Voisin: Kings don't need this guy Artest

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/basketball/kings/story/13981782p-14815445c.html

Ailene Voisin: Kings don't need this guy Artest
By Ailene Voisin -- Bee Sports Columnist
Published 2:15 am PST Thursday, December 15, 2005


Ron Artest is dangling out there on a tree limb, as appealing as a turkey dinner during the holidays. His dynamic physical presence is impossible to ignore. His talent alone provokes conversation. But after this latest display of absurd behavior, where he griped about his scoring opportunities, ripped his coach and completely alienated the Indiana Pacers organization - including his own Brawl Brothers - the guy has become pure poison.

Go ahead. Take a shot. Trade for Artest.

Become a loser.

Become the Portland Trail Blazers.

Surely some franchise will make the move, though fortunately, Kings president Geoff Petrie refuses to join the discussions for the troublesome, if immensely gifted small forward. One gamble (Bonzi Wells) per season is plenty for Petrie. And anyone who has ever championed an Artest-Peja Stojakovic swap should closely scrutinize the chaos that has seized Conseco Fieldhouse mere months after the suspension-depleted Pacers produced one of the more inspiring postseason runs in recent memory.

How fragile it all is. Winning and losing. Without raising a fist or railing at a referee, Artest, 26, has shoved a classy franchise onto its back. In the most recent example of the Sports Illustrated jinx - be featured on the magazine cover and then prepare for the worst - Artest, who was photographed alongside Pacers general manager and Hall of Fame forward Larry Bird for this year's NBA Preview edition, has transformed a legitimate contender into a franchise desperate to trade one of of the game's top 10 players.

Larry Bird. Donnie Walsh. Jermaine O'Neal. Anthony Johnson. The resilient Rick Carlisle. The ghosts of Reggie Miller. The Hoosiers and their history. All deserve better, and certainly have done nothing to warrant the most recent outburst by Artest, who is demanding a trade for reasons suggesting his personal demons will forever damage his professional career.

Even before provoking the Nov. 19, 2004, brawl at the Palace of Auburn Hills - the incident that involved several teammates, resulted in the largest suspension and arguably the most negative publicity in NBA history, and effectively disrupted any thoughts of a Pacers championship run - Artest was a wild card whose brilliance compensated for his idiosyncracies. His defense is exceptional, his impact on a game's outcome immense, often intangible.

But eccentricity has its limits. At least Dennis Rodman owned a pair of championship rings before crossing the line into complete wackiness. Artest has earned nothing of the sort, except perhaps, sympathy from those concerned about his seeming instability. His musings about retiring and making music sounded downright pathetic. His candor about his anger often struck a forgiving, compelling chord.

But he isn't getting enough touches? He doesn't like his coach? He wants to play elsewhere, preferably in his native New York?

Can you imagine Artest with the angst-ridden Larry Brown?

With teams allowed Wednesday to begin trading free agents they signed last summer, several executives are said to be intrigued, with Isiah Thomas undoubtedly observing closely. Still, Zeke is no fool. The risks are as out there as Artest, the rewards historically precious and few. Seldom does one team's major problem become another team's solution.

As an exception, Bonzi Wells immediately comes to mind. Though he had issues in Portland - doesn't everyone these days? - and last season fell out of favor with coach Mike Fratello in Memphis, the veteran shooting guard has been the Kings' most productive player. Not only has he minded his manners while pursuing rebounds, working the low post, and otherwise scrapping for leftovers, he has injected a semblance of personality into an impassive starting lineup; indeed, vanilla is the flavor of choice only for teams that make a habit of collecting trophies (see Spurs and Detroit Pistons).

But in a game that more than any other requires interdependence and selflessness for collective achievement, Artest, by contrast, has become an individualist, a man apart.

And now he has to be traded. He has left the Pacers no option, their tolerance exhausted. He appears to have forgotten how his teammates raced to his side during the brawl, and later, how Bird and Walsh pleaded with NBA Commissioner David Stern on behalf of their young star - often angrily at times, according to sources in the league office.

"You read about the old great coaches," noted Petrie, "and a good portion say that once their teams reach the championship-caliber level in terms of talent, it comes down to how their players got along, what the level of sacrifice was, the degree of camaraderie. That's when all that stuff comes into play."

The team that acquires Artest?

Remember the Blazers.

Who needs that?

About the writer: Ailene Voisin can be reached at (916) 321-1208 or avoisin@sacbee.com.
 
VF21 said:
http://www.sacbee.com/content/sports/basketball/kings/story/13981782p-14815445c.html

Ailene Voisin: Kings don't need this guy Artest
By Ailene Voisin -- Bee Sports Columnist
Published 2:15 am PST Thursday, December 15, 2005

Ron Artest is dangling out there on a tree limb, as appealing as a turkey dinner during the holidays. His dynamic physical presence is impossible to ignore. His talent alone provokes conversation. But after this latest display of absurd behavior, where he griped about his scoring opportunities, ripped his coach and completely alienated the Indiana Pacers organization - including his own Brawl Brothers - the guy has become pure poison.

Go ahead. Take a shot. Trade for Artest.

Become a loser.

Become the Portland Trail Blazers.

Surely some franchise will make the move, though fortunately, Kings president Geoff Petrie refuses to join the discussions for the troublesome, if immensely gifted small forward. One gamble (Bonzi Wells) per season is plenty for Petrie. And anyone who has ever championed an Artest-Peja Stojakovic swap should closely scrutinize the chaos that has seized Conseco Fieldhouse mere months after the suspension-depleted Pacers produced one of the more inspiring postseason runs in recent memory.

How fragile it all is. Winning and losing. Without raising a fist or railing at a referee, Artest, 26, has shoved a classy franchise onto its back. In the most recent example of the Sports Illustrated jinx - be featured on the magazine cover and then prepare for the worst - Artest, who was photographed alongside Pacers general manager and Hall of Fame forward Larry Bird for this year's NBA Preview edition, has transformed a legitimate contender into a franchise desperate to trade one of of the game's top 10 players.

Larry Bird. Donnie Walsh. Jermaine O'Neal. Anthony Johnson. The resilient Rick Carlisle. The ghosts of Reggie Miller. The Hoosiers and their history. All deserve better, and certainly have done nothing to warrant the most recent outburst by Artest, who is demanding a trade for reasons suggesting his personal demons will forever damage his professional career.

Even before provoking the Nov. 19, 2004, brawl at the Palace of Auburn Hills - the incident that involved several teammates, resulted in the largest suspension and arguably the most negative publicity in NBA history, and effectively disrupted any thoughts of a Pacers championship run - Artest was a wild card whose brilliance compensated for his idiosyncracies. His defense is exceptional, his impact on a game's outcome immense, often intangible.

But eccentricity has its limits. At least Dennis Rodman owned a pair of championship rings before crossing the line into complete wackiness. Artest has earned nothing of the sort, except perhaps, sympathy from those concerned about his seeming instability. His musings about retiring and making music sounded downright pathetic. His candor about his anger often struck a forgiving, compelling chord.

But he isn't getting enough touches? He doesn't like his coach? He wants to play elsewhere, preferably in his native New York?

Can you imagine Artest with the angst-ridden Larry Brown?

With teams allowed Wednesday to begin trading free agents they signed last summer, several executives are said to be intrigued, with Isiah Thomas undoubtedly observing closely. Still, Zeke is no fool. The risks are as out there as Artest, the rewards historically precious and few. Seldom does one team's major problem become another team's solution.

As an exception, Bonzi Wells immediately comes to mind. Though he had issues in Portland - doesn't everyone these days? - and last season fell out of favor with coach Mike Fratello in Memphis, the veteran shooting guard has been the Kings' most productive player. Not only has he minded his manners while pursuing rebounds, working the low post, and otherwise scrapping for leftovers, he has injected a semblance of personality into an impassive starting lineup; indeed, vanilla is the flavor of choice only for teams that make a habit of collecting trophies (see Spurs and Detroit Pistons).

But in a game that more than any other requires interdependence and selflessness for collective achievement, Artest, by contrast, has become an individualist, a man apart.

And now he has to be traded. He has left the Pacers no option, their tolerance exhausted. He appears to have forgotten how his teammates raced to his side during the brawl, and later, how Bird and Walsh pleaded with NBA Commissioner David Stern on behalf of their young star - often angrily at times, according to sources in the league office.

"You read about the old great coaches," noted Petrie, "and a good portion say that once their teams reach the championship-caliber level in terms of talent, it comes down to how their players got along, what the level of sacrifice was, the degree of camaraderie. That's when all that stuff comes into play."

The team that acquires Artest?

Remember the Blazers.

Who needs that?

About the writer: Ailene Voisin can be reached at (916) 321-1208 or [EMAIL="avoisin@sacbee.com."]avoisin@sacbee.com.[/EMAIL]

Amen.
 
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.
Amen.
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.

Amen
 
I don't get how she thinks the Bonzi example furthers her point, rather than detracting it. She claims Bonzi has injected personality into an otherwise passive starting lineup, but the group still looks pretty passive at times, and Bonzi alone isn't enough to stem the waves of softness emanating from the rest of our beloved squad.
 
LPKingsFan said:
I don't get how she thinks the Bonzi example furthers her point, rather than detracting it. She claims Bonzi has injected personality into an otherwise passive starting lineup, but the group still looks pretty passive at times, and Bonzi alone isn't enough to stem the waves of softness emanating from the rest of our beloved squad.

Exactly. You'd think she'd leave that out of the argument. The Kings turning Bonzi around helps support the idea that they'd be able to do the same with Artest.
 
"he has injected a semblance of personality into an impassive starting lineup; indeed, vanilla is the flavor of choice only for teams that make a habit of collecting trophies (see Spurs and Detroit Pistons)."

I think Sheed was pretty much the biggest malcontent on the Trail "Blazers" that ever existed. He has since calmed down in Detroit but is still an interesting figure.

Hell as someone pointed out Webber was a huge malcontent, not only on the Warriors but the Bullets. And he was a godsend to the Kings franchise even after the "worries." Honestly, I'd rather have a guy who plays with heart that is kinda crazy ALA Rodman, than a guy who has no personality and just goes about his business. Maybe Ron will be the first failure of the Adelman conversion but with just a couple of months left on Peja's contract, I think Ron and his miniscule contract (Top 15 player with a price tag for good VETS), he's worth the risk. He would still not solve our lack of a post defender though........
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.


Come on Slim these guys are saints compared to stuff Artest has done
 
Oh please. If you can recognize the bonuses Bonzi has brought to the team AND the fans, there's nothing AV or anyone could say could possibly change your minds. It is his HEART, his determination, his dedication, his willingness to put it all out there on the court (you know, all the things I've summed up as being a "warrior King" - LONG BEFORE Grant Napear ever used the phrase) AND his willingness and desire to be PART of the team that has made Bonzi such a breath of fresh air for us.

The Kings didn't turn Bonzi around so much as Petrie had faith that Bonzi coming here would be good for him and the Kings. So far, everything I've seen supports that decision.

Ron Artest, on the other hand, has continually and repeatedly, as AV pointed out, set himself apart from the team. He wanted time off during the season to cut a rap album. If that doesn't show a certain selfishness above and beyond the norm, I don't know what does. Now he's demanding a trade because he wants to be more like Kobe???

You may not agree with AV's assessment of Artest, but - and I really don't believe I'm saying this - you can't really argue with her comments about Bonzi.
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.

What do they have in common? While they may have been "malcontents/trouble makers," I think the reasons for that were widely divergent.

Of those five, I say only TWO are cut from the same cloth. Both Webber and Bonzi are warriors; they want to play more than anything else in the world. They will give everything they have on the court, and they will do everything they can to exort their fellow teammates to do the same - even if it might sometimes cause some hurt feelings. Admittedly, Bonzi seems to be a little less outspoken than Webber was, but it's very clear that the same kinds of hearts beat in both their chests.
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.

Indeed.
 
And what offense would we be playing if Artest does become a King ? Princeton offense ? Would we still be offensive minded team ? I'm sorry, but the type of basketball Artest would bring would be exactly the opposite of the type of basketball Adelman has been preaching for years.
I'm not saying that Adelman's offensive focus is the right way to play, I'm just saying that Adelman and Artest would be a very STRANGE match, to say the least.
 
VF21 said:
What do they have in common? While they may have been "malcontents/trouble makers," I think the reasons for that were widely divergent.

Of those five, I say only TWO are cut from the same cloth. Both Webber and Bonzi are warriors; they want to play more than anything else in the world. They will give everything they have on the court, and they will do everything they can to exort their fellow teammates to do the same - even if it might sometimes cause some hurt feelings. Admittedly, Bonzi seems to be a little less outspoken than Webber was, but it's very clear that the same kinds of hearts beat in both their chests.

The five listed malcontents pale in comparison to the downright cancer that Artest personifies. No Artest, no thank you, no way.
 
There are no malcontents in the league, and possibly in its history that set any kind of precedant for Ron Artest. Thinking that he's going to miraculously become like Bonzi (a man who is intense, but not emotionally damaged or mentally deficient) is wishfull thinking based on desperation. We have no need to be desperate yet.
 
Last edited:
Sacramento would not be the best place to promote his rap album, you know.

He has already said he does not want to play for a west coast team, and will bail out whenever he gets the chance if he got sent to one. You don't want someone who won't even want to play for your team.
 
VF21 said:
Ron Artest, on the other hand, has continually and repeatedly, as AV pointed out, set himself apart from the team. He wanted time off during the season to cut a rap album. If that doesn't show a certain selfishness above and beyond the norm, I don't know what does. Now he's demanding a trade because he wants to be more like Kobe???

You may not agree with AV's assessment of Artest, but - and I really don't believe I'm saying this - you can't really argue with her comments about Bonzi.

vf....why, of all people, do u insist on perpetuating a rumor that has been proven over and over to be false....

ron never wanted time or asked for time off to cut a rap album....period...

he didnt ask for time off for anything remotely resembling a rap album or the record business...

dislike the guy or not..thats fine...dont want him on ur team? i can definitely understand that....

but dont use sensationalized rumors that have since been proven to be false as the basis for such opinions....thats not right....

and u vf...are way better than that....

respectfully

taz
 
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1920455&CMP=OTC-DT9705204233

"I've been doing a little bit too much music, just needed the rest," Artest said. "I've still got my album coming out Nov. 23. After the album comes out I'm going to make sure all of my time is focused on winning a championship."

It's the latest in a long line of controversial situations for Artest, ranging from destroying television monitors at Madison Square Garden two years ago to missing the team flight to Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals at Detroit last season.

Rumor, Artest says he wanted time off to rest because he was working too hard on the Album. Hmmmmmm.......he was tired because of the rap album and thus wanted time off to recover from it......I guess he didn't ask for time to cut the rap album but it's easily assumed.


HUH? I personally want Artest but what in the world are you talking about
 
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Chris Webber
Vernon Maxwell
Keon Clark
Jim Jackson
Gawen Wells

What do they all have in common? They were all malcontents/trouble makers that had been largely written off before coming to the Kings.

Ron Artest? As long as Adelman is the coach, I'm for it.

YESIR!
 
At first I wanted artest, now I don't. He's too unstable and right now we need somebody stable because the organization needs to convince sacramento to get a new arena and if ron went off that wouldn't happen. I mean, the opportunity of getting a player who will fight the WHOLE OTHER TEAM AND THEIR CROWD seems good, but then you don't know if he'll fight your team too. The way I look at it is Ron is like a bomb with a timer on it, and every day that goes by is one day sooner till he explodes.
 
I stopped reading about half way through. Voisin references "facts" that aren't even true, or are at least distorted. Artest ripped his coach? I thought he went out of his way to praise the coach while saying that he just doesn't fit into the coach's style. He has shoved a classy franchise onto its back? You mean the franchise tied for the second best record in its conference? The franchise calmly giving in to Artest's request and listening to available offers? How is Indiana now on its back? How has Artest ruined that franchise? I expect them to come out of this just fine.

There are reasons people don't like Voisin's columns. Twisted "facts" and dubious conclusions. Why should I listen to the conclusions when she can't even get the facts straight?
 
bigbadred00 said:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1920455&CMP=OTC-DT9705204233

"I've been doing a little bit too much music, just needed the rest," Artest said. "I've still got my album coming out Nov. 23. After the album comes out I'm going to make sure all of my time is focused on winning a championship."

It's the latest in a long line of controversial situations for Artest, ranging from destroying television monitors at Madison Square Garden two years ago to missing the team flight to Game 6 of the Eastern Conference finals at Detroit last season.

Rumor, Artest says he wanted time off to rest because he was working too hard on the Album. Hmmmmmm.......he was tired because of the rap album and thus wanted time off to recover from it......I guess he didn't ask for time to cut the rap album but it's easily assumed.


HUH? I personally want Artest but what in the world are you talking about

espn, great source...anyway...just because its reported doesnt mean its accurate....i shouldnt even bother, but since u asked...

ron 'cut' the album in the offseason....and it wasnt rap it was an r and b album he produced for allure....a group he promoted...it wasnt his own music

due to his time and efforts with the album, he came into camp out of shape for him....260 instead of 252...and this is ron, him coming into camp out of shape isnt like brad miller coming into camp out of shape..trust me, been there done that...

yes ron was tired and emotionally spent....but when facts were revealed, and pacers management came clean, it was made clear that things were misrepresented as with the reference above....

rons grandmother had died, he was in poor spirits as well as being spent, and went to management and ask if he could take some time and get things together...nothing ever about cutting an album or promoting an album....the album was cut...and a release date done with ron having done the promo work prior to the season....he did however choose to use the attention he was getting to constantly make mention of the record in an attempt to promote it, which didnt do much good:D

he was suspended for his actions, and the team moved on...and he was playing the best ball of his career when the brawl happened...averaging 25 points, shooting phenomenally from both 2 and 3....and was playing his usual devastating defense....and the pacers were playing great....and absolutely dominated a full strenth detroit team on their home court while not having reggie, foster, anthony johnson, pollard or even bender....

then the roof came crashing down....

thats what happened....but the rap album bs makes for a much better story....so thats what gets strewn all over the place...
 
Last edited:
foretaz-the guy has tru warriors "tattoo-ed" on his head. your kinda just getting into samantics. the point is he was looking at his 2nd job over his first and his secondary job was potentially hurting his first job. I guess they could have misquoted him but, but the story seems reasonable. Ah, doesn't matter, Ron has problems, he isn't all there off the court and he isn't all there at times when he's on the court, but the guy produces, and he produces extremely well when he's on the court. I want him because we need another defensive minded player albeit he can score well instead of having a pure scorer at the 3. If he was totally sane, we wouldn't be talking about this because the Pacers would have no interest in trading the guy, but he isn't. Right now we have a great role "superstar" in Peja who is just a shooter, we need more than shooters right now for this team to win. A perfectly sane Artest would be the perfect man for the job, he just isn't sane.
 
Comparing these guys to Artest is like comparing a firecracker to an atom bomb. There is no limit to the destruction Artest could do to a team, especailly one with the arena situation we have here in Sacramento.
 
Warhawk said:
Comparing these guys to Artest is like comparing a firecracker to an atom bomb. There is no limit to the destruction Artest could do to a team, especailly one with the arena situation we have here in Sacramento.

Well said, Warhawk.
 
foretaz said:
espn, great source...anyway...just because its reported doesnt mean its accurate....i shouldnt even bother, but since u asked...

ron 'cut' the album in the offseason....and it wasnt rap it was an r and b album he produced for allure....a group he promoted...it wasnt his own music

due to his time and efforts with the album, he came into camp out of shape for him....260 instead of 252...and this is ron, him coming into camp out of shape isnt like brad miller coming into camp out of shape..trust me, been there done that...

yes ron was tired and emotionally spent....but when facts were revealed, and pacers management came clean, it was made clear that things were misrepresented as with the reference above....

rons grandmother had died, he was in poor spirits as well as being spent, and went to management and ask if he could take some time and get things together...nothing ever about cutting an album or promoting an album....the album was cut...and a release date done with ron having done the promo work prior to the season....he did however choose to use the attention he was getting to constantly make mention of the record in an attempt to promote it, which didnt do much good:D

he was suspended for his actions, and the team moved on...and he was playing the best ball of his career when the brawl happened...averaging 25 points, shooting phenomenally from both 2 and 3....and was playing his usual devastating defense....and the pacers were playing great....and absolutely dominated a full strenth detroit team on their home court while not having reggie, foster, anthony johnson, pollard or even bender....

then the roof came crashing down....

thats what happened....but the rap album bs makes for a much better story....so thats what gets strewn all over the place...

So you are saying ESPN fabricated the quotes? Has Artest said anything like that?

He is not devoted to basketball. I put more info here from the article:

http://www.kingsfans.com/forums/showthread.php?p=235067#post235067

HE WANTED TIME OFF BECAUSE HE WAS MORE INTERESTED IN THE LABEL THAN BASKETBALL. Reason enough for me not to want him, besides him being crazy and all.

Yes, he is a fantastic player. That was never in question. That is not enough. Not for me.
 
Oh, and when Bobby Jackson's mother (?) died of cancer, he didn't request a month off, the team went to the funeral (costing them a win because of the travel and lack of rest and practice, IIRC). Did the team sacrifice a win for Bobby because he asked them to? No, but Artest seems to feel that if he is "tired" because of his propotion activities, MAYBE HE SHOULD CONSIDER WHICH IS MORE IMPORTANT, MUSIC OR BASKETBALL.
 
If you don't want artest on this team(and basically trading our softest player for him), then you really don't want this team to win but rather have peace of mind for yourself because you don't wanna deal with a loose cannon(which I don't even think will be an issue).
 
Back
Top