Who do we draft?
- Thread starter CaminoChaos
- Start date
We've been without a quality big man since February 2005. I think it's pretty apparent we aren't going to be able to get one at the local discount store. You think we should get the BPA and I don't think there's that much difference between players at that point in the draft. It's all conjecture... we'll have to see what happens.
BMiller52 - Saying you'd rather have a star than a role player is pretty much assuming facts not in evidence at this point. We don't know that ANY of them are actually going to be stars, do we?
Right. It is thinking like that that made the Blazers think it'd be a good idea to take Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan because they had Clyde Drexler already. Now, Wright, et. al are no Michael Jordan. But Kevin Martin is not Clyde Drexler, either. And a lot of the big men being bandied about could very well be Sam Bowie.
Get the best player available. The only one I WOULDN'T want is a SG, especially all other things being equal. We don't want to end up like the Hawks with 15 swingmen and no big men or point guard. But our team is devoid of talent. We need upgrades at many places. Artest is good but he'll either be gone soon or it'll take a lot of cash to sign him. And he'll be quite old. I don't want to bash Bibby, but this team needs a new point guard. Whoever it is could learn under Bibby. Quality PGs don't grow on trees, just like quality big men don't.
Just give me someone good and exciting at this point. We aren't going to get a savior. I'm not saying DON'T get a big man. But if it's not there for us, why waste the pick? Why waste this terrible season? Get what you can. Then, if we're in a similar situation next year, get a big man if there is a quality one available. I don't want to be going through this next year, basically at square one because we reached on a big man who isn't good enough, while some player out there is lighting up the league.
Again...not saying don't get a big man. But make sure it's the right one.
Last edited:
HighFlyingMonkey
Starter
If Mike Conley's available, we HAVE to pick him. The only way for a team to be successful without a superstar is to have a great PG running the helm.
nbrans
All-Star
Wait, so you like Julian Wright because of his athleticism and length, but you like Hawes because he's skilled? I think you have it completely backwards. If you're drafting a power forward or center, athleticism and size are most important, because that's how they impact the game. A big, athletic power forward or center (we're talking over 6'10"/6'11" here) can block shots, get rebounds and control the paint. The guards and small forwards can carry the offensive load. Araujo isn't the example, he's earthbound. Petro, who is athletic, actually looked pretty good this season. Then there's Dalembert, Chandler, Hunter, Verejao, etc. Combine size (over 6'10") and athleticism and you have an impact player, even if they're not particularly skilled.
For a small forward, on the other hand, you need athleticism PLUS skills. A small forward who can't shoot, can't take the ball to the hoop, and can't be a lockdown defender doesn't really have much left in the way of helping a team. There are so many guys like that on the fringes of the league, including supposedly can't miss guys on draft day (Darius Miles) whose impact on the game ended up being severely limited because they didn't have enough ways to be an impact player. Throwing down dunks in transition is not enough to be a good small forward.
Now, maybe you think Julian Wright is going to be a power forward -- I'm not so sure. He plays like a small forward, he's listed as a small forward... and besides, he's not a shotblocker and a lane enforcer, and it's reasonably likely that there is going to be at least one of those available at #10. Don't knock drafting for need -- as VF21 said, there isn't a huge amount of difference between the players at #10, and it's kind of pointless to take a flyer on someone you don't need at all, and who wouldn't get any playing time. And besides, I question whether Wright really is going to be the BPA at #10. I'd rather have someone off of my list earlier in the thread, who I really think are the BPAs for the Kings.
Last edited:
I don't get where you're getting this "Wright has no skills" stuff. His comparison is a super athletic Boris Diaw+an inch or so of height with more star potential. Diaw is a very skilled player. Sure he isn't a great shooter but neither was TMac when he came into the league and look at him now. I don't get where you say he isn't a good defender. He is a good defender.
And he is still a good rebounder, if he plays PF that definitely helps. Look at his game log( http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/gamelog?playerId=27143 ) Against Noah/Horford he went and got 10 rebounds. Against Durant he got 13 rebounds. Against BC's frontcourt of Dudley/Williams he got 12 rebounds. Against Kentucky who has Randolph Morris he got 8 rebounds. And there are plenty of other games where he gets double digit rebounds or close to it, I just listed the ones against notable frontcourts/players.
nbrans
All-Star
He doesn't have the type of skills I'd want to have in a prospective small forward or out of a power forward. The Boris Diaw thing isn't much of an endorsement to me. Diaw's success is as much about Phoenix and the type of players he's surrounded by than Boris Diaw. Take him off that team and he'd be half the player. Wright is not strong enough or enough of a shotblocker to be the type of power forward the Kings need, and he doesn't have the offensive skills to be the type of small forward the Kings need.
Corey Brewer is much more of the type of player I'd want out of a small forward -- someone who can shoot from outside, can take the ball to the hoop and can play smothering defense. Those are the NBA skills I'd want out of a small forward.
And college rebounding, to me, has to be taken with a grain of salt. Teams play zone, the average height is smaller, it's just not the same thing. To be sure that's an admirable trait, and I'd give him that, but I don't think that would necessarily translate to the NBA. There's a long list of 6'8" guys who dominated with their athleticism at college and could get away with being tweeners, but who flopped coming into the NBA because they no longer had the size and athleticism advantage. I think Wright is one of those guys.
Did you really just argue that big men don't need skills in order to have an impact and use Dalembert, Varejao and Steven Hunter as your prime examples?
Wow. I have officially seen everything.
Last edited:
nbrans
All-Star
Um, yes? We already have Brad Miller. Would you rather add someone like Chandler (who you conveniently left out), Verejao, Dalembert and Hunter to the roster or a "skilled" and unathletic player like Kaman, Brezec, Doleac or, uh, Brad Miller. I'd take the athletic player, thank you.
Also, I meant offensive skills. Rebounding and defense, obviously, is a skill.
Last edited:
Brad Miller is old and I want him gone. Hawes is not Brad Miller. He's more of a throwback, back to the basket kind of guy. Yes I left off Chandler because he's the one guy on your list who you could actually call athletic and impactful. Varejao is decent but not tremendously athletic. Dalembert? How much longer is he going to be a promising young guy?
Apparently to you there is no middle ground? There are middle grounds, you know (e.g. Amare Stoudemire).
Responding to your question directly, though, I was making no argument about who the Kings should just draft. I just couldn't help laugh at your assertion that Dalembert and Hunter are impactful and that Varejao is super athletic.
And, like I said, Hawes is not Brad Miller. How many times did you see UW play? I doubt many if you think he is Brad Miller. Scouting reports are, unfortunately, not colorblind.
Last edited by a moderator:
nbrans
All-Star
What middle ground does Amare Stoudemire represent? He's ridiculously athletic (even after microfracture surgery) and ridiculously skilled.
And Varejao's not athletic?? What do you call this? http://youtube.com/watch?v=lWF8HmtYkmY
I'm not going to get into a semantic debate on what constitutes "impactful," but I'm just making the point that I'd rather have some of the least offensively skilled and most athletic centers in the league than I would some of the more offensively skilled, unathletic centers.
Last edited by a moderator:
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Tell you what, people complain about Dalmebert for whatever reason all the time -- I would take his 11pts 9rebs and 2blks on this team over any of our "skilled" bigs on the roster. Hell, he's no star, but I would cheerfully trade ALL of our crappy bigs for that kind of prodcution.
I'll keep banging this drum until it is self-evident to everybody five years from now, but Brewer is the third best prospect in this draft. Therefore, if he "drops" to #9 or #10 he is the guy I want. In our current situation, I go strict BPA. This is basketball, you win with your best five on the court. If Afflalo was in this draft, and the BPA, I would take him. Good luck covering two dead eye shooters like him and Martin. However, the same type of shooter is in this draft, stands 6'9", is a great athlete, a true lock-down defender, and can pass and handle. His name is Corey Brewer.
Let's be serious, Artest and Bibby are leaving soon. We need talent, not 7' cheerleaders.
Let's be serious, Artest and Bibby are leaving soon. We need talent, not 7' cheerleaders.
I agree. 10th pick is not enough to pick a good big man. I would pick a best PG rather than a mediocre big man on the draft, though I don't know very much about Conley.
Anyway. Just NO SG or SF. That would be ok to me.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Yeah, he's a guy who has intrigued me too -- moreso than I think any other guy on the list above. Posted a link to this video back in the fall first time I saw it:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kRaXgRlEJkU .
Very impressive stuff. Such fluidity and speed out of a 7 foot guy, and very natural with the ball. Moves like a SF. Love the escape dribble, the body lean on those drives, the little bit of nasty. Know some have seen him and questioned whether that intensity is always there, but after you get past those top bigs: Oden, Durant, Wright, Horford, this guy could have the biggest star potential of the rest. Maybe.
Last edited:
ParniValjak
All-Star
My only concern is the belief that his age is not legit. Many believe he is closer to 24 than 19.
I do agree that he is the most intruiging big out of the top 4 and the one with most upside but I doubt he lasts until pick 10.
We might need to trade up to get him which is something I don't think we will do.
LPKingsFan
All-Star
Think something should be cleared up: The title of the thread is "who will the Kings draft" while the poll question is "who should the Kings draft"? Now, those are two different things.
Who will the Kings draft? Well, that depends on who's still on the board when we have the pick. But assuming the above 10 are all available, I'd predict Petrie would select Noah or Hawes, with Jianlan as the dark horse. I could see this turn into another Peja pick, with Petrie going with the unknown overseas product instead of the popular college star. Who should the Kings draft? Out of this crew, I'd pick Hibbert, Jianlan, Noah, in that order.
Who will the Kings draft? Well, that depends on who's still on the board when we have the pick. But assuming the above 10 are all available, I'd predict Petrie would select Noah or Hawes, with Jianlan as the dark horse. I could see this turn into another Peja pick, with Petrie going with the unknown overseas product instead of the popular college star. Who should the Kings draft? Out of this crew, I'd pick Hibbert, Jianlan, Noah, in that order.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
If Noah is there when we pick I think you have to take him. I think that guy may be something special. I can't see him lasting that long though. No way.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Could be a big risk but the payoff could be huge. He didn't look real good at the Chinese basketball championships though.
Circa_1985_Fan
All-Star
Noah is NOT lasting until #10. I think the best pick we could make if we get 10-12 is Tiago Splitter...dude has game, and he's improved alot over the last 2 years. I dont want Thabeet, Hawes or McRoberts, I know that much. I think a sleeper pick would be Marc Gasol...he's raw, but in a Vlade sort of way.
Vlade4GM
All-Star
I look at the whole spectrum of criteria, not just athleticism or just skills. Just an FYI I have come down on Hawes a bit after a little research, I still pick him over some but not as much anymore. Still it depends on who is available, I still like his offensive maturity and I think he'll be a pretty good rebounder.
As far as Wright goes, I think he does have great defensive potential. Great length, quick hands, good lateral quickness, and is just an active and high energy player. While his shot is inconsistent and doesn't have great range, I think he has the makings of a mid range shot and I think it's not crazy to think he can improve. He is a good rebounder, don't think he'll ever avg much more than 7 rpg though. I liken him defensively to Gerald Wallace but with more size and strength. He's got very good passing and court vision. I think at least he's a solid role player and good defender. I don't know why you doubt his ability to penetrate so much, he's pretty good explosion, he can handle very well, and he's got good strength. He has all the tools to become a good penetrator.
As far as whether we need him or not, well like I've said before the only position we know we don't need is SG. Other than that as far as I'm concerned the lineup is open or at least it should be. I think he'll be mainly a SF that can play some PF and probably can be a regular PF in a run and gun offense.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
I hate sounding negative, but I've saw quite a bit of him and I think whoever takes him in the first round will regret it. Maybe he can become an energetic big off the bench, but I honestly think that's his peak. He plays nothing like his brother, he's way less athletic (if people think Hibbert is slow they will laugh at Gasol) and doesn't have any one standout talent.
Who knows, I could be wrong but from what I've seen he doesn't seem to have the talent to be a good NBA player.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
CaminoChaos
Bench
Wow, I was just watching more footage of Yi Jianlian. This guy does it all. Though he is not real strong but he's quick for a 7'. I wish he had 3pt range on his jump shot but he seems to be a good mid range shooter. The problem is that I have seen him as high as #4 pick and as low as #15 pick in mock drafts. But I have a feeling this is a Petrie type player but he's 7' tall. As it stands now we are most likely pick between #8, #9 or #10 and have a group of Bigs that could fall to us. It seems Hibbert and Hawes have been the most realistic choices but they are both slow and would give us the same defensive problems Brad does in the paint. With the lack of lateral these 2 possess could put us in the same boat as we are now.
Some one had made a good point earlier saying that the Kings do not have a paticular position tied up and that picking a SF in the draft would not be the end of the world. I believe that does hold true seeings how Artest my very well not be here next season. My point is how many would take a guy just because he is 7' and only can only play inside or a skilled player like perhaps Brewer.
Just a couple things to think about.
Some one had made a good point earlier saying that the Kings do not have a paticular position tied up and that picking a SF in the draft would not be the end of the world. I believe that does hold true seeings how Artest my very well not be here next season. My point is how many would take a guy just because he is 7' and only can only play inside or a skilled player like perhaps Brewer.
Just a couple things to think about.
LOL Hibbert is a very good shotblocker. He would HELP our defense, not hurt it like Brad.
And I still am not sold on this Jianlian guy. There are a ton of questions surrounding him(age etc). He's playing against inferior competition. Yeah you can watch some highlight videos of random players and if you have no idea who that player is(you haven't watched him before or looked at his stats) you might say "OMG he has teh superstarz potential!!!!11". But I mean none of us have seen him actually play in a game, none of us have seen his stats, he got outplayed by freaking Wang Zhi Zhi.
CaminoChaos
Bench
I'm not saying he is a bad shotblocker but does not rotate as well as some. With the Illegal defenses being strongly enforced and most teams going with bigs that have range on there shots it's going to be hard for Hibbert to defend players unless it's a slower center like Yao, Dampier or Diop. So my point is the need for huge centers is less important escpecially if they can't get up and down the floor.
