SF Woes: What to do?

[NoBonus]

I think the Salmons/Evans/Thornton thought process goes like this:

1. Get the ball.
2. Begin dribbling, dribble in place for about 5-10 seconds.
3. Look for open shot and take it.
4. If no open shot, attempt some kind of fancy juke/fake to get open.
5. If unsuccessful, back up and shoot a long bomb.
6. If long bomb not available, drive for improbable layup.
7. If, in mid-air during improbable layup, you get turned around or if there are three defenders in the air with you in front of the rim, pass the ball.
8. If pass not available, attempt impossible shot and fall down.
9. If no call, gripe to ref and slowly jog down the court on defense and immediately foul someone. If impossible shot falls and/or you are fouled, get pumped and point to someone in the crowd/bench.
10. Repeat this process 10-25 times per game.

 

[Fear the Putin]

Can we just get rid of ALL of our SF's and do anything possible to snatch AK47?

If we were to only have AK and Honeycutt as our SF's, I would be more happy than having a plethora of SF crap that we have right now

 

[Kingster]

Way to premature to come to a conclusion about Salmons and Outlaw. I think they should be fine. That, to me, is the least of our worries.

 

[Bricklayer]

Way to premature to come to a conclusion about Salmons and Outlaw. I think they should be fine. That, to me, is the least of our worries.

To the contrary, we've been hurt at that position, badly, in the first two games. Which was the same hole we had last year. Just getting nothing out of our SFs. And it would be fine if we were just getting nothing offensively out of them, but the problem is they are not stopping their guys either. That's what takes the position into one of the worst SF crews in the NBA thus far. Defensive roleplayers who produce little but hold the other team down would be fine. First couple of games however they've been rocked. We're batting about 50% on Reke/Thornton/Chuck's defense, and Cousins has been a young sloppy factor in both games. We're batting 0% thus far at SF.

 

[NoBonus]

To the contrary, we've been hurt at that position, badly, in the first two games. Which was the same hole we had last year. Just getting nothing out of our SFs. And it would be fine if we were just getting nothing offensively out of them, but the problem is they are not stopping their guys either. That's what takes the position into one of the worst SF crews in the NBA thus far. Defensive roleplayers who produce little but hold the other team down would be fine. First couple of games however they've been rocked. We're batting about 50% on Reke/Thornton/Chuck's defense, and Cousins has been a young sloppy factor in both games. We're batting 0% thus far at SF.

I think if the Kings thought they were set on the SF position, they wouldn't have extended an offer to AK47 or picked up Outlaw.

 

[Glenn]

I can't avoid this subject as much as I'd like to. I really hope this complaining is premature. Two games with guys unfamiliar with their teammates is a recipe for disaster. In their confusion they will revert to what they are the most familiar.

Immediately jumping to Salmons.

I was expecting good things out of John. It's not that I was thrilled with his play with Kings a few years ago but because the FO wanted him. I figured he'd changed or at least hoped so. Well, John is John. He can play offense and defense but doesn't involve the rest of the team. He appearss to be the same black hole as before but given his unfamiliarity with hs teammates, I'll cut him some slack for awhile. I like him better than what we had last year which is faint praise. Very faint.

Outlaw is a financial bargain and a vet. This is probably why we acquired him and I don't fault that. Travis' stats are a flat line of mediocrity across the board. He's athletic, a vet, and a small salary but just the same is he THAT much better tham Cisco or Donte?

Please no trades. We don't know what we have yet except it isn't enough. A trade merely gets us similar quality for what we give up unless it is 2 for one. We have enough to offer to pull off a 2 for 1. It just isn't going to get us AK. Unless AK was never coming back to the NBA, we dropped the ball. Big time. For those who don't want to over pay, STFU when it comes to the 3 position. We have about 5 guys who weren't overpaid and here we are.

In the end I can't point fingers at one position 2 games into the season. Salmons and Outlaw seem to be giving everything they have in a very confusing situation.

 

[AleksandarN]

Harrison Barnes

 

[Bricklayer]

I think if the Kings thought they were set on the SF position, they wouldn't have extended an offer to AK47 or picked up Outlaw.

Sure, we keep on trying to patch the hole, and while the Salmons/Outlaw pairing needs more time to get a definitive read on, I rather doubt they are the answer either. Problem is that in continuing to pile up mediocre players while hoping to patch the hole, we have also been piling up long term contracts attached to those mediocre players so that it becomes impractical to keep on adding new guys looking for a solution.

Now in an overall sense, its not the end of the world. A lot of teams have positional holes, ever good ones. Miami still can't find a center. Chcacgo had to resort to the waiver wire to try to get a SG. The Spurs were going to amnesty Richard Jefferson until they realized they couldn't get anybody better. The Hawks have to play Horford out of poistion at C every year etc. But with now 5 SFs on the roster, and none of them seeming to be the immediate solution, we may have to just accept this as a semi-permanent weakness until we can ship out some of the contracts we've gto stacked at the position.

 

[TehSwimGuy]

Sure, we keep on trying to patch the hole, and while the Salmons/Outlaw pairing needs more time to get a definitive read on, I rather doubt they are the answer either. Problem is that in continuing to pile up mediocre players while hoping to patch the hole, we have also been piling up long term contracts attached to those mediocre players so that it becomes impractical to keep on adding new guys looking for a solution.

Now in an overal sense, it not the end of the world. A lot of teams have positional holes, ever good ones. Miami still can't find a center. Chcacgo had to resort to the waiver wire to try to get a SF. teh Spurs were going to amnesty Richard Jefferson until they realized they couldn't get anybody better. The Hawks have to play Horford out of poistion at C every year etc. But with now 5 SFs on the roster, and none of them seeming to be the immediate solution, we may have to just accept this as a semi-permanent weakness until we can ship out some of the contracts we've gto stacked at the position.

Yup. Quantity over quality in the SF department.

I'm betting they wanted to find at least 1 or 2, and then ship out the rest. Problem is, they are all pretty mediocre.

 

[NoBonus]

Yup. Quantity over quality in the SF department.

I'm betting they wanted to find at least 1 or 2, and then ship out the rest. Problem is, they are all pretty mediocre.

This is one position I hope Coach W jumbles minutes for so there will be some sense of "play well or sit" for the SFs... with five of them, I am guessing the bench guys are more than a little hungry... and there just aren't great SFs floating around out there...

 

[beb0p]

I've been saying this about Salmons the DAY we got him (again!). Boy, I sure took a lot of heat for it from the regulars on this board (again!). Yes we're just two games into the season, but Salmons' defensive shortcoming as related to his size is nothing new!! We saw this movie before. He is also not a good help defender nor a good off the ball defender. He is simply not that guy we need at SF. I don't care if he bounces back next game and drops 30 pts, he is still the same old John Salmons.

All the Kings need is a SF who plays defense and knock down open threes. That's all. Don't tell me that those are hard to find; but yet it's been years and still not filled.

 

[Bricklayer]

I've been saying this about Salmons the DAY we got him (again!). Boy, I sure took a lot of heat for it from the regulars on this board (again!). Yes we're just two games into the season, but Salmons' defensive shortcoming as related to his size is nothing new!! We saw this movie before. He is also not a good help defender nor a good off the ball defender. He is simply not that guy we need at SF. I don't care if he bounces back next game and drops 30 pts, he is still the same old John Salmons.

All the Kings need is a SF who plays defense and knock down open threes. That's all. Don't tell me that those are hard to find; but yet it's been years and still not filled.

There will be nights when Salmons will be useful on defense. Against the Lakers was one of those -- as a SG he is able to D up Kobe and save Reke from having to carry the load on both ends. In that same way he'll be useful against DWade, against Kevin Martin etc. But as a guard he just isn't a good match for the power SFs. The Artests, LeBrons, Melos etc. So sometimes he'll be much more useful than others on defense.

 

[beb0p]

There will be nights when Salmons will be useful on defense. Against the Lakers was one of those -- as a SG he is able to D up Kobe and save Reke from having to carry the load on both ends. In that same way he'll be useful against DWade, against Kevin Martin etc. But as a guard he just isn't a good match for the power SFs. The Artests, LeBrons, Melos etc. So sometimes he'll be much more useful than others on defense.

That game was more the case of Kobe being off than Salmons being on. Case in point: even Isiah Thomas stopped Kobe, enough said.

Salmons is a good on-ball defender (against other SG or SF with SG size), not a good off-ball defender. Kobe lost him many times coming off screens, the Lakers should have kept running screens for Kobe to get him wide open looks but for some reason they stopped that late in the game with Kobe going one v one and played into Salmons' strength.

I agree, Salmons will occasionally have good defensive games against the "right" players. Which means we need to find a more consistent SF.

 

[upinsmoke]

Time to play Reke at the 3 imo. The kid cant shoot or facilitate an offense so he is not a 1 or 2.

 

[Prince_XY]

That game was more the case of Kobe being off than Salmons being on. Case in point: even Isiah Thomas stopped Kobe, enough said.

I've watched the game twice and saw the same thing.

 

[Prince_XY]

How much money is going for sfs (let me see)?

Salmons 8.5 (at least 3 years of salmons) we should call him K8 because K9 was better
Garcia 5.8 (at least 2 years)
Outlaw 3 (at leat 4 years)
Donte 1.7 (contract year)
Honeycutt <1 (1 year guaranteed, then two team options)

19.8 MILLION DOLLARS to these scrubs......that couldn't stop anybody in the last two games!!!!!!!!! This is obviously incredibly poor money management. How much is wallace making why can't we pay for A (single) good sf instead of five crappy one's?

This is the reason why the Maloofs are losing money on the Kings. It would have been wiser if we had that $8.5M on Dalembert instead of Salmons.

Time to change GM.

 

[ParniValjak]

Well, AK47 has made it official that he is staying with CSKA at least until the end of the season! Its not like we didn't expect that!

Maybe next year!

 

[bajaden]

Well, AK47 has made it official that he is staying with CSKA at least until the end of the season! Its not like we didn't expect that!

Maybe next year!

Yep, saw that as well. Too bad, I still had hope that maybe we could solve our SF woes this season. Doesn't look like it now. Unless we make a trade of some kind. I've never been a big fan of Salmons at the SF position. I think he's fine as a SG, but we have a little logjam there.

 

[TehSwimGuy]

Question. In the golden years, how much were the Kings going over the salary cap? I thought we were one of the higher paid teams in the NBA? I thought I recalled something to that effect. Perhaps not.

 

[Glenn]

Question. In the golden years, how much were the Kings going over the salary cap? I thought we were one of the higher paid teams in the NBA? I thought I recalled something to that effect. Perhaps not.

I don't remember exactly but I think you are right in that we had one of the highest salaries. I also think the team lost money. So it was claimed.



As a side note, Pau and Kobe are scheduled to make $50 mil between them in a couple years. I wonder how that's going to work. Can they still amnsty Kobe? He is scheduled to make $30 mil at age 35 or whatever it is. Bizarre and definitely out of control. Hard to compete with also.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

As a side note, Pau and Kobe are scheduled to make $50 mil between them in a couple years. I wonder how that's going to work. Can they still amnsty Kobe? He is scheduled to make $30 mil at age 35 or whatever it is. Bizarre and definitely out of control. Hard to compete with also.

Yes, they can still amnesty Kobe. I mean, not that they would, but they can - they haven't used their amnesty yet and during any offseason they can amnesty any contract signed and/or acquired before the current CBA. Obviously they would still have to pay Kobe his $30.45M in '13-'14, but it wouldn't count against the salary cap. But in the real world, I don't see them amnestying Kobe unless he can't play due to injury. Any other scenario and they let him play, no matter what the contract is. You don't "fire" a surefire Hall-of-Famer.

 

[Lafayette]

They need to either start Greene or Honeycutt at the 3 and have Salmons come off the bench.

 

[Lafayette]

Trade Tyreke for a SF, please! Get rid of Salmons along with him and bring in one player and get Greene some playing time.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I think we should get Boris Diaw. He's almost 30 now, but he's learned to shoot the 3 and he can be a pass-first playmaker at the SF position, could really help smooth out our offense IMO.

 

[Aenadin]

I wouldnt mind Marvin Williams, but right now I see Hedo complementing our players really well.. he's a facilitator/shooting 3. I wouldnt mind him around. spotting up 3s

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

I wouldnt mind Marvin Williams, but right now I see Hedo complementing our players really well.. he's a facilitator/shooting 3. I wouldnt mind him around. spotting up 3s

I wouldn't mind Hedo either. He loved Sacramento and I bet he'd play well here. He's a better fit than Salmons IMO. Hedo's contract is a little steep though (about 33$ million) and it runs through 2014. The only way i can see a deal like that working is if the Magic take Salmons and Outlaw and The Kings throw in a draft pick or something.

 

[Lafayette]

I'd start Donte and have Salmons off the bench and the RASHARD LEWIS idea isn't that bad, he comes off the books after this year and we can unload baggage like Garcia and Salmons and then dump Lewis' salary next season. I like that trade because that opens up PT for Outlaw and Greene and call up Whiteside.

 

[Chupacabra]

You all are mentioning good players and thats great. I think the last thing this team needs is another scorer in the starting lineup. The kings require a player at the 3 that doesnt need to score to be affective. We need an athletic defense oriented player that can make open spot up 3 pointers at a decent clip. Greene or Outlaw shouldnt have much problem doing this but for some reason they have. What im saying is we dont need much offense out of our small forward. If im the coach i start Greene. Id much rather use someone already on our roster than make a trade for another scorer.