Comments on pre-season game Phoenix at Monarchs

[Den-Den]

Okay all who attended...what are your impressions of this year's team???

We have four to cut--who do you think they will be?

 

[KINGSDOTCOM]

[yt="Monarchs Postgame"]eDgEiwF1nh8[/yt]

 

[6th]

Thanks for posting the post-game comments by the players. Since I could not attend, I am anxious to hear how we, as a team, are coming along.

 

[Purple Reign]

Thanks for posting the post-game comments by the players. Since I could not attend, I am anxious to hear how we, as a team, are coming along.

Snuck away from work, and got back without being noticed gone, it was a great day for me. As far as the game goes, overall it was a terrible game, even for pre-season. Both teams combined for 40 plus turnovers!!!! I do believe we will have a good team that will compete and will be better on defense than they were last year. A lot of energy on defense was great to see.

Maiga Ba was very good. She is going to be key and should play big minutes at multiple positions. Offensively she looks so much more fluid. It is like she left Sac as a girl and returned as a full grown woman with a full grown game.

You can see that Courtney Paris has the skills, the talent and the competitive desire and drive. But I can see why six teams passed her up in the draft. She is a big girl!!!! In my view besides Brunson, she is already the best post player on the squad. She just needs to get in professional condition and I think she knows that. She displayed soft hands and great foot work. But I don't think you will see the best of Ms. Paris until 2010 when she has had a full year to physically develop.

DeMya Walker was terrible!! If she was not a veteran player that means so much to the organization, she would be on the brink of getting cut. But I don't think Whisnant or Boucek would do that neither should they. DeMya means far more to the Monarchs organization than numbers, but I hope during the season it gets better for her.

I had hopes going into the game that Whitney Boddie would do enough to earn a third point guard roster spot, because I do believe a third lead guard is needed just in case Ticha or Kara gets injured. After today, I do not think Boddie will make the team. She is offensively challenged. She can run a squad and can lead a team, but she does not do enough offensively to earn a spot on a veteran laden club that is trying to win right now. I have made a complete 180 degree turn on her prospects. The team just goes into the season with fingers crossed that Kara or Ticha stays healthy.

Those are my thoughts, every thing else was staus quo. Powell, Ticha, Harper, Kelly, Sholanda, Newton, they all do what they do. Powell looks in game shape already and seems to be ready to pull the trigger at will. After today the four cuts will not be as hard as I thought they would:

Whitney Boddie, Morgan Wharburton, Miao Li Jie and Charel Allen (who got very little time today) will be the casualties. They are just not good enough.

 

[mdme]

I don't see the games but Morgan Wharburton seems to be putting up decent numbers for the minutes played. This team needs offense and she has some. I don't think Scholanda and Chelsea BOTH make it. It may be one of them will get cut. Charel Allen is done for. We need a third pg and Boddie is NOT it.

I think Boddie and Allen are definitely out.
Either Scholanda or Chelsea will be out.
Don't know who the last one is but DWalk is stinking it up right now. Plus with the "injury" bug always a question, I don't know about her. Although I agree, She means more than the numbers she makes but I think in the competitive state of the league we have to make our choices carefully. Not saying she will be cut though.

 

[HoopMatron]

I think they have to keep another guard. Kara is apparently not going to be ready to start the season, and at the end of the game today, Ticha was sporting an ice pack on her right shoulder. Warburton was okay (oddly, I kept thinking I was seeing Haynie out there, since both wear #4 and Warburton did something to the front of her hair).

I agree that Maiga-Ba seemed team-worthy. When Whisenant let both her and Buescher go, the Monarchs lost their speed. Having her back will help possibly get a few fast break points again. I love seeing her span the court in about 4 strides.

Messy game, but you can blame continuity for that -- coach was definitely getting a lot of looks at potential roster-makers and letting some youngsters get experience in the system.

I'm ready for June 6! GO MONARCHS!!!

 

[Purple Reign]

Either Scholanda or Chelsea will be out.

For the same reason the organization will not cut Walker is the same reasons they will not cut Newton or Robinson; veteran players who have won with the organization, who are young and still have something to offer. Wharburton will not make this team over Newton or Robinson.

They know the system, Wharburton does not.
They both play defense, we don't know Wharburton can play defense yet.

If it were a 13 player roster, I would say yes she makes it. But she (Wharburton) is not talented enough to bump off a key member of the 2005 Championship team (Newton) or a 1st round pick (Robinson), both are very productive and more talented than a 3rd Round rookie.

 

[mdme]

For the same reason the organization will not cut Walker is the same reasons they will not cut Newton or Robinson; veteran players who have won with the organization, who are young and still have something to offer. Wharburton will not make this team over Newton or Robinson.

They know the system, Wharburton does not.
They both play defense, we don't know Wharburton can play defense yet.

If it were a 13 player roster, I would say yes she makes it. But she (Wharburton) is not talented enough to bump off a key member of the 2005 Championship team (Newton) or a 1st round pick (Robinson), both are very productive and more talented than a 3rd Round rookie.

This is the kind of reasoning that might hold us back.

Wharburton doesn't know the system: yes but that doesn't mean she can't learn it either. Chelsea and Scholanda have been given the chance....Scholanda hasn't really proven anything yet. And while Chelsea (only Chelsea) was with the 2005 championship team, she clearly has not panned out since then. I think the coaching staff would be served better by looking at all the players equitably. Yes, being a veteran should count but deciding solely on that matter defeats the purpose of a training camp and is counter productive.

I am not saying Wharburton should make the roster and both chelsea and scholanda don't. What I am thinking is that since Scho and Chelsea bring very similar things to the table, I think it may not be the best choice to bring them BOTH. This team needs .....NEEDS offense. using two roster spots for redundant talent is not something we can afford right now. Outside of Powell and Kara, we don't really have much offense. What if one of them goes down? Maiga-Ba is there but still we clearly need options out there.

 

[Den-Den]

I always find it interesting to read others comments about a game. Often, the comments and game impressions make it seem like we were not at the same game!

If I am Wiz, I am keeping Boddie. Wiz has already made it clear that he does not care if his point guard can score--that is not his first priority for a pg. Boddie had crisp, clean passes, many of which she placed inside. Not her fault if the bigs inside did not convert on all of them. She is a good ballhandler, played good defense on Cappie (ie fast), had four steals against one of the faster teams in the league, and did not make me feel like I wanted to climb out of my skin when she had the ball. Quite frankly, Ticha is the only other pg we have ever had that I feel that way about. No, she is not Ticha (no one ever will be), but I do not feel that she is likely to be trapped in the backcourt by a double team, or have the ball regularly stripped from her. She is smart, reads the floor well, and lest we forget-LED THE NATION IN ASSISTS! Kara is not game ready, Ticha hurt her bad shoulder again today, and we need a back-up point guard. Both of ours are hurt right now. Not a great way to start

Warburton was a great surprise. She makes her own shot, is not afraid to drive the lane, had some great steals as well, and is a surprisingly good ballhandler. I thought it was very interesting at the end of the game that Jenny-Boo had her play point...

I would keep them both, but I think at least one of them makes the team. The coaching staff has four tough cuts to make. I think that Charel and Maoi are both gone, and either Chelsea or Sho--I do not think that both will make the team. Wiz does not strike me as the sentimental type, so it does not matter that they were part of our championship team. Let no one forget that he let Yo walk, and didn't he also cut Ruthie years ago from training camp? I do not think that Sho and Chelsea are definite locks, and do not even have a guess who the fourth player cut will be...glad it's not my jpb

Overall, I think this was the best I have seen them look in a pre-season game--even with all the turnovers. Those will settle down when we get down to eleven, and get used to working together on offense. Rotation on defense was much better than I had expected it to be with so many players coming in & out, and so many new players learning the system. They frustrated Phoenix, and did so without getting into foul trouble.

Fifteen steals, 40 points in the paint, giving Taurasi fits already. Priceless. I cannot remember when I looked soooo forward to a season

 

[6th]

This is the kind of reasoning that might hold us back.

Wharburton doesn't know the system: yes but that doesn't mean she can't learn it either. Chelsea and Scholanda have been given the chance....Scholanda hasn't really proven anything yet. And while Chelsea (only Chelsea) was with the 2005 championship team, she clearly has not panned out since then. I think the coaching staff would be served better by looking at all the players equitably. Yes, being a veteran should count but deciding solely on that matter defeats the purpose of a training camp and is counter productive.

I am not saying Wharburton should make the roster and both chelsea and scholanda don't. What I am thinking is that since Scho and Chelsea bring very similar things to the table, I think it may not be the best choice to bring them BOTH. This team needs .....NEEDS offense. using two roster spots for redundant talent is not something we can afford right now. Outside of Powell and Kara, we don't really have much offense. What if one of them goes down? Maiga-Ba is there but still we clearly need options out there.

I absolutely agree. Our thinking must change. AFAIC even DeMya should be dispensable if she cannot get back to her old self. With only 11 players, this is not the time for sentiment.

I don't want both Chelsea and Scho........not if it means tying up 2 spots for basically the same player. I would rather have Boddie. But then, MBF knows how I feel about having a pure pg. We'll never agree on that.

Thanks to everyone who gave their opinion. Only time will tell which way this team goes. I am ready for some real change, i.e. keep the players who can get it done for you, regardless if they are a veteran or a rookie.

 

[creative one]

I don't think a team that wants to win now can stand to have more than one rookie on the team. It's obvious that Courtney will be our one rookie. With the roster cuts and the mentality that we need to improve upon what we've accomplished in Jenny's previous two seasons, we can't have any holes on our roster. For all those who love Boddie, please keep in mind that this is the same player who is shooting 29% from the floor and has one assist to five turnovers...IN PRESEASON! While Whiz claims that he doesn't need his PGs to score, I'm sure he would rather his PGs have more assists than turnovers. Geez. Even Aqua could do that.

Boddie is not ready, folks. With the 11-man roster restrictions, we do not have time to coach up a substandard rookie PG and make her WNBA caliber. If finding a suitable PG is priority, then we need to do what we did with the SGs (why did we have five camp SGs and only one camp PG anyway?) and find the best possible solution if we do in fact need another PG (I don't think it's necessary). If the PG who emerges from that battle is Boddie, then we go with her. If it's someone else, then we go with that person. But we do not need to hand another back-up apprenticeship to the one and only PG in camp yet again this year. We did that last year and got lucky that nothing serious happened to Ticha. We cannot afford to do that this year. If it is necessary to keep another PG on the roster, it has to be someone who is a professional PG. That ain't Boddie.

 

[creative one]

My best suggestion for that final guard spot would be Coco Miller. Atlanta wants Izi to be its starter (helps DeSouza communicate with teammates), and I don't think they're ready to give up on Young. That doesn't leave room for Coco. KB Sharp could become available if we absolutely need a PG, but we might have to fight Phoenix for her.

 

[6th]

Hell! I'd take Coco Miller as a back-up in a heartbeat.

 

[Luv13fan]

Intrestingh thread

I think I pretty much agree with what has been posted about the game.

I am personally being very impatient with Powell because i believe she can do and be more to help the Monarchs. But that is my own personal bugga-Boo.

People I was pleased with..

Courtney- She is everything she was advertised. Soft hands, big target, finishes around the rim. The better conditioned she gets the better she gets.
Harper- You could see that she progressed. Free throw shooting was better. Still a bit of a spazz, but she gives energy.
Warbourn- Very surprised... She is a shooter, and she attacks the basket.
Maiga-Ba- She's back with a jumper. Joy and happiness.
Sho- I believe has the inside track in the Sho/Chelsea competition.

Everyone else Pretty much didi what I thought they would do except for DeMya. I personally thought she was further along than she appears to be. I mean she is way behind schedule and that was not the impression that MS&E gave to us. And There is NO Way Kara will be ready in a week. She might be able to "play" but in terms of readiness I think she is a few weeks off, at least.

Based on what I saw today If I had my choice of cuts...

Starters
Ticha Sholanda Nicole Rebekkah (If Healthy)& Laura Harper

Rotation Players
Kara
Maiga-Ba
Courtney Paris
DeMya
Crystal Kelly
Warburton

Odd players out... Maio, Chelsea, Allen, Boddie.

My rationale- None of those players stood out to me, and they all got enough minutes to have shown something. Chelsea was especially disappointing to me. Warburton looked far more interesting on the floor. even when she got her shot blocked she still attacked the basket. Boddie played okay, not great but not bad and if we had 13 spots I would think it worth our while to keep her. Allen needs another year overseas. And Maio I just don't know what to make of her. I know she can play, but she still looked a bit losted out there.

In reality I would wager that Maio stays. I just can't believe that Whiz would go thru all the drama to get her here just to send her home in 2 weeks of camp. And think about how much Whiz gave up to get Chelsea back, I wouldn't keep her but I would be surprised if she stuck.
And yes...

Originally Posted by mdme
This is the kind of reasoning that might hold us back.

I hope I am pleasantly suprised.

And I look forward to seeing who makes the final cut.
Wouldn't mind seeing any late additions like a Coco Miller or Seasoned Vet we can pick up off of waivers.

 

[Purple Reign]

I don't think a team that wants to win now can stand to have more than one rookie on the team. It's obvious that Courtney will be our one rookie. With the roster cuts and the mentality that we need to improve upon what we've accomplished in Jenny's previous two seasons, we can't have any holes on our roster. For all those who love Boddie, please keep in mind that this is the same player who is shooting 29% from the floor and has one assist to five turnovers...IN PRESEASON! While Whiz claims that he doesn't need his PGs to score, I'm sure he would rather his PGs have more assists than turnovers. Geez. Even Aqua could do that.

Boddie is not ready, folks. With the 11-man roster restrictions, we do not have time to coach up a substandard rookie PG and make her WNBA caliber. If finding a suitable PG is priority, then we need to do what we did with the SGs (why did we have five camp SGs and only one camp PG anyway?) and find the best possible solution if we do in fact need another PG (I don't think it's necessary). If the PG who emerges from that battle is Boddie, then we go with her. If it's someone else, then we go with that person. But we do not need to hand another back-up apprenticeship to the one and only PG in camp yet again this year. We did that last year and got lucky that nothing serious happened to Ticha. We cannot afford to do that this year. If it is necessary to keep another PG on the roster, it has to be someone who is a professional PG. That ain't Boddie.

AMEN and AMEN. Like I said before, I have changed my whole philosophy in keeping Boddie. After what I saw yesterday, she has playmaking skills, and promise but again for a team that wants to and needs to win RIGHT NOW, the Monarchs can not afford to put the ball into the hands of a player learning on the fly. And she is not talented enough (see Charel Allen) to take up a valuable roster spots waiting on progress.

Now if there is a point guard cut from another team that the organization feels can contribute right now, i can see cutting Newton for that player, but not for Boddie.

 

[kingsnation]

[yt="Monarchs Postgame"]eDgEiwF1nh8[/yt]

I really like Courtney Paris so far, I'm glad we got this kid.

 

[nancgo]

Luv13 - YES......totally agree with your insights.

DeMya looked really lost out there. I know she's still rehabbing and all, but she made alot of errors.

Warburton was definitely a surprise. I did like her a bit better than Boddie. Her attacking the basket was nice. The only thing is that if she were selected, I wonder how often she would continue to do that given the 20-passes before you shoot coaches mentality.

Crystal seemed a little out of it too. But Harper looked more confident and pushed her way through. Paris definitely needs some conditioning, otherwise she moved well and handled the ball well. A couple of times a smaller Phoenix player ran into her and she didn't even feel it!! Which was nice to see rather than a flop (DeMya).

Sorry not hating on DeMya, I just expected to see a little better since they were hyping her as being better.

Should be an interesting season......

 

[mdme]

Luv13 - YES......totally agree with your insights.

DeMya looked really lost out there. I know she's still rehabbing and all, but she made alot of errors.

Warburton was definitely a surprise. I did like her a bit better than Boddie. Her attacking the basket was nice. The only thing is that if she were selected, I wonder how often she would continue to do that given the 20-passes before you shoot coaches mentality.

This is another MENTALITY that we need to change.

 

[creative one]

How do folks on here feel about Lisa Willis, Tan White, or Erica White? I think the three of them are better than the rookie guards we have in camp right now. My preference would be Lisa Willis because she a tall guard (allowing Kara to be a full-time PG while she works back into playing shape) who can shoot. The only question is will she defend enough to get court time?

 

[Luv13fan]

Tan White

I was looking at that situation in Indy too.

I think Tan White is a better athlete. I thought she was taller tho. But she is very Explosive. And Quite frankly She is Better than everyone at the 2. Sho, Chelsea, and everyone else. And she could be a better asset on the defensive end than Willis.

And I would go a step further. Which I know no one else will go there with me. But If I was gonna go to the point of bringing in White (or any other FA) then I would put Sho on the chop block as well. And still keep the rookie.

Scholanda has clearly outplayed Cheslea but she is still gonna need to show a lot more IMO. At this point I would be more willing to give a shot to Warburton than to deal with the Sluggish development of Robinson. Don't get me wrong, she is progressing. But it just seems to be awfully slow.

 

[creative one]

How about this, Luv13fan? Let's say we do pick up a guard from another team (let's say Tan White), cut Robinson, and keep Warburton. Could we, then, keep Scho on "stand-by status" in case Warburton fizzles out (which, at that point, we'd cut Warburton and re-sign Scho assuming no one else picks her up...a pretty safe assumption)? Seems like a bit of a risk, but it could work.

 

[Luv13fan]

How about this, Luv13fan? Let's say we do pick up a guard from another team (let's say Tan White), cut Robinson, and keep Warburton. Could we, then, keep Scho on "stand-by status" in case Warburton fizzles out (which, at that point, we'd cut Warburton and re-sign Scho assuming no one else picks her up...a pretty safe assumption)? Seems like a bit of a risk, but it could work.

Absolutely... In fact that was exactly what I thought would be the idea. Of course there is the option that someone else will be available if Warburton doesn't work out too. But In that case I think it would be better to bring back Robinson.

This is all moot right now tho. Until these other players become available We roll with Sho. And I am okay with that. Besides I am not convinced that Whiz or Jenny would make that move this close to the season starting.

 

[Purple Reign]

I am not asking this question rudely, but can somebody, anybody please school me on the facination of Morgan Warburton (a Third Round, #33 pick). I have been to an open practice, I went to the pre-season game, and I have seen her numbers from the first game against Seattle (10 min, 6pts, 2-4 shooting), what makes her so unique that she would push out one or two veterans such as Robinson and Newton on an 11 man roster.

The Monarchs have tried the proverbial thrid round pick before from Kate Starbird to Anne O'Neill, Cisti Greenwald, Lamisha Augustine, Meg Bulger
to A'quanisha Franklin, none could stick on the roster let alone the league for that matter. In fact the only thrid round pick that i can remember that has really panned out is Jia Perkins. Even Crystal Kelly was cut by one team before she found a fit here in Sac (and I am still not convinced about her. SHE GETS HER SHOT BLOCKED TOO MUCH!!! ).

I guess what I am saying is Warburton has not shown me that she is talented enough to earn a precious one of eleven roster spots. I know what Sho and Chelsea can do, and I think they do what they do well enough to be on this team.

 

[creative one]

I am not asking this question rudely, but can somebody, anybody please school me on the facination of Morgan Warburton (a Third Round, #33 pick). I have been to an open practice, I went to the pre-season game, and I have seen her numbers from the first game against Seattle (10 min, 6pts, 2-4 shooting), what makes her so unique that she would push out one or two veterans such as Robinson and Newton on an 11 man roster.

The Monarchs have tried the proverbial thrid round pick before from Kate Starbird to Anne O'Neill, Cisti Greenwald, Lamisha Augustine, Meg Bulger
to A'quanisha Franklin, none could stick on the roster let alone the league for that matter. In fact the only thrid round pick that i can remember that has really panned out is Jia Perkins. Even Crystal Kelly was cut by one team before she found a fit here in Sac (and I am still not convinced about her. SHE GETS HER SHOT BLOCKED TOO MUCH!!! ).

I guess what I am saying is Warburton has not shown me that she is talented enough to earn a precious one of eleven roster spots. I know what Sho and Chelsea can do, and I think they do what they do well enough to be on this team.

I feel you on the Warburton fascination. If I had to guess, I think her name keeps popping up because she has shown herself to be a better performer than the other rookie guard. Personally, I'd keep Robinson, cut both the rookie guards, and pick up whomever looked enticing enough off NY's or Indiana's training camp roster because, as I pointed out earlier, we can't afford to nurture a rookie who isn't ready to contribute right away. Paris should be our only rookie because she has proven that she is ready to deliver from the start.

As for third round picks (or undrafted FAs) that have panned out in recent years, don't forget Cat Kraayeveld, though she did get cut her rookie season from the Silver Stars. Jamie Carey and Amber Jacobs both played four years in the league despite being former third-round picks. Le'Coe Willingham wasn't even drafted...yet here she is in Season #6! I don't think the Dream's team captain from a year ago (Jen Lacy) was drafted, and she even got cut her first attempt trying out for the league. I would wager that Charde Houston (3rd round pick last year) is safe for another season, until Minnesota misses the playoffs AGAIN and drafts either Jayne Appel or Tina Charles. It's all about how the third-rounder fits in with the team. I don't know off top how well Warburton fits in with the Monarchs, but it's always possible that she'd be a better fit elsewhere. It's also possible that this is the only good fit for her. We have no way of knowing right now.

Looking at our recent third-round picks, none of them would have been drafted by other teams. Perhaps that's why we don't seem to have any luck with them. For what it's worth, I'm not high on Kelly, either, but she's not nearly as bad as DeMya right now.

 

[samq]

Speaking for myself, Scho and Newton bring basically the same thing. No offense and above average defense. Now, I haven't seen Warburton play, but her and Miao are apparent "shooters" who can make shots, even in limited minutes (in theory). Neither Scho or Newton will be able to score, and we really shouldn't have both on the roster.

I wouldn't mind Lisa Willis if NY cuts her. No to Tan White though.

 

[Luv13fan]

Well I am not sure why other people like Warburton. But I like her cause she has a shot, she can drive to the basket and she is spunky.

There are things that after 4 years Chelsea hasn't been able to display. That is why Scho got the nod over Chelsea for me. Scholanda hasn't been a total world beater but she has shown more than Chels at this point. And Chelsea is out of excuses. She is suppose to be healthy, so she should have brought her A game.

As for Scholanda she is progressing but it really does seem very slow going. But she has enough to contribute and hopefully she can excelerate her progress.

Warburton I believe has more of an upside than either Scholanda or Cheslea at this point. That is my ratoinale for making the investment in her. The fact that she is a 3rd round draft pick and she is playing basically even with Scholanda/Newton does not say much for either one of them.

She is playing equal to if not better than Newton. That is why I have Chelsea gone. And Scholanda is playing better than Warburton but not dramatically better. And after 3 years in the league, a 3rd rounder shouldn't be that close in talent and effort to you.

That is why I said that if we went out and got a "Vet" then I would work that vet in and try to invest in Warburton. Then Look to invest or draft another 2 guard in 2010 if neither Warburton or your Vet doesn't work out.

My guess is that we are gonna stand pat. The only reason we wouldn't is if Kara can't go. That is Whiz's MO and I doubt he will change that now.

Then again the 11-man roster may force him to adjust his thinking.

 

[creative one]

Well, I'll be honest. I think the real change that needs to be made with respect to this team is at general manager. Only then can we hope to see change in the identity of this team.