Grades v. Pistons 11/08

Status
Not open for further replies.

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#1
Peja ( F ) -- Another F. Just see no way around it. 4-13, 9pts 1reb 0ast? Scored early on a couple of layups off of nifty feeds, also missed a few more in close when challenged by the Pistons. And I liked the obvious strategy move to try to loosen the perimeter defense on him by having him cut early. Unfortunately it led nowhere. Turned into a classic Peja game vs. the Pistons -- ugly. Forced shots, airballs, and now Tayshaun Prince has grown to such a degree in his career that he is able to come out and really light Peja up on the other end too -- had a helluva game against Peja and at one point was shooting 10-11 :eek: . And Peja was so badly out of rhythm that even when Prince sat down and Mo Evans took over, Peja still was misfiring badly and getting beat on both ends of the court. On one especially bad missed open layup in the 4th, he actually heard boos from the crowd. I hope that doesn't get started again.
Reef ( B- ) -- An ok game by Reef. Good on offense. Not so good at everything else. Made a nice early spin on Big Ben, got hacked on the arm on the finish, but there was no call and Reef ended up getting a technical. Otherwise mostly stayed out of the post and got his early points on numerous jumpers, which looked good all night. Forced the Pistons to switch Sheed off onto him. His jumpers paid dividends in the second half when Sheed started to crowd him a bit, leading to back to back drives to slam it home as we made our final push to stay in the game. On the flipside, boardwork was not there on a night when we desperately needed somebody to clean things up inside, and the Pistons had a free path to the rim all night long.
Miller ( D ) -- fast start again shooting and passing, but then things began to go awry. Started throwing away passes, missing shots, and was completely invisible on the glass as the Pistons just squeezed him right out of the game. And of course being Brad, whenever things start going wrong he loses his head, starts arguing instead of playing, and it just all goes south. The missed shots and turnovers hurt, but we also simply need more from our only 7-footer on the glass and inside defensively. The Pistons just pounded us in there.
Bonzi ( B ) -- started off the game helping on the defensive boards, but was quiet otherwise. But he began to assert himself as the game went along and maybe his physical play was winning the war of attrition. Not able to really dominate the glass as he has in the past games with all the long, physical Pistons rebounders inside. Battled and fought well (he and Mo were really banging bodies when matched up), and was maybe the last King still fighting there, but not able to turn the tide tonight.
Bibby ( C+ ) -- yummy early thread the needle pass to Peja kind of set the tone for Mike. Not much offense, but nice passing, at least until things fell apart for us in the third, and was helping out our feeble frontline rebounders by getting on the glass. Could not shoot, but was doing a decent job of directing things. Not the sort of game where he was going to turn things around for us, but I wasn't horribly unhappy with his overall play. Was thinking of a B-, until I remembered how badly we got beaten. Think maybe my expectations for him are falling a bit when he has little impact on a game and it feels ok to me.
Hart ( C ) -- showed good scrap in there against Billups. Did not win the battles, but fought hard and matched the physical Pistons style. Unfortunately on the other end of the floor just forced and forced, and you can't win that way against the Pistons. Just feeds right into their gameplan. Giving him this grade just based on his competitiveness and the return of that in your face defense we saw in the preseason. Offensively though, was obviously not helping.
Skinner ( C+ ) -- seemed like a good match physically to bring Brian in early in this one, but just didn't have much effect in his first half stint except to try a one on one move that was sent back in his face. Made contributions in garbage time, but I am discounting them compared to the "real" minutes for grading purposes.
Martin ( C ) -- entered the game at the end of the third and immediately forced a shot, may have been blocked. The sort of thing you just can't do against the Pistons. Looked overmatched but did come back in garbagetime to add some points to the statline. Picked up another steal, and continues to show good instincts there. No impact when it mattered once more, but not horrible. Given our other struggles, chalk it up to a learning experience.
Thomas ( B- ) -- made a difference in there on the boards after being inserted relatively late in the 2nd quarter. Still nothing on offense, but made a rebounding contribution on a night we needed it and helped key our 2nd quarter push. Didn't get back on the floor until garbagetime (which was really the whole 4th quarter), and against the Pistons reserves finally hit a couple of jumpers from his favorite spots. Maybe it will get him going in future games. One can hope at least.
Corliss ( B- ) -- inevitable that a man nicknamed "Big Nasty" would get some early run in a game against the nastiest team in the league. Came in early for him in the 2nd quarter, and after some shaky plays, got hit in full stride on a breakaway and soared (for Corliss) for a dunk to key really our last, best spurt in this one. Also scored in the post against Mo. Did nothing in garbagetime, but again am going to weight this grade toward what he did while it still mattered.

Adelman ( C- ) -- We started off hot, and for about 5 minutes it looked like classic Kings passing stuff. But we were unable to sustain, and the Pistons began to turn up the pressure. Our transition defense sucked all night, the lane was wide open, and and our interior guys were getting killed on the glass in the earlygoing by Big Ben. We did at least show a little concern for defense with our first batch of substitutions (Skinner, Hart, Martin), but it didn't change much. I liked what Rick did early with Peja -- and I can only assume getting the ball to Peja on a series of backcuts was intentional on our part in an effort to get him off. Failed miserably of course, but a good idea. We went surprisingly deep into the bench in the second quarter given the way things went in Phoenix, but it paid off with our benchers keying a decent run to stay within striking distance. May have been inspired by needing to stay fresh for the back to back game tommorow night. So a lot of little ingame moves that I liked. But the overall effect was badly wanting. The defense was never there. Got smashed on the glass. And once the Pistons cranked things up, they squeezed our offense into an ugly, ragged series of forced shots and one on one play. Some of that is not Rick's fault of course, but as always in the sport, the coach ends up holding the bag when things go badly. Bottomline -- Pistons are just flat out better than us right now. So off to Denver, where we can maybe hope the Nene and Earl Watson issues are proving a distraction to the Nuggets.
 
Last edited:
#7
AleksandarN said:
I will start early

Pedja F-
I'm looking at the box score and Peja had one rebound?! How are you 6'10" and only getting one rebound?! IMHO, F- doesn't reflect how poorly he played tonight...
 
#10
So I'm looking at Prince and Peja's box scores... and I gotta say, I can't recall ever seeing such perfect failure from a starter in every aspect of the game. I mean, wow. I've seen bad games from Peja before, but wow.
 
#11
As a teacher, I have learned NEVER to grade when I am sad, mad, or TOO happy, so I will postpone my grade comments until tomorrow. Just in case you are wondering, it is NOT because of being too happy!;)
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#12
Bibby...C...Another off-night shooting wise, but did everything else he could be expected to do. Rebounded and passed well.

Bonzi...B-...
Scored well, but got lost trying to guard Rip.

Peja...F-...As I've said...When a shooter doesn't shoot well, he's useless. Especially a 6'10 one who is allergic and/or afraid of rebounds and hustle.

Reef...B...Efficient offensive game, and probably should have been utilzed a bit more. Some explosive dunks were nice too...Not to much on the rebounding side, though.

Miller...D...
Started off looking like it was gonna be a good Brad Miller night, but that quickly faded away, as he missed shot after shot. Not only was missing shots, but also got frustrated by the Wallace's.

Bench...C-...Well, it was a step in the right direction...Hart still is pretty innefective, Martin is still very raw, Thomas is still trying to figure the bench out...Positives were a massive Big Nasty dunk, and pretty decent play from Skinner.

I'm not gonna grade Rick, but I really think he should empty the benches in a blowout. Especially when you have the next game in Denver. I don't want Hart and Skinner expelling energy when we have Price and Sampson on the bench...Oh well, I guess.
 
#13
Miller gets an F from me every time he loses his temper and takes him self out of the game. It happens way too often to be overlooked. ANybody can get inside his head .
 
#14
Hart: D

I've been surprised more fans haven't been all over the subpar play of Jason Hart. I've seen all the games on League Pass, and from my seat on the couch, this guy bring absolutely nothing. His lateral quickness is average at best, he can't penetrate and all the GMs in the league know he's a subpar shooter. I guess he plays defense -- allegedly. But he's not athletic. Can he pass or make plays? I haven't seen it.

He put up 10 points a game last year and had a good assist-to-turnover ratio. But so what? He did it for one year on the Bobcats! He's been a fringe NBA player fighting for a roster spot for most of his career, and that's all he'll ever be.

I mean, Bernie Bickerstaff knew he couldn't beat out Brevin 'freakin' Knight for a roster spot so he wisely dumped him for a second rounder.

Eddie House is looking really good right now. The team might as well give some run to Ronnie Price.

I'll probably get ripped for these comments, but I just don't want Bibby to play 42 minutes a game.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#16
Eddie_the_Eagle said:
Hart: D

I've been surprised more fans haven't been all over the subpar play of Jason Hart. I've seen all the games on League Pass, and from my seat on the couch, this guy bring absolutely nothing. His lateral quickness is average at best, he can't penetrate and all the GMs in the league know he's a subpar shooter. I guess he plays defense -- allegedly. But he's not athletic. Can he pass or make plays? I haven't seen it.

He put up 10 points a game last year and had a good assist-to-turnover ratio. But so what? He did it for one year on the Bobcats! He's been a fringe NBA player fighting for a roster spot for most of his career, and that's all he'll ever be.

I mean, Bernie Bickerstaff knew he couldn't beat out Brevin 'freakin' Knight for a roster spot so he wisely dumped him for a second rounder.

Eddie House is looking really good right now. The team might as well give some run to Ronnie Price.

I'll probably get ripped for these comments, but I just don't want Bibby to play 42 minutes a game.
I would definatly like to have an in-depth chat with Geoff Petrie as to why Eddie House was let go in favor of this guy...A backup point guard with above average defensive skills isn't going to help a team defensivly, when pretty much everyone else can't guard their own shadows.

I would much rather have the offensive threat that is Eddie House, who after he learned the system was pretty damn good, to this guy anyday.
 
#17
Eddie_the_Eagle said:
Hart: D

I've been surprised more fans haven't been all over the subpar play of Jason Hart. I've seen all the games on League Pass, and from my seat on the couch, this guy bring absolutely nothing.
I gotta agree, compared to other guards we had that weren't even that great in years past, he just isn't stacking up. I expected way less than some others from this bench but even for me this bench has been really disapointing.
 
#18
I'd drop Wells' grade to at least a B-. His effort on defense against Hamilton in the first quarter was non-existent. I'd bump Abdur-Rahim up to a B, he didn't rebound much, but he was very effective on the offensive end when the Kings in general weren't.

I'd much rather have Hart than House. The Kings bench is struggling on offense, but I'd rather have a consistent defense presence there (especially behind Bibby) than a potentially streaky shooter. I loved seeing that effort on defense from him tonight.
 
Last edited:
#19
uolj said:
I'd drop Wells' grade to at least a B-. His effort on defense against Hamilton in the first quarter was non-existent.

I'd much rather have Hart than House. The Kings bench is struggling on offense, but I'd rather have a consistent defense presence there (especially behind Bibby) than a potentially streaky shooter.
Have you seen House play this year? House even played some decent D for us last year, it was better than Bibbys(not that thats saying much)
 
#20
I saw him play very well last year (for what he does) and I saw him light it up on offense in the game against the Kings. How does that change that he brings shooting, while Hart brings defensive effort?
 
#21
As far as Hart goes, it's good some of you agree with me. Let's hope the Sonics release Mateen Cleaves or Rick Brunson soon so the team can acquire an upgrade.

Um, I guess I have descended into meanness.

Seriously, Hart's defense? I wouldn't call him a stopper. At least House has some explosiveness and quick hands.
 
#23
uolj said:
I saw him play very well last year (for what he does) and I saw him light it up on offense in the game against the Kings. How does that change that he brings shooting, while Hart brings defensive effort?
I'm just saying he brought some D too, and to be honest I wouldn't call Hart a defensive stopper after the games I've seen him play so far.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#24
Eddie_the_Eagle said:
As far as Hart goes, it's good some of you agree with me. Let's hope the Sonics release Mateen Cleaves or Rick Brunson soon so the team can acquire an upgrade.

Um, I guess I have descended into meanness.

Seriously, Hart's defense? I wouldn't call him a stopper. At least House has some explosiveness and quick hands.
Now that would be a little over the top, IMO...

Hart proved in the preseason he could be a reliable defender with a good midrange jumper, provided he's open.
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#25
i don't agree on the idea that we left the lane wide open all night. They only had 21 points in the paint and 16 were on fast breaks.. I saw jump shot after jump shot after jump shot followed by threes all night from the pistons. Reef helf Wallace to 10 points. As far as rebounds go. Its hard to get defensive rebounds when the other team never misses. LOL
 
#26
If we continue to play like does. Will Rick suffer the same fate that Flip went through in when he got fired by the T'wolves mid season? IT just seems like the players are not responding to him.
 
#27
AleksandarN said:
If we continue to play like does. Will Rick suffer the same fate that Flip went through in when he got fired by the T'wolves mid season? IT just seems like the players are not responding to him.
I think you may be right..
 
#29
Entity said:
i don't agree on the idea that we left the lane wide open all night. They only had 21 points in the paint and 16 were on fast breaks.. I saw jump shot after jump shot after jump shot followed by threes all night from the pistons. Reef helf Wallace to 10 points. As far as rebounds go. Its hard to get defensive rebounds when the other team never misses. LOL
I didn't see the game, and only listened to the first two quarters and the fourth (although that last quarter didn't really matter), but "holding" Sheed to 10 points isn't an accomplishment unless the Pistons were consistently running plays for him, which they very rarely do in the games I've watched.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.