Tom Thibodeau vs. George Karl

[Jespher]

What a cluster of a season for the Sacramento Kings. December decisions spoiled a very promising start, leading to an inexplicable news conference by Pete D. One nugget that I keep revisiting is how he wanted to keep Tyrone Corbin as the coach for the remainder of the season, however when pressed by Carmichael Dave regarding a multiple year contract for Corbin, if he was the guy, Pete back pedaled and said the position would be reevaluated in the summer.

Is it possible that they anticipated/expected other major names (Thibodeau) to be available following the season? Did they favor these over George Karl, and were merely waiting to hire Ty Corbin's replacement until the summer when a bigger name (Thibodeau) would become available?

While Thibodeau's teams rarely excelled in the offense that enamored Chris Mullin and Pete D, his team's consistent defensive dominance was admired by DeMarcus Cousins. Thibodeau forged a relationship with him (along with Rudy Gay) over the World Cup Tournament in Spain, followed by tremendous defensive improvements by Cousins. He is a clear upgrade to Michael Malone, as he now has 5 years of head coaching experience, and the 6th highest winning percentage in NBA history. George Karl is no slouch himself, as he sports the 6th most total victories in NBA history.

This feels like unsubstantiated speculation, however, charting the incentives, it does explain why the team didn't hire George Karl immediately when Michael Malone was fired, as 85+% of the fan base was clamoring for. Ultimately, the fans won out, and an exceptionally talented coach was brought in the right the ship.

However...

Suppose there was a take-back, and Pete stuck to his guns. Tyrone Corbin did finish the season, and with the coaching downgrade the team won 22 games, and fell to the #4 pick in the draft...

1) Now that Tom Thibodeau is officially a coaching free agent, who would you choose to run this team? George Karl, Tom Thibodeau, or someone else that has become/is still available (Monty Williams, Mark Jackson, Scott Brooks, Scott Skiles, Rick Adelman, ect...).

2) Does a better pick due to tanking and a defensive scheme head coach vs an offensive scheme head coach bode better for winning in brutal western conference?

3) Is Thibodeau an upgrade to Karl at all, or was the Tyrone Corbin experiment and the mid season coaching waiting game better explained by:

Sacramento ownership infighting
Fear of paying multiple coaches for a losing product
Incredibly incompetent choices by management in hopes that Corbin could right the ship
or
Mass hysteria from the tin foil hat clan.

 

[KingMilz]

Unfair question everyone here will say Thibs because he's a insane version of Mike Malone who got us off to a 9-6 start and based off that he's a living legend.

 

[Bricklayer]

Yep Thibs, and the forging of that relationship at the World's is a big part of that.. After 9 straight year's worth of being the very worst defensive franchise in the NBA, that problem would suddenly and abruptly end, and the disastrous mistake made back when we hired Westphal instead of Thibs in '08 finally corrected.

That said, that boat has sailed, and many others. So Karl it is, and if he doesn't trip over his own ego, or worse yet trip others around him with it, he's more than good enough a coach to win with.

 

[jdbraver]

You are assuming Thibs would have taken this job. I believe otherwise. Either way Karl is the best Coach we have had in a while and we needed him at that moment in time....

 

[Bricklayer]

You are assuming Thibs would have taken this job. I believe otherwise. Either way Karl is the best Coach we have had in a while and we needed him at that moment in time....

Oh there's every indication he would have if the offer had come. He came in, interviewed, and was one of the three finalists we had that summer. He, Kurt Rambis, and Paul Westphal. There was a 1 in 3 chance of getting that one right, we did not.

 

[ParniValjak]

Thibs for me! Builds his teams the right way. Educates the right principles and has a good realtionship with DMC! Plus he is younger and will last longer that Karl!

Defence wins championships!

 

[jdbraver]

Oh there's every indication he would have if the offer had come. He came in, interviewed, and was one of the three finalists we had that summer. He, Kurt Rambis, and Paul Westphal. There was a 1 in 3 chance of getting that one right, we did not.

Sorry I meant this summer.

 

[dude12]

Unfair question everyone here will say Thibs because he's a insane version of Mike Malone who got us off to a 9-6 start and based off that he's a living legend.

Try not to get the terms living legend and the coach who had us playing our best ball in a decade confused unless your trying to sensationalize everything.

 

[lawlman91]

Try not to get the terms living legend and the coach who had us playing our best ball in a decade confused unless your trying to sensationalize everything.

I guess your point is valid.

 

[Albatros]

I don't see Thibs as realistic personally so Karl.

 

[sidney]

New Orleans would likely be a better spot than here and rumors are he's not even interested in them and wants to take a year off. I'm just thankful we have a good coach without playing the "what if" game.

 

[ockingsfan]

Thibs does not fit the FO idea of the "PACE" they want and envision.

He is even more slow down than Malone. The FO would never have hired him.

I am hoping the Kings move towards the ball movement and pace of the Adelman era, with Vlade as the architect.

 

[Larry David]

He is even more slow down than Malone. The FO would never have hired him.

Sadly, this is probably right.

4 owners and not one of them has been able to stretch together more than 4 seasons of competence.

 

[notoriousBEN3]

I agree that a Thibs strong defensive minded presence would have been nice to have, but looks like a lot of s*** is hitting the fan about him being rough on his players and not being interested in any sort of compromise, etc. His track record speaks for itself, but it sure sounds like a handful of guys were not happy with him by the end of the season. Karl certainly seems like a more personable guy. We shall see how it plays out...

 

[King Baller]

Oh there's every indication he would have if the offer had come. He came in, interviewed, and was one of the three finalists we had that summer. He, Kurt Rambis, and Paul Westphal. There was a 1 in 3 chance of getting that one right, we did not.

I forgot about that! Can you imagine a scenario if Rambis was selected

 

[King Baller]

New Orleans would likely be a better spot than here and rumors are he's not even interested in them and wants to take a year off. I'm just thankful we have a good coach without playing the "what if" game.

I was pulling for the Bulls during the Playoffs. Watching Thibs it appeared he was coaching his heart out to the point where a high toll was taken.

I suspect he needs a year off to get refreshed. Or perhaps a lower stress assignment as a Defensive Coordinator for the Kings

 

[King Baller]

I wonder if Doc Rivers would take a step back in LA as GM only and bring in Thibs to Coach the Clips??? (I hate this idea because the West is tough enough)

 

[Sac.Kings]

Problem with Thibs is his offensive sets are simple and the Bulls could not score efficiently with Gasol-Butler-Rose, which is kind of concerning. However, on the opposite side of the court, he is a wizard. Karl is kind of the polar opposite. It would be nothing short of a miracle if he came here as a defensive coach, but it's never going to happen. It's not a role he wants.

 

[Prince_XY]

Thibs for me! Builds his teams the right way. Educates the right principles and has a good realtionship with DMC! Plus he is younger and will last longer that Karl!

Defence wins championships!

Oh yeah. That is why they have Rose, Butler, Gasol, Noah, Gibson, etc. etc. and they are now gone....fishing. You name it, they have it. Unbelievable.

 

[Gilles]

Chicago's number of Lebron's = 0
Cleveland's number of Lebron's = 1

 

[pdxKingsFan]

My biggest concern with Karl is that he is probably a short term solution, a guy like Thibs who seems to have wore out his welcome in Chicago could be a 10+ year coach at his next destination. And that consistency is something the Kings have been lacking.

 

[Kings Faithful]

Its pretty clear to me that if we did not hire George Karl at the time, we would likely be looking at Chris Mullin as our next head coach. So George Karl 1000x over.

 

[bajaden]

Don't see the point of this survey...Karl is our coach and that isn't going to change anytime soon.

 

[VF21]

Don't see the point of this survey...Karl is our coach and that isn't going to change anytime soon.

Come on, baja...you know what happens around here during TDOS.

There are always some folks who like to play "what if" ... I think as we get older, we appreciate and accept what is why too much to worry about "what if"...

 

[kingsboi]

Thibs being here would of worn Cousins down...he has a history of doing that to his Bulls players. Maybe that explains all the injuries accumulating for the Bulls the last couple of seasons. I'm not the biggest Karl supporter either because he hasn't gotten past the first round in how long but hey...it's better than what the team has been working with so it can't be that bad. I just hope the successor is a competent one.

 

[KingMilz]

Thibs being here would of worn Cousins down...he has a history of doing that to his Bulls players. Maybe that explains all the injuries accumulating for the Bulls the last couple of seasons. I'm not the biggest Karl supporter either because he hasn't gotten past the first round in how long but hey...it's better than what the team has been working with so it can't be that bad. I just hope the successor is a competent one.

He wears down wing players more than big's plus with the way Cousins fouls he would take himself out more often than not.

 

[Mike]

The thing I like about Thibs is the success he's had when Derrick Rose has been injured. His teams have always remained competitive and made the play offs. Before this season he had to rely on Deng and Noah being the main two guys leading the team when Rose has been down. So to make the play offs and do ok shows how good a coach he is (or lucky?).

I think if he came here he could turn us around and get us going in the right direction. We might become a tough defensive basketball team like the Bulls have been, but I'd be happy with that if it gets us to the play offs.

In regards to Karl vs Thibs. I would probably have gone for Thibs, but Karl is a damn good coach as well, so it's not like we've settled with a two bit replacemt for Malone.

 

[kingsboi]

He wears down wing players more than big's plus with the way Cousins fouls he would take himself out more often than not.

Noah's injuries haven't really caught up to him until this season so he wears all his players down, whether it's a guard, forward or center.

 

[Gary]

Karl, by a mile.

 

[Peter_Gibbons]

One can always argue that Thibs' style is better suited for our franchise player. But then again, working them too hard and running them to the ground is not what I want for Big Cuz. Regardless, Karl is who we have and I'm going to support this team to make the playoffs next year.