[Grades] Grades v. Blazers 04/15/12

[rainmaker]

your context is incorrect. personally, i am quite fond of the little rocket engine. but in my estimation, thomas' size (not just his height, mind you) is a tremendous problem, defensively. stronger guards can and have run straight through him, and yes, taller guards can and have shot over him. i'd prefer a backcourt combination of evans and williams that can compete defensively on any given night, while running offensive sets through cousins in the high post. or, at the very least, i'd like to see a thomas/evans/williams starting combo that provides enough defense to compensate for weaknesses elsewhere. but continuing to start two defensive sieves in thomas and thornton is simply a no-win situation. i don't like this nonsensical ROY campaign because i find the elevation of thomas has come at the expense of better players, and i want what's best for the team. its not "hating" to point out that at least one of either thomas or thornton should be coming off the bench in a move to improve defensive balance in the starting lineup and offensive balance in the second unit. that's just good sense. i've been saying it all season long: you balance your rotation...

now, its quite fine and dandy to look at the positives, but i'm not terribly interested in ra-ra'ing a single player beyond his potential. its fortunate that thomas seems like a level-headed kid, because otherwise this overblown campaigning might be detrimental to his development. regardless, i'd rather look at the big picture in one of the most disappointing kings' seasons in recent memory. tyreke's rookie year was, for better or worse, an entirely different bag of tricks. he was the front runner for rookie of the year, and, outside of the promising but inconsistent and volatile omri casspi, the success of his unique skill set was the only bright spot of that season. this season was supposed to be much, much different. the fans were not supposed to see all of their ra-ra's locked up in the performance of a single player again. demarcus cousins and tyreke evans were supposed to be developed further, and the team as a whole was supposed to begin taking strides towards legitimacy. isaiah thomas' emergence should have been icing on that cake, rather than the entire three-course meal. significant progress has not occurred, and, payroll issues aside, i lay significant blame at the feet of the kings' head coach, who has, seemingly, exactly zero ideas about how best to utilize his two most talented players. i am not some embittered tyreke fan who can't stand to see the spotlight taken off of him. rather, i am bitter that the kings' most talented players are not being maximized in their usage. its shameful, to be perfectly honest. you do not sabotage the future of your team by consistently taking the ball out of the hands of cousins and evans, especially when you have an ownership group that's doing enough to sabotage the team already...

none of this is isaiah thomas' fault, though. he has performed admirably in the face of rising expectations. but this team will not live or die by his development. again, he's an icing on the cake kind of player. he's a nice underdog story. he's a bobby jackson type of sparkplug that you want on your bench and in your locker room. but i'm sorry, he's not meat and potatoes. news flash: the modern nba is a grown *** man's league. it just is. the nate robinson's of the league can find success, but its usually of a nomadic variety (played for new york, traded to boston, traded to oklahoma city, waived, signed by, guess who? the warriors). thomas has the right kinda me-against-the-trees attitude that will help him survive in the nba, but his success in sacramento is the result of a perfect storm. the kings began the season without a guard who can effectively complement tyreke evans' skillset. jimmer was never gonna fill that role, and has underperformed, either way, which then opened the door for thomas' rise. his head coach is also a former point guard, and runs an uptempo, smallball-oriented offense that depends on speed but forgoes honest defense in favor of reach-in tactics. i have no qualms with thomas' emergence as a rotation player, but it should not come at the expense of demarcus cousins and tyreke evans, who are being featured less and less in the kings' offensive schemes. if the kings were winning, it'd be one thing, but the losing has increased since the all star break, with a home-heavy schedule, and with thomas starting at pg. keith smart is running a gimmick offense that doesn't motivate players to compete on the defensive end. he, or somebody on his staff, needs to exercise some creativity in the half court set, while drawing up some honest defensive schemes. if you wanna perpetually restart your rebuild while you're already in the middle of it, then go ahead and continue the gimmick ball, alienating cousins and evans until they decide to go play for a team that would more consistently value their unique skill sets. the maloofs probably won't [be able to] pony up the cash to re-sign them, anyway...

 

[Agent23]

your context is incorrect. Personally, i am quite fond of the little rocket engine. But in my estimation, thomas' size (not just his height, mind you) is a tremendous problem, defensively. Stronger guards can and have run straight through him, and yes, taller guards can and have shot over him. I'd prefer a backcourt combination of evans and williams that can compete defensively on any given night, while running offensive sets through cousins in the high post. Or, at the very least, i'd like to see a thomas/evans/williams starting combo that provides enough defense to compensate for weaknesses elsewhere. But continuing to start two defensive sieves in thomas and thornton is simply a no-win situation. I don't like this nonsensical roy campaign because i find the elevation of thomas has come at the expense of better players, and i want what's best for the team. Its not "hating" to point out that at least one of either thomas or thornton should be coming off the bench in a move to improve defensive balance in the starting lineup and offensive balance in the second unit. That's just good sense. I've been saying it all season long: You balance your rotation...

Now, its quite fine and dandy to look at the positives, but i'm not terribly interested in ra-ra'ing a single player beyond his potential. Its fortunate that thomas seems like a level-headed kid, because otherwise this overblown campaigning might be detrimental to his development. Regardless, i'd rather look at the big picture in one of the most disappointing kings' seasons in recent memory. Tyreke's rookie year was, for better or worse, an entirely different bag of tricks. He was the front runner for rookie of the year, and, outside of the promising but inconsistent and volatile omri casspi, the success of his unique skill set was the only bright spot of that season. This season was supposed to be much, much different. The fans were not supposed to see all of their ra-ra's locked up in the performance of a single player again. Demarcus cousins and tyreke evans were supposed to be developed further, and the team as a whole was supposed to begin taking strides towards legitimacy. Isaiah thomas' emergence should have been icing on that cake, rather than the entire three-course meal. Significant progress has not occurred, and, payroll issues aside, i lay significant blame at the feet of the kings' head coach, who has, seemingly, exactly zero ideas about how best to utilize his two most talented players. I am not some embittered tyreke fan who can't stand to see the spotlight taken off of him. Rather, i am bitter that the kings' most talented players are not being maximized in their usage. Its shameful, to be perfectly honest. You do not sabotage the future of your team by consistently taking the ball out of the hands of cousins and evans, especially when you have an ownership group that's doing enough to sabotage the team already...

None of this is isaiah thomas' fault, though. He has performed admirably in the face of rising expectations. But this team will not live or die by his development. Again, he's an icing on the cake kind of player. He's a nice underdog story. He's a bobby jackson type of sparkplug that you want on your bench and in your locker room. But i'm sorry, he's not meat and potatoes. News flash: The modern nba is a grown *** man's league. It just is. The nate robinson's of the league can find success, but its usually of a nomadic variety (played for new york, traded to boston, traded to oklahoma city, waived, signed by, guess who? The warriors). Thomas has the right kinda me-against-the-trees attitude that will help him survive in the nba, but his success in sacramento is the result of a perfect storm. The kings began the season without a guard who can effectively complement tyreke evans' skillset. Jimmer was never gonna fill that role, and has underperformed, either way, which then opened the door for thomas' rise. His head coach is also a former point guard, and runs an uptempo, smallball-oriented offense that depends on speed but forgoes honest defense in favor of reach-in tactics. I have no qualms with thomas' emergence as a rotation player, but it should not come at the expense of demarcus cousins and tyreke evans, who are being featured less and less in the kings' offensive schemes. If the kings were winning, it'd be one thing, but the losing has increased since the all star break, with a home-heavy schedule, and with thomas starting at pg. Keith smart is running a gimmick offense that doesn't motivate players to compete on the defensive end. He, or somebody on his staff, needs to exercise some creativity in the half court set, while drawing up some honest defensive schemes. If you wanna perpetually restart your rebuild while you're already in the middle of it, then go ahead and continue the gimmick ball, alienating cousins and evans until they decide to go play for a team that would more consistently value their unique skill sets. The maloofs probably won't [be able to] pony up the cash to re-sign them, anyway...

this this this this

 

[pshn80]

your context is incorrect. personally, i am quite fond of the little rocket engine. but in my estimation, thomas' size (not just his height, mind you) is a tremendous problem, defensively. stronger guards can and have run straight through him, and yes, taller guards can and have shot over him. i'd prefer a backcourt combination of evans and williams that can compete defensively on any given night, while running offensive sets through cousins in the high post. or, at the very what's best for the team. its not "hating" to point out that at least one of either thomas or thornton should be coming off the bench in a move to improve defensive balance in the starting lineup and offensive balance in the second unit. that's just good sense. i've been saying it all season long: you balance your rotation...

now, its quite fine and dandy to look at the positives, but i'm not terribly interested in ra-ra'ing a single player beyond his potential. its fortunate that thomas seems like a level-headed kid, because otherwise this overblown campaigning might be detrimental to his development. regardless, i'd rather look at the big picture in one of the most disappointing kings' seasons in recent memory. tyreke's rookie year was, for better or worse, an entirely different bag of tricks. he was the front runner for rookie of the year, and, outside of the promising but inconsistent and volatile omri casspi, the success of his unique skill set e supposed to be developed further, and the team as a whole was supposed to begin taking strides towards legitimacy. isaiah thomas' emergence should have been icing on that cake, rather than the entire three-course meal. significant progress has not occurred, and, payroll issues aside, i lay significant blame at the feet of the kings' head coach, who has, seemingly, exactly zero ideas about how best to utilize his two most talented players. i am not some embittered tyreke fan who can't stand to see the spotlight taken off of him. rather, i am bitter that the kings' most talented players are not being maximized in their usage. its shameful, to be perfectly honest. you do not sabotage the future of your team by consistently taking the ball out of the hands of cousins and evans, especially when you have an ownership group that's doing enough to sabotage the team already...

none of this is isaiah thomas' fault, though. he has performed admirably in the face of rising expectations. but this team will not live or die by his development. again, he's an icing on the cake kind of player. he's a nice underdog story. he's a bobby jackson type of sparkplug that you want on your bench and in your locker room. but i'm sorry, he's not meat and potatoes. news flash: the modern nba is a grown *** man's league. it just is. the nate robinson's of the league can find success, but its usually of a nomadic variety (played for new york, traded to boston, traded to oklahoma city, waived, signed by, guess who? the warriors). thomas has the right kinda me-against-the-trees attitude that will help him survive in the nba, but his success in sacramento is the result of a perfect storm. the kings began the season without a guard who can effectively complement tyreke evans' skillset. jimmer was never gonna fill that role, and has underperformed, either way, which then opened the door for thomas' rise. his head coach is also a former point guard, and runs an uptempo, smallball-oriented offense that depends on speed but forgoes honest defense in favor of reach-in tactics. i have no qualms with thomas' emergence as a rotation player, but it should not come at the expense of demarcus cousins and tyreke evans, who are being featured less and less in taff, needs to exercise some creativity in the half court set, while drawing up some honest defensive schemes. if you wanna perpetually restart your rebuild while you're already in the middle of it, then go ahead and continue the gimmick ball, alienating cousins and evans until they decide to go play for a team that would more consistently value their unique skill sets. the maloofs probably won't [be able to] pony up the cash to re-sign them, anyway...

I thought we were talking about --------- Thomas ---------- how his year was compared to 59 others ------------ ROY,because he had a good year ------------ his perfornance, offense and defensr ------------- basketball -------- kid from U of W. What is all this Kings' team performance bull**** , there are other threads for that. I shake my head in absolute disbelief.

 

[Padrino]

I thought we were talking about --------- Thomas ---------- how his year was compared to 59 others ------------ ROY,because he had a good year ------------ his perfornance, offense and defensr ------------- basketball -------- kid from U of W. What is all this Kings' team performance bull**** , there are other threads for that. I shake my head in absolute disbelief.

i thought this was a grades thread... in which we discuss the team's performance... i shake my head in absolute disbelief...

 

[VF21]

And I shake my head in absolute disbelief that some of my favorite posters are ending up sniping at each other...

One year it was Peja. Another year it was Kevin Martin. Now it's Isaiah Thomas. I really just don't get it.

/oldperson'slamentation

 

[Padrino]

And I shake my head in absolute disbelief that some of my favorite posters are ending up sniping at each other...

One year it was Peja. Another year it was Kevin Martin. Now it's Isaiah Thomas. I really just don't get it.

/oldperson'slamentation

i think this is a mischaracterization. there is nothing wrong with isaiah thomas as a player on an implicit level, and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone here who isn't satisfied with his ability to contribute at a high level. i certainly have no problem with him. i rather like the little bundle of energy...

that said, many of us are dissatisfied with the ways in which both the organization and the coaching staff have elevated thomas' role to the detriment of the growth of the team. pushing tyreke's ROY campaign so adamantly a few years back was likely ill-advised, but there was also nothing else to root for in sacramento. however, in tyreke's third year and demarcus' second year, i expected a lot more work to be done towards clearly defining the prominence of their roles within the team's framework. but nearly the exact opposite thing has happened: keith smart decided to problematize their roles on the team, which is both unfortunate and idiotic (and, in my opinion, an egregious offense that should result in his firing, if the maloofs weren't too broke to pursue a real full time coach at the level of, say, nate mcmillan)...

i understand that the emergence of isaiah thomas is exciting to some, and i welcome them to revel in it. but the hard-line campaigning from MSE and the prominent featuring of thomas in the starting unit ignores a much bigger and much more important picture. thomas will likely have a successful career as a rotation player in the nba, but the kings' drafted two potential cornerstone pieces prior to thomas' arrival in sacramento, and the development of those two players has completely stagnated due to the idiocy embedded in keith smart's particular brand of basketball. moving tyreke to SF, and, in effect, shoving him into the proverbial corner, is tremendously short-sighted, in my opinion. it strips away so many of his natural advantages over the opposition, and renders his unique skillset ordinary in the face of bigger, longer defenders (evans/durant matchup? what the ever-living-****?!)...

and i have repeatedly insisted that any success demarcus cousins has had this season has come in spite of his head coach. his recent inconsistency seems to be evidence of that. he's likely exhausted from having to fight so hard for a place in the offense. some days he's up for that battle. other days he's not. and i'm still waiting for keith smart to draw up a single pick and pop play for demarcus that the kings can go back to on a consistent basis. but that kinduva deliberate halfcourt set doesn't fit the template of smart's gimmick offense, so it doesn't appear before us in any practical manner...

and this is all before we discuss smart's complete lack of defensive schema. he actually commands his players to reach in, from isaiah thomas up to cousins!! what kinda defensive philosophy is that, especially when you have the most foul-prone center in the game? again, pure idiocy. if anybody at kingsfans.com isn't well versed in the minutiae of nba defense, just watch the chicago bulls or the boston celtics. its tempting to pay attention to that bouncy orange ball, but if you look closely at a well-oiled defense, you'll notice that its every bit as deliberate in its execution as the most sophisticated of offenses. keith smart is playing with tinker toys while the bulls are busy constructing a great wall of china-sized defense. it can drive a fan crazy with envy, especially when tom thibodeau interviewed for the same head coaching position that paul westphal was fired from this season...

ultimately, i want the kings to succeed as a team, and, in my opinion, keith smart has held back and handicapped his two best players. if it isn't obvious already, this has absolutely nothing to do with isaiah thomas. he's doin' just fine, for the most part, busying himself with all sortsa expectation-defying ****. but the team has MASSIVELY underperformed this season. i expected .400 ball from the kings. they'll be lucky to finish at .300, which isn't exactly the marked improvement i was hoping for. in my estimation, the ball needs to be in cousins' and evans' hands for this team to achieve any sustainable, long term success. they have to be allowed to **** up together so that they might learn how to win together. and they are waaaaaay behind the learning curve for exactly two reasons: 1) management has not surrounded them with complementary talent. 2) the coaching staff has not put them in a position to thrive...

isaiah thomas is unexpected, shiny, and new. his talent is worth celebrating. but i think its unfair for people to assume that those of us dissatisfied with the sacrifices made to highlight thomas are targeting him in a specifically negative manner...

 

[Mass]

Thank you Padrino, I completely agree with you on everything you said in the last 2 pages. Great job!

 

[swisshh]

I don't see how IT has been elevated to a point detrimental to the team. He's doing his role and doing it fine. He's no more in the way of others than TWill is right now. The only player on a higher scale is Cousins, who gets away with not running the floor more than others.

Seriously, how does IT get in the way of Cousins? He's helped Cousins more than any other player. IT is the first PG on the team to feed his big man the ball. The two man game of IT & Cuz on the pick n roll is one of the best plays this team has. How has IT gotten in the way of Reke? By taking over PG duty? That was never Reke's future to begin with. Tyreke needs to learn to play off the ball. The only player in Evans way is Evans right now. Tyreke has major issues in his game that he needs to resolve. Letting him dribble-death the ball has only let him off the hook.

And why would you expect .400 ball from a roster so misaligned and imbalanced? 1 undersized PG, way too many SGs, no decent, reliable NBA sized SF and not one shotblocking big man. No veterans on the team to get people together. Very few consistent players. Very little leadership. There's a lot of young talent but very little of it fits together.

 

[Spike]

Padrino speaks my mind.

Tyreke doesn't need to learn how to play off the ball. Smart needs to learn how to play with the ball in Tyreke's hands. That's how you grow a franchise player. Should Kobe play off the ball? Wade? Lebron? That's the kind of player we should be trying to build. Playing off the ball creates a complementary piece, a nice "hey-look-at-him-spot-up" player that defenses don't have to cater to. In fact, playing off the ball will probably limit his ceiling - but hey, if coach says that's what he needs to do...

Smart earned my kudos earlier in the year with Evans at the PG position because he was coaching from the sideline. He was working with him on finding people in the right spots - it's what you do. You coach. You teach. It was probably the first time he's had actual teaching. Calipari's dribble drive didn't really do much in terms of prepare for the NBA, except for enhance his ability to drive to the hoop, which is what he can do with success.

The book on Smart is pretty clear now, though - it's easier to go small and try to outscore than it is to spend time designing a proper half-court scheme that utilizes your franchise talents. It's easier to put the ball in IT's hands and say "run". Hopefully Petrie goes with some bigger players this off-season and a quality SF in order to force Smart's hand, because for some reason it still seems unclear to people. He's playing this style because he wants to, and there are enough guards on the team for him to get his wish.

 

[mac]

Padrino speaks my mind.

Tyreke doesn't need to learn how to play off the ball. Smart needs to learn how to play with the ball in Tyreke's hands. That's how you grow a franchise player. Should Kobe play off the ball? Wade? Lebron? That's the kind of player we should be trying to build. Playing off the ball creates a complementary piece, a nice "hey-look-at-him-spot-up" player that defenses don't have to cater to. In fact, playing off the ball will probably limit his ceiling - but hey, if coach says that's what he needs to do...

Smart earned my kudos earlier in the year with Evans at the PG position because he was coaching from the sideline. He was working with him on finding people in the right spots - it's what you do. You coach. You teach. It was probably the first time he's had actual teaching. Calipari's dribble drive didn't really do much in terms of prepare for the NBA, except for enhance his ability to drive to the hoop, which is what he can do with success.

The book on Smart is pretty clear now, though - it's easier to go small and try to outscore than it is to spend time designing a proper half-court scheme that utilizes your franchise talents. It's easier to put the ball in IT's hands and say "run". Hopefully Petrie goes with some bigger players this off-season and a quality SF in order to force Smart's hand, because for some reason it still seems unclear to people. He's playing this style because he wants to, and there are enough guards on the team for him to get his wish.

Well to be fair, it's without question that Evans need to work on his off-the-ball game. But making him work on that aspect of his game and throwing him to the corner and saying "find a way to score without us putting the ball in your hands all the time" are entirely different things.

 

[Section 101]

Padrino speaks my mind.

Tyreke doesn't need to learn how to play off the ball. Smart needs to learn how to play with the ball in Tyreke's hands. That's how you grow a franchise player. Should Kobe play off the ball? Wade? Lebron? That's the kind of player we should be trying to build. Playing off the ball creates a complementary piece, a nice "hey-look-at-him-spot-up" player that defenses don't have to cater to. In fact, playing off the ball will probably limit his ceiling - but hey, if coach says that's what he needs to do...

Smart earned my kudos earlier in the year with Evans at the PG position because he was coaching from the sideline. He was working with him on finding people in the right spots - it's what you do. You coach. You teach. It was probably the first time he's had actual teaching. Calipari's dribble drive didn't really do much in terms of prepare for the NBA, except for enhance his ability to drive to the hoop, which is what he can do with success.

The book on Smart is pretty clear now, though - it's easier to go small and try to outscore than it is to spend time designing a proper half-court scheme that utilizes your franchise talents. It's easier to put the ball in IT's hands and say "run". Hopefully Petrie goes with some bigger players this off-season and a quality SF in order to force Smart's hand, because for some reason it still seems unclear to people. He's playing this style because he wants to, and there are enough guards on the team for him to get his wish.

the difference between Evans and Kobe/Wade/LBJ is they latter have a mid range game. How often do you see those 3 dribble the ball for 15 seconds then make a move? Never.

 

[CruzDude]

........ I feel like I have to go take a shower after listening to Jerry Reynolds have on air sex with IT for the past 2 hours,...

I gotta find out how he does that and at his age!

 

[Agent23]

the difference between Evans and Kobe/Wade/LBJ is they latter have a mid range game. How often do you see those 3 dribble the ball for 15 seconds then make a move? Never.

Did they have midrange games earlier in their careers? Did they have plays ran for them? Tyreke is practically placed in the corner and mainly scores from fast break opportunities.

 

[CruzDude]

Padrino speaks my mind.

Tyreke doesn't need to learn how to play off the ball. Smart needs to learn how to play with the ball in Tyreke's hands. That's how you grow a franchise player. Should Kobe play off the ball? Wade? Lebron? That's the kind of player we should be trying to build. Playing off the ball creates a complementary piece, a nice "hey-look-at-him-spot-up" player that defenses don't have to cater to. In fact, playing off the ball will probably limit his ceiling - but hey, if coach says that's what he needs to do...

While you make a valid point however there is one problem: Kobe, Wade and LeBron all have excellent mid-range and floating jump shots, the missing link in Tyreke's arsenal.

 

[Spike]

While you make a valid point however there is one problem: Kobe, Wade and LeBron all have excellent mid-range and floating jump shots, the missing link in Tyreke's arsenal.

But they didn't have it at the start - and that's where we are. I agree that he needs that mid-range shot to be deadly - but he can't do it/get better at it without the ball in his hand. That shot usually comes off the dribble in a half-cout set, which ties to the greater issue at hand, I suppose.

 

[mac]

the difference between Evans and Kobe/Wade/LBJ is they latter have a mid range game. How often do you see those 3 dribble the ball for 15 seconds then make a move? Never.

How often have you seen Tyreke do that in the past 10 games? Go count for me. With video proof.

 

[Section 101]

How often have you seen Tyreke do that in the past 10 games? Go count for me. With video proof.

He doesn't because he's not the primary ball handler !

 

[mac]

He doesn't because he's not the primary ball handler !

So what you're saying is you're basing your judgment that Evans should not be given the ball in his hands on his earlier play, whereby he didn't receive much coaching, ignoring the fact that when Smart was making an effort to turn him into a proper PG he was showing improvement. In other words, you'd rather we chuck Evans in the corner and tell him to man up and play off the ball or **** off instead of trying to develop him.

Why is it then that when we do give him the ball now at the elbow or something he doesn't do what you say? Why is it then that he now swings the ball a lot more? What is to say that he can't do that if we make him the primary ball-handler?

And I can for sure find you several clips of IT dribbling the ball around for a good portion of the shotclock before making a move or just dumping it off to Cousins for an outside shot. But you have no problem with that?

 

[mr. moustache]

Indeed, quite the stretch to assume:



meant "He's one of the best second round picks in the history of the league"

Again, pedantic. As you are fully aware; any comparison with a rookie and players that have played more than one year are incomplete until said rookie has played more than one year.

Knowing all we know about IT right now(end of rookie year), Geoff Petrie made "one of the best second round picks in the history of the league" when he picked IT at 60.

Marcus Thorton was another great second round pick and per/36, IT has better numbers in FG%, 3P%, FTA, and AST. They're essentially tied in rebounding and while Thorton averages about 3 more points a game, he needs another four shot attempts to get it. I'd argue their defense is comparable.

I'm not bringing up the comparison to denigrate Thorton. He's a nice player. That IT has been playing as well as Thorton is a big compliment.

As to the arguments that this is a terrible team and that's why IT is putting up good numbers; that same argument applies to all of the players. Our team is stacked with intriguing high usage players and we are definitely a terrible team.

 

[mr. moustache]

i think this is a mischaracterization. there is nothing wrong with isaiah thomas as a player on an implicit level, and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone here who isn't satisfied with his ability to contribute at a high level. i certainly have no problem with him. i rather like the little bundle of energy...

...isaiah thomas is unexpected, shiny, and new. his talent is worth celebrating. but i think its unfair for people to assume that those of us dissatisfied with the sacrifices made to highlight thomas are targeting him in a specifically negative manner...

I share the exact same concerns and the blame falls squarely on the GM and the coach. Imagine if Jimmer was playing as well as IT is. We'd be in a similar situation. That was the best case scenario getting Jimmer from the 7th pick.

We have three guards, all capable of scoring at a high level, and two of them are defensive liabilities. All three deserve(on this team) offensive touches, but no two of the three are an ideal starting backcourt. That's on the GM.

The coach decides to play all of them at once so our best(still mediocre) backcourt defender is now playing SF. Bizarre.

As for the coach misusing Cousins, I tend to agree, but he's a tough nut to crack. I'm not in the locker-room, but if I'm the coach, I get him touches so he stays engaged, and I reprimand/coach between games because he's too immature to take criticism without taking his own game down in flames.

Anyway, I think the simple fact is that IT has absolutely taken full advantage of the opportunities given to him. These "opportunities" at times literally take the ball out of the hands of Cousins/Evans. Add the preposterous jocking by MSE and I think some people are directing their ire at IT and his "player fans" when they're actually frustrated with the entire organization as a whole.

It's just weird seeing a good bit of negative discussion about the last pick in the draft when he's killing it out there on the basketball court.

 

[Section 101]

So what you're saying is you're basing your judgment that Evans should not be given the ball in his hands on his earlier play, whereby he didn't receive much coaching, ignoring the fact that when Smart was making an effort to turn him into a proper PG he was showing improvement. In other words, you'd rather we chuck Evans in the corner and tell him to man up and play off the ball or **** off instead of trying to develop him.

Why is it then that when we do give him the ball now at the elbow or something he doesn't do what you say? Why is it then that he now swings the ball a lot more? What is to say that he can't do that if we make him the primary ball-handler?

And I can for sure find you several clips of IT dribbling the ball around for a good portion of the shotclock before making a move or just dumping it off to Cousins for an outside shot. But you have no problem with that?

Hey, I was one of the few blaming Westfail from the beginning saying he wasn't doing the right thing and not teaching Evans and others. I think people get off the ball and jump shooter mixed up. Off the ball means, moving with out the ball. Jump shoot is standing in the corner. If you look at Evans drives the past month or so the ones he is most successful in making the basket is when he gets the ball while in motion. It's not when he stands at the top of the key then makes a move on his man. When he gets the ball while moving or on a pass where the defense is moving he can get the the rim and not have 4 guys waiting.

The primary ball handler needs to know when to slow things down and when to speed up. It's about knowing who's hot and when to get the ball in the post. Evans doesn't have it. He also has poor court vision as a PG. He only see's what is in front of him.

When IT has the ball he's moving, not standing around. He's working the screens and getting others involved.

 

[Section 101]

Did they have midrange games earlier in their careers? Did they have plays ran for them? Tyreke is practically placed in the corner and mainly scores from fast break opportunities.

Yes they did have mid range games. I remember LBJ's first game where he was nailing shots from everywhere thinking they said he couldn't shoot.

 

[Bricklayer]

Yes they did have mid range games. I remember LBJ's first game where he was nailing shots from everywhere thinking they said he couldn't shoot.

No he didn't. I remember LeBron's first game too, but it was a complete aberration. LeBron didn't shoot .418 that year because he was missing dunks. His shot was a backboard breaking catapult at the time. Took him years to sort it out. In fact really never did at a high level. Still dominates wihtout it.

 

[Agent23]

Yes they did have mid range games. I remember LBJ's first game where he was nailing shots from everywhere thinking they said he couldn't shoot.

BS. None of them did. I remember Ray Allen mocking Kobe the summer going into his 4th year in the league because Kobe claimed to have made 1000 jumpers a day because he wanted to have a better mid range to three point jumper. Lebron just added mid range to his game last year!

 

[Section 101]

No he didn't. I remember LeBron's first game too, but it was a complete aberration. LeBron didn't shoot .418 that year because he was missing dunks. His shot was a backboard breaking catapult at the time. Took him years to sort it out. In fact really never did at a high level. Still dominates wihtout it.

And he dunks the ball, doesn't throw up weak stuff. Hoopdata doesn't go back to LBJ's rookie year.

so lets look at PER starting with rookie years. LBJ was a year younger than Evans and Wade a year older their rookie years.

LBJ 18.3, 25.74, 28.17, 24.56
Wade 17.61, 23.20, 27.68, 29.04
Evans 18.28, 14.46, 16.4

So right now Evans rookie year is the aberration. Please stop comparing him to any all star let alone future hall of famers.

You want the right comparison here ya go.

Larry Hughes 15.82, 17.58, 21.63, 14.08.

 

[pshn80]

Is all of this to the point that IT is way ahead of LBJ, Wade, Jordan, etc. as a rookie shooter? The future is bright? Are any of you confident you know how to use our players next season? I know, differently, that is the obvious mind set around here. But how do we use the guys we have to best advantage? How can you help Petrie and Smart who have the responsibility and the authority to do it? Assessments of individual players do not make a team.

Do I know how to best use our players next year to the best advantage of the team? No. But I am looking forward to what those in charge do. They are not only in charge they have more interest, more ability, more at stake than me or any of my cohorts on here. But of courese we're not talking about this on this thread, we're talking about IT and ROY this year. Sorry.

 

[ppine]

Some more wins would stop this irrelevant discussion in its tracks. Losing makes every fan edgy.

Brick,
I watched Isaiah Thomas make 3s from well beyond the college line for 4 years before he came to the NBA.

 

[Section 101]

BS. None of them did. I remember Ray Allen mocking Kobe the summer going into his 4th year in the league because Kobe claimed to have made 1000 jumpers a day because he wanted to have a better mid range to three point jumper. Lebron just added mid range to his game last year!

Having the game and being effective are 2 different things. They had a midrange pull up and used it. Not at the shooting % of today. But Evans doesn't even have the pull up game now. The only reason he's taking the 15 footers is because they have backed off and are letting him shoot it. He's not driving, stopping and pulling up.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Some more wins would stop this irrelevant discussion in its tracks. Losing makes every fan edgy.

I'm not quite sure that's the number one reason fans are testy around here these days. Just saying.

 

[Spike]

The only reason he's taking the 15 footers is because they have backed off and are letting him shoot it. He's not driving, stopping and pulling up.

He would consistently need the ball in his hands in order to do that, no?