Grades v. Grizzlies 11/05

[rhythmless]

A center that shoots 3s, 20 footers, and sometimes throws in a hook shot? Not scary. Those centers are all over the place. A center that pounds inside, uses his pivot foot, throws a hook, a drop step, up and unders, and can STILL hit the 3 when opposing centers (yao, howard, shaq, oden) refuse to go outside? Dangerous.

No one's knocking his varied abilities, but he needs to WANT and CHOOSE to do his damage inside, and let his outside shooting be the cherry on top. It will be the difference between an all star center and just a career starter.

Lets hope he chooses the right (read: harder) path.

 

[bajaden]

We all have our prefrences on what we want a player to be, and are sometimes disappointed that they don't play with our vision. I do think picking on Hawes for his one 3pt attempt a game is a tad nic picky. Especially since for the most part he's been wide open, and he's made them.

As is my fashion, because I've nothing better to do, I watched the game twice. The second time concentrating on Hawes and Thompson. Hawes actualy posted up quite a few times. On many of the times he was immediately doubled and he passed out to an open man. On some occasions he posted up and never recieved the ball. I can remember Gasol guarding Hawes on once in the game. I'm assuming that they must have thought Hawes was too quick and might get Gasol into foul trouble. Just speculation on my part.

I know some might consider Gasol a steal, but I'm still skeptical. If he has any offense, he failed to show it. I think he has value, but I'm not sure he's a starting center in this league.

I think after Thompson settled down he played pretty well. It was obvious that he was pretty hyped up for the home opener. Mikki had that one game he has from time to time that makes you think, Well, maybe he is worth having around.

Brown's defense might be, as Bricky says, terrible. But in the last two games it was better than both Beno's and BJax's. So terrible might be relative. Speaking of Beno, I can handle most of the things he doing. Not shooting well and playing matador defense. But I can't handle the turnovers. He appears to be rushing everything.

Salmons had a great game. If he could just play that way all the time. But he doesn't and thats the rub. But kudo's to him for this game. Got to give credit where its due. Offensively Martin was very good, and by now he probably knows that O.J.Mayo can shoot the ball, and it might be a good idea to guard him. In fairness, he did have a few good defensive moments in the game.

I would like to see Greene get a couple of minutes other than the garbage time he seems likely to get.

 

[tradepeja]

Nice guess, but nope. (Name the famous clock in London for $200).


Unless he's old and feeble and the legs are shot there really is no excuse for your biggest player to be playing pattycake with your PG 25 feet away from the hoop on any sort of consistent basis. You draw no fouls. You create no space for teammates. You grab no offensive rebounds. We might as well just put in another guard and gain some extra ballhandling.

There was absolutely no difference on defense between the C and PF position under Flip's 2004 Pistons. The only difference on offense between the 2 positions was that Rasheed was actually passed the ball some times with intent to score and plays were ran for him. Otherwise they both had the same jobs, same low block positions, and set the same screens for a cutting Billups, Rip, or Tayshaun. The distinction between their positions was merely on paper (much like the distinction between many other PF's and C's and SF's and SG's today) and the minute Wallace was gone Rasheed was "moved" to the starting C position.

In short, I agree that Spencer shouldn't make long range shooting his main scoring utensil. But I also agree that its ridiculous to complain about his ability to shoot. It is a very useful skill to have in your back pocket.

Nearly all big men in the league now have at the very least consistent 18 foot jump shot range. If you have a big man with even longer range, that's an advantage no matter which way you can spin it. Pretty much all systems have their big guys taking some perimeter shots. Of course, unless your Mehmet Okur, it would be stupid for it to be a big man's primary scoring option, but demonizing the skill is even stupider.

And how does having a shooting big guy create no space for teammates? That's exactly what it does. Having a big guy who can lure shot-blockers out of the key is huge and is the exact reason why so many teams have guys with at the very least mid-range jumpshot range.

 

[BritishColumbia]

And lets not put it all on Hawes either. He can't get a rebound, dribble up the court and then post up. Someone has to get him the ball. Many times he has his man posted and the wing player never gets him the ball. How many times do you see Salmons throw the ball into the post? What about Garcia?

Exactly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MoneyMike916]

we're happy

 

[Mad D]

we're happy

 

[rhythmless]

garcias wearing a button up, tie all the way knotted, a sweater/sweater vest, and a jacket buttoned fully and hes sweating. why not just take some layers off?

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

There was absolutely no difference on defense between the C and PF position under Flip's 2004 Pistons.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and simply say that you are misinformed. Or perhaps confused: there may not have been much of a difference with Flip's Pistons, but there most certainly was with Brown's Pistons: Ben Wallace jumped center, more often than not, defended the opposing team's center, and was defended by the opposing team's center on the offensive end. And, while they may have run plays to get Rasheed Wallace the ball almost literally anywhere on the court, Ben Wallace was not seen outside of the paint on the offensive end unless he was setting a screen. It is, at best, misguided to imply that the two Wallaces had the same (or, even, remotely similar) role in Larry Brown's offense.

As far as nbrans' remark about Duncan having hit some threes, it's all well and to the good to have the three point shot in your skillset, but there are a lot of off-ramps on the highway between "I have the ability to hit a three-point shot" and "the three point shot is a staple of my offense." Hawes, in a year and change, has already attempted a fifth as many three-pointers as Duncan has in his whole career, and I'd be willing to bet that as many as a third of Duncan's threes have been of the desperation-at-the-buzzer kind, as opposed to the spot-up-from-behind-the line kind, which virtually all of Hawes' threes have been to date. All things being equal, I'd rather Hawes were more like Duncan.

 

[Prince_XY]

I gave the team an A for winning.

A for Salmons and Moore :
As should be expected, John Salmons and Mikki Moore have had a good game against a terrible and inexperienced team. As starters of this team, I hope they would look as good as they looked now when they play against the elite teams in the NBA. Otherwise, the playoff hopes of the Kings will remain just a dream with both of them starting.

B for Martin, Hawes, and Thompson :
Matched against a rookie who is 2-3 inches smaller, Martin did pretty well offensively, but not as well defensively as he should, since he gave Mayo too many points. I gave him credit for scoring that much again and for having a mediocre defense as the leader of this team.

Hawes and Thompson, despite their mistakes due to inexperience continued to show they can be the key pieces for the kings future glory. The kind of raw offensive talent and the exceptional effort they give defending the paint are very encouraging.

C for Brown and Williams
For a seldom used Brown, I give him credit for not making costly mistakes. His 5 assists and decent defense certainly made him look like the future starter at #1 if Udrih remains to be Udrih.

Williams with a meager playing time did enough to hold his own making sure he was not a liability inside.

F for Udrih, Jackson, and Douby
Udrih looked like a terrible rookie playing against an elite team. He needs to wake up now, lest losing his starter status. He was so terrible I want to fire Theus for letting him play.

Jackson is just too slow and old. It looks like he already lost that enthusiasm to play great. I think he needs to retire NOW.

Well, what can I say about Douby? I think he needs to go. There is just no point of letting him stay as a King. The effort to become a real point guard will just never be on him.

 

[VF21]

Since your only criterion for grading is whether the team won or not, all the players on the team should get an A...



The knocks on Bobby Jackson are, IMHO, way out of line. No one with any kind of basketball acumen at all expects him to be the Bobby of old. What we do expect, however, is to see him energized and enthusiastic, spelling our point guards and providing hustle and energy. He still does that. I cannot imagine what game you were watching, because I watching Bobby very closely and he did a lot that doesn't show up in the stats. And his enthusiasm has not dimmed in the least.

Criticize him for slowing down, if you must. Criticize him for getting old. But do NOT criticize him for things that simply are NOT TRUE.

 

[yanon]

Having centers or power forwards who prefer shooting perimeter jumpshots is the reason why the Kings will continue be out rebounded by most teams. The Kings big men are simply too far away from the hoop to grab offensive rebounds. Furthermore, good low post players can cause the opposing big men to be in foul trouble. When opposing big men are in foul trouble, they will be more tentative on offense and rebounding.

Anyway, Hawe is a serviceable center. There are many Dwight Howards in the future drafts. What the Kings need is a true superstar, any position (if he is a pointguard, then even better), who excel in both defense & offense and have a commanding presence on court.