Stauskas' Handles???

[Rob Sonic]

3 years ago too.

Edit: don't know how to embed sorry

We've got a young Ginobli, possibly better given the right organization and players put around him. (wisful thinking)

Cousins and Gay should work extremely well with Nik and vice versa. If he starts he may well win ROY.
35 min/15 pts/3.5 rbs/4 ast

High hopes from this Mich native.

 

[CurseOfTheSalmons]

35 minutes lol

oh, why not? tyreke evans played 37 MPG...

 

[The Hammer]

Time for me to chime in.

I LOVE this pick. He's NBA ready, and the best shooter in the draft, with a great work ethic, and fantastic handles already. Good length, and not such a liability on the defensive end as some think. His work ethic alone provides a protection against that.

I don't care about figuring out who fits with who, how he can coexist with BMac... whatever. WE SUCK RIGHT NOW. We don't have those problems. We need players. Anyway, on a good team, he and Ben could easily co-exist, as Stauskas could swing to point for periods and they could be on the floor together. He's like a better shooting, not as good on D version of Christie. Hopefully the passing will develop.

I saw these videos weeks ago. I've been impressed ever since. Kids got smarts too.

 

[mac]

Time for me to chime in.

I LOVE this pick. He's NBA ready, and the best shooter in the draft, with a great work ethic, and fantastic handles already. Good length, and not such a liability on the defensive end as some think. His work ethic alone provides a protection against that.

I don't care about figuring out who fits with who, how he can coexist with BMac... whatever. WE SUCK RIGHT NOW. We don't have those problems. We need players. Anyway, on a good team, he and Ben could easily co-exist, as Stauskas could swing to point for periods and they could be on the floor together. He's like a better shooting, not as good on D version of Christie. Hopefully the passing will develop.

I saw these videos weeks ago. I've been impressed ever since. Kids got smarts too.

I think that's really the difference maker for me. That and that sort of arrogance/drive to succeed. Now I don't follow prospects, don't watch college games etc - and as such I don't want to pretend like I know what I'm talking about in comparing Nik and Ben. What I do know however, is that the FO and many analysts are saying many of the same things about Nik as they were about Ben. Possibly most NBA-ready, best shooter, prototypical SG. Nik's been praised for his ability to create his own shot and run the pick and roll while Ben was praised more for his athleticism. Just going off of that, I admit to being overly cautious in my enthusiasm.

Personally however I just have a gut feeling that Nik is going to turn out to be a good player for us while I don't have that much faith in Ben. Maybe it's because I'm impatient and Ben sucked his rookie season. Sometimes it's also just a feel you get from a person's intelligence. You can somehow tell that certain guys understand the game, understand how to get better and become great players just from listening to them speak. Either way, I honestly don't think keeping them both is a good idea. I think it's time that our young players develop not only by working on their individual games, but by gaining a different kind of experience that only comes from winning games. And unless you have Lebron James on your team, you don't win when your team still has major gaps in it. As such, I'm really hoping that we move Ben (seeing as we don't have many other assets I think it's realistic to assume Ben has to be one of the major pieces being moved) in order to improve our depth/ fill the weaknesses on our team. Let's move towards building a winner from this season - let our guys gain some experience from understanding how to play as a team and win games. We can't be sitting around waiting for our young guys to magically develop into seasoned talented veterans on a losing team.

 

[The Hammer]

I think that's really the difference maker for me. That and that sort of arrogance/drive to succeed. Now I don't follow prospects, don't watch college games etc - and as such I don't want to pretend like I know what I'm talking about in comparing Nik and Ben. What I do know however, is that the FO and many analysts are saying many of the same things about Nik as they were about Ben. Possibly most NBA-ready, best shooter, prototypical SG. Nik's been praised for his ability to create his own shot and run the pick and roll while Ben was praised more for his athleticism. Just going off of that, I admit to being overly cautious in my enthusiasm.

Personally however I just have a gut feeling that Nik is going to turn out to be a good player for us while I don't have that much faith in Ben. Maybe it's because I'm impatient and Ben sucked his rookie season. Sometimes it's also just a feel you get from a person's intelligence. You can somehow tell that certain guys understand the game, understand how to get better and become great players just from listening to them speak. Either way, I honestly don't think keeping them both is a good idea. I think it's time that our young players develop not only by working on their individual games, but by gaining a different kind of experience that only comes from winning games. And unless you have Lebron James on your team, you don't win when your team still has major gaps in it. As such, I'm really hoping that we move Ben (seeing as we don't have many other assets I think it's realistic to assume Ben has to be one of the major pieces being moved) in order to improve our depth/ fill the weaknesses on our team. Let's move towards building a winner from this season - let our guys gain some experience from understanding how to play as a team and win games. We can't be sitting around waiting for our young guys to magically develop into seasoned talented veterans on a losing team.

I would only consider trading Ben if it was involved in netting us a major player, and preferably near the trade deadline next year so we had a chance to see how he might develop. Obviously if it gets us Rondo, you do it. IT (sign and trade), Ben, JT/Landry for Rondo?

Other than something like that (or for a very good shotblocker/defensive big) I see no problem keeping the two for even a couple years. We need a backup SG anyway.

 

[Prog]

Here's another video:

Insane.

 

[Bricklayer]

I would only consider trading Ben if it was involved in netting us a major player, and preferably near the trade deadline next year so we had a chance to see how he might develop. Obviously if it gets us Rondo, you do it. IT (sign and trade), Ben, JT/Landry for Rondo?

Other than something like that (or for a very good shotblocker/defensive big) I see no problem keeping the two for even a couple years. We need a backup SG anyway.

You need something you can count on back there. A bunch of kids who just discovered they were growing hair in funny places half a dozen years ago is not that.

Cousins is entering his 5th year now. Anybody who thinks he, or especially his agent, would be cool with another sub-30 win season needs to seriously check themselves.

Gay is working on the last year of his contract. Anybody who thinks that winning sub-30 games again is going to convince him to return to a team what hasn't even won 30 games in 6 years needs to seriously check themselves.

As much as Stauskas seems to be a guy who should at least have a career, you just don't know and can't count on a rookie coming in. And you certainly can't count on what you are going to get out of Ben. Or Ray for that matter. You can't have a huge $$ frontcourt that needs to win now and risk hamstringing them with a toys for tots program in the backcourt. Having a few kids is cool, but we absolutely need some vets, quality vets that can be relied on for some low level average production if needed, to create a floor this year in the backcourt that we won't fall beneath. Then whatever kids are with them can excel, or not, without it scuttling the entire season for us.

 

[Prog]

Brick, anyone specific you have in mind for the backcourt? If you discussed it in another thread, I'd appreciate a link.

 

[Bricklayer]

Brick, anyone specific you have in mind for the backcourt? If you discussed it in another thread, I'd appreciate a link.

I've mentioned various names at various times, but there is no specific target. I'm not suggesting we have to go out and find James Harden or Russell Westbrook for out backcourt, just guys good enough to hold down the fort and then if the kids excel, they are the talent.

At SG that could mean something as minor as Thabo in case Stauskas' defensive struggles are as bad as feared. Or Jodie Meeks or Anthony Morrow to provide guaranteed shooting in case there are more struggles there from the kids. It could mean Avery Bradley, a bit of a combo guard (more than a bit), but a guy who plays with enough defensive intensity to make up for his size issues. I'm not talking All Stars here. Just some proven NBA types, specialized in areas we need, who we KNOW from years of NBA production can step up and fill in if the kids are struggling. And if the kids excel, they can settle back as useful reserve/roleplayers. But we need some low level guaranteed NBA production guys.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

3 years ago too.

Edit: don't know how to embed sorry

We've got a young Ginobli, possibly better given the right organization and players put around him. (wisful thinking)

Cousins and Gay should work extremely well with Nik and vice versa. If he starts he may well win ROY.
35 min/15 pts/3.5 rbs/4 ast

High hopes from this Mich native.

There was a Pete Maravich ball handling drills video that was released many years ago. I haven't seen anything of it for a long time,...but I do know that Nik is doing the same kind of ball handling work and drills that I saw on that video.

The young man is intensely focused on continuing to become an elite skillful player. Awesome to see. I have a really good feeling about him

 

[King Baller]

There was a Pete Maravich ball handling drills video that was released many years ago. I haven't seen anything of it for a long time,...but I do know that Nik is doing the same kind of ball handling work and drills that I saw on that video.

The young man is intensely focused on continuing to become an elite skillful player. Awesome to see. I have a really good feeling about him

Red and Pistol Pete:

 

[Reke]

I honestly think Nik is better than Ben.. Nik is more focused on his craft.. He has a crazy work ethic to get better at all aspects of his game.. I think this guy could be special.. I like the Manu Comparisons.. But i also think Ben will play alot better this year than last.. When you first come in the league, the game is SUPER FAST and its tough to adjust to it.. Ben will be fine his 2nd year.. Look for him to play the jamal crawford type role.. runnin ray allen type plays..

 

[kingsboi]

All these videos with Nik shooting in the rain and dribbling in the street is nice and all but let's settle down here and wait for some live game action, I'm looking forward to seeing how he plays in the summer league. I remember Tyreke gave us a nice preview of what was to come in the summer league his rookie year.

 

[Merdiesel]

I like the fire in this kid.

Between Cousins, IT and now Nik, theres enough competitive spirit to become contagious.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Here's another video:

Insane.

The most interesting thing to me about this video is comparing it to this shot chart:

It's clear that Stauskas highly prefers the left corner three to the right corner three. And if you watch that video, his backyard court does not have a right corner three - there's a retaining wall in the way.

I'm not saying that he can't develop a right corner three, but I do think that the preference is interesting given his childhood court.

 

[JB_kings]

All these videos with Nik shooting in the rain and dribbling in the street is nice and all but let's settle down here and wait for some live game action, I'm looking forward to seeing how he plays in the summer league. I remember Tyreke gave us a nice preview of what was to come in the summer league his rookie year.

Well this is live game action.

 

[bajaden]

3 years ago too.

Edit: don't know how to embed sorry

We've got a young Ginobli, possibly better given the right organization and players put around him. (wisful thinking)

Cousins and Gay should work extremely well with Nik and vice versa. If he starts he may well win ROY.
35 min/15 pts/3.5 rbs/4 ast

High hopes from this Mich native.

Well, one major thing I learned from that video is that there isn't much traffic on his street. Seriously, he's a good ballhandler. He's not Tryeke Evans, but he's certainly good enough to get the job done. There's another video of him dribbling with one hand while he bounces a tennis ball off the wall with the other hand. I'll see if I can find it.

 

[Rob Sonic]

I like the fire in this kid.

Between Cousins, IT and now Nik, theres enough competitive spirit to become contagious.

I followed this draft closer than any others as I expect it to be our last lottery pick. I didn't see any other a kid with the desire and work ethic that Stauskas had. This kid could be special, I can almost guarantee it. I was really high on Peyton and was a bit bummed we passed, but his shot would have been tougher to watch develop than Tyreke's. If we sign Livingston I am more than pleased with our backcourt.

 

[fursty13]

The most interesting thing to me about this video is comparing it to this shot chart:

It's clear that Stauskas highly prefers the left corner three to the right corner three. And if you watch that video, his backyard court does not have a right corner three - there's a retaining wall in the way.

I'm not saying that he can't develop a right corner three, but I do think that the preference is interesting given his childhood court.

In Michigan's offense, each position kinda has a "zone" where they start off. Beilein, the Michigan coach, knew Stauskas loved the left corner three, and that's where he started off each time in the half court set. Since he initiated the offense a ton in college, it should come as no surprise that the majority of his shots are left corner to the top of the key.

This doesn't mean that he's incapable of the right corner 3. Shooters are shooters, regardless of where they are on the court. I prefer this shot chart, instead
.

Also attached is a gif of Stauskas vs. Florida his freshman year. He went 6/6 from 3pt range in this game. All from the left side of the court. You're right in saying he prefers the left side of the floor, but he's not limited in terms of where he shoots from.

 

[bajaden]

I think that's really the difference maker for me. That and that sort of arrogance/drive to succeed. Now I don't follow prospects, don't watch college games etc - and as such I don't want to pretend like I know what I'm talking about in comparing Nik and Ben. What I do know however, is that the FO and many analysts are saying many of the same things about Nik as they were about Ben. Possibly most NBA-ready, best shooter, prototypical SG. Nik's been praised for his ability to create his own shot and run the pick and roll while Ben was praised more for his athleticism. Just going off of that, I admit to being overly cautious in my enthusiasm.

Personally however I just have a gut feeling that Nik is going to turn out to be a good player for us while I don't have that much faith in Ben. Maybe it's because I'm impatient and Ben sucked his rookie season. Sometimes it's also just a feel you get from a person's intelligence. You can somehow tell that certain guys understand the game, understand how to get better and become great players just from listening to them speak. Either way, I honestly don't think keeping them both is a good idea. I think it's time that our young players develop not only by working on their individual games, but by gaining a different kind of experience that only comes from winning games. And unless you have Lebron James on your team, you don't win when your team still has major gaps in it. As such, I'm really hoping that we move Ben (seeing as we don't have many other assets I think it's realistic to assume Ben has to be one of the major pieces being moved) in order to improve our depth/ fill the weaknesses on our team. Let's move towards building a winner from this season - let our guys gain some experience from understanding how to play as a team and win games. We can't be sitting around waiting for our young guys to magically develop into seasoned talented veterans on a losing team.

I think anyone that actually watched McLemore play at Kansas, and by watched, I mean 5 or more games, preferly 10 or more, knew that he was very raw in some areas. That didn't take away from his upside, it just meant it was going to take a little while to get the player you thought he could be. I knew his ballhandling needed work. Turns out it needed more work than I thought. However, I still think he'll turn out to be a contributing player for us. How good I don't know. Up to him.

Stauskas is an entirely different player. And the major difference, other than having a more advanced skill set, is between the ears. When Ben goes up to take a shot, he hopes it goes in. When Nik goes up to take a shot, he knows it's going in. Everything with Stauskas is automatic. He see's the open man and makes the pass. You give him some daylight, and the shot is off. He makes instant decisions that are instinctive, where Ben still has to think about what he's doing, and he's going at warp speed while he's thinking.

I think Ben is still in his grateful to be an NBA player mode. I grew up two blocks from where McLemore grew up. That neighborhood was horrible then. I can only imagine what its like now. So Ben wants to prove he belongs in the NBA. Stauskas wants to prove he's going to be a star. Just two different mentalities, and when all things are equal, its the mind set that usually separates the great from the good.

 

[Rob Sonic]

Well, one major thing I learned from that video is that there isn't much traffic on his street. Seriously, he's a good ballhandler. He's not Tryeke Evans, but he's certainly good enough to get the job done. There's another video of him dribbling with one hand while he bounces a tennis ball off the wall with the other hand. I'll see if I can find it.

And to think his ball handling will only get better!

No more college classes and much more time to focus on basketball. I know you've followed Stauskas plenty this year and I am happy that you're happy.

 

[Prog]

At SG that could mean something as minor as Thabo in case Stauskas' defensive struggles are as bad as feared. Or Jodie Meeks or Anthony Morrow to provide guaranteed shooting in case there are more struggles there from the kids. It could mean Avery Bradley, a bit of a combo guard (more than a bit), but a guy who plays with enough defensive intensity to make up for his size issues. I'm not talking All Stars here. Just some proven NBA types, specialized in areas we need, who we KNOW from years of NBA production can step up and fill in if the kids are struggling. And if the kids excel, they can settle back as useful reserve/roleplayers. But we need some low level guaranteed NBA production guys.

Makes a lot of sense, and all players I personally like (Bradley is my favorite, but I think the Celtics overestimate his market worth, so probably not likely to be traded to the Kings).

I think comparing the rookie years of these players is interesting:

Source: http://bkref.com/tiny/MF58U

Ben is 2 or 3 years younger than the others (except Bradley) and the gap isn't one that's impossible to close. I wouldn't give up so quickly on him, but for sure it would be nice to have a veteran SG to fall back on if he doesn't improve.

I would give Nik significant minutes even if he struggles, because we need to develop him and because, at the very least, he should be able to contribute as a spot up shooter (even if he can potentially bring to the table so much more).

 

[Sac.Kings]

I think anyone that actually watched McLemore play at Kansas, and by watched, I mean 5 or more games, preferly 10 or more, knew that he was very raw in some areas. That didn't take away from his upside, it just meant it was going to take a little while to get the player you thought he could be. I knew his ballhandling needed work. Turns out it needed more work than I thought. However, I still think he'll turn out to be a contributing player for us. How good I don't know. Up to him.

Stauskas is an entirely different player. And the major difference, other than having a more advanced skill set, is between the ears. When Ben goes up to take a shot, he hopes it goes in. When Nik goes up to take a shot, he knows it's going in. Everything with Stauskas is automatic. He see's the open man and makes the pass. You give him some daylight, and the shot is off. He makes instant decisions that are instinctive, where Ben still has to think about what he's doing, and he's going at warp speed while he's thinking.

I think Ben is still in his grateful to be an NBA player mode. I grew up two blocks from where McLemore grew up. That neighborhood was horrible then. I can only imagine what its like now. So Ben wants to prove he belongs in the NBA. Stauskas wants to prove he's going to be a star. Just two different mentalities, and when all things are equal, its the mind set that usually separates the great from the good.

This is the main reason why I like Nik as our pick. Too long we have been drafting players or signing players with low BBIQ (Tyreke, Donte Green, McLemore, JT to an extent, Whiteside, among others). Sometimes, in order to play smart, you need smart players.

 

[bajaden]

You need something you can count on back there. A bunch of kids who just discovered they were growing hair in funny places half a dozen years ago is not that.

Cousins is entering his 5th year now. Anybody who thinks he, or especially his agent, would be cool with another sub-30 win season needs to seriously check themselves.

Gay is working on the last year of his contract. Anybody who thinks that winning sub-30 games again is going to convince him to return to a team what hasn't even won 30 games in 6 years needs to seriously check themselves.

As much as Stauskas seems to be a guy who should at least have a career, you just don't know and can't count on a rookie coming in. And you certainly can't count on what you are going to get out of Ben. Or Ray for that matter. You can't have a huge $$ frontcourt that needs to win now and risk hamstringing them with a toys for tots program in the backcourt. Having a few kids is cool, but we absolutely need some vets, quality vets that can be relied on for some low level average production if needed, to create a floor this year in the backcourt that we won't fall beneath. Then whatever kids are with them can excel, or not, without it scuttling the entire season for us.

In general I agree with you. I guess I'm nit picking here, but more than having some vets, I think we need at least one difference making vet. As PDA said in a video I saw when asked about trading the 8th pick for a vet, he asked who? He said last season we had vets on the team, and we won 28 games. The answer of course is that they were the wrong vets. The problem with the team isn't Cousins, or Gay and the money their making. And its not McLemore, McCallum or Stauskas. to my mind the immediate problem is Landry, Thompson, Williams, and Outlaw. Three of which would certainly be considered vets. Those four combined make $22,467,366.00. Just what did we get for that 22.5 million dollars? Basically zippo! To make matters worse, both Williams and Landry were self inflicted wounds. I could include Evans, but he only made 1.5 mil, and one could argue he easily earned his salary. Hopefully PDA and find a way to make a silk purse out of a cows ear.

 

[bajaden]

I've mentioned various names at various times, but there is no specific target. I'm not suggesting we have to go out and find James Harden or Russell Westbrook for out backcourt, just guys good enough to hold down the fort and then if the kids excel, they are the talent.

At SG that could mean something as minor as Thabo in case Stauskas' defensive struggles are as bad as feared. Or Jodie Meeks or Anthony Morrow to provide guaranteed shooting in case there are more struggles there from the kids. It could mean Avery Bradley, a bit of a combo guard (more than a bit), but a guy who plays with enough defensive intensity to make up for his size issues. I'm not talking All Stars here. Just some proven NBA types, specialized in areas we need, who we KNOW from years of NBA production can step up and fill in if the kids are struggling. And if the kids excel, they can settle back as useful reserve/roleplayers. But we need some low level guaranteed NBA production guys.

Based on the draft, I'm wondering if either Dragic or Bledsoe are available. Less anyone noticed, the Suns drafted Tyler Ennis with one of their late first round picks. I thought at the time that it was a strange pick considering that they already have, potentially, two starting PG's on their roster. So I see a little smoke there. Don't know if the Kings are involved in talks with them or not, but there were a couple of rumors about the Kings and Bledsoe prior to the draft. Anyway, food for thought.....

 

[bajaden]

All these videos with Nik shooting in the rain and dribbling in the street is nice and all but let's settle down here and wait for some live game action, I'm looking forward to seeing how he plays in the summer league. I remember Tyreke gave us a nice preview of what was to come in the summer league his rookie year.

Well I've seen him play in real games at least 30 times over the last two years. Trust me, he's the real deal. Doesn't mean he won't take his lumps here and there, but I think everyone is going to love this kid.

 

[bajaden]

In Michigan's offense, each position kinda has a "zone" where they start off. Beilein, the Michigan coach, knew Stauskas loved the left corner three, and that's where he started off each time in the half court set. Since he initiated the offense a ton in college, it should come as no surprise that the majority of his shots are left corner to the top of the key.

This doesn't mean that he's incapable of the right corner 3. Shooters are shooters, regardless of where they are on the court. I prefer this shot chart, instead
.View attachment 4901

Also attached is a gif of Stauskas vs. Florida his freshman year. He went 6/6 from 3pt range in this game. All from the left side of the court. You're right in saying he prefers the left side of the floor, but he's not limited in terms of where he shoots from.

I agree with you about how Michigan started every half court set. Also as a result of that set, most of Stauskas shots coming off a pick were with him moving left to right. However, I did see him hit shots moving from right to left, and as you said, spot up's from the right corner. I'm not really sure if his setting up in the left corner had to do with his preference, or just a result of how Michigan ran their half court sets

 

[bajaden]

And to think his ball handling will only get better!

No more college classes and much more time to focus on basketball. I know you've followed Stauskas plenty this year and I am happy that you're happy.

I was a happy man draft night. Other than some obvious choices that went in the top 4 or 5 picks, Stauskas was my choice. I liked Payton if we were determined to pick a PG, but I just thought that Nik brought more to the table overall. He has to get stronger though. The NBA is a lot more physical than college. He did a good job of drawing fouls in college, and added strength should help him do that in the NBA. He should be able to make money at the line. He's an 80 plus percent freethrow shooter.

 

[Bricklayer]

Based on the draft, I'm wondering if either Dragic or Bledsoe are available. Less anyone noticed, the Suns drafted Tyler Ennis with one of their late first round picks. I thought at the time that it was a strange pick considering that they already have, potentially, two starting PG's on their roster. So I see a little smoke there. Don't know if the Kings are involved in talks with them or not, but there were a couple of rumors about the Kings and Bledsoe prior to the draft. Anyway, food for thought.....

And another rumor about us asking about Dragic as well.

As I said elsewhere, its not impossible we are serious about "PG with size, who might be able to defend a little". Now not all the names we've been associated with have exactly been great distributors, but the rest of the description seems to fit just about everybody we've been mentioned with.

 

[Bricklayer]

Makes a lot of sense, and all players I personally like (Bradley is my favorite, but I think the Celtics overestimate his market worth, so probably not likely to be traded to the Kings).

I think comparing the rookie years of these players is interesting:

Source: http://bkref.com/tiny/MF58U

Ben is 2 or 3 years younger than the others (except Bradley) and the gap isn't one that's impossible to close. I wouldn't give up so quickly on him, but for sure it would be nice to have a veteran SG to fall back on if he doesn't improve.

I would give Nik significant minutes even if he struggles, because we need to develop him and because, at the very least, he should be able to contribute as a spot up shooter (even if he can potentially bring to the table so much more).

The thing there though....Ben is comparing as a rookie to two defensive specialists and two minor roleplayers. So all you can say from that is that well maybe Ben can be a minor roleplayer. but as I used to say with Jimmer, so what? you don't sit around and wait on kids to become ooh! roleplayer! You can sign roleplayers every year in free agency. Pretty much you wait on kids who can be stars or specialized starters (rim protector etc.). Otherwise you may keep them, you may not, but there is no compulsion whatsoever to pass on deals that can help the team just so that one day, a couple of years from now, that kid is going to grow up and average 12ppg! Woot!