What's the plan?

[nbrans]

I don't understand what people think Petrie and the Maloofs could have done in the last few years. There were many forces out of their control at play - the aging of the old core and the diminishment of their trade value, the sudden and somewhat inexplicable erosion of Bibby, Miller and Peja's abilities. I mean, they were dealt some pretty tough cards. When you add in Cuttino's walking in free agency (and the stunning decision of Donald Sterling to open up his pocket book) and Bonzi's demands... sometimes reality doesn't conform to the best of plans. Every move up to and including the Webber trade have been solid moves.

What did you want them to do? Seriously.

I don't understand how people can criticize Petrie for not doing anything when the entire roster, except for Bibby and Miller, is completely different from three years ago. Not doing anything would have been clinging to the deluded notion that Webber is still a superstar after his injury or that Peja was the franchise or that we could have ridden Doug Christie into the ground. I don't think there is a single team in the league that has experienced as many personnel changes as the Kings in the last few years.

People expect way, way too much -- some people think it's easy to just waltz your way through a rebuild (giving up all your good pieces for peanuts for the sake of being bad), overlooking that a team that truly blows things up (New Orleans, Chicago, Atlanta, Portland) takes years and years to reemerge. Other people think it's easy to just snap your fingers and remain a contender.

In fact the best route to being a contender, as evidenced by Phoenix, Miami, San Antonio, the Lakers, and the Jazz, is holding onto what talent you have, accept a few years of mediocrity, get a few key pieces through the draft and free agency and reemerge a stronger team. That's the plan. You don't give up everything you have for 2 cents on the dollar. You don't rebuild solely through the draft (how's that working for Boston?). You keep slowly adding talent and key pieces, make opportunistic trades and, yes, get very lucky.

The Kings have the potential of having cap room in the offseason, they're going to have a fairly good to very good draft pick, and the change will continue. They're following the rebuilding model that works, not the nuclear bomb method that just leaves years of destruction.

 

[nbrans]

And I've mentioned before that we are one late late pick not blossoming (Kevin) away from this franchise being headed straight for the cellar. You don't sit around and plan on drafting 20ppg scorers in the 20s as your plan. Well, unless you are a fool. That just fell in our lap, as have many of our moves in recent years.

Way to turn drafting Kevin Martin into an insult. I mean, clearly Kevin Martin just fell into our lap. What a horrible GM we have.

 

[Bricklayer]

Way to turn drafting Kevin Martin into an insult. I mean, clearly Kevin Martin just fell into our lap. What a horrible GM we have.

Way to entirely miss the point.

Drafting Kevin Martin = good. PLANNING on drafting Kevin Martin -- and you may have noticed the word "PLAN" in the title of this thread -- is moronic. Not only does it rarely happen, but 25 other teams could have taken him before us and left us drafting Beno Udrih. Drafting that late all you are doing is hoping to get lucky. Its not a rational plan.

 

[kupman]

It is remarkable to me. All of this talk stems from a brief event that happened on the evening of May 8th, 2003.

It is remarkable how such a brief event can change the course of a franchise so dramatically.

 

['89 Kings Fan]

To begin with, let us acknowledge, that the current state is a direct result of mortgaging our future in an effort to win a championship during the golden years. We kept trading away our draft picks and young guys. In the process, we kept getting old and the veterans kept clogging the cap.

I think this is an oversimplification that gives Petrie a free pass. The team we have now is suffering from not geting anything out of the draft for three years.

2001: Gearld Wallace fiasco
2002: Traded our Pick to Atlanta to get the pick we gave away in the Mateen trade
2003: The Nick Anderson trade back in 1999. Who were the next three picks? Kendrick Perkins, Barbosa, Josh Howard. They would be nice right now. Also remember we traded Tarq who was our '97 first rounder so Nick was two firsts.

Also I have been reading this board off and on since 2001 and I don't ever remember anyone pointing out that the year we went to the WCF, JB led the league in 3PT% .469. Not to say he would have done as well had he stayed, but it might have helped in that series having a career .848% FT shooter instead of a towel waver. Of course I still blame Mateen for everything that goes wrong.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I don't understand what people think Petrie and the Maloofs could have done in the last few years. There were many forces out of their control at play - the aging of the old core and the diminishment of their trade value, the sudden and somewhat inexplicable erosion of Bibby, Miller and Peja's abilities. I mean, they were dealt some pretty tough cards. When you add in Cuttino's walking in free agency (and the stunning decision of Donald Sterling to open up his pocket book) and Bonzi's demands... sometimes reality doesn't conform to the best of plans. Every move up to and including the Webber trade have been solid moves.

What did you want them to do? Seriously.

I don't understand how people can criticize Petrie for not doing anything when the entire roster, except for Bibby and Miller, is completely different from three years ago. Not doing anything would have been clinging to the deluded notion that Webber is still a superstar after his injury or that Peja was the franchise or that we could have ridden Doug Christie into the ground. I don't think there is a single team in the league that has experienced as many personnel changes as the Kings in the last few years.

People expect way, way too much -- some people think it's easy to just waltz your way through a rebuild (giving up all your good pieces for peanuts for the sake of being bad), overlooking that a team that truly blows things up (New Orleans, Chicago, Atlanta, Portland) takes years and years to reemerge. Other people think it's easy to just snap your fingers and remain a contender.

In fact the best route to being a contender, as evidenced by Phoenix, Miami, San Antonio, the Lakers, and the Jazz, is holding onto what talent you have, accept a few years of mediocrity, get a few key pieces through the draft and free agency and reemerge a stronger team. That's the plan. You don't give up everything you have for 2 cents on the dollar. You don't rebuild solely through the draft (how's that working for Boston?). You keep slowly adding talent and key pieces, make opportunistic trades and, yes, get very lucky.

The Kings have the potential of having cap room in the offseason, they're going to have a fairly good to very good draft pick, and the change will continue. They're following the rebuilding model that works, not the nuclear bomb method that just leaves years of destruction.

the aging of players and erosion of talent is completely forseeable dude. i don't see how you can use that as an excuse, not that i'm blaming them or anything it's just that it's not a good excuse.

who's saying that the rebuilding process is easy? nothing is easy, why do people keep saying that? the rebuilding on the fly method doesn't work. why? because it depends solely on getting lucky in the draft and getting lucky in the free agent market. it's dependant way too much on getting lucky with trades and free agents. another reason why rebuilding on the fly is bad for us is that we need to start over because our guys have no chemistry together, there was no method or plan behind lumping this group together. we need to start from scratch, so please whining about nuking this team is crazy because look what we'd be actually trying to save. i mean seriously look at it, ron artest? the guy is completely undependable you never know when he's going to blow up. miller? old, no d. bibby? getting old and overpaid and no d. trying to become the next detroit pistons is a retarded move, rarely do teams win like that. the best way to win is to build around a franchise player and the best way to get them is being there at the top of the draft. making stupid little patchwork trades and signings along with middle draft picks isn't going to get us anywhere other than first round exits, now maybe you'd love that, but i would hate it.

 

[GoGoGadget]

Honestly Brick, what could he have done with the cap room we have?

And how, exactly, did we end up in a bad cap position?

Sorry, this is the real world -- okay, the multi-million dollar basketball franchise segment of the real world, at least. You don't get to take credit for the good decisions without also taking the blame for the bad ones.

I think there's a large misunderstanding beneath the Petrie argument that hasn't yet been addressed -- those of us who are frustrated with the decision making (and, I normally try to avoid speaking for others, so please let me know if I'm off base here) are not just looking at the past few months, we're looking at the sum of the past several years.

What has been the long term plan? What has been the long term goal? Where was the Kings organization hoping to be right now when they made moves three years ago? These are the questions that I'm still waiting to have answered. So there's no moves out there right this instant and we're being patient. Great. But in what direction is the organization hoping to move when that deal comes along. We're not currently structured to make the moves necessary to win now. We're also not currently structured to fully rebuild and try to win later. We're not built for anything other than continuing to flop around near the 8th spot for ever and ever, ad infinitum. And, for some asinine reason, all signs point to the front office being content to stay there.

That's my problem. That's the source of my frustration.

 

[chelle]

And how, exactly, did we end up in a bad cap position?

Sorry, this is the real world -- okay, the multi-million dollar basketball franchise segment of the real world, at least. You don't get to take credit for the good decisions without also taking the blame for the bad ones.

I think there's a large misunderstanding beneath the Petrie argument that hasn't yet been addressed -- those of us who are frustrated with the decision making (and, I normally try to avoid speaking for others, so please let me know if I'm off base here) are not just looking at the past few months, we're looking at the sum of the past several years.

What has been the long term plan? What has been the long term goal? Where was the Kings organization hoping to be right now when they made moves three years ago? These are the questions that I'm still waiting to have answered. So there's no moves out there right this instant and we're being patient. Great. But in what direction is the organization hoping to move when that deal comes along. We're not currently structured to make the moves necessary to win now. We're also not currently structured to fully rebuild and try to win later. We're not built for anything other than continuing to flop around near the 8th spot for ever and ever, ad infinitum. And, for some asinine reason, all signs point to the front office being content to stay there.

That's my problem. That's the source of my frustration.

I just thought that all you said should be repeated. I sadly agree with all of it.

I think that whatever plan they had to begin with did not work. They seem to be just realizing it and have no back up plan ready. They seem as lost as we are about how to fix things.I hope that I am wrong.

 

[nbrans]

I don't agree at all that this team isn't structured to make moves. Bibby, Artest, Abdur-Rahim, Garcia... all these guys have trade value. You have $12 million in expiring contracts to dangle for the right player. Or you could go for a free agency strategy and trade some of the players with value for expirings. There are tons of ways to go. You could try packagin Bibby and Corliss to go after, say, Pau Gasol. Or you could trade Artest for, say, an expiring and a pick. Or a younger player and a pick.

Look at a team like Houston or Minnesota if you want to see a team with no options. Those teams are financially strapped, and short of trading their superstars they have zero trade opportunities.

The Kings have lots and lots of options, thanks to the Webber trade and thanks to the fact that they signed two good players (SAR and Salmons) to reasonable contracts. It just remains to be seen which approach is taken.

 

[Smills91]

I don't understand what people think Petrie and the Maloofs could have done in the last few years. There were many forces out of their control at play - the aging of the old core and the diminishment of their trade value, the sudden and somewhat inexplicable erosion of Bibby, Miller and Peja's abilities. I mean, they were dealt some pretty tough cards. When you add in Cuttino's walking in free agency (and the stunning decision of Donald Sterling to open up his pocket book) and Bonzi's demands... sometimes reality doesn't conform to the best of plans. Every move up to and including the Webber trade have been solid moves.

What did you want them to do? Seriously.

I don't understand how people can criticize Petrie for not doing anything when the entire roster, except for Bibby and Miller, is completely different from three years ago. Not doing anything would have been clinging to the deluded notion that Webber is still a superstar after his injury or that Peja was the franchise or that we could have ridden Doug Christie into the ground. I don't think there is a single team in the league that has experienced as many personnel changes as the Kings in the last few years.

People expect way, way too much -- some people think it's easy to just waltz your way through a rebuild (giving up all your good pieces for peanuts for the sake of being bad), overlooking that a team that truly blows things up (New Orleans, Chicago, Atlanta, Portland) takes years and years to reemerge. Other people think it's easy to just snap your fingers and remain a contender.

In fact the best route to being a contender, as evidenced by Phoenix, Miami, San Antonio, the Lakers, and the Jazz, is holding onto what talent you have, accept a few years of mediocrity, get a few key pieces through the draft and free agency and reemerge a stronger team. That's the plan. You don't give up everything you have for 2 cents on the dollar. You don't rebuild solely through the draft (how's that working for Boston?). You keep slowly adding talent and key pieces, make opportunistic trades and, yes, get very lucky.

The Kings have the potential of having cap room in the offseason, they're going to have a fairly good to very good draft pick, and the change will continue. They're following the rebuilding model that works, not the nuclear bomb method that just leaves years of destruction.

Totally agree....couldn't have said it better myself. I completely concur on this entire post.

 

[Smills91]

I don't agree at all that this team isn't structured to make moves. Bibby, Artest, Abdur-Rahim, Garcia... all these guys have trade value. You have $12 million in expiring contracts to dangle for the right player. Or you could go for a free agency strategy and trade some of the players with value for expirings. There are tons of ways to go. You could try packagin Bibby and Corliss to go after, say, Pau Gasol. Or you could trade Artest for, say, an expiring and a pick. Or a younger player and a pick.

Look at a team like Houston or Minnesota if you want to see a team with no options. Those teams are financially strapped, and short of trading their superstars they have zero trade opportunities.

The Kings have lots and lots of options, thanks to the Webber trade and thanks to the fact that they signed two good players (SAR and Salmons) to reasonable contracts. It just remains to be seen which approach is taken.

Once again I totally agree...the Kings can go in completely opposite directions.

 

[LA King Fan II]

I won't address the structuring but we are not prepared to deal with anyone because of inferior players. IMO nobody wants Kenny Thomas, SAR or Miller, Corliss. Certainly not enough to give us anything of value in return.

Unfortunately the plan is that our frontline is good enough, and that Salmons can replace Bonzi's presence from last year. And Ron Artest will become brilliant and consistent intellectually. And Bibby will make ALL of his outside shots every game bolting us into the #8 spot. Oh yeah, and that Martin, Garcia and Douby will metamorphise their bodies into ONE NBA BODY who can think, score and shoot free throws at the end of the game without a hitch.

In fairness, had Wells stuck around (healthy of course) we had something going with matchup problems for other teams. Unless Bibby or Artest is traded the plan is to suck.

 

[VF21]

What has been the long term plan? What has been the long term goal? Where was the Kings organization hoping to be right now when they made moves three years ago? These are the questions that I'm still waiting to have answered.

And that was the original question posed in the beginning of the thread. I wanted to see what people thought Petrie and the organization might have had in mind.

 

[Evenstar]

right now the plan seems to be "wait and see" mode.

it's frsutrating, how many games to they have to see our tandem of a 6'7'' "PF" and a "7" ( i say "7" becuase he rebounds like a PG) center rebound the basketball like kindergarteners before they make a move to get someone in there who CAN rebound?? seriously, the spread per game on rebounding are horrendous! we can't get clutch rebounds to secure games ( free throw shooting has been an issue in that department as well, but thats easier to fix IMO)

but no, they seem to be in "wait and see mode"

yah well i'm getting crabby waiting.... i hope the kings don't embarass themselves too much on friday night, i've been looking foawrd to this game for a looong time... don't let me down boys!