[Grades] Grades v. Mavs 12/10/2012

[Padrino]

I really don't understand what you're talking about. Please clarify the jargon.

jargon? where? basketball, like any professional sport, is a game of discipline. if you want a team to grow in a worthwhile and disciplined fashion, then encouraging impatience is not how you do it. fast break opportunities present themselves naturally in this league, and i would encourage the kings to take advantage of those opportunities, but the modern nba is also incredibly athletic. the worst nba defenses (kings included) still manage to get back in transition the majority of the time. that said, pushing the ball recklessly has so far only augmented this team's offensive inefficiency, because a young team is often an impatient team, and a lack of patience does not equate to a lack of intelligence. it equates to a lack of discipline. but if pushing the ball were made supplemental to a strong halfcourt discipline in which the kings' coaching staff held its players accountable for their mistakes, then you'd also see more success in the open court...

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Then why are we playing him with IT as opposed to Jimmer?

Because jimmer sucks

 

[HereWeBoogie]

And how exactly would we go about doing this. Unless we somehow convince David Stern to let us start 6 players as opposed to 5, I don't see any room for him in the starting line-up as opposed to who we currently have in there.

Take out Brooks. Tyreke needs to be playing PG anyway.

 

[Kingster]

jargon? where? basketball, like any professional sport, is a game of discipline. if you want a team to grow in a worthwhile and disciplined fashion, then encouraging impatience is not how you do it. fast break opportunities present themselves naturally in this league, and i would encourage the kings to take advantage of those opportunities, but the modern nba is also incredibly athletic. the worst nba defenses (kings included) still manage to get back in transition the majority of the time. that said, pushing the ball recklessly has so far only augmented this team's offensive inefficiency, because a young team is often an impatient team, and a lack of patience does not equate to a lack of intelligence. it equates to a lack of discipline. but if pushing the ball were made supplemental to a strong halfcourt discipline in which the kings' coaching staff held its players accountable for their mistakes, then you'd also see more success in the open court...

I love these adjectives. Now let's add "reckless" to the list. So we won't have them be reckless, or jack up shots, throw up shots, or toss up shots. We'll have them be prudent and use wise judgement, even with a modicum of BB IQ. And we will play defense and run the ball up the court on turnovers and missed shots. Forget half court discipline for this young team. You're dreaming. You're a teacher teaching calculus to an arithmetic class. How 'bout if they learn their multiplication tables before we go forward with the differential calculus.

 

[Spike]

I love these adjectives. Now let's add "reckless" to the list. So we won't have them be reckless, or jack up shots, throw up shots, or toss up shots. We'll have them be prudent and use wise judgement, even with a modicum of BB IQ. And we will play defense and run the ball up the court on turnovers and missed shots. Forget half court discipline for this young team. You're dreaming. You're a teacher teaching calculus to an arithmetic class. How 'bout if they learn their multiplication tables before we go forward with the differential calculus.

Had a foundation been built last year, you'd see the benefits this year. Running, for the sake of running, accomplishes nothing. It's middle school at it's worst. Padrino is absolutely right. A team this young, and structured with these sorts of players, is absolutely crying out for discipline. Give us a pattern, we'll follow it. If team B does this, then I do this. Asking a team to run won't get them to play the halfcourt any better. They won't pick it up by osmosis. Considerable time needs to be spent implementing a consistent disciplined offense.

But hey, scoring points is cool, too. Just like last year.

 

[Padrino]

I love these adjectives. Now let's add "reckless" to the list. So we won't have them be reckless, or jack up shots, throw up shots, or toss up shots. We'll have them be prudent and use wise judgement, even with a modicum of BB IQ. And we will play defense and run the ball up the court on turnovers and missed shots. Forget half court discipline for this young team. You're dreaming. You're a teacher teaching calculus to an arithmetic class. How 'bout if they learn their multiplication tables before we go forward with the differential calculus.

you're a strange one. ever play organized basketball before? i did. fifteen years ago in junior high, where i ran the pick and roll as a point guard. to this day, i can still execute a pick and roll in the rec leagues i join every now and again. it never left me. it never will. that said, i have absolutely no idea where you get the notion that basic, fundamental play-calling that encourages discipline in the halfcourt amounts to the basketball equivalent of "differential calculus." you're the worst kind of armchair coach: condescending to the abilities of kids who've been playing basketball their whole lives...

 

[VF21]

its time to put him back in the starting lineup. or at least stop playing him in a lineup with 4 incapable offensive bench players. the defenses focus completely on him when hes on the floor, they give no respect to anybody else hes on the court with and its hurting his game

No. If Thornton can't adapt to fit our current needs, then we find a way to move him for someone who will. The idea that a player just can't play if he has to come off the bench is without merit IMHO. If he wants to contribute badly enough, he'll find a way. One reason defenses key on Thornton is because they're aware he suffers from Seagull Syndrome. They don't give respect to anyone else on the court with him for the simple reason they know he won't be passing them the ball anyway.

 

[bajaden]

I don't know who to vote for. They were all garbage until garbage time.

Is it Chuck who's supposed to be our vet leader?

Is it IT who received the backup PG mins and was leading our offense when it imploded? He's also looking for his shot too much. One reason MT might be struggling is he can't get the ball from our PG's.

Outlaw, if you think he deserves more accountability after the Por game? When you play the way he did at Por then more is expected of you, and he fell flat on his face with those expectations. Could have left him in Por and not noticed his absence.

MT, who's supposed to be our go-to bench guy and scorer, who's in his 4th year, yet not only his missing shots, but is forcing poor shots and not helping elsewhere? TRob said the other day he focused on defense because that was what he needed to do to get mins. It's time MT contributed elsewhere when his shots aren't falling. I'm on the fence about giving Cisco MT's mins for the time being when Reke returns.

TRob? Only one with a legit excuse as he's just barely a month in to his career, but he is the 5th pick.

The biggest question I have is not about these guys playing so poorly, but rather playing them considerable mins and all at the same freakin time when they are playing poorly. Didn't Smart say two weeks ago he didn't want to play Reke more than about 36 mins because of empty mins? Then please, Smart, enlighten us as to why you kept that bench unit in when that 6 min stretch in the 2nd was the emptiest of mins I've seen in years, and our backup bigs producing more empty mins in the 4th kept Cuz on the bench while he was filling his mins with the most production of anyone tonight?

Interesting that you mention Thornton not getting the ball as much, and possibly that being part of the reason for his slump. And then later you sort of answer your own question by saying Thornton is missing shots and not doing much else when on the floor. I sort of think that sums up the entire problem with Thornton. When your teammates pass you the ball, and your not effective with it, and, they're not likely to get the ball back once they pass it to you, they stop passing it to you. Thornton has become a black hole on offense. The majority of times he gets the ball, you can just about bet your house he's going to shoot it. On the rare occasion, like last night, he does try and pass the ball, it ends up being a turnover.

I don't have a problem with him shooting the ball if he has an open shot, but unfortunately, most of his shots are defended well, thus his poor shooting percentage.

 

[bajaden]

its time to put him back in the starting lineup. or at least stop playing him in a lineup with 4 incapable offensive bench players. the defenses focus completely on him when hes on the floor, they give no respect to anybody else hes on the court with and its hurting his game

I sat in a bar sharing beers with Jerry Reynolds one night many moons ago. He told me how he was sitting in the stands watching the Kings practice, when Derrick Smith came over and sat down next to him. Smith told Jerry, that he wasn't shooting the ball well, and that he needed his teammates to do more to get him open. Jerry said, I told him we traded two starters and a first round draft pick for you. Get yourself open!

If your being paid big bucks to be the man, then be the man. Or, just maybe your not as good as everyone thought you were. In his last 12 games, he's shot the ball well in only two, if you count last nights game where he went 3 for 6. Both those games had one thing in common. We were far behind in both. The other game was the Clipper game. In other words, he's hitting shots when they don't matter. Look, I like Thornton, but right now he's not helpinig us. I'm not sure whats wrong with him, but something is, and he needs to put it behind him if he wants to help this team.

 

[Glenn]

The way Cisco has been playing, maybe inserting him into the bench squad would be wise. Of course he is short but he is a good off the ball shot blocker and obviously his years in the league have taught him a lot. He might help tie that bench group into a cohesive unit if only by being another shooter. Of course the obvious solution is to quit having 5 starters and 5 bench players and playing them as units. There should always be at least one starter on the floor. Not sure why that's so difficult but this "five man unit" thing has been a Smart plan since he took over the team a year ago.

Not sure where the JJ experiment is going. I can see why trading him for our second round pick seemed like a good deal to the other team. He seems a lot like TRob in that he is a decent athlete with very low BB IQ. If we choose these kind of guys, we have to be ready to mold them into NBA players.

Thornton isn't the only problem but his year has been shockingly bad. I lay some of this on the odd collection of guards we have.

 

[VF21]

I sat in a bar sharing beers with Jerry Reynolds one night many moons ago. He told me how he was sitting in the stands watching the Kings practice, when Derrick Smith came over and sat down next to him. Smith told Jerry, that he wasn't shooting the ball well, and that he needed his teammates to do more to get him open. Jerry said, I told him we traded two starters and a first round draft pick for you. Get yourself open!

If your being paid big bucks to be the man, then be the man. Or, just maybe your not as good as everyone thought you were. In his last 12 games, he's shot the ball well in only two, if you count last nights game where he went 3 for 6. Both those games had one thing in common. We were far behind in both. The other game was the Clipper game. In other words, he's hitting shots when they don't matter. Look, I like Thornton, but right now he's not helpinig us. I'm not sure whats wrong with him, but something is, and he needs to put it behind him if he wants to help this team.

What he said...again.

 

[ParniValjak]

Pffft -- barely even rates a 1 on the Reggie Evans cheapshot scale.

It's nothing. These sort of cheap shots happen all the time. If you focused on them, you would get at least 10 a game in every game.

 

[HereWeBoogie]

speaking of Thornton, i wonder if he will be playing tomorrow. he put this message on Instagram

"Moms not doin to well came back to da crib for a couple days to see bout her. Everything else is not important right now"

 

[kingsnation]

Did anyone happen to catch Smart's interview on Grant's show today? I heard Grant's summary of it regarding MT and apparently Smart is going to start putting MT in games earlier so he can have floor-time with the starters. He isn't meshing well with the bench or something to that degree. Anyone else hear this?

 

[VF21]

speaking of Thornton, i wonder if he will be playing tomorrow. he put this message on Instagram

"Moms not doin to well came back to da crib for a couple days to see bout her. Everything else is not important right now"

This would go a long way towards explaining why MT's head hasn't seemed to be in the game recently. My thoughts and prayers are with Thornton. Family is much more important than a stupid game.

 

[kennadog]

This would go a long way towards explaining why MT's head hasn't seemed to be in the game recently. My thoughts and prayers are with Thornton. Family is much more important than a stupid game.

My thoughts and prayers are also with the Thornton family. That is difficult for anyone to cope with and would have to be affecting Marcus. I'm so sorry to hear this.

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Did anyone happen to catch Smart's interview on Grant's show today? I heard Grant's summary of it regarding MT and apparently Smart is going to start putting MT in games earlier so he can have floor-time with the starters. He isn't meshing well with the bench or something to that degree. Anyone else hear this?

i heard most of the interview. he said MT is not fitting in with the bench players because he is the main focus of the Defense (exactly what i said on the last page) and that defenders are all over him even when he doesnt have the ball. i didnt catch the part about him saying hes going to use him differently but hopefully that's the case