Carmichael Dave going HAM on twitter about the Magoofs

[Trueblood]

They went as far as selling the family beer distributor business to save the Palms. I can see George trying to talk the family into more measures. Who knows, maybe they dipped into the stock or borrowed against. Their moves lately seem more combative than sitting tight for the long haul. Keep an eye out for any funny stuff with trading players for cash and moves send off players who might be up for long term contracts soon.

That's what I love about the new collective bargaining agreement though. The minimum payroll number has to be 85% of the cap and it goes up to 90% soon. They can trade away long term contracts but when they get under the cap, they're going to have to fill it back up to 85%.

 

[Section 101]

They went as far as selling the family beer distributor business to save the Palms. I can see George trying to talk the family into more measures. Who knows, maybe they dipped into the stock or borrowed against. Their moves lately seem more combative than sitting tight for the long haul. Keep an eye out for any funny stuff with trading players for cash and moves send off players who might be up for long term contracts soon.

Fortunately the NBA fix this for us already. The max per year they can get in trades is $3 mil instead of $3 mil per trade. And with the salary cap min rising by around $5mil this year there is no way for them to cut salary. They have to take on salary at this point.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

A favor to ask for a new avatar: can someone skilled with photoshop put Adrienne Maloof's face on the owner's face and KJ's face on the manager's face?? Our whole situation is 'Major League' in Sacramento. Lol

 

[John Galt]

I honestly wish I could boycott. I would if it were just up to me. But I promised my STH partner that I'd re-up and I have to follow thru so I don't renege on a promise to a person. In fact he needs still another quarter season partner... so I cant' leave the guy holding the bag for a 3/4 season by himself.

If I didn't have those issues in play, I'd never go to another Maloof owned game at Arco. And this will be my last check to the Maloofs (well, maybe eleven more large popcorns).

I think they are as good as gone... lame duck season.... heartbreaking.

 

[Kingsguy881]

A favor to ask for a new avatar: can someone skilled with photoshop put Adrienne Maloof's face on the owner's face and KJ's face on the manager's face?? Our whole situation is 'Major League' in Sacramento. Lol

Rachel Phelps in a bikini is cool, but trust me you don't wanna see Plasticanne Maloof in a bikini.

 

[Spike]

I honestly wish I could boycott. I would if it were just up to me. But I promised my STH partner that I'd re-up and I have to follow thru so I don't renege on a promise to a person. In fact he needs still another quarter season partner... so I cant' leave the guy holding the bag for a 3/4 season by himself.

If I didn't have those issues in play, I'd never go to another Maloof owned game at Arco. And this will be my last check to the Maloofs (well, maybe eleven more large popcorns).

I think they are as good as gone... lame duck season.... heartbreaking.

Let's compromise - don't buy popcorn.

 

[rainmaker]

Maybe Dave is off his rocker. Has he started drinking again? Or he just doesn't know basketball....

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
Quit ripping Smart chodes remember, Scott Brooks and Tom Thibodeau were once Keith Smart too. You think THEY get 40 out of the Kings?

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
How do you know Smart doesn't do the same thing with the Thunder or Bulls? I didn't see major weaknesses w/him this year. Wasn't the coach.

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
Hating on Keith Smart is like hating on Nazi Germany because their colors were stupid. Eye on the ball guys. It's the engine, not the tires.

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
@News10Sean There were many more reasons to hate the Nazi's than a bad color scheme was my point.Smart is not the reason the Kings suck. ROR


Is he seriously comparing Smart to Thibs and Brooks? Then starts bringing Nazi Germany into the equation when fans suggest Smart isn't a good coach? Weird.

Kind of odd to blast the Kings for not following on OKC's footsteps which he's done a fair amount of recently, and at the same time act that without a doubt Smart will get us to where OKC is currently. Should probably just stick to HereWeStay.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Rachel Phelps in a bikini is cool, but trust me you don't wanna see Plasticanne Maloof in a bikini.

Oh don't I know this...that's why I said just paste her face over Rachel Phelps' face, but keep her body. Lol

 

[John Galt]

Let's compromise - don't buy popcorn.

the ladies who run the popcorn stand are nice and seem like they could use the bread. tricky economics. and popcorn's good... mmmm

 

[Trueblood]

the ladies who run the popcorn stand are nice and seem like they could use the bread. tricky economics. and popcorn's good... mmmm

I'm guessing they get paid by the hour so less sales wouldn't hurt their bottom line. Again, it's just a guess. Maybe they do get commission per box or bag of popcorn. But if they're paid hourly, save your dough for the movie theatre.

 

[kennadog]

I'm guessing they get paid by the hour so less sales wouldn't hurt their bottom line. Again, it's just a guess. Maybe they do get commission per box or bag of popcorn. But if they're paid hourly, save your dough for the movie theatre.

Yes, I'm sure they are paid hourly. However, if sales at various concessions fall off too much, guess what happens? Employees get hours cut or get laid off.

Go ahead and boycott games or or other team/arena purchases, if you think it's the right way to go. Just don't fool yourself into believing that boycotting games or concessions will only hurt the Maloofs. As the employer, they are the last to get hurt. Janitors, ushers, kitchen help, stockers, team store help, ticket sales persons at those windows, bar tenders, concession workers, etc. will all get hurt first.

I've seen it happen over and over for a lot of years. People at upper end of a business are the last to get hurt.

 

[gunks]

But if they move the team all these people will lose their jobs anyways.


I think the best move is to "occupy" Arco. Go out, support the team, show that we want the Kings to stay in Sac, but get as many people in the stands as possible to hold up anti-Magoof, pro-new owner signage. It'll give the family even more bad press, and maybe spread awareness of what horrible owners they are while at the same time show that we still love the Kings in Sacramento.

 

[Section 101]

Nobody would expect somebody a business to try to go forward without a key part they needed. Arco is all but done as an NBA arena. It's not going to get replaced while they are here. Even if a fellow owner is being really dumb about an offer on a arena, owners aren't going to back a city over an owners right to move in this fight in two year. Right now, they'd say no. Next year, maybe. Two years from now, they let the Maloofs go.

No shot the Kings are forced to say here 3 seasons or more with, "You can't move. You can take the Orlando deal or stay in Arco." If the NBA did that, the Kings will win in court and force the move.

This has nothing to do with paint on a house you can otherwise live in.

How about another possible scenario. Petrie turns it around and they are in the playoff hunt March 1st. How would it look if there was no support?

 

[Larry David]

How about another possible scenario. Petrie turns it around and they are in the playoff hunt March 1st. How would it look if there was no support?

The casual fans are done. They arent flocking to chase an 8th seed, because they correctly assume were in a lame duck phase. Attendance will be poor, the only question is how poor.

 

[Section 101]

The casual fans are done. They arent flocking to chase an 8th seed, because they correctly assume were in a lame duck phase. Attendance will be poor, the only question is how poor.

That wasn't the question. How would it look to the BoG?

 

[Larry David]

That wasn't the question. How would it look to the BoG?

Either like the Maloofs ran off the fans that were loyal for many years and came back last season or Sacramento is the problem. Two very different results and we'll never agree on how they will see it.

At the same time, as bad as the maloofs case is, mediocre attendance and no progress on an arena is just as bad for Sacramento.

 

[upinsmoke]

With a min of $290 Million in dept any profit goes right back to NBA the BOG is looking at the Magoofs thinking "Are you done".

 

[Spike]

Maybe Dave is off his rocker. Has he started drinking again? Or he just doesn't know basketball....

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
Quit ripping Smart chodes remember, Scott Brooks and Tom Thibodeau were once Keith Smart too. You think THEY get 40 out of the Kings?

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
How do you know Smart doesn't do the same thing with the Thunder or Bulls? I didn't see major weaknesses w/him this year. Wasn't the coach.

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
Hating on Keith Smart is like hating on Nazi Germany because their colors were stupid. Eye on the ball guys. It's the engine, not the tires.

Carmichael Dave ‏@CarmichaelDave
@News10Sean There were many more reasons to hate the Nazi's than a bad color scheme was my point.Smart is not the reason the Kings suck. ROR


Is he seriously comparing Smart to Thibs and Brooks? Then starts bringing Nazi Germany into the equation when fans suggest Smart isn't a good coach? Weird.

Kind of odd to blast the Kings for not following on OKC's footsteps which he's done a fair amount of recently, and at the same time act that without a doubt Smart will get us to where OKC is currently. Should probably just stick to HereWeStay.

The only quote that means anything to me is when he says "It's the engine, not the tires." As for the rest, we can agree to disagree. There's a lot that shows that Smart isn't like Thibs ( one stresses offense, the other stresses defense - what gets you into the playoffs?) Nor is he like Brooks, who has set up a hierarchy and manages the game well for a young coach...ask Pop.

The fish rots from the head. Will new owners dump the bad contracts and give Smart a balanced roster? Would Smart still f it up with smallball? I don't know, and I don't know that the questions will be answered next year, which sucks for the fans.

 

[Glenn]

That wasn't the question. How would it look to the BoG?

It depends on how stupid you thing the BOG is. As a preface, if this team made the post=season I think the place would fill up. If it didn't, I'd be pointing my fingers directly at the Maloofs as the fault.

 

[Glenn]

Either like the Maloofs ran off the fans that were loyal for many years and came back last season or Sacramento is the problem. Two very different results and we'll never agree on how they will see it.

At the same time, as bad as the maloofs case is, mediocre attendance and no progress on an arena is just as bad for Sacramento.

No progress on an arena? Is that what you think occurred over the last year? It was axed by the Maloofs. It was a far better deal then is being proposed by the Warriors. It mimics the deal done in Orlando in many respects. What more do the Maloofs want?

 

[VF21]

The casual fans are done. They arent flocking to chase an 8th seed, because they correctly assume were in a lame duck phase. Attendance will be poor, the only question is how poor.

An assumption without a basis in fact. The casual fans go to the game to enjoy it as entertainment. They don't look at a "lame duck phase" ... they look at it as a evening of fun. You can't have it both ways. You talk about casual fans and then just bring up things die-hards worry about.

It's clear you have very strong opinions, but they aren't always facts.

 

[Larry David]

No progress on an arena? Is that what you think occurred over the last year? It was axed by the Maloofs. It was a far better deal then is being proposed by the Warriors. It mimics the deal done in Orlando in many respects. What more do the Maloofs want?

Yes. That plan is dead in the water. No city leader is going anywhere near the Maloofs, because they aren't going to make a deal and making a deal with the has again become a bad move with voters. Thus, if you try - you won't get a deal but you might loose your job.

If the Maloofs own the team this March, there will be nothing cooking here for an NBA arena for the Kings.

 

[kennadog]

Either like the Maloofs ran off the fans that were loyal for many years and came back last season or Sacramento is the problem. Two very different results and we'll never agree on how they will see it.

At the same time, as bad as the maloofs case is, mediocre attendance and no progress on an arena is just as bad for Sacramento.

I'm with Glenn. What do you mean by no progress? We pretty much had a very reasonable arena proposal laid out. One worked out with Stern and his people. It was the Maloofs who killed the deal. The lack of an arena now, is totally on the Maloofs. The city, under KJ's leadership, stepped up in a major way with a solid and creative plan of financing.

 

[whozit]

Yes. That plan is dead in the water. No city leader is going anywhere near the Maloofs, because they aren't going to make a deal and making a deal with the has again become a bad move with voters. Thus, if you try - you won't get a deal but you might loose your job.

If the Maloofs own the team this March, there will be nothing cooking here for an NBA arena for the Kings.

I respect a lot of what you post, but even with that plan "dead in the water" two of his aides of left to concentrate on plan "B." Voters are fickle and the election just happened. Are Sacramento County Supervisors staggered in terms of elections? If they are not, they have time to work on this plan "B" whatever it is before they have to face the wrath of the voters.

The fact that they are going to continue gives the indication that they may know something we do not. At least, I hope they do.

 

[Larry David]

An assumption without a basis in fact. The casual fans go to the game to enjoy it as entertainment. They don't look at a "lame duck phase" ... they look at it as a evening of fun. You can't have it both ways. You talk about casual fans and then just bring up things die-hards worry about.

It's clear you have very strong opinions, but they aren't always facts.

When are are faced with opinions you don't like you call the "assumptions without fact." You didn't respond much to my Maloof money posts, but other did with the same thing. "You're assuming a lot. Where are your facts?" I've been wrong a lot, but my batting average is higher because I'm looking at this saying, "What do I think is going to happen." On this issue, a lot of people start with, "How are the Kings going to stay here" and work backwards.

The board is full of Kings zelots, and a big chunk of them are ready to stay away and are done with the Maloofs. Do you talk to many casual fans? Between this team falling off the map, the Maloofs crapping all over the team, and the fact that most casual fans think the team is moving ... if you think they are showing up mid-week to see the Bucks or Jazz, no shot.

Sonics fans started to stay home the last season in Seattle. Houston Oilers, Whalers, ect. When fans understand the team is about to drop the city, they return the favor. It happens.

The Hornets didn't dip much, but if you're thinking that more fans will come to games after what went down this spring. Good luck with that.

You have strong opinions, but they aren't always based in logic.

 

[Larry David]

I respect a lot of what you post, but even with that plan "dead in the water" two of his aides of left to concentrate on plan "B." Voters are fickle and the election just happened. Are Sacramento County Supervisors staggered in terms of elections? If they are not, they have time to work on this plan "B" whatever it is before they have to face the wrath of the voters.

The fact that they are going to continue gives the indication that they may know something we do not. At least, I hope they do.

It’s highly unlikely plan B will be a downtown arena in the rail yards without an anchor tenant. Even if they could make the numbers work, the Maloofs would be fools not to file a lawsuit claiming the city violated the non-compete clause. At which point, the city could have a 67 million dollar hole blown in the budget if 9 of 12 bay area jurors (trial moved) voted the arena was similar enough to “compete” with PBP. There aren’t five votes on the city counsel for that move. Too much risk.

Really, the first plan B is new owners come in and take the Kings deal.

After that, it’s an NHL team or some other NBA team like Memphis want to step in after the King leave.

At this point, the story yesterday seemed to indicate that Think Big is going back to the drawing board. They are probably going to explore whether baseball and other civil projects are possible using the parking money.

When the Maloofs when to the BOG last spring, KJ could tell the NBA owners “Wait, we’re working on a plan." That was big. Unless something major changes, there is no longer a plan in the pipe to keep the Kings here with the Maloofs. Maybe, “Sacramento got screwed" keeps the team here one or two seasons, perhaps three. But at some point, if the Maloofs keep control over the team and Sacramento doesn’t fund and break ground on an arena, even if the Maloofs are being unreasonable, the BOG will allow them to be tenants elsewhere.

So to that end, I’m saying next March there will have been no progress on an arena. KJ is hoping the Maloofs run out of cash and RE is kicking the tires on baseball and other things. If I’m an NBA owner, that means as of right now, “There is no progress on an NBA arena here.”

We almost had a plan that’s dead and not being worked on does not constitute current progress.

 

[kennadog]

When are are faced with opinions you don't like you call the "assumptions without fact." You didn't respond much to my Maloof money posts, but other did with the same thing. "You're assuming a lot. Where are your facts?" I've been wrong a lot, but my batting average is higher because I'm looking at this saying, "What do I think is going to happen." On this issue, a lot of people start with, "How are the Kings going to stay here" and work backwards.

The board is full of Kings zelots, and a big chunk of them are ready to stay away and are done with the Maloofs. Do you talk to many casual fans? Between this team falling off the map, the Maloofs crapping all over the team, and the fact that most casual fans think the team is moving ... if you think they are showing up mid-week to see the Bucks or Jazz, no shot.

Sonics fans started to stay home the last season in Seattle. Houston Oilers, Whalers, ect. When fans understand the team is about to drop the city, they return the favor. It happens.

The Hornets didn't dip much, but if you're thinking that more fans will come to games after what went down this spring. Good luck with that.

You have strong opinions, but they aren't always based in logic.

I respect your knowledge of actual facts. Unfortunately you express the conclusions you draw from those facts as though they are actual facts, instead of the conclusion you believe in. "The casual fans are done." I do talk to casual fans, but not all of them. Maybe you need to define "casual fan." Some casual fans haven't been attending, because the economy has made it a luxury they can't afford right now. You don't even mention that in drawing your conclusion.

And in numerous posts you state the team is leaving as though it were already an indisputable "fact."

You do present some very good facts and insights and I repect that. I respect your opinion and you have a right to your opinion or interpretation of the real facts. But you are not a fortune teller. Intelligent people can look at the same "facts" and draw different conclusions.

I'm pessimistic, too, about the whole situation. I'm not stupid/blind. But there are a some of us here, who are well-organized and taking actions on the team and the arena and have been doing so for some time. Until a move is officially announced, we won't give up. Why? Because it's not a "fact" yet.

 

[Larry David]

[/U]I'm with Glenn. What do you mean by no progress? We pretty much had a very reasonable arena proposal laid out. One worked out with Stern and his people. It was the Maloofs who killed the deal. The lack of an arena now, is totally on the Maloofs. The city, under KJ's leadership, stepped up in a major way with a solid and creative plan of financing.

Your looking at the blame. That might keep the team here for a season or two (might not). The Maloofs and the city are done with each other and the NBA can't make them take a deal.

If they aren't working on any deal, an arena deal is dead in the water. We had one plan that could work, and the Maloofs killed it. But the city has tried 5-7 deals and didn't get it done over 12-15 years.

Look at the fundamentals and the players. 29 owners are going to vote as to whether the Maloofs have to stay in a city where the city didn't get an arena done for over 10 years, the city and team aren't even trying to make a deal right now, and the mayor is taking about using the parking money that will be needed to make a deal to build a non-NBA arena instead. In 1 or 2 years, those owners side with the city over the Maloofs?

Fans here are saying "We were fouled!" Yes, we were. Unless something changes, I think that gives us one more season. Maybe, two. At which point, there will be a lot of owners that say, "The Maloofs botched the last deal. The city botched 5 others. You can go." I don't know where they go. I wouldn't be shocked if the NBA tells the, you can move but not to So Cal (which spins off, where? and a possible Maloofs lawsuit).

But the "progress" that ended with a dead deal, isn't going to matter much in 12 or 18 months. To Stern yes, but not to most owners, who fight with cities all the time.

 

[Larry David]

I respect your knowledge of actual facts. Unfortunately you express the conclusions you draw from those facts as though they are actual facts, instead of the conclusion you believe in. "

This is true. And you've always been fair on that point. So I'm not throwing dirt at you.

Fans are hurt by what went down in the spring. Even when a bad teams starts to win, the fans don't show up right away. A LOT of fans think the Maloofs intend to move ASAP. This is a young team with roster issues. They are going to have issues drawing early.

If they were over .500 after two months and there was no Maloof or arena news until 2013, then they could draw better in the spring. But based upon the early numbers, attendance - mostly among non-die hards - will be poor for the season.

Plus, having a March and April attendance bump and no new arena plan is only going to get you so far.

There is a great case for "Don't stop coming to game. It will burn us." Somehow this changed into, I think the Kings can still draw well with casual fans. Really? That's the debate? Why? And where does it lead?

 

[kennadog]

I will certainly agree that attendence has be mediocre for some time now. I personally, don't want to make it worse by boycotting games. As I've said, it will hurt employees long before it hurts the Maloofs. Casual fans not showing up and now some would like the diehards to not show up? It will just make the Maloofs case stronger in support of a move, along with the poor condition of the arena. Unless such actions is clearly marked as a boycott of the ownership and is tied into other organized action. Like a petition to the league.

Personally, I have to think Stern and the league must be researching to see if there's any way to oust the Maloofs as majority owners. None of us has any idea what's going on back in NY with Stern and the BOG. I would guess it's not a "dropped" subject for them, yet. Yes, owners will always tend to support other owners, but what if an ownership is so bad, that's its a detriment to the league? I don't know. But its one of the reasons why I won't give up yet. I believe Stern is on the fans side in this and must be mad as hell at the Maloofs.

BTW, in terms of number of games I can afford to attend, some might think I'm a casual fan.