maybe we can still win the championship with a midget super point guard.
If we are content on building a mediocre team and we don't have the aspiration to become a championship team, then by all means let us annoint IT now as our future starter at 1.
Or, we can surround him with Kobe, Lebron, Griffin, and Howard and maybe we can still win the championship with a midget super point guard.
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Yes. He has everything you want except for the "standard" height of an NBA point guard. Quickness, speed, smarts, shooting from 3, shooting from mid-range, a runner, great passing ability, good defensive quickness, toughness, and high leadership ability. Just think about the comparison with Bibby, a starter we had on an excellent team. IT is better than Bibby was as a rookie. He has better passing ability, quickness, speed, and he's better defensively. So if Bibby could start for us, then to my mind, of course IT could start. I think IT's talent would be wasted coming off the bench. He's not a point a minute type guy like Bobby Jackson was or Thornton, for that matter. He's a guy who makes other guys better, and that's a guy you want starting.
Thornton needs to start playing better D though. He gambles way too often, both in a half court defense and when the opponent gets a defensive rebound, leaving one guard back to play transition D. He's also got to correct his bad habit of moving towards the paint for no reason (when there are already guys there to rotate), leaving his man open for 3s.
What I saw in Miami was some double teaming of IT. That could happen more in the future, which would probably lower his point and assist totals. But we should all hope that he is double teamed because that really leaves gaping holes for Tyreke & Co. As he gets more experience he's going to be anticipitating these kind of defenses and that will work to everybody's benefit. He won't get the assist, but as has been said before, it will be a hockey-assist that will lead to the assist. He's already doing some of that already.
I'm also hoping that IT's hard work, energy and fighting spirit will rub off on some of the other guys. I wish coach would explain why Donte just doesn't get consistent PT despite his decent play. I'm sure Jimmer will also go into the offseason with a stronger drive to get better, having lost many of his minutes to the last pick in the draft!
Notice what IT did against Irving and Wall in consecutive games. The highly touted big money rookies have nothing on Thomas. The seminal play last night was when IT took Wall to the hoop on a break for a reverse lay-up. He could see by his reaction how important that play was to him. The stat at the end of the game was- when was the last player in Sacto to score as many points as IT in his first 4 games? It was in the early 1970s by Otis Birdsong.
As far as defense. IT can out quick people and clearly bothered Irving. He is a very good rebounder for a PG and has the biggest hop on the team. IT, Thornton and Evans are all very strong players physically. Thornton has a knack for offensive rebounds. None of these guys get pushed around. JT has given a lot effort lately as a starter, but he is a journeyman player. A dominant 4 playing with DMC would give small ball a better chance.
As far as defense. IT can out quick people and clearly bothered Irving. He is a very good rebounder for a PG and has the biggest hop on the team. IT, Thornton and Evans are all very strong players physically. Thornton has a knack for offensive rebounds. None of these guys get pushed around. JT has given a lot effort lately as a starter, but he is a journeyman player. A dominant 4 playing with DMC would give small ball a better chance.
I thought Isaiah struggled against Wall early on, i mean Wall just abused him, blew by him a few times straight up and a couple of times from a wing position.
but what was nice to see was an adjustment, the second half Isaiah stayed infront of wall at all costs, even at the cost of a foul, ok, not ideal but at least he'd learnt in a short space of time what Wall wanted to do and he was going to try his damnedest to stop him.
but what was nice to see was an adjustment, the second half Isaiah stayed infront of wall at all costs, even at the cost of a foul, ok, not ideal but at least he'd learnt in a short space of time what Wall wanted to do and he was going to try his damnedest to stop him.
I'd be wary of annointing him a starter, just in case he's having a Jennings-ish hot streak, but its becoming harder and harder to ignore his exploits. The reason I think he can be a starter is because he's not just 5'9; he's a rock of a 5'9 kid. Not only can he defend the lightning quick guys that Reke and Thornton can't cover, but he gets into a low defensive stance and bigger guards have a hard time posting him. Its the Malik Rose on Shaq strategy, the Chuck Hayes style of post defense of getting lower than your opponent and using gravity against him. He's not a scrawny midget, IT is built.
Honestly I think his style defense could be a better compliment to Reke than Thornton is.
Honestly I think his style defense could be a better compliment to Reke than Thornton is.
Except that when that happened last night, McGee was alone with IT on him, 10 feet from the hoop - and McGee actually started his move on IT and then flopped backwards, losing the ball out of bounds.
Yeah, McGee is an absolute braindead player, but I thought it was possibly telling that a huge guy like him would actually think to flop against IT's "overly physical defense" than to just pound it into him.
We've seen quite a few other players, big and smaller alike, act a similar way when IT guards them.
He's been iso'd against some of the best (DRose, Kobe, etc) and he's shockingly stopped them on repeated drives.
So it's not a fluke - players are obviously discombobulated when he faces off against them, for some weird reason.
Yeah, McGee is an absolute braindead player, but I thought it was possibly telling that a huge guy like him would actually think to flop against IT's "overly physical defense" than to just pound it into him.
We've seen quite a few other players, big and smaller alike, act a similar way when IT guards them.
He's been iso'd against some of the best (DRose, Kobe, etc) and he's shockingly stopped them on repeated drives.
So it's not a fluke - players are obviously discombobulated when he faces off against them, for some weird reason.
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True dat.
He is just absurd on his cheating into the paint and constantly leaving the 3pt shooters wide open.
He THINKS he can be in 2 places at once, I believe.
My concern is that for how many times he's been burned on that exact play, he keeps making it - so what would teach him to stop doing it, if constant failure isn't?
He is just absurd on his cheating into the paint and constantly leaving the 3pt shooters wide open.
He THINKS he can be in 2 places at once, I believe.
My concern is that for how many times he's been burned on that exact play, he keeps making it - so what would teach him to stop doing it, if constant failure isn't?