Smart says a lot of things. Also, it's not just about being aggressive. If Tyreke starts trying to be aggressive with this kind of spacing on the floor he's just going to end up dribbling into traffic all the time and you and section101 are just going to call him a ballhog selfish player blablabla dumb no bball IQ etc.
[Grades] Grades v. Lakers 11/11/2012
- Thread starter Bricklayer
- Start date
Smart says a lot of things. Also, it's not just about being aggressive. If Tyreke starts trying to be aggressive with this kind of spacing on the floor he's just going to end up dribbling into traffic all the time and you and section101 are just going to call him a ballhog selfish player blablabla dumb no bball IQ etc.
tyreeeke
Bench
D12 isn't that good? lol, it must be personal!
JoMama
Bench
Tyreke was flat-out embarrassing. One of the game's up-and-coming stars just two years ago, he's now no better than a role player. How many easy shots can you miss? Even Jimmer made a couple in the lane - without turning the ball over. The Kings would be wasting huge money giving this guy a lucrative contract. Johnson is making Donte look like an all-star. He's a complete failure at SF. Sometimes it feels as if the Kings have accumlated every guy in the NBA who CAN'T shoot! There's not enough beer and wine to get through these games...hic.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
It looks like Tyreke Evans has hit his ceiling, for the most part. It would be fair to assume he'll make some minor advances throughout the next 5 or so years, but he'll never be the best player on a contending team. He'll never be the 'every year all-star' we all sort of expected after his rookie season.
This has something to do with coaching, it has something to do with position changes, it has something to do with injuries, but that isn't the whole story here. He's just not that guy.
With that being said, I still think he is incredibly valuable to this team. He is our second best player, and he's still the key to this entire season. Cousins is Cousins, we know what we'll get from him. I can't tell you what were going to get with Evans from game to game.
I would love for him to embrace the Iguodala role. I just don't think his brothers will let him accept that, and I think it's hurting him. They seem to think it's superstar or bust, which is great if the player has that in him, but I don't think Evans does. I have no proof of this, but it feels like those guys are in his ear telling him he needs the points. Which causes those 3 or 4 possessions in a row where he takes off balanced jumpers for no apparent reason.
If Evans can give us 12-15 PPG, 6 Reb, 4-5 AST, and play spectacular defense I want him on this team forever. And the truth is, he is doing that most of the time. His defense this year has been the best it's ever been. The issues now are a bit different then they have been in the past. The most important is 'Is he happy?' , which I can't answer. The next issue is his horrendous shooting percentage. This is where I come to the conclusion that he may not like this role, and that his people are telling him he needs to score more. He's shooting .369 from the field, which is BY FAR the worst of his career. His 3P%, which has never been good, is also FAR worse than it's ever been. For someone who should be taking most of his shots at the rim, his percentages just aren't good enough.
I want him here, though. I really do. If he can embrace the 'jack of all trades' role, and be happy with it, without forcing shots that makes his FG% plummet, he's going to make a ton of money in this league. I just hope that's good enough for him and his brothers.
This has something to do with coaching, it has something to do with position changes, it has something to do with injuries, but that isn't the whole story here. He's just not that guy.
With that being said, I still think he is incredibly valuable to this team. He is our second best player, and he's still the key to this entire season. Cousins is Cousins, we know what we'll get from him. I can't tell you what were going to get with Evans from game to game.
I would love for him to embrace the Iguodala role. I just don't think his brothers will let him accept that, and I think it's hurting him. They seem to think it's superstar or bust, which is great if the player has that in him, but I don't think Evans does. I have no proof of this, but it feels like those guys are in his ear telling him he needs the points. Which causes those 3 or 4 possessions in a row where he takes off balanced jumpers for no apparent reason.
If Evans can give us 12-15 PPG, 6 Reb, 4-5 AST, and play spectacular defense I want him on this team forever. And the truth is, he is doing that most of the time. His defense this year has been the best it's ever been. The issues now are a bit different then they have been in the past. The most important is 'Is he happy?' , which I can't answer. The next issue is his horrendous shooting percentage. This is where I come to the conclusion that he may not like this role, and that his people are telling him he needs to score more. He's shooting .369 from the field, which is BY FAR the worst of his career. His 3P%, which has never been good, is also FAR worse than it's ever been. For someone who should be taking most of his shots at the rim, his percentages just aren't good enough.
I want him here, though. I really do. If he can embrace the 'jack of all trades' role, and be happy with it, without forcing shots that makes his FG% plummet, he's going to make a ton of money in this league. I just hope that's good enough for him and his brothers.
Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
Indeed...perhaps instead of being wowed by T-Rob dropping to us in the draft, we should have been smarter and chosen Barnes or Lillard...hindsight is 20/20 I guess, right? Something needs to happen soon, I know THAT much.
tyreeeke
Bench
Excellent post. I love the AI comparison, as i've said before. Time will tell if Reke can accept this but as of right now, I still think he believes he's more than what he is offensively. He's a 3rd tier scorer, IMO. I do not believe he can be the second best player on a title team. He has the talent to be an all-nba defender and major contributor, but he needs to focus on dishing the rock and playing defense. I cringe when he shoots.
tyreeeke
Bench
Harrison Barnes has NOT impressed me. I take Tyreke over him all day.
I'm thinking it makes sense to try starting the following lineup:
IT, MT, JJ, JT, DC
You than have Tyreke, TRob, Jimmer, Hayes come in as part of the second unit.
With MT starting you'd get a great shooter which should help create more spacing - although sacrificing on the defensive end. But we desperately need offense at this point, so I would like to see how this works.
Than when you bring the second unit in jimmer will help create spacing for Tryeke and TRob. Use jimmer as the combo guard with Tyreke handling the ball most of the time with jimmer running off screens.
I would like to see how Tyreke and jimmer play together.
IT, MT, JJ, JT, DC
You than have Tyreke, TRob, Jimmer, Hayes come in as part of the second unit.
With MT starting you'd get a great shooter which should help create more spacing - although sacrificing on the defensive end. But we desperately need offense at this point, so I would like to see how this works.
Than when you bring the second unit in jimmer will help create spacing for Tryeke and TRob. Use jimmer as the combo guard with Tyreke handling the ball most of the time with jimmer running off screens.
I would like to see how Tyreke and jimmer play together.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
you would only be able to do so for a few weeks until Reke is traded. Once the plan was to have those two start. Actually the beginning of the disastrous series of decisions that has us in the dumps again since Beno DID work well with Reke, an with MT.
Now I think we have certain synergies and...dissynergies I suppose you would say.
IT and MT work well together
IT and Reke do not work well together
Brooks and Reke may work well together
Brooks and MT do not work well together
Jimmer and Salmons work well together
Jimmer and Reke may work well together
Jimmer and MT do not work well together
Reke and MT do not work well together, but are dangerous
Reke and Salmons do not work well together
MT and Salmons do not work well together
IT and Jimmer are brutal as a defensive pairing
Brooks and Jimmer you would have to assuem the same
IT and Brooks let's not even talk about
Salmons and Brooks we do not know
etc.
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Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
Sooo...all this being said, why isnt this our starting lineup:
Brooks
Evans
Johnson
Thompson
Cousins
With a bench rotation of:
Thornton
Thomas
Robinson
Hayes
Jimmer
Nobody else should be playing at this point...and not EVERYBODY needs to play.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I have no answer for that, because that's likely how I would have been playing it all along. But Brooks has been a hard guy to get a feel for this season.
Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
This is the lineup I was hoping for way before the pre-season. And Smart actually played with it 1 game if I remember right and it worked well! What is going through Smart's head that he feels the need to run a 'set' offense and not allow his guys to open it up...or my other logical thought: why hasn't he implemented the pick & roll with Cousins?? That would work great for guys like Jimmer and Brooks. What gives Keith?!?
treach1976
Bench
Then - the other conclusion is that you would have to start Jimmer, with IT being JJ Barea 2.0 off the bench.
Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
Jimmer isn't the guy you want handling the point, he's a shooter not ballhandler. Brooks should be starting at point.
tyreeeke
Bench
Jimmer's handles are very good, I don't know what you're talking about. He runs the pick and roll better than any PG on this team.
The OBVIOUS starting lineup is...
Reke
Jimmer
JJ
JT
Cuz
I mean it is so blatently easy to see, that it isn't being seen.
Padrino
All-Star
repeating these assertions over and over and over again does not make them any less false...
Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
As in my earlier post, I agree with you about Jimmer needing the pick and roll, but he's not a PG...he's a SG. He doesn't have the creative instincts to play the point. Unless he morphs into a Mark Price type of player, but he's lightyears from that. He NEEDS the pick and roll though...Cousins, like Malone, would be perfect for this.
tyreeeke
Bench
Same goes for you.
Hadlowe
Starter
I've hoped since the end of last year that Jimmer and Tyreke would become the backcourt duo for this team. On paper, they shore up each other's deficiencies nicely. The piece that is missing that would make the whole thing work beautifully is another floor spacing long-range threat. Johnson plays good defense, but he has no outside shot. Without a second outside shooter, any guard you run out there with Tyreke won't be enough to keep defenses from clogging the paint, and that punishes Cousins too. IT looks bad on offense right now because he can't penetrate and kick to a shooter. He is the shooter. Jimmer and Brooks would look similarly bad. It's part of the problem with this team's construction.
IT could have success in a 2-man game with Cousins on offense, but that would freeze out Tyreke even more in the offense. Tyreke could have success with Jimmer and Thornton out there for kick out passes, but that would leave us exposed defensively. There is just no winning with the team as it is constructed, and whatever point guard you run out there is going to look crappy or selfish or both.
Jimmer has looked pretty good in limited minutes for a few games. He has been a far cry better than he was last season. Now you're agitating for him to start? Do you want him to fail?
Hadlowe
Starter
He won't see time against Lillard. He'll be in against Nolan Smith (who I really like as a bench point guard) and Ronnie Price.
Of course, that assumes a coach with reasonable rotations. He's probably just as likely to get a DNP-CD as he is to see the floor, though.
UK_King
Starter
well exactly...
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
That would be an unlikely matchup, and an unfortunate one.
It all depends on who loses minutes so Jimmer can get his.
If it Brooks, then those are backup PG minutes, minimal Lillard exposure. If its Johnson, with more of Reke at SF, those are the ultimate offense for defense swaps but presumably it owuld still mean Jimmer off the bench, and probably off the ball.
If its IT then as unlikely as that seems, there would be your Jimmer gets lit up by Lillard scenario. But that's always the proble mwith Jimmer as any kind of starter. He has no chance to guard any major offensive player, and he's too small to guard any big SG. So you play the Thunder and you wonder should Jimmer guard Westbrook, Durant, or 6'7" Thabo Sefalosha. Not good.
If its Reke or MT then I thoroughly expect to lose one or more members of this board to an assualt and battery charge.
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I wish the same. I don't think we'll be heard.
Padrino
All-Star
not exactly. my perspective is team-oriented, while yours is jimmer-oriented. i want the sacramento kings to succeed. you want jimmer fredette to succeed. you have gone and will go to great lengths to spin any conversational circumstance in jimmer's favor, which is more aggravating to see in every single thread than you will ever know. as brick has said recently, player-fans like you who seek to elevate their favorite player over the rest end up doing a great disservice to that player, as the incessant, oversized ra-ra'ing just turns everybody else off to the realities of that player...
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