Start of College Basketball season:

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#31
I watched Poeltl last year and I can away impressed. He is going to be a hand full.
I'm a big fan of Poeltl. He's one of the best natural rebounders I've seen. Most of the time he's boxing out before - that's right, before - the shot goes up. He sees a guy go into a shooting motion and, bam! goes to box out. Just about everything else looks to play pretty well at the NBA level - size, strength, post offense, post D...he may never have a 20 foot jumper, but I think he's a starting C for a long time.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#32
I'm a big fan of Poeltl. He's one of the best natural rebounders I've seen. Most of the time he's boxing out before - that's right, before - the shot goes up. He sees a guy go into a shooting motion and, bam! goes to box out. Just about everything else looks to play pretty well at the NBA level - size, strength, post offense, post D...he may never have a 20 foot jumper, but I think he's a starting C for a long time.
Yep, so far so good. I've seen him play a few times so far this year and except for on game, he played very well. Mostly a post guy right now, but very crafty and as you said, a very good rebounder, and a better shotblocker than Cuz. At least at the college level. He struggled against Wichita St., but that was because Wichita St. did an excellent job of denying him the ball, and his guards didn't do a good job of getting him the ball. That aside, once he got the ball in the post, he was virtually unstoppable. Don't know about top five just yet. Too early to make that call. But he's certainly in the runnng.
 
#33
With Isaiah Briscoe out, Jamal Murray was given more opportunities to handle vs Lousiville...I don't think he's a PG at all.

Hes a SG who can handle the ball. D'angelo Russell was a much better comboguard coming out of college. Russell was 6-5 185? Murray is 6-5 205lbs.

I think he may need to slim down a bit in order to increase his quickness.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#34
With Isaiah Briscoe out, Jamal Murray was given more opportunities to handle vs Lousiville...I don't think he's a PG at all.

Hes a SG who can handle the ball. D'angelo Russell was a much better comboguard coming out of college. Russell was 6-5 185? Murray is 6-5 205lbs.

I think he may need to slim down a bit in order to increase his quickness.
I would never compare Russell to Murray. Two entirely different players. The only thing they have in common is size, and the fact that both are average athlete's. But your right in saying that Murray is a SG with PG skills, while Russell is a PG with the ability to play the SG positon if necessary. Other than that, two different mentalities, and two different aggressive nature's. I would compare Murray more to a less athletic Harden. I have no idea if he'll ever reach that level of play, but I was a big Harden fan when he was Arizona St., and Murray reminds me of him. Of course Harden had Carte Blanche in college and Murray doesn't at Kentucky. But both players have that confidence about them. Murray is definitely a lottery pick, and a possible top five pick. At least up to now.

A player I find fascinating is Cal's Jaylen Brown. He's such an electric athlete, but so far his athleticism hasn't added up to expectations, or team success. Cal still has a lot of time left to jell, but they should be better than they are. Of late Rabb is playing better. I wish Montgomery was still the coach.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#35
For those of you that get the SEC channel, Kentucky vr's Louisville is always a competitive matchup. Wouldn't surprise me to see Louisville beat Kentucky. On paper Kentucky is the better team, but they haven't put it altogether yet. Kentucky misses that big inside presence, and Labissiere isn't it so far.
 
#36
I would never compare Russell to Murray. Two entirely different players. The only thing they have in common is size, and the fact that both are average athlete's. But your right in saying that Murray is a SG with PG skills, while Russell is a PG with the ability to play the SG positon if necessary. Other than that, two different mentalities, and two different aggressive nature's. I would compare Murray more to a less athletic Harden. I have no idea if he'll ever reach that level of play, but I was a big Harden fan when he was Arizona St., and Murray reminds me of him. Of course Harden had Carte Blanche in college and Murray doesn't at Kentucky. But both players have that confidence about them. Murray is definitely a lottery pick, and a possible top five pick. At least up to now.

A player I find fascinating is Cal's Jaylen Brown. He's such an electric athlete, but so far his athleticism hasn't added up to expectations, or team success. Cal still has a lot of time left to jell, but they should be better than they are. Of late Rabb is playing better. I wish Montgomery was still the coach.
I'd like to see Murray a hit more aggressive at the rim. There's been a few times where he drives while keeping his head down, and just throws up a floater or a layup. His lack of quickness is the only thing stopping him from looking erratic and out of control when he does that lol. So it does help him in that sense of body control. Even though he makes a lot of it, I don't think that'll work vs. the next level.

I wouldn't mind drafting Ulis in the 2nd round. He's a backup PG that cam do a bit of everything. Very quick and good shooting the ball.

I really like Jaylen Brown, but I think he'll need more development than the Kings are capable of. To think if we drafted Zingers, he'd look like a huge bust who gets 11mins a game and gets taken out after a foul or mistake.

I don't know if the kings can afford to draft a project in the lotto(if we make it). Ingram and internationals prospects might be the only exception.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#37
I'm going to withhold judgement for a while on most of the prospects. A lot depends on their skill level, and is the system they're in helping or hurting them. Very few knew what Kevin Johnson was capable of because of his coach at Cal. He was forced to play a walk it up the court, half court game. But if you watched enough of their games, every once in a while Johnson would throw everything to the wind and just blow up the court and explode to the basket. If you wern't watching that game, you didn't know. So the more information I have, the better the judgement. right now, I'm not even close. I've probably seen Kentucky play more than any other team, but that's because their on TV all the time. Like today.

There are players that won't be as big a project as others. Players like Dunn. I'd like a player like Ron Baker of Wichita St. as a 2nd round pick. I like Danuel House of Texas A&M. Damian James of Vanderbilt. I don't look at Jakob Poeltl as a big project. He has a skill set that could help right away. I like what I've seen out of Henry Ellenson from Marquette. Very skilled big man. However, in general, I agree with you. I'm tired of projects. But that's the nature of the draft. If you approach the draft as a provider of the future and not the now, I think your fine. We as Kings fans have expected our draft picks to come in and be the saviors of the team. As a result we have no patience, and too often, they're put into positions of responsibility that they're not ready for.
 
#38
I'm going to withhold judgement for a while on most of the prospects. A lot depends on their skill level, and is the system they're in helping or hurting them. Very few knew what Kevin Johnson was capable of because of his coach at Cal. He was forced to play a walk it up the court, half court game. But if you watched enough of their games, every once in a while Johnson would throw everything to the wind and just blow up the court and explode to the basket. If you wern't watching that game, you didn't know. So the more information I have, the better the judgement. right now, I'm not even close. I've probably seen Kentucky play more than any other team, but that's because their on TV all the time. Like today.

There are players that won't be as big a project as others. Players like Dunn. I'd like a player like Ron Baker of Wichita St. as a 2nd round pick. I like Danuel House of Texas A&M. Damian James of Vanderbilt. I don't look at Jakob Poeltl as a big project. He has a skill set that could help right away. I like what I've seen out of Henry Ellenson from Marquette. Very skilled big man. However, in general, I agree with you. I'm tired of projects. But that's the nature of the draft. If you approach the draft as a provider of the future and not the now, I think your fine. We as Kings fans have expected our draft picks to come in and be the saviors of the team. As a result we have no patience, and too often, they're put into positions of responsibility that they're not ready for.
Any initial thoughts on the overall strength of this coming draft class? Or perhaps the one after? I don't watch much NCAA, and I'm hearing this coming class is weak while the next is strong, but I wanted to hear it from the mouth of our resident scout.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#39
Any initial thoughts on the overall strength of this coming draft class? Or perhaps the one after? I don't watch much NCAA, and I'm hearing this coming class is weak while the next is strong, but I wanted to hear it from the mouth of our resident scout.
The general consensus is that the coming class (2016) is a weaker class than last years, but not necessarily a weak class, if that makes sense to you. The 2017 class is considered on a par with the 2015 class. Now of course that's on paper. So far, and it's just my opinion, there is only one for sure, can't miss player in the coming draft and that's Ben Simmons. That's not to say that a few other players won't rise to that level. After Simmons there are quite a few players that I think will be very good NBA players, and maybe a few will be stars. Like last years draft, the quality in the draft goes fairly deep. So in short, it's not a bad draft. There's a lot of talent in it, but it doesn't have four or five players at the top that could all be considered can't miss players.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#40
Finally got a look at Ben Simmons and it looks like he is everything he's cracked up to be. The only thing missing is the jumpshot. Has a great motor, smooth and easy athleticism and unthinkable body control. Gets to the rim, draws fouls. Has a good handle, good court vision, he's a very good passer. Crashes the boards hard. He has literally everything but a jumpshot. Barring a devastating injury or a murder conviction, he's going #1.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#41
Finally got a look at Ben Simmons and it looks like he is everything he's cracked up to be. The only thing missing is the jumpshot. Has a great motor, smooth and easy athleticism and unthinkable body control. Gets to the rim, draws fouls. Has a good handle, good court vision, he's a very good passer. Crashes the boards hard. He has literally everything but a jumpshot. Barring a devastating injury or a murder conviction, he's going #1.
Yep, that's the only knock on him, but to his credit, he knows he's not a good outside shooter, so he doesn't take them. I think he's taken 3 three point shots all season. Lest anyone forget, Lebron wasn't a good shooter coming into the league either. If he can develop a decent to good jumper, you might have a superstar on your hands.
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#42
unreal game between Kansas and Oklahoma. 3 OT!! Buddy Hield had himself a hell of a game...46 points. Brice Johnson with 39 and 23 for North Carolina, where the hell did that come from?
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#44
Buddy Hield... he's a winner, despite his TOs late.

5-8 from 2pt
8-15 from 3pt
12-14 from FT
8rebs
7asts
46pts
That shouldn't have been a turnover. The inbounder is supposed to have three feet of clearance to inbound the ball, and Hield didn't have that. It should have been a violation. But, that's life in college basketball. Funny, I just did a post in the players to watch in 2016 about Hield a few days ago. Timing is everything.
 
#45
That shouldn't have been a turnover. The inbounder is supposed to have three feet of clearance to inbound the ball, and Hield didn't have that. It should have been a violation. But, that's life in college basketball. Funny, I just did a post in the players to watch in 2016 about Hield a few days ago. Timing is everything.
I think he goes late lotto-end of 1st. While DX guys are really good, it blows my mind how long they had him in the 2nd before putting him in the 1st.

While he's a great college player, I really wonder how his game projects to the next level.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#46
I think he goes late lotto-end of 1st. While DX guys are really good, it blows my mind how long they had him in the 2nd before putting him in the 1st.

While he's a great college player, I really wonder how his game projects to the next level.
I think they had him in the 2nd round due to how he had played up till this year. As I said in my write up, I always felt that if he could be more selective with his shots, and let the game come to him more, he could be a very good player. And so far this year, he's really cut down on his forced shots. I think his game translates to the NBA. He's a good enough ball handler and plays good defense at the college level. He has the athleticism. The only knock on him now is his age, which isn't a big deal to me. I've never figured out why it's a big deal to some of the NBA teams. He's definitely a first round pick in my opinion, and as I stated, if he were to fall into the second round, someone is going to get a steal.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#47
Got my very first look at Purdue's A.J. Hammons tonight (game vs. Michigan a few days ago). Kind of surprising I'd never caught him considering he's a senior. He never seems to break the mid-30s in the mocks, but I don't get why. Sure, he's not super athletic, but despite that he's a great shotblocker based on timing and with his size and skill he's unstoppable in the post. He probably needs to drop a bit of weight, but at worst he looks like a solid backup C, and that low-end is only because of his mediocre conditioning/athleticism.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#48
Got my very first look at Purdue's A.J. Hammons tonight (game vs. Michigan a few days ago). Kind of surprising I'd never caught him considering he's a senior. He never seems to break the mid-30s in the mocks, but I don't get why. Sure, he's not super athletic, but despite that he's a great shotblocker based on timing and with his size and skill he's unstoppable in the post. He probably needs to drop a bit of weight, but at worst he looks like a solid backup C, and that low-end is only because of his mediocre conditioning/athleticism.
Been following Hammons since he entered college, and he's a player that will drive you nuts. He'll have a game where you think your looking at a top five pick in the draft, and then he'll follow it with a game were he seems disinterested or bored and appears to be going through the motions. He has great size, and is skilled, and if he would apply himself consistently, he would be a lottery pick, and perhaps a top five pick. But because of his Dr. Jeckell and Mr. Hyde personality, he'll probably be a low first round, or even a second round pick.
 
#49
I'm having a tough time figuring out Wade Baldwin.. He doesn't really excel at any one thing. I also feels like he's not entirely focused at times... it's a bit like mental lapses, but I'm not sure where they come from.. am I the only one seeing this? There's been a lot of ball watching, stillness, and lack of movement off the ball.

I think if he had the aggression and focus of McCallum, he'd be a lotto pick.

I don't know about him as an overall prospect. It's a bit weird to see a guard have these mental lapses. It's much more common in bigs.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#50
I'm having a tough time figuring out Wade Baldwin.. He doesn't really excel at any one thing. I also feels like he's not entirely focused at times... it's a bit like mental lapses, but I'm not sure where they come from.. am I the only one seeing this? There's been a lot of ball watching, stillness, and lack of movement off the ball.

I think if he had the aggression and focus of McCallum, he'd be a lotto pick.

I don't know about him as an overall prospect. It's a bit weird to see a guard have these mental lapses. It's much more common in bigs.
I have Baldwin ranked as my third best PG in the next draft, if indeed he declares. Remember, he was hardly recruited coming out of highschool and played SG in highschool. So he's basically learning how to play the PG position, and to my mind, he's doing a very good job. So far through his freshman year, and this year, he's shooting the ball very well from the outside. I haven't looked at his stats recently, but he was around 47/48% overall, and a little over 40% from the three. Not a lot of people have heard about Baldwin outside of weird people like me or you because Vandy doesn't get a lot of national press like Kentucky or Duke etc. I sort of stumbled onto him because of watching Damian Jones, who I like quite a bit.

I think Baldwin has a lot of potential (there's that word again). He has good size for a PG, and he has a huge wingspan. While he's not a great athlete, he's a good athlete, and if you watch him on defense, he has excellent anticipation and lateral quickness to go along with very good instincts. I think he needs to improve his ballhandling a little, and get a bit stronger. He has a good frame and could easily carry another 10 pounds of muscle. He's definitely a first round pick. Not bad for a player that was a stones throw from being a walk on. I have him going somewhere between the middle of the first round and the 25th spot. If Vandy makes a big splash in the tournament, he could go higher, which wouldn't surprise me.
 
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bajaden

Hall of Famer
#51
After re-reading what I wrote about Baldwin, I want to make sure I'm not misunderstood when I said he needed to improve his ballhandling a little. By no means am I saying he's a bad ballhandler. Just that he's not an elite ballhandler. And by 10 pounds of muscle, I mean turning a little of his body fat into muscle. By the way, most people don't know that he played on the same highschool team with Karl Anthony Towns.
 
#52
Jarrod Uthoff.....not sure what to make of the guy.

Watched him earlier vs. Norte Dame. Thought he was a very nice college player, didn't make much out of him for the NBA. Then I watched him dominate vs. Iowa St?
Then I watched the MSU games where he was OK.
Today? Dominates Purdue like he did a few weeks ago...

Initially, he was in my camp of guys who would be good for international ball, however, now, I wouldn't mind taking him with a mid 2nd rounder.

Admittedly, I've only watched 6-7 Iowa games, and most of the time it was for the opposing team.. him averaging 3.1blks a game is eye popping.

He doesn't nearly have the frame to guard NBA PFs, but he has the athletic ability to become a decent weakside blocker. He also has a good handle for a big man and does a great job creating his own shots when needed. Elite 3pt shooter as well.

Can anyone tell me what to make of him?
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#53
Jarrod Uthoff.....not sure what to make of the guy.

Watched him earlier vs. Norte Dame. Thought he was a very nice college player, didn't make much out of him for the NBA. Then I watched him dominate vs. Iowa St?
Then I watched the MSU games where he was OK.
Today? Dominates Purdue like he did a few weeks ago...

Initially, he was in my camp of guys who would be good for international ball, however, now, I wouldn't mind taking him with a mid 2nd rounder.

Admittedly, I've only watched 6-7 Iowa games, and most of the time it was for the opposing team.. him averaging 3.1blks a game is eye popping.

He doesn't nearly have the frame to guard NBA PFs, but he has the athletic ability to become a decent weakside blocker. He also has a good handle for a big man and does a great job creating his own shots when needed. Elite 3pt shooter as well.

Can anyone tell me what to make of him?
The question is, what is he. Is he a PF or a SF. If a PF then he's a stretch four because he can really shoot the ball. Most of his shots are three point shot. He basically has little to no game at the basket in the conventional sense. Defensively, I agree that he's a weakside help defender at best, but isn't capable of matching up with the typical NBA PF. At least not now. It's interesting that Iowa, maybe the best team in their division, record wise (they've yet to play Maryland) and one of the best, win/loss records in college, is a very small team. The simply out shoot you on a regular basis. After Woodbury, a 7 foot take up space center, Uthoff, and Uhl, both 6'9", are the tallest players on the team, and both players are mostly perimeter players.

I don't know if Uthoff is athletic enough to play SF in the NBA. His handles are good enough, and Iowa overall is a pretty good defensive team. I want to see them play a good team with some size.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#55
With Simmons, I think it's a little of both. I'm not a big fan of the coaching at LSU, but bear in mind that Simmons though very skilled offensively, is very very unselfish. Think of him as a 6'10" Rondo. I exaggerate of course, but that's the degree to which he's unselfish at times. I've seen him pass up open layups to make a pass to one of his teammates. He needs to find more balance in his game, and once in the NBA I think that will happen. I agree with you on Hield. I see him late lottery, maybe mid lottery depending on the needs of the teams drafting. I keep waiting for him to falter, but so far, he's holding steady.
 
#56
Almost mid-way through the season and it seems like Karl may be gone before ASB. This only increases our chances of being a lotto team..yet...again. Here are a few players Kings fans should be looking at. These are the best top 10 players who'd provide a huge need for the team(in order by overall rankings)
  1. Brandon Ingram SF
  2. Jaylen Brown SF
  3. Kris Dunn PG
  4. Buddy Hield SG
  5. Jamal Murray SG
  6. Denzel Valentine SF/SG
  7. Demetrius Jackson PG
  8. Gary Payton II PG
  9. Grayson Allen SG
  10. Taurean Prince SF
No surprise that a lot of these guys are perimeter players..

Top 5 PGs:
  1. Kris Dunn
  2. Demetrius Jackson
  3. Dejounte Murray
  4. Gary Payton II
  5. Melo Trimble
Top 5 SGs:
  1. Buddy Hield
  2. Josh Hart
  3. Grayson Allen
  4. Jamal Murray
  5. Caris Levert(PG likely)
Top 5 SFs:
  1. Brandon Ingram
  2. Jaylen Brown
  3. Tauren Prince
  4. Dorian-Finney Smith
  5. Denzel Valentine
My rankings probably won't change a lot by the end of March Madness. The only players I'm on the fence about is Wade Baldwin and the backcourt duo from Florida St.

Just a personal note, I'm still a big believer in Ben, so my SG list was based on guys who could come right away and contribute day 1. None of those SGs have a higher overall ceiling than Ben. Murray's lack of athleticism and quickness will hurt him on defense. LeVert is difficult to evaluate for the pros since he's already suffered multiple injuries in college. Hield is only 3 months younger than Ben, and his defense will only be average at best.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#57
Almost mid-way through the season and it seems like Karl may be gone before ASB. This only increases our chances of being a lotto team..yet...again. Here are a few players Kings fans should be looking at. These are the best top 10 players who'd provide a huge need for the team(in order by overall rankings)
  1. Brandon Ingram SF
  2. Jaylen Brown SF
  3. Kris Dunn PG
  4. Buddy Hield SG
  5. Jamal Murray SG
  6. Denzel Valentine SF/SG
  7. Demetrius Jackson PG
  8. Gary Payton II PG
  9. Grayson Allen SG
  10. Taurean Prince SF
Not a fan of Ben Simmons, I gather?
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#60
I really like Tyler Ulis...he is going to be solid.
I like Ulis as well, but he has a size problem at 5'9". He's a little unusual for a diminutive PG, in that he's more of a pass first PG. Very good defender despite his size. Just not sure how that's going to translate to the NBA. Decent to good athlete, but not blessed with freak athleticism