What should Vlade do at Trade Deadline???

[Livinthedream]

I don;t see how any player is going to make a defensive impact in Sacramento, as long as George Karl is in charge of the defensive schemes and the substitutions/roster.

Karl has absolutely no clue how to play defense in the modern NBA, and that has been proven this season, many times over.

This is what I've been saying since the end of last season. The defensive system is designed to force teams to shoot threes. We're essentially playing a matchup zone. Zones never work in the NBA for any length of time. But we do it all the time. We're not forgetting about 3pt shooters (well, sometimes we do). Our system takes us out of effective defensive position.

 

[HndsmCelt]

I hate to say it but any move larger than trading spare pieces like Butler, Anderson or Marco could do more harm than good. Underlying all the visible problems with defense, inconsistent play etc. is the long term franchise instability. At this point I think there is MORE risk in moving coaches or role players than in keeping them even if they are problematic. IF we are going to turn the corner as a franchise it is going to take a team and staff that trust each other and play for each other, you just can't do that with out taking time to build bonds. Further trust and unselfishness just do not flourish when people are wondering if they are going to be kept around or if they even WANT to hang around. So if I am Vlade at this point I have to leave the staff and rotation players alone and give them the time and space to either succeed or fail on their own, then make adjustments after the season has played out.

 

[Merdiesel]

Dream scenario.

 

[N0tmyfault]

Honestly, Belli has been straight trash, but I feel he's missed used. Collison is trash and is terrible off the bench. I honestly believe Belli could do well if he was asked to spot shoot like he did in San Antonio. I know Brandon Jennings could be had very easily, and it's been awhile since I have seen him play, but I believe he's a perfect 6th man who can create his own shot. We need someone on the bench who can create their own shot and play hero ball. Collison and Belli dribble, dribble, dribble and get no where on the court. A deal around Meeks/Jennings for Belli/Collison would be interesting. I'm not sure on the cap, so perhaps more scrubs would have to be included. I believe Meeks is more of a pure shooter han Belli (not positive, though).

 

[bajaden]

This is what I've been saying since the end of last season. The defensive system is designed to force teams to shoot threes. We're essentially playing a matchup zone. Zones never work in the NBA for any length of time. But do it all the time. We're not forgetting about 3pt shooters (well, sometimes we do). Our system takes us out of effective defensive position.

To add to what you said, Zone's particularly don't work well when you have undersized players on the floor. It's was hard to play a zone with IT out there and with both Collison and Eondo on the floor at the same time, your going to get horrible matchups. Zone's work best when you have tall PG's, 6'4"or taller. A zone can be effective if you pick your moments, but as you said, you can't play it for an entire game. Especially against a team with very good outside shooters. Stretch four's are zone killers..

 

[hrdboild]

Honestly, Belli has been straight trash, but I feel he's missed used. Collison is trash and is terrible off the bench. I honestly believe Belli could do well if he was asked to spot shoot like he did in San Antonio. I know Brandon Jennings could be had very easily, and it's been awhile since I have seen him play, but I believe he's a perfect 6th man who can create his own shot. We need someone on the bench who can create their own shot and play hero ball. Collison and Belli dribble, dribble, dribble and get no where on the court. A deal around Meeks/Jennings for Belli/Collison would be interesting. I'm not sure on the cap, so perhaps more scrubs would have to be included. I believe Meeks is more of a pure shooter han Belli (not positive, though).

I don't think Collison is trash. He's playing half of his minutes at SG this season which is a terrible way to use him, but that point aside, I have been considering a similar kind of deal with Detroit. Brandon Jennings is wasted on the bench, but at this point in his career I don't see a starting spot opening up for him anywhere. Stan the Man loves shooters and needs more backcourt production so Collison and Belinelli should theoretically be desirable targets. Jennings is more of a Rondo style PG in that he'll run the offense and try to set guys up. That could result in a smoother transition between starting lineup and bench play. He is an erratic shooter though and losing Collison's efficient scoring would hurt.

That's why I don't think Jennings is the key target. He'd be a Collison replacement (since it's awfully hard to sell somebody on Belinelli alone as a deadeye shooter when he's currently at 31% on the season). Assuming the deal has to be Collison/Belinelli for Jennings/? and we're downgrading a little at backup PG, my other target would be (surprise, surprise) Stanley Johnson. We can fill Marco's spot in the rotation with a combination of guys we already have: Ben, Seth, and Omri. That opens up more minutes at backup SF and what we need even more than another shooter is a perimeter defender. Johnson isn't lighting the league on fire, but he's had his moments. The rook would actually be an upgrade from the three point line at their current percentages and he's young and improving and, more importantly, a hell of a lot better on perimeter D than Marco is.

Salaries match: (Marco 6.3 + Darren 5) = (Brandon 8.3 + Stanley 2.8)

And an we're not giving up any key pieces, so hopefully this doesn't have a negative effect on team chemistry. Darren is an important part of the team but Jennings fills most of his production in the short-term and we only have 1 more year of Darren on his current contract anyway. I don't think we need to make a big trade, just a sensible swapping of mismatched pieces and this is a deal which could benefit both teams.

 

[bajaden]

Dream scenario.

You know, I kind of like this trade. Crowder is having a very good year, and if the Celts were to trade for Gay, you'd almost have to have Crowder coming coming back. Both Crowder and Bradley are good defenders, both can hit the three with consistency, and both are relatively young. We'd be giving up a lot, so I'd have to think about it for a little while, but it is an interesting trade. It would also free up a little capspace for us. Hey, maybe we can get the Celts to throw in a first round draft pic while were at it.

 

[Amit149]

I don't think Collison is trash. He's playing half of his minutes at SG this season which is a terrible way to use him, but that point aside, I have been considering a similar kind of deal with Detroit. Brandon Jennings is wasted on the bench, but at this point in his career I don't see a starting spot opening up for him anywhere. Stan the Man loves shooters and needs more backcourt production so Collison and Belinelli should theoretically be desirable targets. Jennings is more of a Rondo style PG in that he'll run the offense and try to set guys up. That could result in a smoother transition between starting lineup and bench play. He is an erratic shooter though and losing Collison's efficient scoring would hurt.

That's why I don't think Jennings is the key target. He'd be a Collison replacement (since it's awfully hard to sell somebody on Belinelli alone as a deadeye shooter when he's currently at 31% on the season). Assuming the deal has to be Collison/Belinelli for Jennings/? and we're downgrading a little at backup PG, my other target would be (surprise, surprise) Stanley Johnson. We can fill Marco's spot in the rotation with a combination of guys we already have: Ben, Seth, and Omri. That opens up more minutes at backup SF and what we need even more than another shooter is a perimeter defender. Johnson isn't lighting the league on fire, but he's had his moments. The rook would actually be an upgrade from the three point line at their current percentages and he's young and improving and, more importantly, a hell of a lot better on perimeter D than Marco is.

Salaries match: (Marco 6.3 + Darren 5) = (Brandon 8.3 + Stanley 2.8)

And an we're not giving up any key pieces, so hopefully this doesn't have a negative effect on team chemistry. Darren is an important part of the team but Jennings fills most of his production in the short-term and we only have 1 more year of Darren on his current contract anyway. I don't think we need to make a big trade, just a sensible swapping of mismatched pieces and this is a deal which could benefit both teams.

Why would Detroit trade a guy they just drafted at 8 to get Marco and DC?

Dream scenario.

That is a very nice trade but I doubt the Celtics would want anything to do with that, they want a star to add to their nice collection of roleplayers and I don't think they are aiming for a guy like Gay.

 

[hrdboild]

Why would Detroit trade a guy they just drafted at 8 to get Marco and DC?

That is a very nice trade but I doubt the Celtics would want anything to do with that, they want a star to add to their nice collection of roleplayers and I don't think they are aiming for a guy like Gay.

Because they're a playoff team this year and need immediate production. Because their starting SG has been even worse than Belinelli this year (KCP is taking 5 threes a game and making 31%). Because Brandon Jennings off the bench is not working for them and he's an expiring deal anyway. The key for them would be upgrading the backup PG spot (Collison is shooting 37% from three, Jennings is shooting 30%) and getting an extra year of Collison on a very team-friendly 5 million dollar deal. Stan Van Gundy has targeted players like Marco Belinelli in the past and you could also make the argument that his career numbers suggest he'll improve his shooting in the second half of the season. A bench SG who can hit threes consistently would be an absolute godsend for that team right now.

We're giving up a guy with positive value (Collison) and a guy who isn't producing for us with potential to have a positive impact in the right situation (Belinelli) in exhange for a guy who has positive value to them (Johnson) and a guy who isn't producing and is about to become a lost asset (Jennings). There's a fair amount of risk/reward involved for both teams.

 

[King Baller]

I don;t see how any player is going to make a defensive impact in Sacramento, as long as George Karl is in charge of the defensive schemes and the substitutions/roster.

Karl has absolutely no clue how to play defense in the modern NBA, and that has been proven this season, many times over.

Agreed, in most of this seasons wins the other team was not shooting well.

 

[Amit149]

Because they're a playoff team this year and need immediate production. Because their starting SG has been even worse than Belinelli this year (KCP is taking 5 threes a game and making 31%). Because Brandon Jennings off the bench is not working for them and he's an expiring deal anyway. The key for them would be upgrading the backup PG spot (Collison is shooting 37% from three, Jennings is shooting 30%) and getting an extra year of Collison on a very team-friendly 5 million dollar deal. Stan Van Gundy has targeted players like Marco Belinelli in the past and you could also make the argument that his career numbers suggest he'll improve his shooting in the second half of the season. A bench SG who can hit threes consistently would be an absolute godsend for that team right now.

We're giving up a guy with positive value (Collison) and a guy who isn't producing for us with potential to have a positive impact in the right situation (Belinelli) in exhange for a guy who has positive value to them (Johnson) and a guy who isn't producing and is about to become a lost asset (Jennings). There's a fair amount of risk/reward involved for both teams.

Just cause they are playoff team doesn't mean they'll trade a guy they just picked this high in the draft for spare parts... I think you are massively undervaluing his worth, and since I doubt Stan is thinking of contention this year I doubt he'll choose short term talent boost for a guy who's got a lot of promise.

KCP has been far better than Marco this year, his shooting is bad (same as Marco) but he is far better overall- especially defensively. And if they are looking for a shooter to fix they already have Jodie Meeks on the roster who's supposed to come back around All-Star weekend.

DC is an upgrade over current Jennings, but if you are talking about Marco getting back to his old level you can say the same about him, anyway I doubt the upgrade at backup PG is worth enough for them to drop Stanley (they also got Steve Blake there).

 

[KingMilz]

Just cause they are playoff team doesn't mean they'll trade a guy they just picked this high in the draft for spare parts... I think you are massively undervaluing his worth, and since I doubt Stan is thinking of contention this year I doubt he'll choose short term talent boost for a guy who's got a lot of promise.

KCP has been far better than Marco this year, his shooting is bad (same as Marco) but he is far better overall- especially defensively. And if they are looking for a shooter to fix they already have Jodie Meeks on the roster who's supposed to come back around All-Star weekend.

DC is an upgrade over current Jennings, but if you are talking about Marco getting back to his old level you can say the same about him, anyway I doubt the upgrade at backup PG is worth enough for them to drop Stanley (they also got Steve Blake there).

Stanley has a massive ceiling there is zero chance they trade him for Marco/DC that's like us trading WCS for Anthony Tolliver and Jennings.

 

[randymoss1881]

Gay for Gallinari

For Denver: they say he's on the block and with Malone/PDA there Gay can be there guy.

Sacramento:
Gallinari can be a very good #2 guy next to DMC. He isn't a ball dominate guy so he can fit next to DMC/Rondo without hurting his or there production. Gallo is also a player who can get his own shot so we won't be loosing much with trading Gay. Gallo also plays with passion and what would make this trade worth it is that Gallo is a great 3point shooter and is only 27

 

[hrdboild]

Just cause they are playoff team doesn't mean they'll trade a guy they just picked this high in the draft for spare parts... I think you are massively undervaluing his worth, and since I doubt Stan is thinking of contention this year I doubt he'll choose short term talent boost for a guy who's got a lot of promise.

KCP has been far better than Marco this year, his shooting is bad (same as Marco) but he is far better overall- especially defensively. And if they are looking for a shooter to fix they already have Jodie Meeks on the roster who's supposed to come back around All-Star weekend.

DC is an upgrade over current Jennings, but if you are talking about Marco getting back to his old level you can say the same about him, anyway I doubt the upgrade at backup PG is worth enough for them to drop Stanley (they also got Steve Blake there).

Fair enough. It was just an idea I tossed off. I hate trade threads anyway because it always comes down to "I like this guy" and "I don't like this guy". 99% of the trades proposed in these threads are impractical so it's really just an exercise in pointing out who you want gone.

To answer the original question, I think Vlade should make a smaller trade if it's there but I don't think trading Rudy Gay or Ben McLemore is a good idea and obviously trading DeMarcus or Rondo would sink our season. With our draft picks already accounted for, there's not a lot to work with. We have more than enough talent already to make the playoffs. The biggest problems on this team are internal (imo).

 

[ParniValjak]

IMHO, Gay will only be traded if we get a legitimate 2nd go to guy in return.

We do need a genuine wing defender and genuine production from our SG. I think Marco is not getting used properly, hence career worst shooting numbers.

 

[dude12]

Trading Rudy and not getting back anyone that can create their own shot would be a massive mistake.

 

[LPKingsFan]

Gay for Gallinari

For Denver: they say he's on the block and with Malone/PDA there Gay can be there guy.

Sacramento:
Gallinari can be a very good #2 guy next to DMC. He isn't a ball dominate guy so he can fit next to DMC/Rondo without hurting his or there production. Gallo is also a player who can get his own shot so we won't be loosing much with trading Gay. Gallo also plays with passion and what would make this trade worth it is that Gallo is a great 3point shooter and is only 27

The same thought occurred to me last night. It's an interesting proposition. Contracts are similar, if I recall correctly. Also trades a Malone guy for a Karl guy, no?

 

[ParniValjak]

Trading Rudy and not getting back anyone that can create their own shot would be a massive mistake.

If people don't see this, then they really do not understand basketball. Cousins needs a wingman 2nd scorero who plays well with him and can create his own shot and be our primamry scorer when DMC is out of the game. If our last 3 games should have taught us anything, it's a clear need for a 2nd scorer.

I would go as far as saying if Rudy didn't get a poke in the eye against the Hornets we would likely be 2-1 in the last 3 or at worst 1-3 and still 8th in the West.

 

[swisshh]

The Kings are in a weird position where they need to tweak the roster a bit to help Karl, but can't change the roster in any way that depends on Karl and his system hanging around since it feels doubtful that he will be around next year.

It's a very narrow lane they have to drive their mid-season roster moves on. Only thing that fits is a defensive guard/wing that can play minutes without hurting you offensively and without costing you too much. That's going to be nigh impossible to find. If you trade Gay then you have to get a scorer in return as well.

 

[Boogie_Fever]

Trading Rudy and not getting back anyone that can create their own shot would be a massive mistake.

That's actually been the main culprit of the last 3 games. Without Rudy, you need a historic performance from Big Cuz to be competitive. Can't be kept up. With Rudy at his natural position, they aren't horrendous on defense either.

 

[206Fan]

Other teams are approaching the Kings about Belli. I wonder what it would take for Vlade to trade him.

 

[kingsboi]

Other teams are approaching the Kings about Belli. I wonder what it would take for Vlade to trade him.

While the other teams are acquiring, maybe they may utilize Marco better than the Kings are.

 

[Dukie Dukan]

Fearful of Rondo walking, here is a trade involving him going to the Knicks.

Rondo to Knicks for O'Quinn, Seraphin, Grant, and maybe a 1st round draft pick.

 

[Bricklayer]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/240614/Kings-Receiving-Trade-Interest-On-Marco-Belinelli

 

[Sac.Kings]

I think Karl's defensive game plan to allow the three worked a few years ago, but teams are so deadly from the three now that it just doesn't work anymore. He needs to change his ways. I would much rather force them to drive than take uncontested threes.

 

[VF21]

Fearful of Rondo walking, here is a trade involving him going to the Knicks.

Rondo to Knicks for O'Quinn, Seraphin, Grant, and maybe a 1st round draft pick.

Oh good lord. Are you on crack?

 

[VF21]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/240614/Kings-Receiving-Trade-Interest-On-Marco-Belinelli

The offers the Kings have received have been far lower than they'd accept.

Stay tough, Vlade. Insist on a WHOLE bag of chips.

 

[ockingsfan]

Other teams are approaching the Kings about Belli. I wonder what it would take for Vlade to trade him.

How about a belillini to cavs for iman shumpert trade.

Helps both teams. Lebron gets a shooter and the Kings get a defensive wing.

Shumpert can either start or come off the bench and we keep Ben.

 

[Bricklayer]

How about a belillini to cavs for iman shumpert trade.

Helps both teams. Lebron gets a shooter and the Kings get a defensive wing.

Shumpert can either start or come off the bench and we keep Ben.

Not exactly sure why the Cavs would need a shooter and we would not, given we're the ones with the league's best center.

Ongoing problem, we need defenders badly, but it seems that every piece you use to go get one has its own, different, use.

 

[Boogie_Fever]

It's going to be tough. You gotta hope Bellineli snaps out of his funk and Ben becomes our best perimeter defender. Unless an extremely one sided trade in our favor comes along, there's no way this team can acquire what it needs unless it gives away one of it's "core" players.