Don't Sleep On B-Mac....Here's Why:

[Bricklayer]

Joerger is just being nice to the holdover, and of course he'd hope for anybody coming back to take a step forward for him. Although the again holdover part is kinda interesting, because it makes me wonder if Vivek is still back there somewhere still not letting go of his first overenthusiastic mistake. On a team with Afflalo, Temple, Richardson just drafted, Bogdanovic coming next year...we've clearly moved on. Yet here we go again.

In any case, there's no real place for Ben in the rotation. He's the 5th guard now. If Richardson takes the strides Ben never did, he could even end up the 6th guard. There are 3 SFs ahead of him, he obviously can't play PG. I'm sure somewhere in the background Joerger and his staff will be trying to Courtney Lee him, simplify things down to roleplayer level. Don't try to do too much. Shoot open shots, defend, etc. But Ben's best and perhaps only shot to make any play for minutes is going to come right at the start of the season while Collison is out, and at that point the staff won't have had much time to work with him.

 

[ParniValjak]

Joerger is just being nice to the holdover, and of course he'd hope for anybody coming back to take a step forward for him. Although the again holdover part is kinda interesting, because it makes me wonder if Vivek is still back there somewhere still not letting go of his first overenthusiastic mistake. On a team with Afflalo, Temple, Richardson just drafted, Bogdanovic coming next year...we've clearly moved on. Yet here we go again.

In any case, there's no real place for Ben in the rotation. He's the 5th guard now. If Richardson takes the strides Ben never did, he could even end up the 6th guard. There are 3 SFs ahead of him, he obviously can't play PG. I'm sure somewhere in the background Joerger and his staff will be trying to Courtney Lee him, simplify things down to roleplayer level. Don't try to do too much. Shoot open shots, defend, etc. But Ben's best and perhaps only shot to make any play for minutes is going to come right at the start of the season while Collison is out, and at that point the staff won't have had much time to work with him.

Is it Vivek or the fact that there are really no takers out there for McLemore.

He has been in the league for 3 years and has not taken a step forward. That is not only a problem for us because we wasted a pick on a player who has come on but we can't even get anything back for him in a trade.

 

[LPKingsFan]

From off season interviews with Joerger I think he is at least intrigued by Ben. At the same time it is hard to see where he will get minutes barring injury. I would expect Afflalo will play 28-30 minutes at SG, Temple will get 20-22 at SG. Gay, Casspi and Barnes will have all the SF minutes and some PF minutes locked up. Also Temple will be used to cover minutes from positions 1-3. He may get a shot off the bench to start the season if Collison has a substantial suspension and Temple has to backup Lawson.

At full strength i see the rotation as such

PG: Collison 32 mpg, Lawson 16 mpg(if he surprises i could see him getting more minutes or even seeing 2 PG lineups)

SG: Afflalo 28 mpg, Temple 20 mpg( could pickup scrap minutes at the 1 or 3)

SF: Gay 32 mpg, Casspi 20 mpg( plus some minutes as stretch 4) Barnes 16-20 mpg( wildcard I could see starting at the 4 if WCS doesn't shine)

PF: WCS 16 mpg( plus 6-10 min at C) Casspi and Barnes I expect to get main backup PF minutes with Tolliver ready to contribute but out of rotation to start

C: Cousins 36 mpg, if Willie plays C minutes that leaves Koufos the odd man out at the only position he can play.

Joerger will have a tough job as pretty much every player on the roster except the rookies will come into the season expecting to play. At full strength its hard to see Ben getting many minutes unless Afflalo plays himself out of favor. I would expect Temple to be a stable force throughout the season.

Nice breakdown. This team lacks sufficient star power at the top but it does have depth at the rotation player level (perhaps too much).

I worry that it might be WCS that gets squeezed, though, among the bigs, especially if he comes out looking like he did in summer league. Hopefully that poor showing was just the result of experimenting with some new looks, and that he will look better in his comfort zone again.

 

[dude12]

Unlike Joerger's predecessor, if you actually defend well and work hard on that side of the ball, there will be minutes for a player....so each player needs to go out and defend at an active high energy tempo and then minutes will be there for most....maybe not a ton of minutes but you can find your way onto the floor.

 

[Blob]

Joerger is just being nice to the holdover, and of course he'd hope for anybody coming back to take a step forward for him. Although the again holdover part is kinda interesting, because it makes me wonder if Vivek is still back there somewhere still not letting go of his first overenthusiastic mistake. On a team with Afflalo, Temple, Richardson just drafted, Bogdanovic coming next year...we've clearly moved on. Yet here we go again.

In any case, there's no real place for Ben in the rotation. He's the 5th guard now. If Richardson takes the strides Ben never did, he could even end up the 6th guard. There are 3 SFs ahead of him, he obviously can't play PG. I'm sure somewhere in the background Joerger and his staff will be trying to Courtney Lee him, simplify things down to roleplayer level. Don't try to do too much. Shoot open shots, defend, etc. But Ben's best and perhaps only shot to make any play for minutes is going to come right at the start of the season while Collison is out, and at that point the staff won't have had much time to work with him.

Whether Ben is the 5th guard is yet determined. That will be decided in training camp.

We haven't necessarily moved on from Ben, we've moved on from Marco, a fiasco of a player you honestly defended most of last season, saying he was a victim of system and coach when in reality the guy stunk, missing many wide open shots, being one of the worst defensive players I have witnessed in history of the Kings over 25 years, and complaining (!), yes complaining (!), plays were being called for him.

Marco had the worst adjusted plus/minus in the NBA.....he was basically the worst player in the league, yet by analysis of some it was not his fault. Incredulous. But I digress...

Affalo is a better player than Ben at creating his own shot, taking an opponent into the post, having a semblance of a mid range game. But Affalo finished last season with a crummy 11 PER, fell out of favor on a sorry Knicks team that won fewer games than the Kings did, and turns 31 the 1st month of the season. This guy is not great shakes. He's a castoff from a lottery team on the downside of his career. Don't get me wrong, he's better than Ben. But the differential is not Grand Canyon-esque..

Ben is coming into his athletic prime with strength catching up to his other athletic skills, quickness, agility and hops. Combined with experience, this is when a player comes into his own.

Then we have Temple. Temple is a utility player who bounced around the league for 6 years on 6 teams and shot 39.8% FGs last year....this journeyman is destined to take away Ben's minutes? I don't see this as fate d'complete. Temple is a smart player, he handles the ball well, he has that lanky quality to his game like Levingston or Doug Christie, but he's also a bricklayer turning 31 .

These are the guys with whom Ben will be competing. He should not be conceding anything to them. And he should go into training camp that the starting SG position is his to seize. The bottom line is here is that I don't have a lot of confidence in any of these guys, but to suggest that Ben is permanently on the outs is premature. This kid may just surprise us yet.

 

[ElRey]

Ben is too nice and too passive for his own good.

If coach Joerger can light a fire under his behind, Ben can still be a very productive player in this league.

I think if coach can develop Ben into a higher end Courtney Lee type player, that would be the best case scenario for everyone.

Maybe Matt Barnes can light a fire under Ben. Barnes isn't exactly the nicest guy on the street haha.

 

[ElRey]

If he can get the primary backup role, he should be a bigger part of the offense. He will always be the third or fourth option with the starting lineup. With the second unit, he should be at least the second option.

Agreed, Ben might turn out to be a better bench player than starter. And that's okay.

 

[Bricklayer]

Whether Ben is the 5th guard is yet determined. That will be decided in training camp.

We haven't necessarily moved on from Ben, we've moved on from Marco, a fiasco of a player you honestly defended most of last season, saying he was a victim of system and coach when in reality the guy stunk, missing many wide open shots, being one of the worst defensive players I have witnessed in history of the Kings over 25 years, and complaining (!), yes complaining (!), plays were being called for him.

Marco had the worst adjusted plus/minus in the NBA.....he was basically the worst player in the league, yet by analysis of some it was not his fault. Incredulous. But I digress...

Affalo is a better player than Ben at creating his own shot, taking an opponent into the post, having a semblance of a mid range game. But Affalo finished last season with a crummy 11 PER, fell out of favor on a sorry Knicks team that won fewer games than the Kings did, and turns 31 the 1st month of the season. This guy is not great shakes. He's a castoff from a lottery team on the downside of his career. Don't get me wrong, he's better than Ben. But the differential is not Grand Canyon-esque..

Ben is coming into his athletic prime with strength catching up to his other athletic skills, quickness, agility and hops. Combined with experience, this is when a player comes into his own.

Then we have Temple. Temple is a utility player who bounced around the league for 6 years on 6 teams and shot 39.8% FGs last year....this journeyman is destined to take away Ben's minutes? I don't see this as fate d'complete. Temple is a smart player, he handles the ball well, he has that lanky quality to his game like Levingston or Doug Christie, but he's also a bricklayer turning 31 .

These are the guys with whom Ben will be competing. He should not be conceding anything to them. And he should go into training camp that the starting SG position is his to seize. The bottom line is here is that I don't have a lot of confidence in any of these guys, but to suggest that Ben is permanently on the outs is premature. This kid may just surprise us yet.

1) I trust Gregg Popovich's player assessment rather more than yours

2) No. Moving on from Belinelli = trading Belinelli. We did that. And if that was all we were moving on from, that would have been the end of it, oh yay, look we cleared the spot back up for Ben for a 4th straight year of failure!

Not what happened. Moving on from Ben = then immediately turning around and drafting/trading for $20 million of free agents at his position, and drafting/acquiring two more guys to take his position. When a team in one summer slaps down 4 new bodies at your position...well Helen Keller could read that writing. Mind you this is a year after we tried to sign Wes Matthews to replace him. And at the end of a summer that saw us throwing our hat in the ring for Courtney Lee as well. Somebody even tried to attach our name to Dion Waiters, which would not have been cool.

 

[Blob]

1) I trust Gregg Popovich's player assessment rather more than yours

2) No. Moving on from Belinelli = trading Belinelli. We did that. And if that was all we were moving on from, that would have been the end of it, oh yay, look we cleared the spot back up for Ben for a 4th straight year of failure!

Not what happened. Moving on from Ben = then immediately turning around and drafting/trading for $20 million of free agents at his position, and drafting/acquiring two more guys to take his position. When a team in one summer slaps down 4 new bodies at your position...well Helen Keller could read that writing. Mind you this is a year after we tried to sign Wes Matthews to replace him. And at the end of a summer that saw us throwing our hat in the ring for Courtney Lee as well. Somebody even tried to attach our name to Dion Waiters, which would not have been cool.

Pop's assessment has nothing to do with Marco being one of the worst if not the worst player in NBA last season. It is absurd not to assign a substantial degree of his terrible play to Marco, his matador and indifferent defense, which was far worse than Rondo by the way, his excuse-making mindset, and his countless wide open misses.

I don't think I am overstating when I say Marco was as bad as Stauskas. And that is about as bad as it gets! And if Popovich was watching, I think he'd agree! Thankfully Vlade found a sucker to take Marco's contract and gift us a #1 pick (Richardson!) instead of falsely concluding the ineptitude of Marco was due entirely to system and bad coaching.

And here's a thought to ponder for you:

The more specific set of conditions a player needs to perform only reflects on the limitations of said player.

And according to your logic regarding Ben, we are also "moving on" from Boogie. After all we drafted Papa and Skal in an offseason after drafting Willie and signing Koufos, right? Or at least we are making contingency plans. That's 3 or 4 guys who can play center.

Regardless I don't want to be perceived as carrying a torch for Ben. But I think there's a 50/50 chance he's in the rotation on opening night. I have not given up on him and I don't think our FO or coaches have either, despite what you or Hellen Keller may perceive to be the case.

 

[Sac.Kings]

Pop's assessment has nothing to do with Marco being one of the worst if not the worst player in NBA last season. It is absurd not an assign a substantial degree of his terrible play to Marco, his matador and indifferent defense, which was far worse than Rondo by the way, his excuse-making mindset, and his countless wide open misses.

I don't think I am overstating when I say Marco was as bad as Stauskas. And that is about as bad as it gets! And if Popovich was watching, I think he'd agree! Thankfully Vlade found a sucker to take Marco's contract and gift us a #1 pick (Richardson!) instead of falsely concluding the ineptitude of Marco was due entirely to system and bad coaching.

And here's a thought to ponder for you:

The more specific set of conditions a player needs to perform only reflects on the limitations of said player.

And according to your logic regarding Ben, we are also "moving on" from Boogie. After all we drafted Papa and Skal in an offseason after drafting Willie and signing Koufos, right? Or at least we are making contingency plans. That's 3 or 4 guys who can play center.

Regardless I don't want to be perceived as carrying a torch for Ben. But I think there's a 50/50 chance he's in the rotation on opening night. I have not given up on him and I don't think our FO or coaches have either, despite what you or Hellen Keller may perceive to be the case.

The difference with all of that is that not a single one of them is even close to the talent level we have in Cousins and Cousins is a superstar not a scrub. They weren't brought here to take over for Cousins, they were very clearly brought here to support him. Papa is too young to be considered even remotely a threat to Cousins and Skal is definitely not a 5, not even in today's league. Koufos was on the trading block several times since we have had him so he definitely is not taking over for Cousins. Willie's skill set offsets Cousin's largest weakness -- defense and shot blocking so they are a good pair.

You're reaching for arguments that just aren't there. It's not at all the same as Ben's situation. Ben has sucked for the majority of his career; he had some bright moments, but he never tied anything together for more than a few games at a time and would then proceed to disappear for the next 10 games before being heard from again. Bricklayer is right, we have been trying to offset Ben and his lack of production for years (Matthews, Marco in the past, and the guys we got this offseason). You would have to be blind or downright ignorant to come to any other conclusion. Ben has sucked for 90% of his entire career and the players we went after this season only support this argument.

I am a King's fan first and foremost and would therefore absolutely love to see Ben come out and average 15 a game while showing us a confidence in himself that we have never seen before, but.... i'm not holding my breath. He's just too fragile between the ears and has the confidence of a lost puppy. When things are going well, he's alright, but any turmoil and you might as well just send him home.

 

[Blob]

The difference with all of that is that not a single one of them is even close to the talent level we have in Cousins and Cousins is a superstar not a scrub. They weren't brought here to take over for Cousins, they were very clearly brought here to support him. Papa is too young to be considered even remotely a threat to Cousins and Skal is definitely not a 5, not even in today's league. Koufos was on the trading block several times since we have had him so he definitely is not taking over for Cousins. Willie's skill set offsets Cousin's largest weakness -- defense and shot blocking so they are a good pair.

You're reaching for arguments that just aren't there. It's not at all the same as Ben's situation. Ben has sucked for the majority of his career; he had some bright moments, but he never tied anything together for more than a few games at a time and would then proceed to disappear for the next 10 games before being heard from again. Bricklayer is right, we have been trying to offset Ben and his lack of production for years (Matthews, Marco in the past, and the guys we got this offseason). You would have to be blind or downright ignorant to come to any other conclusion. Ben has sucked for 90% of his entire career and the players we went after this season only support this argument.

I am a King's fan first and foremost and would therefore absolutely love to see Ben come out and average 15 a game while showing us a confidence in himself that we have never seen before, but.... i'm not holding my breath. He's just too fragile between the ears and has the confidence of a lost puppy. When things are going well, he's alright, but any turmoil and you might as well just send him home.

I agree with most of what you said. None of our bigs are ready to take over for Boogie now, but they might be when his contract expires in two years. Both our center position and SG spot, heck every spot on the floor is in flux, and this means Ben may be in or out, Boogie may be in or out, and Vlade and Co are making contingency plans based on pending performance and collective success or lack thereof

The premise of my position in regards to Ben is twofold, first in regards to Ben:

If Ben came into the league as a "mature 20 year old" then maybe we would have seen his stake his claim to legitimacy as starter or quality role player by year two or three. But I would contend Ben came in to the league as an "immature 20 year old". In fact, his failure to impress in pre-draft interviews is one of the reasons he slipped from where he was rumored to go, possibly as high as #2 overall, down to #7.So based on this assessment it is not unreasonable to conclude it would take him until his fourth season to turn the corner, longer than hoped but within a reasonable time frame.

You are correct he has sucked most of his tenure, but I am not ready to throw in the towel yet, aided by video that showed he has worked his butt off this summer. And the second reason is Temple and Affalo are medicore talents on the wrong side for 30. Granted they have had better and more consistent runs than Ben ever has, and are more fundamentally sound, but the talent gap is not that wide. Accordingly I am not ready to exclude Ben from the teams future or rotation just yet.

 

[ElRey]

While it's great that Ben is working out and lifting weights, as weird as it sounds I think more than anything he needs to play more BASKETBALL. Yes, BASKETBALL. He needs more basketball experience and BBIQ. He needs to learn when to shoot, pass, or drive and that can only come by playing. Even if he's only playing one on one, he will benefit because he works on his one-on-one skills ie shot creating skills.

I'm going to say the same thing for Skal, who also has lots of potential but very raw. These guys need more experience playing organized ball. The more they play the better.

 

[dude12]

The absurdity continues

 

[dude12]

Would not shock me to see that Malachi Richardson on the floor is better than Ben right now....but then again the bar isn't set to high. Ben is a nice kid but he's really lacking in some areas.

 

[Warhawk]

None of our bigs are ready to take over for Boogie now, but they might be when his contract expires in two years.

No. Just....no.

 

[Blob]

No. Just....no.

"Take over for" doesn't necessarily mean better or as good as Boogie but replace his minutes to competent degree. By the way according to Kings Insider, team officials say Papa looks "incredible" , which is consistent with what I said around LSVL, that is, with a summer of hard work we'd see a different player coming training camp, while others around here (not you to my knowledge) were already writing him off as a wasted pick and project player.

 

[kingsboi]

I've fallen asleep on Ben a long time ago. That ship has long sailed. At this point, he will be buried at the end of the bench unless he surprises coach in training camp and the preseason and shows significant improvement. The Kings might try to hold on for him until they can include him in a package for a trade, in the mean time, I'd rather give Malachi a chance to showcase himself, play him in small spurts and see what happens.

 

[Bricklayer]

I've fallen asleep on Ben a long time ago. That ship has long sailed. At this point, he will be buried at the end of the bench unless he surprises coach in training camp and the preseason and shows significant improvement. The Kings might try to hold on for him until they can include him in a package for a trade, in the mean time, I'd rather give Malachi a chance to showcase himself, play him in small spurts and see what happens.

Ben's entering the last year of his deal, if he's anything but starting and putting up numbers here, which is highly unlikely, its doubtful anybody is going to give up much of anything for him midseason. For a full season evaluation? Maybe. But then again if they were we might have already pulled the trigger.

 

[Gilles]

These stats never get old :

Kings over last 2 seasons per 100 poss w/Boogie and Ben: 108.3-104.2 = +4.1
Kings over last 2 seasons per 100 poss w/Boogie and w/o Ben: 105.9-109.0 = -3.1

Boogie is only successful because of Ben!

 

[One and Done]

The ship has sailed on Ben as a King and it's clear we couldn't get anything in return for him in what could be a 1-year rental.

I think there's still potential for him in a well-defined system, but the key problem is his motor or lack thereof. Can he be a 3-and-D player? Possibly, but that takes a lot of efficiency in a small amount of possessions - and for a guy like Ben, who coasts in and out of games, that's going to be tough.

 

[Kingsfan23]

Nice breakdown. This team lacks sufficient star power at the top but it does have depth at the rotation player level (perhaps too much).

I worry that it might be WCS that gets squeezed, though, among the bigs, especially if he comes out looking like he did in summer league. Hopefully that poor showing was just the result of experimenting with some new looks, and that he will look better in his comfort zone again.

"Take over for" doesn't necessarily mean better or as good as Boogie but replace his minutes to competent degree. By the way according to Kings Insider, team officials say Papa looks "incredible" , which is consistent with what I said around LSVL, that is, with a summer of hard work we'd see a different player coming training camp, while others around here (not you to my knowledge) were already writing him off as a wasted pick and project player.

Hes a talented kid, but I think your view might be slightly ambitious because of how little you might think of Cousins future here. Those of us who see Cousins as a fixture might have less invested

With that said, He does have some innate tools, and I'm interested to see how he does in Reno. I still view Koufos as not movable and the dominant third big he showed in Memphis with Joerger

 

[Livinthedream]

These stats never get old :

Kings over last 2 seasons per 100 poss w/Boogie and Ben: 108.3-104.2 = +4.1
Kings over last 2 seasons per 100 poss w/Boogie and w/o Ben: 105.9-109.0 = -3.1

Boogie is only successful because of Ben!

Bam! Case closed. Indisputable.

 

[twslam07]

I think their is a possibility of McLemore proving himself, but I'm also fine moving on from him (considering we have Bogdanovic & Richardson) if we get something back in return. Something like the deal below...

Bulls Get: Kosta Koufos & Ben McLemore
Hawks Get: Taj Gibson
Kings Get: Tiago Splitter, Atlanta 2017 2nd, & easing the protection on our 2017 1st from Top 10 to Top 12

We free up cap space for next year, allow Cousins to play all of his minutes at C, add a 2017 2nd, and give ourselves a better shot at keeping our 2017 1st rounder.


PG - Collison (30 min) / Lawson (18 min) / Farmar
SG - Temple (22 min) / Afflalo (26 min) / Richardson
SF - Gay (34 min) / Casspi (14 min) / Barnes
PF - Cauley-Stein (14 min) / Tolliver (22 min) / Casspi (12 min) / Labissiere
C - Cousins (36 min) / Cauley-Stein (12 min) / Splitter / Papagiannis

Cousins - 36 min
Gay - 34 min
Collison - 30 min
Afflalo - 26 min
Casspi - 26 min
Cauley-Stein - 26 min
Temple - 22 min
Tolliver - 22 min
Lawson - 18 min

 

[Bricklayer]

Not a surprise, but:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...-Has-Been-Available-In-Trade-Talks-For-Months


I think this is yet another case where we simply held onto a declining asset for too long to the point it lost all value. More importantly, it underscores how much Ben has really not been in our plans, and is going to have to throw open doors that have been closed with some outstanding play. Realistically though, I thought we and Ben came to a sort of tacit agreement midway through last season. I'm not at all sure he would mind being moved.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Not a surprise, but:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...-Has-Been-Available-In-Trade-Talks-For-Months

Oddly enough this is somewhat at odds with Jason Jones' tweets this morning:

https://mobile.twitter.com/mr_jasonjones/status/779360853308997632

https://mobile.twitter.com/mr_jasonjones/status/779361385985605633

One player the Kings are happy about this offseason is Ben McLemore. He's really connected with the coaching staff. Months ago it seemed to be a matter of when McLemore would be traded. Not the case now. Coaches excited to see how he plays this season

 

[206Fan]

Not a surprise, but:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...-Has-Been-Available-In-Trade-Talks-For-Months


I think this is yet another case where we simply held onto a declining asset for too long to the point it lost all value. More importantly, it underscores how much Ben has really not been in our plans, and is going to have to throw open doors that have been closed with some outstanding play. Realistically though, I thought we and Ben came to a sort of tacit agreement midway through last season. I'm not at all sure he would mind being moved.

Oddly enough this is somewhat at odds with Jason Jones' tweets this morning:

https://mobile.twitter.com/mr_jasonjones/status/779360853308997632

https://mobile.twitter.com/mr_jasonjones/status/779361385985605633

I feel like Vlade wants to move on from Ben. Drafts Richardson. Grabs Bogdanvoic for next year. Signs 3 SGs, Afflao, Temple, and Barnes.

Ben has been in trade talks for the last 2 years. Maybe the only thing holding Vlade from pulling that trigger is the current coaching staff?

 

[andjel]

I think that Vlade listens to Joerger closely.
He should also be aware that we cannot count on Ben as being a starter.

Hence temporary SGs in Afflalo (on a seeming decline) and Temple (Barnes is not SG).
Despite Bogdan's potential, we cannot count that he will be SG starter level either in NBA.
Too soon to say anything about Richardson.

In short, we do not have proven SG for the future, but we have three candidates (Ben, Bogdan and Richardson) and one assurance (Afflalo).
Temple is proven SG backup.

If more than one works out, it is a good problem to have.

 

[Kingster]

When McLemore was drafted he struck me as a player who was very immature. He also struck me as a man who was immature. I'm not talking bad behavior immature, I'm talking about his inexperience in life and education and his palpable lack of confidence because of it. He hadn't proved anything in college, and he knew it. He really really needed to stay in college for at least three years, imo. Now, after being battered around some and toughened up a little bit he still has a shot at being a valuable member of this team. Everything I've heard about him has said he's a hard worker, but you've got to work smart, not just hard. I hope that he and his coach have had several conversations on what to work on in the offseason so that he will come into camp mentally and emotionally prepared and prove a lot of people wrong, including me.

 

[Blob]

When McLemore was drafted he struck me as a player who was very immature. He also struck me as a man who was immature. I'm not talking bad behavior immature, I'm talking about his inexperience in life and education and his palpable lack of confidence because of it. He hadn't proved anything in college, and he knew it. He really really needed to stay in college for at least three years, imo. Now, after being battered around some and toughened up a little bit he still has a shot at being a valuable member of this team. Everything I've heard about him has said he's a hard worker, but you've got to work smart, not just hard. I hope that he and his coach have had several conversations on what to work on in the offseason so that he will come into camp mentally and emotionally prepared and prove a lot of people wrong, including me.

Exactly. This was the basis for my contention in my OP what would normally take a 20 year old lottery pick 2-3 years to substantiate his value may take Ben 4 years, or this pending season. I think Ben will impress with his improved strength and confidence and guidance. I also think he will be better not sharing the court with Rondo, who had goo-goo eyes for Boogie and only passed it to Ben as a last resort.

 

[Blob]

I think their is a possibility of McLemore proving himself, but I'm also fine moving on from him (considering we have Bogdanovic & Richardson) if we get something back in return. Something like the deal below...

Bulls Get: Kosta Koufos & Ben McLemore
Hawks Get: Taj Gibson
Kings Get: Tiago Splitter, Atlanta 2017 2nd, & easing the protection on our 2017 1st from Top 10 to Top 12

We free up cap space for next year, allow Cousins to play all of his minutes at C, add a 2017 2nd, and give ourselves a better shot at keeping our 2017 1st rounder.


PG - Collison (30 min) / Lawson (18 min) / Farmar
SG - Temple (22 min) / Afflalo (26 min) / Richardson
SF - Gay (34 min) / Casspi (14 min) / Barnes
PF - Cauley-Stein (14 min) / Tolliver (22 min) / Casspi (12 min) / Labissiere
C - Cousins (36 min) / Cauley-Stein (12 min) / Splitter / Papagiannis

Cousins - 36 min
Gay - 34 min
Collison - 30 min
Afflalo - 26 min
Casspi - 26 min
Cauley-Stein - 26 min
Temple - 22 min
Tolliver - 22 min
Lawson - 18 min

I would not do this trade. Koufos for Splitter is a lateral move at best, and all you are getting for Ben is a meaningless second rounder and slight more protection on your 2017 pick. This amounts to next to nothing. Unless a trade offer presents itself for an impact perimeter player that would require including Ben, it is far more prudent to discover if after a three year investment in this kid, we finally get a belated return.