The ONE AND ONLY Luka Doncic discussion thread

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VF21

VF21

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jellyfish said:
Yeap just like trading Mclemore/Staskus/Robinson/WCS/Jimmer after one season would have set the franchise back.....................hell we should have kept and developed Derrick Williams as well since he was younger than Buddy is. The main reason is that his skillset and understanding of the game is bottom of the barrel.
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Please tell me how this furthers a legitimate discussion. I'd really like to know.

It actually amuses me at this point that some are so hung up on Doncic that Bagley has assumed permanent resident status in their heads above and beyond anything else.

I can honestly pretty much predict which KF members are going to like certain posts, Logic and rational attempts at meaningful discussion are tossed aside or burned on the altar of Luka worship.

Capt. made a very good point. I'm wondering now how long before some of you just drift away because your dream of Luka on the Kings is never coming true.
 
fansinceday1

fansinceday1

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I’m very critical of Bagley. Personally I don’t think he’s gonna amount to any more than what DMC accomplished here. And for me at this point in my sports fandom, I could care less if he succeeds or not. No skin off my back. it’s just very interesting to see how certain posters here are willing to bend to excuse what the kings have done.

if one is being totally objective, which side would be more likely to be closer to reality? The side that swears dudes gonna be an all star or the side that thinks Bagley is gonna be a bust?
 
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Joshoua

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fansinceday1 said:
I’m very critical of Bagley. Personally I don’t think he’s gonna amount to any more than what DMC accomplished here. And for me at this point in my sports fandom, I could care less if he succeeds or not. No skin off my back. it’s just very interesting to see how certain posters here are willing to bend to excuse what the kings have done.

if one is being totally objective, which side would be more likely to be closer to reality? The side that swears dudes gonna be an all star or the side that thinks Bagley is gonna be a bust?
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Not the side that still compares him to all star or near hall of fame players cause he could finish lobs
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
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Joshoua said:
When do you lower your expectations for someone not showing all star potential, after 5 years?
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1) Change of direction away from your strawman noted.

2) If you think Bagley is "not showing all star potential" you're not watching the same player I'm watching. Though, to be fair, I'm watching Marvin Bagley. You're watching Somebody-Who-Isn't-Luka.

3) #2 notwithstanding, I don't have a firm answer to the question. But if, for sake of example, the player is 20 years old and has played in 70 career games, the answer is certainly "not yet".
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#1,028
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Capt. Factorial said:
1) Change of direction away from your strawman noted.

2) If you think Bagley is "not showing all star potential" you're not watching the same player I'm watching. Though, to be fair, I'm watching Marvin Bagley. You're watching Somebody-Who-Isn't-Luka.

3) #2 notwithstanding, I don't have a firm answer to the question. But if, for sake of example, the player is 20 years old and has played in 70 career games, the answer is certainly "not yet".
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plenty of players I’m excited about from that draft it’s not a Luka thing. I love Trae/Jackson I like Ayton a lot for hindsight I like SGA a lot and I thinks he has all star potential, I believe all those guys will be better than Bagley you can quote me on that and we can revisit in 3-5 years.

You don’t have too do this but you can check my posts in the draft thread/Bagley thread. I liked Bagley a lot at Duke a lot but not over Luka/JJ/Young so you definitely can’t say I’m blind hating on him cause of Luka. Hell I still wish we traded Fox for a pick from that draft and built around Trae Young it it was Luka.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

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Capt. Factorial said:
1) Change of direction away from your strawman noted.

2) If you think Bagley is "not showing all star potential" you're not watching the same player I'm watching. Though, to be fair, I'm watching Marvin Bagley. You're watching Somebody-Who-Isn't-Luka.

3) #2 notwithstanding, I don't have a firm answer to the question. But if, for sake of example, the player is 20 years old and has played in 70 career games, the answer is certainly "not yet".
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Capt, Bagley was a liability out there Monday night. He was forcing bad misses, lost on defensive assignments, and could barely dribble the ball up the court under pressure without turning it over. He looked like he had a lot of work to do just to stick in the NBA past his current contract. Granted he's had much better games, and I'm not going to pretend that "Somebody-Who-Isn't-Luka vision" isn't a thing for a sizable subset of Kings fans (I was at that Houston game and somebody behind me yelled "We want Luka" after a particularly brutal Bagley miscue) but it may be time to acknowledge that Marvin Bagley becoming an All-Star is not guaranteed and right now he's being outplayed by a former second round pick and an undrafted free agent.

Everybody matures on their own timeline but we also have a vast database of statistical data to compare players to and so far this season Marvin has fallen way below the mark where I would say All-Star level performance is more likely than not in his future. Small sample size is noted. It will be interesting to see if he takes this small setback of needing to earn his starting spot back and he humbles himself and works harder or if he decides that he deserves better and continues to freelance and hunt points outside the structure of the offense.
 
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S

sergmatt

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Capt. Factorial said:
2) If you think Bagley is "not showing all star potential" you're not watching the same player I'm watching. Though, to be fair, I'm watching Marvin Bagley. You're watching Somebody-Who-Isn't-Luka.
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What about his game this season indicates all-star potential? Is it because he can jump really high, jump quick, and run fast? Granted those are nice god given skills to have and a lot of all stars do have them......but it takes a lot more than just athletic ability to be an all- star.

I see Bagley as a potential all-star too if he fixes/improves numerous aspects of his game. We can say that about many young players though. The real question is how likely is Bagley to be an all-star?

We already know Luka is going to be one and likely a perennial all-star barring major injury. Knowing that I'm not sure how anybody could continue to think Bagley was a good pick.
 
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Joshoua

All-Star
#1,034
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sergmatt said:
What about his game this season indicates all-star potential? Is it because he can jump really high, jump quick, and run fast? Granted those are nice god given skills to have and a lot of all stars do have them......but it takes a lot more than just athletic ability to be an all- star.

I see Bagley as a potential all-star too if he fixes/improves numerous aspects of his game. We can say that about many young players though. The real question is how likely is Bagley to be an all-star?

We already know Luka is going to be one and likely a perennial all-star barring major injury. Knowing that I'm not sure how anybody could continue to think Bagley was a good pick.
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I hope we get an answer to this
 
Capt. Factorial

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sergmatt said:
What about his game this season indicates all-star potential? Is it because he can jump really high, jump quick, and run fast? Granted those are nice god given skills to have and a lot of all stars do have them......but it takes a lot more than just athletic ability to be an all- star.
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Let me quote myself from a mere 10 days ago: "One of the reasons that Bagley was so highly thought of in the draft was his mix of post and perimeter skill combined with his athleticism. Outside of poor court vision (which seems to be improving) and a weak off hand (not an uncommon deficit) his "modern 4" skills are all there. He shot 39.7% from the college three, he can handle, he can face up and drive, he's got the lateral quickness to guard even smaller players on the perimeter, the entire skill set is pretty much all there. He has to adapt it to the professional game, but most players have to."

I see Bagley as a potential all-star too if he fixes/improves numerous aspects of his game. We can say that about many young players though. The real question is how likely is Bagley to be an all-star?

We already know Luka is going to be one and likely a perennial all-star barring major injury. Knowing that I'm not sure how anybody could continue to think Bagley was a good pick.
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You know what? If I were drafting in 2018, I'd have taken Luka #1, Bagley #2, and Ayton #3. It's not like I hate Luka or anything. But the thing is, people keep treating this as if it were a question of Bagley or Luka. It's not a question of Bagley or Luka. There's no "or Luka" involved. It's a question of being happy with Bagley or being unhappy with Bagley as a building block of the Kings core. Unfortunately, this is the thread for folks who can't move past the 2018 draft, and part of that is the ability to only see Bagley through the He's-Not-Luka filter.
 
KainLear

KainLear

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Capt. Factorial said:
You know what? If I were drafting in 2018, I'd have taken Luka #1, Bagley #2, and Ayton #3. It's not like I hate Luka or anything. But the thing is, people keep treating this as if it were a question of Bagley or Luka. It's not a question of Bagley or Luka. There's no "or Luka" involved. It's a question of being happy with Bagley or being unhappy with Bagley as a building block of the Kings core. Unfortunately, this is the thread for folks who can't move past the 2018 draft, and part of that is the ability to only see Bagley through the He's-Not-Luka filter.
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I'll admit that I am a huge Luka Doncic fan myself. I was very excited that we had the chance to draft this European phenom, and I was devastated that we didn't. (I also wasn't a huge fan of Luke Walton's hiring but that's another discussion for another day)

But what's done is done.

I'll even go so far as to say, even if after all things settled, 50 years later, we look back and see that we should've drafted a different player. What's so great about analyzing a decision and point out that it is wrong or if it's prematurely judging? I can tell you what NOT so great about that, which is that you'll lose what's in front of you. You'll lose the present, which might not be perfect but it's boring to be perfect.

Enjoy the present. Watch what Bagley going to grow into. I for one am very interested to see how the Kings pivot and adjust with strategy and player acquisition when Bagley and Fox grow into the full-fledged players they will become.
 
fansinceday1

fansinceday1

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Capt. Factorial said:
There's no "or Luka" involved. It's a question of being happy with Bagley or being unhappy with Bagley as a building block of the Kings core. Unfortunately, this is the thread for folks who can't move past the 2018 draft, and part of that is the ability to only see Bagley through the He's-Not-Luka filter.
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As a recovering Kings fan, I enjoy coming to the LUKA thread that was set aside for fans who can't get over not drafting a once in a generation player and watching KINGS FANS spin themselves in circles trying to convince other kings fans and i suspect, themselves, that bagley will be an allstar and that the kings actually knew what they were doing draft night 2018. I no longer wear the rose colored glasses. I no longer believe the kings talking heads or other kings fanatics when they tell us this franchise has a plan. Ill be blunt here, this franchise sucks. Vlade is one of the worst GM's in the league, if not the worst. This team is not even close to turning the corner. I read posts of these poor kings fans coming into the luka thread trying to convince the luka fans here that they are missing out on this current kings team (thats a frigging doozy!) by pining for luka and not enjoying bagley for who his is and what he will become. I just gotta put my head in my hands. WOW. Just WOW! I count my lucky stars that i no longer live and die with this sorry excuse for a franchise. I watch this team every so often because it is something to watch when more exciting competent franchises aren't playing.

I do have to ask, why can't you people who have a problem with other people pining for Luka just leave this thread alone? It was started because other kings posters couldn't stand to hear Luka's name mentioned on the more traveled parts of kings fans because its just too painful. I guess i kinda understand. But now you guys gotta come here and lecture this thread why we are wrong or ridiculous or whatever you think we are? Let us fans of other teams and kings fans who don't drink the cool aid commiserate amongst ourselves about what a lost cause this kings franchise is. Bagley won't even be half the player luka currently is. Accept it. Own it. And try to hold your franchise accountable for giving their sorry excuse for a GM a friggin contract extension!!!! Let that doozy sink in! WOW!!!!!!!!
 
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Chupacabra

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Bagley was a 1 and done blue chip talent who is now a 2nd year player with a different coaching staff than the one he had in his first year. He hasnt even played 10 games this year. The Bagley blues seems more like a product of anxiety brought on by the fact that we did not select the uniquely stellar Doncic and Young, and less about Bagley's actual game. Doncic is great does not equal Bagley is not good.
 
SLAB

SLAB

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Despite their best effort to let the Spurs come back and win, the Mavs take it.

I’m still yet to see Maxi Kleber do anything good... ever. :p

24/10/8 final line for Luka.
 
VF21

VF21

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fansinceday1 said:
...I do have to ask, why can't you people who have a problem with other people pining for Luka just leave this thread alone? It was started because other kings posters couldn't stand to hear Luka's name mentioned on the more traveled parts of kings fans because its just too painful. I guess i kinda understand. But now you guys gotta come here and lecture this thread why we are wrong or ridiculous or whatever you think we are? Let us fans of other teams and kings fans who don't drink the cool aid commiserate amongst ourselves about what a lost cause this kings franchise is. Bagley won't even be half the player luka currently is. Accept it. Own it. And try to hold your franchise accountable for giving their sorry excuse for a GM a friggin contract extension!!!! Let that doozy sink in! WOW!!!!!!!!
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Possibly for the same reason the people who are pining for Luka can't leave the Marvin Bagley thread alone. It's a two-way street.

It ain't broke right now, so why are you trying to fix it? For the most part, both sides have found a way to co-exist.
 
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Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

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fansinceday1 said:
As a recovering Kings fan...why can't you people...just leave this thread alone?
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So. Just to be clear. You're saying you're NOT a Kings fan but you want KingsFans.com to specifically provide you a forum where you can talk about a player who is not on the Kings and badmouth people who ARE Kings fans without being bothered by anybody that the website is actually dedicated to.

OK.

I want a flying car.
 
fansinceday1

fansinceday1

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VF21 said:
Possibly for the same reason the people who are pining for Luka can't leave the Marvin Bagley thread alone. It's a two-way street.

It ain't broke right now, so why are you trying to fix it? For the most part, both sides have found a way to co-exist.
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I’ve ventured out of the luka Thread to post on the game day thread maybe a couple times. Posted on the Bagley thread a couple times. That’s it. I stick to the luka thread and the NFL thread. That’s about it.
I made a comment about being amused by the comments lecturing the kings fans who are still pissed about not drafting luka. That’s it.
 
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