The Kings Future Might Be Brighter than One Thinks

Čarolija said:
Luck plays the least part. You make your own luck by working your backside off and doing the right things.

Is it luck that Spurs keep finding productive players and all-stars no matter where they draft?! I don't think so. Buford and his team scout their backsides off and then Pop and his staff develop the hell out of their draftees. Teams that draft and develop well are those that put a lot of work into scouting and development.
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sounds simple, but if it were this easy then why aren't the 29 other teams in the league doing the exact same thing?
 
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The Kings have some nice pieces, but no stars have yet emerged from the pack.
But there's nothing wrong with letting Joerger and this mix of players gell for a couple of seasons, plus a couple of (hopefully) good draft picks, and Bogdan. Out of that mix, I'd be shocked if three of our players didn't blossom into borderline All-Stars. A top 10 player like Cuz? Nah, probably not. But the Pistons won two titles without a top 10 player, and there are plenty more examples where that came from. I think I'd prefer to have three borderline All-Stars rather than one top ten star, one borderline All-Star, and role players.
 
jcassio said:
The Kings have some nice pieces, but no stars have yet emerged from the pack.
But there's nothing wrong with letting Joerger and this mix of players gell for a couple of seasons, plus a couple of (hopefully) good draft picks, and Bogdan. Out of that mix, I'd be shocked if three of our players didn't blossom into borderline All-Stars. A top 10 player like Cuz? Nah, probably not. But the Pistons won two titles without a top 10 player, and there are plenty more examples where that came from. I think I'd prefer to have three borderline All-Stars rather than one top ten star, one borderline All-Star, and role players.
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They won one title and that roster had one of the best defensive players of all time and three other dudes who had been or would become all-stars. That team was seriously one of the best defensive squads of all time playing slowed down grit-and-grind basketball. Big Ben, Tayshaun Prince, Mr. Big Shot all made multiple All-NBA Defensive Squads and Sheed averaged two blocks a game.

Now we do have the right coach if we want to go down that route but everything that Vlade and Vivek have said indicates that they want to go the opposite direction.
 
HndsmCelt said:
sounds simple, question what word 29 other teams in the league would all be doing the same thing
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Pacers seem to get franchise level players reasonably well in the later half of the lottery. Wasn't George pick 10 and Myles Turner who potentially could be a franchise level big was pick 11 if I recall correctly.

Then Jimmy Butler at 30 or there abouts was also an excellent pick. Some teams seem to do a pretty decent job of picking franchise level talent later than where Kings usually pick (i.e. inside top 10)
 
Tetsujin said:
They won one title and that roster had one of the best defensive players of all time and three other dudes who had been or would become all-stars. That team was seriously one of the best defensive squads of all time playing slowed down grit-and-grind basketball. Big Ben, Tayshaun Prince, Mr. Big Shot all made multiple All-NBA Defensive Squads and Sheed averaged two blocks a game.

Now we do have the right coach if we want to go down that route but everything that Vlade and Vivek have said indicates that they want to go the opposite direction.
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Sheed for sure was a high character guy, so thats why they won the championship right?
 
Čarolija said:
Name them!

If the Kings had 6 NBA quality starting players (i.e. those that would start on other team) they would be contenders and now struggle to win 30 games in a season.
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Granted they are injured, free agents, possibly past their prime along with a couple of solid current players. But there are six players who have played significant starting minutes in the NBA. Tyreke, Rudy, Ty, Kosta, Garrett and Darren.
 
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King Baller said:
Man you guys are brutal:) But then so was last nights game. I'm starting to consider that IfAt1st could be right on his conspiracy theory about the Nuggets game:eek:
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Don't go there. You might not come back.

Does the league have team and player "darlings?" Yup. But that is whole lot different than conspiring with a team to throw a game. Too many witness's there.
 
At least Vlade will be gone, if he is relying on those picks to save his job and have us competitive in two years then good luck, look around the league for the past few seasons rookies are not having the type of impact they used too, the overall skill level of the league has increased so much that it takes a generational talent to have an impact on winning right away. Oh and this is if we keep our picks AND draft the right guys.

This was game two into the rebuild, there was alot of booing and negativity from the crowd yesterday already, that shiny new building with high end dining inside and out might just be empty in the upcoming few years. I hope Vivek has the bankroll to survive this and still pay some guys when they come due to be paid.

And at any point should Vlade blow draft picks etc that pushes competitiveness even further away, I hope people enjoyed the close games and wins earlier on this season, even though there was a lot of griping over certain issues surrounding the team, pre all star game might be the best stretch we see for maybe even 5 years.
 
Tetsujin said:
They won one title and that roster had one of the best defensive players of all time and three other dudes who had been or would become all-stars. That team was seriously one of the best defensive squads of all time playing slowed down grit-and-grind basketball. Big Ben, Tayshaun Prince, Mr. Big Shot all made multiple All-NBA Defensive Squads and Sheed averaged two blocks a game.

Now we do have the right coach if we want to go down that route but everything that Vlade and Vivek have said indicates that they want to go the opposite direction.
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And if you're referring to grit-and-grind with no 3 point shooting, they'd be right to do so. What we need is to space the floor, be a good 3 point shooting team AND be a good defensive team. All the good teams do that. Ben Wallace would not be a defensive juggernaut in today's NBA with how the game is called and bigs shooting 3s.
 
Čarolija said:
Luck plays the least part. You make your own luck by working your backside off and doing the right things.

Is it luck that Spurs keep finding productive players and all-stars no matter where they draft?! I don't think so. Buford and his team scout their backsides off and then Pop and his staff develop the hell out of their draftees. Teams that draft and develop well are those that put a lot of work into scouting and development.
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Luck as in where you are slotted to draft when the ping pong balls are drawn. Getting a top 3 pick versus getting a 6-10 pick like the Kings have been doing. The Spurs organization in general is a well oiled machine so it's not really fair to compare them to anyone in the league IMO. I don't see any other teams developing players and unknown players at the rate that the Spurs do. Pop is simply a mastermind. A one of a kind.
 
Curious, who do you guys think looks like the better player/prospect between Hield and Richardson?

I feel like Richardson has the upper-hand due to his better quickness and athleticism. Age plays a factor as well.
 
Yes, the draft position is important, no doubt about it. But it's not SO important. The most important thing is the ability to evaluate talent, to pick the right guy. This is what this team needs. Over the year we''ve never been lucky enough to get a top 3 pick. So what? That's not the reason why we keep sucking. The reason is Robinson over Lillard or Drummond. Jimmer over Klay or Leonard or Butler. Ben over Antetokounmpo or Steven Adams. Nick over LaVine.
 
Tetsujin said:
They won one title and that roster had one of the best defensive players of all time and three other dudes who had been or would become all-stars. That team was seriously one of the best defensive squads of all time playing slowed down grit-and-grind basketball. Big Ben, Tayshaun Prince, Mr. Big Shot all made multiple All-NBA Defensive Squads and Sheed averaged two blocks a game.

Now we do have the right coach if we want to go down that route but everything that Vlade and Vivek have said indicates that they want to go the opposite direction.
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I was actually referring to the Bad Boys who won two titles (1989 and 1990). But I didn't mention them because I think the Kings should emulate their style of play. These are different times. I mentioned them because they're an example of a team that became champions with a bunch of borderline All-Stars and no top ten player who dominated. (I realize some will argue that Isiah Thomas was a "top ten player who dominated," but I would counter that he was a top 20 player at best... a sort of Chris Paul of his time.) In any case, what I'm suggesting is that the Kings might have a better chance at success without depending on a dominant star to guide them, er, lead them. Team basketball, with very good players, could be our best bet.
 
206Fan said:
Curious, who do you guys think looks like the better player/prospect between Hield and Richardson?

I feel like Richardson has the upper-hand due to his better quickness and athleticism. Age plays a factor as well.
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Freakin' McBen looks like a better prospect than Hield. And I'm only being mildly hyperbolic.
 
Čarolija said:
So hopefully the Kings get two top 10 picks in this draft and another top 10 pick next year.....hopefully with a bit of luck top 3. Kings really have NO room for error if they are to come out of this reasonably quickly. The pick in 2019 is going to Philadelphia so ideally you want that to be a non-lottery pick.
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This is an important point that got lost in the thread. The trade was not just about Buddy (Vivekisms notwithstanding). Rather, the Kings saw they had a flawed franchise player and little hope of adding a second or third star in support. Now, the hope is to get those stars the next two years. Hopefully, this draft is as good as advertised.
 
I don't mind Skal and our wing prospects. Going to come down to WCS. Good skill level with a tough motor. He's still learning. I still have faith we can get to a place where we are a consistent positive starter. Faith

Or if he doesn't get there Papa will

One of the two of them need to hit
 
I'm really excited for Skal. I think Buddy could be the best shooter on the team and Ben could become a consistent shooting threat if he keeps it up. Willie might be the next Javale Mcgee or he could be something more. Maybe in 2 years I could see this team being good.
 
HndsmCelt said:
Yes and no. Draft picks are notoriously fickle. Some work out, some exceed expectations and others are T-Rob and Jimmer. More often than not I urge trading picks for known entities but since this year we are precluded from even dreaming of a top 3 pick we may do well to draft the guy we want to keep and hope he at least meets expectations.
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I can understand trading away a draft pick as part of a package to acquire a special player, but I don't understand the concept of thinking, that in general, an established player is better than a draft pick. Every established player in the league was drafted. Cousins was drafted! Lebron was drafted! To think that way is an admission that you have no faith in Kings management (Vlade) to make good choices. To my mind, that's not a good starting point.

In most cases, an established player is going to cost you somewhere above 8 to 10 mil a year. A draft pick is going to cost less, and, if you've made a mistake, your only wed to that mistake for two years with team options on the remaining years. If you make a good choice, you have a young player you can mold to your system on a very cheap salary for five years. Or you can have an Afflalo making 12 mil a year. (just an example)

As I said, I'm not against trading a draft pick under the right circumstances, but I don't like it as a general policy.
 
Suicide King said:
I think it shows that generally speaking we have a wide spectrum of fans here as opposed to the hive mind that permeates some other Kings related sites.

There is always optimism to be found along with negativity. Some just see one a little more often than the other.
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No one ever accomplished anything by thinking they couldn't. One negative person will bring down a room of positive people. Negativism is a cancer to success. Never in my short career did I go up to the plate thinking I couldn't get a hit. Anyone who does, has already struck out.
 
bajaden said:
No one ever accomplished anything by thinking they couldn't. One negative person will bring down a room of positive people. Negativism is a cancer to success. Never in my short career did I go up to the plate thinking I couldn't get a hit. Anyone who does, has already struck out.
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I am the latter. I'm not joking.
 
SLAB said:
Freakin' McBen looks like a better prospect than Hield. And I'm only being mildly hyperbolic.
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I think with Hield, the hope is that his big trouble is just adjusting to the speed of the NBA. One he does, hopefully he can get things going. We're still not sure what he can do in the NBA, so it's a mystery factor. With Ben, we've seen 4 years of him, and we do know what type of player he'll probably end up being: 3&D, with occasional cuts.
Even with Ben's 4 years in the NBA, his ceiling is still decently-high. If he can just put it all together mentally, he'd be a really good player.
So I don't see it as a slight to Hield for thinking that Ben looks like a better prospect. Let's hope Buddy can start rolling.
 
bajaden said:
No one ever accomplished anything by thinking they couldn't. One negative person will bring down a room of positive people. Negativism is a cancer to success. Never in my short career did I go up to the plate thinking I couldn't get a hit. Anyone who does, has already struck out.
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I can't tell if the negativism to Buddy is a backlash to Cousins or if I'm supposed to take it seriously? If it's the former, Hield has nothing to do with Cousins, or the trade, personally, and I don't see the point of tearing him down

I think he has the tools to be solid in time

Is this going to continue a section of fans mocking him on a play by play basis?
 
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