Ellis or Thornton?

[Entity]

if you get Ellis at the same price as thornton and dump thornton. The only question here that needs to be asked really is. Who is better on this team with Vasquez, Mclemore, IT, Ellis or thornton. Thats the question needed to be asked. I sure don't want both. I also don't want to waste the Salmons ender to get Ellis to have him in the mix with the others. To Me its Thornton or Ellis. simple as that. if we have both then cap space sucks next season.

 

[kingsnation]

if you get Ellis at the same price as thornton and dump thornton. The only question here that needs to be asked really is. Who is better on this team with Vasquez, Mclemore, IT, Ellis or thornton. Thats the question needed to be asked. I sure don't want both. I also don't want to waste the Salmons ender to get Ellis to have him in the mix with the others. To Me its Thornton or Ellis. simple as that. if we have both then cap space sucks next season.

Trade MT and use our cap space to sign someone else.

 

[Entity]

Trade MT and use our cap space to sign someone else.

No lol. can't deviate from the choices. Seriously it seems clear we want him right? but we can't go over cap obviously. I don't think they wan't to lose Salmons with the question mark at SF. They must move Thornton to get Ellis. I think that is whats going on right now.

 

[Glenn]

Trade MT and use our cap space to sign someone else.

In other words, there should have been an option to want neither which is my attitude.

 

[Entity]

In other words, there should have been an option to want neither which is my attitude.

yeah its just I don't think that happens or you put all your hopes and dreams on a rookie with no backup. I mean if Ben gets hurt or gets the flu does IT play SG or i guess it could be Salmons.

 

[VF21]

I voted Thornton. I don't want Monta Ellis for the simple reason I DETEST people who refer to themselves in the third person AND I don't think STA is big enough for his ego.

 

[King-Da-Yah]

In other words, there should have been an option to want neither which is my attitude.

You don't know the power of the dark side! I must obey Monta Elli'...

 

[HndsmCelt]

Well obviously the only reason to sign Monta is because you see him as an upgrade to MT at the 2. The idea of playing ME at the 1 makes the Vasques move even dumber.I am sure some Ellis fan will post number showing what a great upgrade he is over Thorton, but from the cheap seats I see him a redundant talent who only post bigger number by jacking up more shots. Does that leave Thorton on the bench? maybe, but since there arecap issues once Ellis is signed, I assume they have to at least consider trading away Thorton.

 

[Entity]

I voted Thornton. I don't want Monta Ellis for the simple reason I DETEST people who refer to themselves in the third person AND I don't think STA is big enough for his ego.

Entity understand your plight.

 

[TyFreak Evans]

Neither, but since I have to pick one, I voted for Marcus Thornton.

I'd go with Ellis if I wanted to see a better overall game. But I want Thornton for his better overall attitude. We're a young team, our locker room does not need to include a mess such as Monta Ellis.

 

[cuad]

Monta Ellis is one of those million dollar talent but ten cent brain guys, which is not good for the culture. I'd rather have Marcus Thornton.

 

[Glenn]

Let me throw this in as I think we don't know what to expect from MT now that he has been in the hands of Smart and the Maloofs in complete disinterest mode. Before he signed his $8 mil contract, I thought he was worth it as his play was at a high level. I won't pull out stats to back up what I am saying. I don't recall people whining about the size of MT's contract. Now we have an MT sullied by the input of Smart and his last year seemed a bit aimless. I don't study these matters as much as others so I presume there is some stat that will prove me wrong. I seem to remember a guy who we wanted to have the ball in the fourth quarter or in the last minute. This last year, he wasn't so successful. Deciding whether I want MT on this team is not easy as we are deciding where we want the MT pre-Smart or the MT post-Smart. In any case, that's the way it seems. Many of the players that were on the team last year may spring to life.

Just to nail home what I think is different in the last two years, I realize he was in Smart's hands both years but things went south last year. I think last year a variety of players simply had reached their cracking point and threw up their hands in frustration. The toxic locker room was as much the fault of the Maloofs and Smart than any individual player. A bad coach is one thing but pile on the effect of having owners who didn't even attend games and you have a uniquely bad situation. I look forward to seeing the actions of comparable players under the Vivek/Malone regime.

I feel the same about several other players including one we lost in a trade.

 

[sdballer]

If Ellis was willing to come in as a 6th man and had matured into that off the bench scorer we need, I'd go with Ellis at 8-9m. But he hasn't and brings more negative on both sides of the court along with major issues off the court. Pass.

 

[Amory]

The problem is, if we are talking about talent then it is Ellis all the way...

Everything, we have to go with Thornton.

 

[funkykingston]

I think the question is flawed as I don't think Ellis signs for what Thornton will make this year and next. I think you also have to take into account that Ellis is wanting (and likely getting) a 3 or 4 year deal whereas Thornton comes off the books after the 2014-2015 season.

Honestly, Ellis makes more sense as a sixth man because he can swing between guard spots where Thornton can't. And with McLemore not having ballhandling/playmaking abilities you can't play he and Thornton together as you could with he and Ellis. Still, I doubt that Ellis would accept a sixth man role meaning he's either our starting PG or he's pushing McLemore to the bench as the starting SG AND he'd tie up $10 million or so in caproom for a year or two longer than Thornton would.

Even with the Landry signing, the Kings would only have Cousins, McLemore, Mandry and (if he's not traded) Jason Thompson on the books after two seasons for a cap hit of around $35 or $36 million. Add in couple rookies and you're still around $40-$42 million meaning there's a big chunk of capspace to add another player or a pair of them.

Obviously things will likely change dramatically in the next couple years but keeping cap flexibility seems like a better idea than an Ellis/McLemore backcourt.

 

[Hadlowe]

Let me throw this in as I think we don't know what to expect from MT now that he has been in the hands of Smart. Before he signed his $8 mil contract, I thought he was worth it as his play was at a high level. I won't pull out stats to back up what I am saying. I don't recall people whining about the size of MT's contract. Now we have an MT sullied by the input of Smart and his last year seemed a bit aimless. I don't study these matters as much as others so I presume there is some stat that will prove me wrong. I seem to remember a guy who we wanted to have the ball in the fourth quarter or in the last minute. This last year, he wasn't so successful. Deciding whether I want MT on this team is not easy as we are deciding where we want the MT pre-Smart or the MT post-Smart. In any case, that's the way it seems. Many of the players that were on the team last year may spring to life. I realize he was in Smart's hands both years but things went south last year. I think last year a variety of players simply had reached their cracking point and threw up their hands in frustration. The toxic locker room was as much the fault of the Maloofs and Smart than any individual player. A bad coach is one thing but pile on the effect of having owners who didn't even attend games and you have a uniquely bad situation. I look forward to seeing the actions of comparable players under the Vivek/Malone regime.

I feel the same about several other players including one we lost in a trade.

I don't dislike Thornton as a player. He brings a scorer's mentality and a hard edge on offense, which can be useful in the right system. Thornton is a liability on defense due to a lack of effort, bad habits, and his lack of size. He is also a below-average passer at the 2, largely due to that scorer's mentality thing. His abilities seem tailored to bench scoring, but he lacks the handles and facilitating mindset of a sixth man in the vein of Jason Terry.

Monta has all of Thornton's defensive deficiencies, but is a better facilitator and ballhandler on offense. If he could be convinced to be a sixth man, he would be amazing. I don't think his personality would allow that.

Given my druthers, I wouldn't have either, but I'll take Monta simply due to his better passing and ballhandling.

 

[pshn80]

I chose NEither. And feel very strongly about it. I want Thornton gone and don't want Ellis on the opening day roster. Also I fully support the new FO. How long can I live this way.

 

[sidney]

If Thornton is gone, IT is squashed, our new starting SF is a 5th scoring option, our starting PG is a 4th scoring option, and our major minute rookie was not known to be a major shot-chucker in college....

dare I say that there may be room for an Ellis to chuck 16 shots a game?

This is not the way I wanted this summer to go, but given some of the other players already brought in, if you hold a gun to my head Ellis is going to be a better fit than Thornton.

 

[Rockmeister]

I voted Thornton. I don't want Monta Ellis for the simple reason I DETEST people who refer to themselves in the third person AND I don't think STA is big enough for his ego.

And that is the reason why I voted for Thornton.

 

[DesertFox]

MT is not a great fit on this team, and I have no interest in keeping him around.
That said, I would keep him over signing Ellis everyday of the week.

 

[apollo916]

Monta... no brainer.... how much did thornton average? Numbers dont lie. If I am looking for the better scorer. Its monta

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Thornton all the way. less of a ball hog, less egotistical, cheaper, and he will be fine with the 6th man roll. Monta will demand to start.

 

[sdballer]

Monta... no brainer.... how much did thornton average? Numbers dont lie. If I am looking for the better scorer. Its monta

But that depends on the role. The half season MT was the guy here he averaged 21/game. Not saying Ellis has demonstrated more long term scoring ability, just don't think you should compare Ellis as the number 1 option vs MT as a sub last year.

 

[Kings Faithful]

But that depends on the role. The half season MT was the guy here he averaged 21/game. Not saying Ellis has demonstrated more long term scoring ability, just don't think you should compare Ellis as the number 1 option vs MT as a sub last year.

Honestly i think Thornton most valuable quality is his clutch shooting. That alone makes him more valuable for our team in my mind.

 

[roasthawg]

Basketball wise I'll take Monta... he can get to the rim which we need now that Tyreke is gone. He's a better passre than Marcus and can play the point which Marcus can't do.

Attitude wise I'm concerned... Marcus has been a good team guy during his time here. Wondering if we'd be able to say the same about Monta.

 

[kingjatt]

in a perfect world neither, Monta is better than Thornton but not at the contract length he will demand, since thornton only has 2 years left on his deal i would rather bite that bullet than a bigger one with monta. lets face it, this roster, barring a blockbuster trade, isnt getting anywhere near the playoffs with or without monta, so we might as well be as bad as possible and save some cap room in the process while having a better shot at a top pick in next years draft, the moment we traded reke for an expiring roleplayer it signaled (to me) a total rebuild and to do that we must stay bad while saving as much cap space as possible to use down the line.

The FO might not have seen a total rebuild coming but once they found out how hard it is to add even a solid starter via free agency in sacramento they may have changed course.
whether it was not assessing the market correctly or the fact that all 3 of the shotcallers are rookies we will never know but in my opinion they will kick themselves for letting reke walk and not let that mistake happen again with Cuz.
Acquiring star/potential star talent in sacramento is only done via once in a lifetime trade or via the draft and with next years draft being stacked I want us to lose as many games as possible, Monta would definately hurt that cause.

 

[Fear the Putin]

the chance of **** hitting the fan with Monta is a lot greater than with Thornton.

 

[Npliam]

Npliam doesn't like it when dudes refer to themselves in the 3rd person either but Ellis is better than Thornton.

 

[Spike]

Ellis has more talent, but does not fit Sacramento. He can take his attitude and talents to the ATL.

 

[The_Jamal]

Here's the intriguing idea with Monta.

IF you get him to buy into a 6th man role and use his playmaking ability more, then he's the most dangerous weapon off the bench in the NBA. Easily. He has value at both PG and SG too, so a Vasquez-McLemore-Monta in theory could work.

The problem is I don't think you get Monta to buy into that role. He's far too egotistical as many have said already