The ONE AND ONLY Luka Doncic discussion thread
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In 10-15 years people will look at Bagley and Luka like they do Jordan and darko situations. Don’t know why people are trying to act like that’s a hot take Bagley could average 20-10 it won’t matter. Luka is doing 29-9-9 in year 2 while leading his team to a 19-10 record ( should be 22-7, 2 losses to NYK and refs literally giving LeBron a game).
Bagley will never come close to that impact as a big unless he does 20-10 with Gobert defense. Look at KAT dudes a monster and average on defense yet doesn’t impact the game like Luka a wing. Bagley won’t ever be as good as KAT
Bagley will never come close to that impact as a big unless he does 20-10 with Gobert defense. Look at KAT dudes a monster and average on defense yet doesn’t impact the game like Luka a wing. Bagley won’t ever be as good as KAT
You obviously misunderstood me. I said that TODAY it's not true. You responded that in 15 years it probably will be. Do you understand my point? Sometimes I wonder if it's worth the effort. If it's not true yet, there's A POSSIBILITY it might not be. Thus, using absolutes is wrong. See, this isn't about basketball at all, it's actually about understanding English.
Ok I understand what you’re saying and at the same time it’s a GMs job to try to predict how a player will look in the future not now when drafting. This reasoning is why we allegedly took Bagley over Luka cause his ceiling was higher for the future not now. So as fans if we’re gonna discuss the players we can look past this year
I understand completely. It's just hard to say "I agree with everything you said except the conclusion that it couldn't ever be different, and since I'm one of those people who are more particular about being precise than most, it matters to me, while it doesn't matter to you for perfectly good reasons, so I'm not criticizing you, I'm just saying it's hard for me to understand at first, and if we could just get the misunderstanding out of the way, then we could talk about things that really matter about the Kings."
If I could say that in a couple of words, then I wouldn't bore people to death about things that don't really matter to them. So I'm almost there, I just haven't figured out what the words are.
Hopefully that clears at least something up, it's hard to tell in advance.
If I could say that in a couple of words, then I wouldn't bore people to death about things that don't really matter to them. So I'm almost there, I just haven't figured out what the words are.
Hopefully that clears at least something up, it's hard to tell in advance.
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I was typing my response to CelticsFan when you posted this, so most of my response is there. In summary, I basically agree with anything about Doncic being better than Bagley at the moment. My only objection is to saying that we already know it will never be any different. And I understand completely what you are saying, I just needed to "translate" it to understand it, since I hear things differently. So it's more like "we're both enthusiastic Kings fans, but we speak different languages."
I'm still trying to figure out the best way to get across the idea that we disagree but I don't have a problem with that. It's a simple message that's hard to understand, primarily because it's too different from the typical sports discussion.
I'm still trying to figure out the best way to get across the idea that we disagree but I don't have a problem with that. It's a simple message that's hard to understand, primarily because it's too different from the typical sports discussion.
Maybe, and I'm just spitballing things here, but maybe the Kings should try to develop a team, you know, a full core, together for more than say a year before pulling the plug and starting over.
The only reason anybody wants to trade Bagley is because they're still upset about us not picking Doncic, and seriously, that's not a good enough reason.
I don't care if Doncic turns out to be LeBron James raised to the Michael Jordan power multiplied by Kobe factorial, he's not on our team. So drool over him all you want, fine. But if you're going to advocate blowing up our team AGAIN for the nth time in n years just to get rid of the guy who got picked instead of Teacher's Pet, well, that's where things start to get silly. For the first time in perhaps two decades that Kings have a young core worth building around, and that young core is Fox/Bagley/Hield. (Hield, of course, is not super young, but he's still only going to be 31 at the end of his contract.) I'm willing to be patient as that core develops, because I think it can be a VERY strong core and because that's who we have. We don't have Doncic. We can't get Doncic. Spilt. Freaking. Milk. We have Bagley. Kicking Bagley to the curb to start a rebuild YET AGAIN is a bad, terrible, bad, stupid, dumb, horrible, bad idea.
The only reason anybody wants to trade Bagley is because they're still upset about us not picking Doncic, and seriously, that's not a good enough reason.
I don't care if Doncic turns out to be LeBron James raised to the Michael Jordan power multiplied by Kobe factorial, he's not on our team. So drool over him all you want, fine. But if you're going to advocate blowing up our team AGAIN for the nth time in n years just to get rid of the guy who got picked instead of Teacher's Pet, well, that's where things start to get silly. For the first time in perhaps two decades that Kings have a young core worth building around, and that young core is Fox/Bagley/Hield. (Hield, of course, is not super young, but he's still only going to be 31 at the end of his contract.) I'm willing to be patient as that core develops, because I think it can be a VERY strong core and because that's who we have. We don't have Doncic. We can't get Doncic. Spilt. Freaking. Milk. We have Bagley. Kicking Bagley to the curb to start a rebuild YET AGAIN is a bad, terrible, bad, stupid, dumb, horrible, bad idea.
Yeap just like trading Mclemore/Staskus/Robinson/WCS/Jimmer after one season would have set the franchise back.....................hell we should have kept and developed Derrick Williams as well since he was younger than Buddy is. The main reason is that his skillset and understanding of the game is bottom of the barrel.
I agree with @jellyfish
if you know Bagley doesn’t have it do you trade him yes, do I wanna trade him yes for the right pick but I’m also willing to wait on him. Wanting to trade him has nothing to do with Luka like jellyfish says his skill set and basketball IQ is very low. I just don’t think he’ll be able to okay a winning brand of basketball and will be tough to build around unless he develops a jump shot.
if you know Bagley doesn’t have it do you trade him yes, do I wanna trade him yes for the right pick but I’m also willing to wait on him. Wanting to trade him has nothing to do with Luka like jellyfish says his skill set and basketball IQ is very low. I just don’t think he’ll be able to okay a winning brand of basketball and will be tough to build around unless he develops a jump shot.
If this were all about Luka, then there'd be calls to trade him last June.
I can't say all my bias has been completely eliminated, My thought process has gone from being pissed about the pick, coming around on Bagley midway last year, being pissed again when Luka blew up this year, and now thinking Bagley just isn't very good.
He looks flat out bad, and it's not like regression from young NBA players is uncommon, even ours where we typical draft busts right off the bat. We all thought WCS was going to be a cornerstone and defensive monster for years to come. Then his second year happened. And his third. And so on. Even Ben McLemore has a stretch where he looked competent for half a season (I remember him shooting 50/40/90 at one point). There's nothing really here I can point to say he looks raw, if he were raw he'd typically be a net negative but have a skillset that looks like something could be built. Fox his rookie year comes to mind as raw.
The mods should be happy. Whenever we mention Bagley it's not with the caveat of mentioning Luka in the same breath. Now his ineptitude atm is speaking for itself.
I can't say all my bias has been completely eliminated, My thought process has gone from being pissed about the pick, coming around on Bagley midway last year, being pissed again when Luka blew up this year, and now thinking Bagley just isn't very good.
He looks flat out bad, and it's not like regression from young NBA players is uncommon, even ours where we typical draft busts right off the bat. We all thought WCS was going to be a cornerstone and defensive monster for years to come. Then his second year happened. And his third. And so on. Even Ben McLemore has a stretch where he looked competent for half a season (I remember him shooting 50/40/90 at one point). There's nothing really here I can point to say he looks raw, if he were raw he'd typically be a net negative but have a skillset that looks like something could be built. Fox his rookie year comes to mind as raw.
The mods should be happy. Whenever we mention Bagley it's not with the caveat of mentioning Luka in the same breath. Now his ineptitude atm is speaking for itself.
Sometimes I'm just amazed by the logic. If I understand this correctly, the Kings aren't playing well and so if Bagley's dad says something obnoxious we should all think of new ways to ridicule him. I realize that can be tremendous fun; I just don't understand how that has anything to do with basketball.
Really? You don’t understand how a disgruntled over bearing, helicopter dad of a player on the kings has anything to do with basketball?
Dude thinks his son is way WAY better than he is AND he thinks the kings may be using him incorrectly. Not to mention he has his sons ear and runs “team Bagley”, ala Mr “a-hole ball. That has nothing to do with basketball? You are in for a rude awakening my friend........
Dude thinks his son is way WAY better than he is AND he thinks the kings may be using him incorrectly. Not to mention he has his sons ear and runs “team Bagley”, ala Mr “a-hole ball. That has nothing to do with basketball? You are in for a rude awakening my friend........
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This is a textbook bad faith argument. When the Kings drafted those players, they still had DeMarcus Cousins. The Kings core, at the time, was... DeMarcus Cousins. When you have an All-Star in their prime, you can't afford to take the time to develop players: you've got to figure it out, now. Pretending that the Kings' situation in 2019-20 is even remotely similar to what happened when McLemore/Stauskas/Robinson/Cauley-Stein/Fredette was drafted, so that you can get off a "It didn't work, then, and it won't work now" hot take, is disingenuous at best.
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