2014 Draft Prospects:
- Thread starter bajaden
- Start date
Sorry Baja, but I disagree that Craft is close to being the athlete that Smart is. I know you didn't say Craft is a better athlete, but you compared them as similar athletically. People just keep repeating that Smart isn't athletic and it's one of those myths that eventually becomes "fact". Smart, whatever about anything else, is a very good athlete. He doesn't look as quick as he actually is because he's very big. But he's explosive, very strong and is plenty quick. And we all know his lateral quickness is excellent.
Craft is a very good defender, there's no doubt about it. But to say he's as athletic as Smart just isn't true, and isn't even close to being true.
Craft is a very good defender, there's no doubt about it. But to say he's as athletic as Smart just isn't true, and isn't even close to being true.
I was comparing their athleticism from a defensive point of view. I agree that overall Smart is a better athlete, and I never wanted to imply that Smart wasn't athletic, but that he's not an elite athlete. He doesn't have great hops, or terrific end to end speed. But he does have terrific anticipation. I think Smart will be a good NBA player, while I think Craft will have to find a team that has the luxury of having a good defensive PG there if needed. Neither of them can shoot the ball very well, but Craft may be a tad better in that area. I'm not one that puts a lot of emphasis on being an elite athlete. I'm more of a skills guy. There has been a lot of great NBA players that weren't great athlete's.
My problem with Smart, is that I just don't see him as a good fit for the Kings. That doesn't mean I wouldn't draft him if all of the other players I really like are gone off the board. There are a lot of things I really like about him. But I think the Kings need a solid pass first PG, that can, if needed, still shoot the ball in order to keep other teams honest. So far, Smart hasn't shown me the ability to consistently shoot the ball. If I'm drafting that high, I really don't want to gamble on his becoming a good shooter down the road. Now that's just me. Just my opinion! I've been wrong about some players in the past and I could be wrong about Smart. But I'm not going to lie about how I perceive him. What I will do is stop talking about him.
My problem with Smart, is that I just don't see him as a good fit for the Kings. That doesn't mean I wouldn't draft him if all of the other players I really like are gone off the board. There are a lot of things I really like about him. But I think the Kings need a solid pass first PG, that can, if needed, still shoot the ball in order to keep other teams honest. So far, Smart hasn't shown me the ability to consistently shoot the ball. If I'm drafting that high, I really don't want to gamble on his becoming a good shooter down the road. Now that's just me. Just my opinion! I've been wrong about some players in the past and I could be wrong about Smart. But I'm not going to lie about how I perceive him. What I will do is stop talking about him.
Just finished watching Arizona St. at Stanford. Josh Huestis (senior, will most likely be undrafted FA) will be an NBA player at some point: 6'7" with 7'3" wingspan, super athletic going up or sideways, picks up every contested rebound (great timing), defends very well on perimeter (the only guy on Stanford team Jahii Carson didn't want to deal with - passed the ball out immediately, after Huestis picked him up), really bothers shooters on close-outs. Offense is a bit shaky: can handle a bit, decent passer, can shoot 3 from the corner, and obviously great around the rim, but overall shooting is a problem as evidenced by 62% from FT line, though he made 4 straight FTs with game on the line with nothing but net each time, so he has some touch.
P.S. Jahii Carson really reminded me of IT.
P.S.2 Jabari Brown from Mizzou had a great game against Kentucky. Wildcats are not as good defensively as Kansas or Arizona, but they have a roster as close to an NBA one as any team in the country, and Brown looked really good on both ends of the floor outside of first couple of minutes (either lack of concentration or big game anxiety). Got Kentucky front line into foul trouble, and connected from outside 3 (out of 6) times. Both DX and ND.net project him as undrafted, which I don't believe, but some team will get a steal.
P.S. Jahii Carson really reminded me of IT.
P.S.2 Jabari Brown from Mizzou had a great game against Kentucky. Wildcats are not as good defensively as Kansas or Arizona, but they have a roster as close to an NBA one as any team in the country, and Brown looked really good on both ends of the floor outside of first couple of minutes (either lack of concentration or big game anxiety). Got Kentucky front line into foul trouble, and connected from outside 3 (out of 6) times. Both DX and ND.net project him as undrafted, which I don't believe, but some team will get a steal.
Duke v Cuse was a great game. Duke finally broke down that tough zone at the end, but came up just short.
Parker clearly is an NBA level player at this point. His game will thrive once he's out of the college game.
Ennis, eh, I don't know. Heady player but I have my doubts in the NBA. He's a freshman, so tough to judge too hard. I'd compare him to a cerebral Conley without the pedigree.
Fair - makes shots. Not much else. I could see him as a nice option spark plug off the bench.
Jeremi Grant - now this guy I like. Skinny as hell right now. But I think he can guard 3/4 in the NBA someday. Hope he stays in school for another year.
Hood - spot up shooter. Not a great slasher from what I've seen. I wouldn't take him top 10.
Not high on any of the other guys for the NBA, but great college players. Maybe the 'Cuse PF/C as a hustling defender?
Parker clearly is an NBA level player at this point. His game will thrive once he's out of the college game.
Ennis, eh, I don't know. Heady player but I have my doubts in the NBA. He's a freshman, so tough to judge too hard. I'd compare him to a cerebral Conley without the pedigree.
Fair - makes shots. Not much else. I could see him as a nice option spark plug off the bench.
Jeremi Grant - now this guy I like. Skinny as hell right now. But I think he can guard 3/4 in the NBA someday. Hope he stays in school for another year.
Hood - spot up shooter. Not a great slasher from what I've seen. I wouldn't take him top 10.
Not high on any of the other guys for the NBA, but great college players. Maybe the 'Cuse PF/C as a hustling defender?
Today wasn't Parker's best game. He struggled to get his shot, and was pretty bad defensively when he was guarding Fair and Grant.
Ennis was impressive tonight. He found a lot of open guys and showed he has a high bball iq. He's a freshmen like Parker, Wiggins, Embiid, and etc.
I'm not sure why, but a majority of the big name guys tonight. struggled like Parker, Wiggins, and Smart. Embiid didn't me in this game, but he didn't struggle too much.
Ennis was impressive tonight. He found a lot of open guys and showed he has a high bball iq. He's a freshmen like Parker, Wiggins, Embiid, and etc.
I'm not sure why, but a majority of the big name guys tonight. struggled like Parker, Wiggins, and Smart. Embiid didn't me in this game, but he didn't struggle too much.
You need to catch more games with Ennis. Very creative play maker with terrific court vision. Funny you should say what you did about Hood. One of his strengths coming to Duke, was his ability to get to the basket. He's always been known as a slasher, and not a good outside shooter. During the year he sat out to transfer, he worked hard on his outside shot, and improved it. Anyway, he is good at scoring at the basket. However, I agree, I wouldn't take him top ten.
Parker is in the position where so goes Parker, so goes Duke. I agree that once in the NBA, where the load isn't all on him, he'll thrive. I also love Grant. Needs a ton of muscle, and needs to improve his outside shot. But he defends and hustles.
Parker is in the position where so goes Parker, so goes Duke. I agree that once in the NBA, where the load isn't all on him, he'll thrive. I also love Grant. Needs a ton of muscle, and needs to improve his outside shot. But he defends and hustles.
Well, I just woke up from hibernation...
This might be the first time mentioned in this thread, but does anyone like Delon Wright, Dorell Wright's younger brother? Seriously, watch some Utah games this season, and just zero in on Wright. Dude is a 6'5" PG with a great game mid-range in, and unlike faux PGs that draftniks just dub as PGs because they look like one, this guy passes and handles the ball like one. And all his defensive metrics--rebounding, height-wise, steals, blocks, and the actual defense are insane. I know it's Utah and they haven't produced anyone relevant since Bogut, and his long ball is a bit spotty and he's severely underweight, but this is one guy I think will really rise up the boards provided he can maintain this.
Rondae Hollis Jefferson: a 212 lb version of Draymond Green. Needs to put on 30 more lbs, play undersized PF as a backup in this league. Not sure if the upside goes beyond that, but for a college freshman, he's exciting to watch.
Continuing in the Arizona vein, Nick Johnson has really perfected his craft as an all-around scoring spot-up SG who can play good defense. He'll definitely really need a specific team, perhaps one with MCW or Livingston or a tall PG who can pass, or he can be a good popcorn scorer off a bench in staggered lineups in the NBA. Glad to see him right the ship, he was kind of tenuous there after last season for the NBA.
Watch Nevada games for Deonte Burton. Very aggressive mid-range in type scorer with NBA handles. Too bad he's a 6'1" SG all the way who can't play a lick of defense. But I suppose someone could fall in love with the offense.
Jordan Mickey of LSU needs another year, but has a decent game-frame with inside-outside scoring and shotblocking without fouling, but he's a 6'8" center with his style of play and he seems to lack a bit of toughness, as he doesn't really draw contact that well or defend all that special. Need another year to evaluate.
Ennis is absolutely special on defense and PG vision/handles--very rarely you see freshman look that awesome in the NCAAs immediately. I sort of question the upside as he plays a low usage, conservative game and I like his three point shot more than any other parts of his offensive arsenal, but those Mike Conley comparisons are somewhat legit. Canada basketball!
This might be the first time mentioned in this thread, but does anyone like Delon Wright, Dorell Wright's younger brother? Seriously, watch some Utah games this season, and just zero in on Wright. Dude is a 6'5" PG with a great game mid-range in, and unlike faux PGs that draftniks just dub as PGs because they look like one, this guy passes and handles the ball like one. And all his defensive metrics--rebounding, height-wise, steals, blocks, and the actual defense are insane. I know it's Utah and they haven't produced anyone relevant since Bogut, and his long ball is a bit spotty and he's severely underweight, but this is one guy I think will really rise up the boards provided he can maintain this.
Rondae Hollis Jefferson: a 212 lb version of Draymond Green. Needs to put on 30 more lbs, play undersized PF as a backup in this league. Not sure if the upside goes beyond that, but for a college freshman, he's exciting to watch.
Continuing in the Arizona vein, Nick Johnson has really perfected his craft as an all-around scoring spot-up SG who can play good defense. He'll definitely really need a specific team, perhaps one with MCW or Livingston or a tall PG who can pass, or he can be a good popcorn scorer off a bench in staggered lineups in the NBA. Glad to see him right the ship, he was kind of tenuous there after last season for the NBA.
Watch Nevada games for Deonte Burton. Very aggressive mid-range in type scorer with NBA handles. Too bad he's a 6'1" SG all the way who can't play a lick of defense. But I suppose someone could fall in love with the offense.
Jordan Mickey of LSU needs another year, but has a decent game-frame with inside-outside scoring and shotblocking without fouling, but he's a 6'8" center with his style of play and he seems to lack a bit of toughness, as he doesn't really draw contact that well or defend all that special. Need another year to evaluate.
Ennis is absolutely special on defense and PG vision/handles--very rarely you see freshman look that awesome in the NCAAs immediately. I sort of question the upside as he plays a low usage, conservative game and I like his three point shot more than any other parts of his offensive arsenal, but those Mike Conley comparisons are somewhat legit. Canada basketball!
No one misses Ennis more than Wiggins! I think Ennis is the best PG right now. Like you, I'm not sure of his upside. But he's a very smart player that doesn't make many mistakes. He has a 4 to 1 assist to turnover ratio. Or for those that want to quibble, a 3.9999 to 1 assist ratio. He's only an average athlete though, and I'm sure some will downgrade him because of it.
I was following Delon Wright for a while, and his instincts and decision-making is elite. Gets a lot of steals without gambling, runs P&R really well and directs traffic on offense. Shooting needs work. He's a JUCO transfer and is older for his class. That's why I think he will work hard on his shooting in the summer, try to get into postseason next year, and someone will pick their ready PG around 20th pick in summer 2015.
Ennis does play in gimmicky zone, so I wouldn't call him a good defender, just based on a game, where he match upped with outside shooter with not much range past the line. Also it's Duke defense, we're talking about. When match uped with good defenders he doesn't get into the lane, and is just making passes to the open man. Still Ennis is poised, doesn't force at all, and can pass. Wouldn't mind taking him, just not with #8 pick.
P.S. Michigan met a team with a big man, granted it was an away game, and got first loss in Conference play.
Ennis does play in gimmicky zone, so I wouldn't call him a good defender, just based on a game, where he match upped with outside shooter with not much range past the line. Also it's Duke defense, we're talking about. When match uped with good defenders he doesn't get into the lane, and is just making passes to the open man. Still Ennis is poised, doesn't force at all, and can pass. Wouldn't mind taking him, just not with #8 pick.
P.S. Michigan met a team with a big man, granted it was an away game, and got first loss in Conference play.
You struck on the one thing about Ennis that bothers me, the fact that he plays for Syracuse. Of course I held that against Carter-Williams, and so far, he's doing OK. But in general I agree with you. I do think you have to take the fact that Syracuse is unbeaten with him at the helm into consideration. For what that's worth. You also struck on Michigan's problem going forward. They have very good guard play, but on the nights where the guards don't score, or hit their outside shots, and the other team has a good inside presence, they become beatable. You have to wonder if Michigan would have beaten Michigan St. if Payne had been available? Solid game by Vonleh. Played good defense, rebounded, and scored efficiently. The kid is growing on me.
I think Delon has a good chance of improving his shot--he hits his foul shots, which is often the key indicator you look at for any sort of shooting base, and he has a good mid-range pull up. I think he's a major sleeper. Again, provided he maintains this, there's a ton to like here, and I think he could even go late lottery with the proper exposure. Whether this year or next. He's more intriguing than Dorell, IMO, was, who tailed off for me ever since he became super obsessive with the three point shot on offense.
Have to agree with baja here about Ennis: it's the gimmicky zone all over again. I did a study on which schools produce the best first round prospects from 2000s and beyond, and Syracuse was near the bottom of the list, especially for a school that produces a ton of NBA prospects. Very little bang for the buck. Only Anthony and MCW have really bucked that trend a bit. But even with the zone, you can tell which players play better within the zone, and which play worse, and defensively, manning his zone, Syracuse on defense has been a lot better, so there's something to be said for that. Also, he has super quick hands, something that's a key marker as far as the NBA is concerned. And of course, offensively, he's just extremely poised and has a credible outside shot. I think he'll look good in the NBA--he's a smart player with good enough physical gifts.
Have to agree with baja here about Ennis: it's the gimmicky zone all over again. I did a study on which schools produce the best first round prospects from 2000s and beyond, and Syracuse was near the bottom of the list, especially for a school that produces a ton of NBA prospects. Very little bang for the buck. Only Anthony and MCW have really bucked that trend a bit. But even with the zone, you can tell which players play better within the zone, and which play worse, and defensively, manning his zone, Syracuse on defense has been a lot better, so there's something to be said for that. Also, he has super quick hands, something that's a key marker as far as the NBA is concerned. And of course, offensively, he's just extremely poised and has a credible outside shot. I think he'll look good in the NBA--he's a smart player with good enough physical gifts.
Guess it's time to throw Trevor Cooney's name into the mix. He went crazy last night hitting 9-12...3's. Deep, NBA 3's on most.
Athletic too. He is a sophomore playing for Syracuse, mostly a role player this season. I'm sure he'll stay in school for another year and he may be the lead dog on the team next year. He's listed at 6'4" and is a SG.
I know most of you guys who post in this forum already know about him, just wanted to get his name out there.
Dunk:
Athletic too. He is a sophomore playing for Syracuse, mostly a role player this season. I'm sure he'll stay in school for another year and he may be the lead dog on the team next year. He's listed at 6'4" and is a SG.
I know most of you guys who post in this forum already know about him, just wanted to get his name out there.
Dunk:
Remember Gerry McNamara? Or Andy Rautins?
Cooney is of that mold. On offense, all he does is hit spot-up threes all day in low usage, low turnover role. That's simplistic. I'll agree--he surprised me with his resourcefulness with some of his at rim ventures in recent games, but that doesn't change the fact that he rarely penetrates to begin with. The joining feature I like with his threes is his ability to get steals--kind of unexpected, but he plays over the top of Syracuse's zone and gets his hands to deflect passes well. He's a tough kid and based on what we're seeing I think he's definitely a hard working defender. I think he'll need the full four years, because there's limitations with his frame and with his offensive game, though, but if he maintains this trajectory (3's, steals, D) someone might throw a 2nd round flyer.
Cooney is of that mold. On offense, all he does is hit spot-up threes all day in low usage, low turnover role. That's simplistic. I'll agree--he surprised me with his resourcefulness with some of his at rim ventures in recent games, but that doesn't change the fact that he rarely penetrates to begin with. The joining feature I like with his threes is his ability to get steals--kind of unexpected, but he plays over the top of Syracuse's zone and gets his hands to deflect passes well. He's a tough kid and based on what we're seeing I think he's definitely a hard working defender. I think he'll need the full four years, because there's limitations with his frame and with his offensive game, though, but if he maintains this trajectory (3's, steals, D) someone might throw a 2nd round flyer.
Oh, don't get me wrong. 2nd round is where I'd expect him to get drafted after his junior or senior season. Unless he can show he can be a lead guard after Ennis is gone. I think he has a little more game than McN or Rautins overall. But when a guy hits 9 3's in a game, most from NBA range and contested, it piques my interest, just thought he deserves a mention here and is a big part of SU's undefeated season.
I'd like to see how he performs vs. man-to-man, of course, we'll never see that from him on D at Syracuse.
I'd like to see how he performs vs. man-to-man, of course, we'll never see that from him on D at Syracuse.
Having a hard time believing QA scoring 40! Haha even looked it up and couldn't find anything, but I'll trust you on that one.
Cooney has caught my eye from previous games with his surprising athletic ability. Didn't know he could also shoot it pretty good. But yeah, he's really a 4th option on that team and doesn't get a lot of attention, so... one great reason SU has a great shot and running the table is they have wildcard's like Cooney that teams don't focus on.
Cooney has caught my eye from previous games with his surprising athletic ability. Didn't know he could also shoot it pretty good. But yeah, he's really a 4th option on that team and doesn't get a lot of attention, so... one great reason SU has a great shot and running the table is they have wildcard's like Cooney that teams don't focus on.
Walker, if he pans out, is a perfect fit next to Cuz down the road. Hope he can learn a little 15 foot jumper and gain, oh, 30 or so pounds in a couple of years. I like his upside. In another thread I compared his body/athleticism to Larry Nance - minus the short shorts - remember Nance winning the first dunk contest against Dr J?
I didn't learn much from watching Walker play 7 minutes that I didn't already know. Very good athlete with defensive potential. He was one of the players I wanted to follow this season, but unfortunately, this is his first game. I'm not ready to anoint him to Cousins playing partner just yet. Florida will definitely be in the tournament, so we'll get a chance to see him play quite a bit before the season ends. Good start though!
I don't follow the college game like i used to, but the 2 guys that have me intrigued and who both fit 2 huge needs for the Kings are Exum and Embiid. Embiid looks like he could go #1, so if the current Kings lotto luck continues, Exum could be the guy at the Kings slot. His size, quickness and first step for a PG are very tantalizing.
After watching Randle about 10x this year, I can't help but feel like something is missing there. I don't know what it is. I can't put my finger on it, but I'm not overly impressed. He doesn't feel like a can't miss prospect. Good player, Paul Milsap level seems a little more appropriate than multiple time all-star I'd certainly take Embiid or Wiggins over him at this point.
