Assessment from Extremely Knowledgeable fan

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1) Philosophical Differences: Musselmen's style will not suit the kings because most of the acquisitions Petrie has made were made for a motion offense. Even with Musselmen running motion sets it will not be the same because the coach does not understand the nuance of a system that he's never worked with.

2) Player Types: The collection of players we have make very good complementary players. Like it or not, our team was Webber. Everything ran through him and he was our focal superstar player. Accordingly he had a few MVP type seasons. Our players would be very useful or an asset to another team needing a piece to make a title run. Brad miller would really help a Hornets team or Mike bibby could help Rockets team. Now I haven't considered or looked at the possibility/plausibility of those trades...iv'e only offered some ideal situations for such role players.

3) Player Salaries: Players such as Kevin Martin and Ron Artest are too strong of assets for us to trade because of their salary to production rate. Low salary for these players yet theyr'e some of our better talented players. Such players are usually ones you should keep and players the Kings likely will.

4) Coaching: Look, some people might say it's too early to judge musselmen but he does not have the coaching background for this job. It's as simple as that. Most of his assistants lack many years of nba experience in coaching. Look at the other rosters. We probably have one of the least experienced coaching staffs in the NBA. I hope with after we have truly selected a style of play after this year that we hire an experienced coach. Look, Musselmen has coached a very talented team in Golden state to average results. True, you could say they were young but his style may not be conducive to winning. To play his style, you need at least a few dominant defensive players...or at least A spotblocker. Look at SA or Dallas. With Dallas, it may not be that clear but Dampier and Diop have more blocks than our entire roster.

Conclusion: We must address the issue of finding a style, superstar player we will build around AND please, do not say Kevin Martin. Anyone who has watched basketball knows that a superstar has MVP like qualities and consistantly puts up great numbers. Of course martin in young but sorry to burst everyone's bubble...but he's not the next Kobe, TMAC, Wade, Lebron. He might be as good as Rip or even better, Reggie. But as we know, it takes more than Rip and Reggie to win. However, we all can see that the superstars i listed are of a different mold. All can create their own shot and bring a level of skill to the game above the rest. Martin is a great 2nd option and even 3rd. But he doesnt have those qualities. So back to my point, we need to find a superstar...be that Greg Odon or a swingman we draft or player we acquire with superstar potential. Along with a superstar player, a set philosophy, and coach with good experience we can rebuild as people like to bring up often on this forum "on the fly" so improving but also rebuilding.
 
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1) Philosophical Differences: Musselmen's style will not suit the kings because most of the acquisitions Petrie has made were made for a motion offense. Even with Musselmen running motion sets it will not be the same because the coach does not understand the nuance of a system that he's never worked with.

2) Player Types: The collection of players we have make very good complementary players. Like it or not, our team was Webber. Everything ran through him and he was our focal superstar player. Accordingly he had a few MVP type seasons. Our players would be very useful or an asset to another team needing a piece to make a title run. Brad miller would really help a Hornets team or Mike bibby could help Rockets team. Now I haven't considered or looked at the possibility/plausibility of those trades...iv'e only offered some ideal situations for such role players.

3) Player Salaries: Players such as Kevin Martin and Ron Artest are too strong of assets for us to trade because of their salary to production rate. Low salary for these players yet theyr'e some of our better talented players. Such players are usually ones you should keep and players the Kings likely will.

4) Coaching: Look, some people might say it's too early to judge musselmen but he does not have the coaching background for this job. It's as simple as that. Most of his assistants lack many years of nba experience in coaching. Look at the other rosters. We probably have one of the least experienced coaching staffs in the NBA. I hope with after we have truly selected a style of play after this year that we hire an experienced coach. Look, Musselmen has coached a very talented team in Golden state to average results. True, you could say they were young but his style may not be conducive to winning. To play his style, you need at least a few dominant defensive players...or at least A spotblocker. Look at SA or Dallas. With Dallas, it may not be that clear but Dampier and Diop have more blocks than our entire roster.

Conclusion: We must address the issue of finding a style, superstar player we will build around AND please, do not say Kevin Martin. Anyone who has watched basketball knows that a superstar has MVP like qualities and consistantly puts up great numbers. Of course martin in young but sorry to burst everyone's bubble...but he's not the next Kobe, TMAC, Wade, Lebron. He might be as good as Rip or even better, Reggie. But as we know, it takes more than Rip and Reggie to win. However, we all can see that the superstars i listed are of a different mold. All can create their own shot and bring a level of skill to the game above the rest. Martin is a great 2nd option and even 3rd. But he doesnt have those qualities. So back to my point, we need to find a superstar...be that Greg Odon or a swingman we draft or player we acquire with superstar potential. Along with a superstar player, a set philosophy, and coach with good experience we can rebuild as people like to bring up often on this forum "on the fly" so improving but also rebuilding.

well we'd have to start losing a lot or get real lucky with the contracts in return for bibby and miller and then in turn get lucky on a free agent to rebuild "on the fly". artest is our only real piece that can get us a head start on the rebuilding process through draft picks or good young talent.
 
1) Philosophical Differences: Musselmen's style will not suit the kings because most of the acquisitions Petrie has made were made for a motion offense. Even with Musselmen running motion sets it will not be the same because the coach does not understand the nuance of a system that he's never worked with.

Not meaning to be contrary (okay, that's a lie), but what are these aquisitions for a motion offense?

Artest? No. Shareef? No. KT? No. Martin? Somewhat.

The motion offense is NOT what this team is made for. They are a grind it team with two decent spot shooters. The only players this team has that NEED a the old offense for success are Brad Miller and Mike Bibby. And that's because Bibby isn't a PG and Brad Miller isn't a true C.

2) Player Types: The collection of players we have make very good complementary players.

That's always a thing that's bandied about like it means something. There are very few teams that actually have a TRUE superstar. The rest are makeshift stars. We've got players that can fit this role.

3) Player Salaries: Players such as Kevin Martin and Ron Artest are too strong of assets for us to trade because of their salary to production rate.

Martin, I agree. But, Artest has a weak open market value and his production is marginal right now.

4) Coaching: Look, some people might say it's too early to judge musselmen but he does not have the coaching background for this job. It's as simple as that. ... To play his style, you need at least a few dominant defensive players...or at least A spotblocker. Look at SA or Dallas. With Dallas, it may not be that clear but Dampier and Diop have more blocks than our entire roster.

A shotblocker is not a must. People want to keep on and on about "shot blockers". The simple fact is that our problem is outside in. A shotblocker can help clean up the mistakes from the perimeter, but it really wouldn't matter because he'll constantly be out of position making up for Mike Bibby. A shotblocker helps for mistakes, not the norm.

Replace Mike Bibby and start SAR over Miller and our team defense is increased tremendously. We'll still give up the internal size, but our team defense will be better as we won't have to be out of position on every switch, pick, or move put on Mike Bibby.

This team isn't championship bound with either lineup, but I believe you put a lineup with Salmons at PG rather than Bibby and we're instantly a better team.
 
When I talk about players brought in for the motion offense...i'm talking about our highet paid assets....bibby and Miller.

By superstar, I mean a primary player on team which can dominate. Any team with any shot has one.

Pheonix: Amare or Nash
SA: Duncan
Dallas: Dirk
LA: Kobe
Detriot: billups...as much as it didtn seem like they didnt have a "star" billups was the man in Detriot in that finals series and at end of games.
 
Extremely Knowledgable Kings Fan - Self Praise is no praise

i thought it was called the princeton offense, i wouldnt call billups a superstar
 
you apparently didnt watch the nba finals 3 years ago and see who the MVP was.
 
That's always a thing that's bandied about like it means something. There are very few teams that actually have a TRUE superstar. The rest are makeshift stars. We've got players that can fit this role.

Every team that wants to go far has that superstar or near superstar player. And on the kings they have none of those only complementary players. The only team i could think of that has done anything without that type of player is the pistons but you could aurge that billups was that player and that team was full of allstars.
 
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Extremely Knowledgable Kings Fan - Self Praise is no praise

i thought it was called the princeton offense, i wouldnt call billups a superstar

Most NCAA teams run the motion offense invented by Bob Knight and then revolutionized by Coach K. The kings actually stopped running the true version of the princeton offense. (the only team that probably still runs it are the wizards and the hornets have some sets.) All i meant by Motion was a system based on player and ball movement....so call it corners, princeton, motion whatever you want. Right now we run an isolation offense that is similar to what the Spurs used to run with David Robinson and Miami ran for Shaq his first year. We however don't have such a low post presence....to say the least.
 
1) Philosophical Differences: Musselmen's style will not suit the kings because most of the acquisitions Petrie has made were made for a motion offense. Even with Musselmen running motion sets it will not be the same because the coach does not understand the nuance of a system that he's never worked with.

Hogwash

2) Player Types: The collection of players we have make very good complementary players. Like it or not, our team was Webber. Everything ran through him and he was our focal superstar player. Accordingly he had a few MVP type seasons. Our players would be very useful or an asset to another team needing a piece to make a title run. Brad miller would really help a Hornets team or Mike bibby could help Rockets team. Now I haven't considered or looked at the possibility/plausibility of those trades...iv'e only offered some ideal situations for such role players.

Only three players remain from the Webber days. Sorry, "extremely knowledgeable fan," but you should have known that.

3) Player Salaries: Players such as Kevin Martin and Ron Artest are too strong of assets for us to trade because of their salary to production rate. Low salary for these players yet theyr'e some of our better talented players. Such players are usually ones you should keep and players the Kings likely will.

If we're truly going to go into rebuild mold, someone with Artest's skills and Martin's potential might be exactly the type of bait we'd have to dangle to get draft picks, etc. in return.

4) Coaching: Look, some people might say it's too early to judge musselmen but he does not have the coaching background for this job. It's as simple as that. Most of his assistants lack many years of nba experience in coaching. Look at the other rosters. We probably have one of the least experienced coaching staffs in the NBA. I hope with after we have truly selected a style of play after this year that we hire an experienced coach. Look, Musselmen has coached a very talented team in Golden state to average results. True, you could say they were young but his style may not be conducive to winning. To play his style, you need at least a few dominant defensive players...or at least A spotblocker. Look at SA or Dallas. With Dallas, it may not be that clear but Dampier and Diop have more blocks than our entire roster.

Look... Look... Look... ???

Conclusion: We must address the issue of finding a style, superstar player we will build around AND please, do not say Kevin Martin. Anyone who has watched basketball knows that a superstar has MVP like qualities and consistantly puts up great numbers. Of course martin in young but sorry to burst everyone's bubble...but he's not the next Kobe, TMAC, Wade, Lebron. He might be as good as Rip or even better, Reggie. But as we know, it takes more than Rip and Reggie to win. However, we all can see that the superstars i listed are of a different mold. All can create their own shot and bring a level of skill to the game above the rest. Martin is a great 2nd option and even 3rd. But he doesnt have those qualities. So back to my point, we need to find a superstar...be that Greg Odon or a swingman we draft or player we acquire with superstar potential. Along with a superstar player, a set philosophy, and coach with good experience we can rebuild as people like to bring up often on this forum "on the fly" so improving but also rebuilding.

We need to find a superstar, whether it's Greg Odon or a swingman???

Sorry, but I'm not sold on any of your points.
 
Hogwash



Only three players remain from the Webber days. Sorry, "extremely knowledgeable fan," but you should have known that.



If we're truly going to go into rebuild mold, someone with Artest's skills and Martin's potential might be exactly the type of bait we'd have to dangle to get draft picks, etc. in return.



Look... Look... Look... ???



We need to find a superstar, whether it's Greg Odon or a swingman???

Sorry, but I'm not sold on any of your points.

ahh Bibby+Miller= $ 23 million in combined salary. They are what the kings INVESTED in because how the played in a particular OFFENSE (the more free flowing offense designed around WEBBER.)

So out of a $ 53 million salary cap that's roughly less than half. So i guess you're right, we dont really have huge investments in players who fit the older style.

Really, when was the last time a player was traded for a first round draft pick PRIOR to AI???? can you remember? Let's see...never. So it takes a player who's All NBA and a former MVP to get 1st round picks in return....we sure have that in Artest and Martin. Trade player who have small salaries put huge upside? not smart either.

Superstars generally come in 2 molds: either a swingman type or dominant center. Either way has shown to win...a la Jordan in the best case, Lebron currently or Shaq/Wilt/Kareem...the list goes on with big men
 
Really, when was the last time a player was traded for a first round draft pick PRIOR to AI???? can you remember? Let's see...never.
There goes just about any claim you had to being "extremely knowledgable", not like that was really in doubt to begin with.
 
I needed a laugh.

The title was enough, but then I read the post. I got more than I needed.

Thank you, significantly informed individual.
 
ahh Bibby+Miller= $ 23 million in combined salary. They are what the kings INVESTED in because how the played in a particular OFFENSE (the more free flowing offense designed around WEBBER.)

So you've said. And it doesn't make any more sense the second time...

So out of a $ 53 million salary cap that's roughly less than half. So i guess you're right, we dont really have huge investments in players who fit the older style.

Or the third...

Really, when was the last time a player was traded for a first round draft pick PRIOR to AI???? can you remember? Let's see...never. So it takes a player who's All NBA and a former MVP to get 1st round picks in return....we sure have that in Artest and Martin. Trade player who have small salaries put huge upside? not smart either.

So you're basically trying to say no first round pick has been traded?

Superstars generally come in 2 molds: either a swingman type or dominant center. Either way has shown to win...a la Jordan in the best case, Lebron currently or Shaq/Wilt/Kareem...the list goes on with big men

Oh, so now you're revising your comments to include centers in your derfinition of superstars? What's next? Point guards?

You haven't said anything new and your view of your own opinions is over-stated, to say the least.
 
The next time the kings make the playoffs, only 2-3 players from this current roster will be on the team. Martin, Artest and Douby.

And for all of you guys who think that when mike bibby magically gets his stroke back that we're going to be a 7th or 8th seed in the West, well...you're living in a dreamland because that's not going to happen. The kings probably the least talented team in the west (behind seattle) because they have large investments players who are complementary players who all don't fit a similar style of play. This will change once we get a new coach and some youthful talent through the draft or free agency.

Mark my words. I predicted this was going to happen. I'm one of the biggest kings fans alive but it appears i'm the only who sees the value in having a high draft pick...espeically this year!!!! If you want to have a rebuilding year, this is it with the draft class coming out.
 
The next time the kings make the playoffs, only 2-3 players from this current roster will be on the team. Martin, Artest and Douby.

And for all of you guys who think that when mike bibby magically gets his stroke back that we're going to be a 7th or 8th seed in the West, well...you're living in a dreamland because that's not going to happen. The kings probably the least talented team in the west (behind seattle) because they have large investments players who are complementary players who all don't fit a similar style of play. This will change once we get a new coach and some youthful talent through the draft or free agency.

Mark my words. I predicted this was going to happen. I'm one of the biggest kings fans alive but it appears i'm the only who sees the value in having a high draft pick...espeically this year!!!! If you want to have a rebuilding year, this is it with the draft class coming out.

Mark your words? Dude, before you go making pronouncements as though you've thought of something different, you should take some time and read some of the threads. Bricklayer, among others, has consistently maintained that there is a strong case for aiming at a high draft pick this year.

You haven're predicted anything that hasn't already been under discussion on this forum for quite some time.
 
there goes our coaching staff, there goes our game plan.
1. does eric know what he wants to do on offense
2. does he have the players to do it.

nothing has changed. instead of saying give eric time lets accept that its 23 games into the season. they wont gel anytime soon. this is what happens when you have a team full of role players. everyone thinks they're the 1st option; even though they dont publicly announce it in locker room interviews. our best/worst shooter is still jacking up shots. this team needs an anchor. we cannot initiate offense with a brad miller screen every time down the floor. blah blah, stating the obvious. etc
 
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