REPORT: Bogdan Bogdanovic in S&T to Bucks

Neither did Vlade, yet here we are.
Yeah, because that sure means something. Are you kidding me?

If the responsible GM’s had just drafted the right players from the positions the franchise drafted from (all w/o purposely tanking) the ”yet here we are“ situation would look pretty damned good.

It’s never been about fielding teams to lose purposely. The KINGS — through full and honest competition— have drafted in positions throughout the past 12 years to obtain the right players needed to win. To even build a title contender. They just continuously drafted incorrectly.

The KINGS never went Hinkie mode yet still could have drafted Steph Curry, Kawhi Leonard, Klay Thompson, Damian Lillard, Giannis, CJ McCollum, Nikola Jokic, Devin Booker, Pascal Siakam, or Luka. Among many, many others.

And ended up with none of those players.

That’s why they are where they are. Period, end of story.

This notion that they need to purposely tank do accomplish anything is beyond stupid — and lazy.
 
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Considering that Bogi is a bench player on a good team, what did people think the Kings could actually get for him?

Think of it this way. If Milwaukee was trading Bogi to the Kings, would we be willing to give up 1st round draft picks for him? Pretty sure I wouldn't be on board with that.
Is he? Now we find out. There's a reason Bogdan and the Bucks liked eachother. That's a franchise that will know how to use his abilities. They finally replace Brogdon with Bogdan. Heck, they've already taken a Kings blunder in George Hill and revived him, Bogdan could be another reclamation project in the making.
 
Okay here’s my (maybe) final thoughts after having listens to the Ringer Mismatch ep:

They agreed that we got basically nothing for Bogi and said they feel bad for Kings fans. Also pointed out that Bucks way overpaid for Jrue and we didn’t get nearly enough for Bogi. It was very much agreed that DD alone is a poor return for Bogi. More than anything the pod just affirmed to me that we aren’t giving Bogi the purple-glasses overvaluation but that he is seen as a winner and a very strong player, and that there would in fact be a big and active market for him if the Kings has the luxury of shopping him. Said he’s been a winner at every level, already has signature moments (Warriors & Lakers games) and it’s expected that he’ll have a huge impact in Milwaukee. I think we always tend to overvalue our own players but it really does sound like the rest of the league values Bogi as strongly as many Kings fans do

Kevin O’Connor said it was the Bucks deal or the Atl offer sheet. Chris Vernon said there had to be a much bigger market for Bogi - KOC agreed but said the Kings can’t dictate where he goes, if the Kings tried to trade him to another team Bogi could just say he’s not gonna sign. Almost made it sound like Bogi was forcing his way to the Bucks, but they also said that it’s speculation because they don’t have all the info

Here’s my thought: I’m not sure matching that Hawks offer sheet was the worse option here. He’s going to be tradeable very soon with the accelerated schedule. You’re taking on a big contract for a good player, gambling on the idea that you’ll be able to flip him for a better haul than DD even with that big contract. If he gets injured a massive contract could be franchise crippling. But I think that’s a risk worth taking if it means you can get a significant haul in just the next six months. Altho I absolutely understand why the FO would go a different direction and take the safe path forward
 
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Yeah, because that sure means something. Are you kidding me?

If the responsible GM’s had just drafted the right players from the positions the franchise drafted from (all w/o purposely tanking) the ”yet here we are“ situation would look pretty damned good.

It’s never been about fielding teams to lose purposely. The KINGS — through full and honest competition— have drafted in positions throughout the past 12 years to obtain the right players needed to win. To even build a title contender. They just continuously drafted incorrectly.

The KINGS never went Hinkie mode yet still could have drafted Steph Curry, Kawhi Leonard, Klay Thompson, Damian Lillard, Giannis, CJ McCollum, Nikola Jokic, Devin Booker, Pascal Siakam, or Luka. Among many, many others.

And ended up with none of those players.

That’s why they are where they are. Period, end of story.

This notion that they need to purposely tank do accomplish anything is beyond stupid — and lazy.
Never forget the power of the Kings of that last decade to take even gold and polish it into a turd. Drafting was bad for sure, but give credit where credit is due the Kings have written chapters entirely unseen before in the book of sports infamy when it comes to self harm.
 
Okay here’s my (maybe) final thoughts after having listens to the Ringer Mismatch ep:

They agreed that we got basically nothing for Bogi and said they feel bad for Kings fans. Also pointed out that Bucks way overpaid for Jrue and we didn’t get nearly enough for Bogi. It was very much agreed that DD alone is a poor return for Bogi. More than anything the pod just affirmed to me that we aren’t giving Bogi the purple-glasses overvaluation but that he is seen as a winner and a very strong player, and that there would in fact be a big and active market for him if the Kings has the luxury of shopping him. Said he’s been a winner at every level, already has signature moments (Warriors & Lakers games) and it’s expected that he’ll have a huge impact in Milwaukee. I think we always tend to overvalue our own players but it really does sound like the rest of the league values Bogi as strongly as many Kings fans do

Kevin O’Connor said it was the Bucks deal or the Atl offer sheet. Chris Vernon said there had to be a much bigger market for Bogi - KOC agreed but said the Kings can’t dictate where he goes, if the Kings tried to trade him to another team Bogi could just say he’s not gonna sign. Almost made it sound like Bogi was forcing his way to the Bucks, but they also said that it’s speculation because they don’t have all the info

Here’s my thought: I’m not sure matching that Hawks offer sheet was the worse option here. He’s going to be tradeable very soon with the accelerated schedule. You’re taking on a big contract for a good player, gambling on the idea that you’ll be able to flip him for a better haul than DD even with that big contract. If he gets injured a massive contract could be franchise crippling. But I think that’s a risk worth taking if it means you can get a significant haul in just the next six months. Altho I absolutely understand why the FO would go a different direction and take the safe path forward
while I think Bogdan may have been undervalued by Kings fans the idea that Donte is “basically nothing” in return is utter nonsense.
 
while I think Bogdan may have been undervalued by Kings fans the idea that Donte is “basically nothing” in return is utter nonsense.
Not basically nothing i maybe phrased the wrong - I think he’s a good player and asset and will help us a lot. I mentioned earlier he’s maybe as valuable or more than a mid-1st asset wise. I’m excited to see him come to Sacramento and see what he can do.

I just think the value of Bogi in a trade, absent RFA issues, is much much more than Donte. Like Donte is a great piece to start a package for Bogi but he’s absolutely just the start of the conversation not the end of it. That’s not a knock on Ragu that’s an assessment of Bogi’s value
 
Not sure this is completely accurate but also not really inaccurate. Defense is important but you Can’t just put out guys like Cojo especially at the point and think you will be ok.
Just don't get me wrong because it's not like I think defense is useless or anything. I just think that 3&D players are wasted on teams that don't have stars that are capable of making everyone better. Divincenzo is a great little player but he's going to be much more impactful on the Bucks than he would on the current Kings roster. If we had Fox and another Fox level player as our stars, I'd be all for players like Divincenzo or draft picks like Saddiq Bey.

What do you think Bogie's WAR is? I honestly don't think he moves the needle more than a game.
I don't think he's super impactful either. Do I think he's capable of being much more impactful? Yeah. I mean look at his bubble games. That's the 2nd best player on your team right there. Would love to see him solely concentrate on the NBA because I think he could actually be that player if he didn't play year round but he's not going to do that unless forced to by covid so I think the usual 1 good game, 1 average game and 1 bad game player is probably going to be the norm.

I think on the current Kings roster, he is more impactful than Divincenzo. I think the team would be worse next year, merely by swapping those two players. Now if the Kings draft Kira Lewis and he winds up being a Schroder type player, then I think the team would be better off with Divincenzo because he is more complementary than Bogdan would be. If the Kings draft Saddiq Bey, then I think Bogdan would be the better choice because the team would have almost no ball handling whatsoever outside of Fox. Although I'm sure Walton would love to plug Hield into that role :)

Of course then salary comes into play and that throws another wrench into things.
 
Okay here’s my (maybe) final thoughts after having listens to the Ringer Mismatch ep:

They agreed that we got basically nothing for Bogi and said they feel bad for Kings fans. Also pointed out that Bucks way overpaid for Jrue and we didn’t get nearly enough for Bogi. It was very much agreed that DD alone is a poor return for Bogi. More than anything the pod just affirmed to me that we aren’t giving Bogi the purple-glasses overvaluation but that he is seen as a winner and a very strong player, and that there would in fact be a big and active market for him if the Kings has the luxury of shopping him. Said he’s been a winner at every level, already has signature moments (Warriors & Lakers games) and it’s expected that he’ll have a huge impact in Milwaukee. I think we always tend to overvalue our own players but it really does sound like the rest of the league values Bogi as strongly as many Kings fans do

Kevin O’Connor said it was the Bucks deal or the Atl offer sheet. Chris Vernon said there had to be a much bigger market for Bogi - KOC agreed but said the Kings can’t dictate where he goes, if the Kings tried to trade him to another team Bogi could just say he’s not gonna sign. Almost made it sound like Bogi was forcing his way to the Bucks, but they also said that it’s speculation because they don’t have all the info

Here’s my thought: I’m not sure matching that Hawks offer sheet was the worse option here. He’s going to be tradeable very soon with the accelerated schedule. You’re taking on a big contract for a good player, gambling on the idea that you’ll be able to flip him for a better haul than DD even with that big contract. If he gets injured a massive contract could be franchise crippling. But I think that’s a risk worth taking if it means you can get a significant haul in just the next six months. Altho I absolutely understand why the FO would go a different direction and take the safe path forward
So basically Vlade is a better talent evaluator than McNair? I'm not buying it. I think the Ringers view on this is colored by the fact it's the Kings and they historically lose in trades.
 
Just don't get me wrong because it's not like I think defense is useless or anything. I just think that 3&D players are wasted on teams that don't have stars that are capable of making everyone better. Divincenzo is a great little player but he's going to be much more impactful on the Bucks than he would on the current Kings roster. If we had Fox and another Fox level player as our stars, I'd be all for players like Divincenzo or draft picks like Saddiq Bey.
In the short term, Bogi will be more valuable to the Bucks than DDV is to the Kings. However DDV could have a bright future as a 6th man and that is an incredibly valuable role. People may forget but he was the 6th man of the year on that championship Nova squad in '18. Even if the Kings suck for the next couple years, they need to start piecing together a roster that can eventually compete. If the Kings can trade Buddy for a pick and Player. They could have a core of Fox, Bagley, 2 first rounders this year, a top ten pick next year and DDV. If we draft right, we might have the makings of a competitive squad.
 
I like it for both sides. Bogi is gonna thrive playing with better players. His up and down nature here was largely because more was asked of him than what should be. Donte is a nice young player who is in ascension. Had a nice season last year in what was basically his rookie year. Decent secondary ball handler and really good defensive instincts. You can even play he, Fox and Buddy together if you want. Love Bogi but he low key has a lot of miles on him for his age and he has been injury prone, he has played a ton internationally. Kings topped out as an 8th or 9th seed with him. Need to shed some vets and try and find another star in the draft. This year needs to be one of development of Bagley and whoever we take at #12(hopefully a starter or rotation player when it's said and done).
 
Okay here’s my (maybe) final thoughts after having listens to the Ringer Mismatch ep:

They agreed that we got basically nothing for Bogi and said they feel bad for Kings fans. Also pointed out that Bucks way overpaid for Jrue and we didn’t get nearly enough for Bogi. It was very much agreed that DD alone is a poor return for Bogi. More than anything the pod just affirmed to me that we aren’t giving Bogi the purple-glasses overvaluation but that he is seen as a winner and a very strong player, and that there would in fact be a big and active market for him if the Kings has the luxury of shopping him. Said he’s been a winner at every level, already has signature moments (Warriors & Lakers games) and it’s expected that he’ll have a huge impact in Milwaukee. I think we always tend to overvalue our own players but it really does sound like the rest of the league values Bogi as strongly as many Kings fans do

Kevin O’Connor said it was the Bucks deal or the Atl offer sheet. Chris Vernon said there had to be a much bigger market for Bogi - KOC agreed but said the Kings can’t dictate where he goes, if the Kings tried to trade him to another team Bogi could just say he’s not gonna sign. Almost made it sound like Bogi was forcing his way to the Bucks, but they also said that it’s speculation because they don’t have all the info

Here’s my thought: I’m not sure matching that Hawks offer sheet was the worse option here. He’s going to be tradeable very soon with the accelerated schedule. You’re taking on a big contract for a good player, gambling on the idea that you’ll be able to flip him for a better haul than DD even with that big contract. If he gets injured a massive contract could be franchise crippling. But I think that’s a risk worth taking if it means you can get a significant haul in just the next six months. Altho I absolutely understand why the FO would go a different direction and take the safe path forward
Bogdanovic was a restricted free agent though and the Kings had no leverage with another SG already under contract for 4 years/$94 million. Losing Bogdanovic for nothing wasn't the worst-case scenario here. If we had matched an offer sheet in the range of $16-18 million a year thinking we could move one of Hield or Bogdanovic down the road then we would have had even less leverage in any future trade talks and we'd still have the problem of finding starters minutes for two guys who play the same position. The risk isn't just that one of them could get injured, the risk is that nobody is going to come to the bargaining table with a team who is obviously desperate and offer them anything of value. I like Bogi and it's unfortunate that circumstances put the team in a position to lose a good player for nothing but given the chips we had, coming out with a young former first round pick with 2 years left on his rookie deal to replace him and a decent stopgap vet trade piece was more than fair. It's honestly more than I expected. Teams don't throw in first round picks in sign and trade deals.

And wow did Milwaukee overpay for Jrue Holiday. But when you're shopping for a new car and you know you only want it in red with a manual transmission and the upgraded audio package and there's only one such car even on the market, that's what happens. It takes guts to target a few specific players and go all-in to get them. I don't think it's wise but it certainly is gutsy. Don't let that skew your perception of fair market value though. New Orleans is laughing all the way to the bank. We got a fair deal. McNair and co. still have 4 picks to work with in tomorrow's draft. Let's see what they do with them before we start feeling sorry for ourselves. :)
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
Considering that Bogi is a bench player on a good team, what did people think the Kings could actually get for him?

Think of it this way. If Milwaukee was trading Bogi to the Kings, would we be willing to give up 1st round draft picks for him? Pretty sure I wouldn't be on board with that.
Well, I wouldn't call Bogdan a bench player - it certainly looks like the Bucks are planning to start him on a championship contender.

As far as whether we would want to give up picks for a S&T - I mean, nobody WANTS to, but sometimes you have to give to get. But keep in mind that the Kings haven't proven they can get their pick to land outside of the lottery, and the Bucks plan to be picking between 28-30 for the foreseeable future. A Kings pick and a Bucks pick are not exactly the same level of asset. For a good, impactful S&T would I give up a pick I'm pretty sure is going to be worse than 25? Yeah, probably.
 
Well, I wouldn't call Bogdan a bench player - it certainly looks like the Bucks are planning to start him on a championship contender.

As far as whether we would want to give up picks for a S&T - I mean, nobody WANTS to, but sometimes you have to give to get. But keep in mind that the Kings haven't proven they can get their pick to land outside of the lottery, and the Bucks plan to be picking between 28-30 for the foreseeable future. A Kings pick and a Bucks pick are not exactly the same level of asset. For a good, impactful S&T would I give up a pick I'm pretty sure is going to be worse than 25? Yeah, probably.
I didn't realize Matthews walked. My point still stands that it's a lot to give up for a guy who is a role player. We've always known his value is higher on a contending team than it is on the Kings. We shall see how it works out for the Bucks in the end.
 
I don’t have to run a poll to know that 95%+ of KINGS fans on this forum and pundits all around the world would have Swipa ahead of Bogdanovic.

Not even sure the majority would even have Bogi #2.
I'm pretty sure I've replied to this...
Probably the comment has been deleted?
Anyway, it doesn't change my mind.
Fox can still improve by the way, he still has some upside left... Not Bogi, who still is the best player right now.
 
Okay here’s my (maybe) final thoughts after having listens to the Ringer Mismatch ep:

They agreed that we got basically nothing for Bogi and said they feel bad for Kings fans. Also pointed out that Bucks way overpaid for Jrue and we didn’t get nearly enough for Bogi. It was very much agreed that DD alone is a poor return for Bogi. More than anything the pod just affirmed to me that we aren’t giving Bogi the purple-glasses overvaluation but that he is seen as a winner and a very strong player, and that there would in fact be a big and active market for him if the Kings has the luxury of shopping him. Said he’s been a winner at every level, already has signature moments (Warriors & Lakers games) and it’s expected that he’ll have a huge impact in Milwaukee. I think we always tend to overvalue our own players but it really does sound like the rest of the league values Bogi as strongly as many Kings fans do

Kevin O’Connor said it was the Bucks deal or the Atl offer sheet. Chris Vernon said there had to be a much bigger market for Bogi - KOC agreed but said the Kings can’t dictate where he goes, if the Kings tried to trade him to another team Bogi could just say he’s not gonna sign. Almost made it sound like Bogi was forcing his way to the Bucks, but they also said that it’s speculation because they don’t have all the info

Here’s my thought: I’m not sure matching that Hawks offer sheet was the worse option here. He’s going to be tradeable very soon with the accelerated schedule. You’re taking on a big contract for a good player, gambling on the idea that you’ll be able to flip him for a better haul than DD even with that big contract. If he gets injured a massive contract could be franchise crippling. But I think that’s a risk worth taking if it means you can get a significant haul in just the next six months. Altho I absolutely understand why the FO would go a different direction and take the safe path forward
So if your scenario of matching the big Atl offer sheet happened and Bogi stayed healthy what would you prognosticate the return for him would be?
 
I'm with some of the other comments - where is the #1 draft pick next season included? Probably would've been in the 20s but still. Will continue enjoying the NFL season.
 
Never forget the power of the Kings of that last decade to take even gold and polish it into a turd. Drafting was bad for sure, but give credit where credit is due the Kings have written chapters entirely unseen before in the book of sports infamy when it comes to self harm.
Truth.

Let’s all hope that comes to an end with the new front office.
 
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I like Bogi's game but feel he is better suited to helping winning teams win slightly more rather than turning mostly losing teams into consistent winners. Not sure that this is something for us to celebrate - but glad we didn't end up over paying for him at this point in time. Also glad we got a young kid who can come in and make some plays - probably off the bench. This trade does make the possibility of keeping Buddy on the team slightly more tenable. As others have said - removing Bogi from the free agent market may also push Buddy's trade value up slightly. Eager to see where we are this time tomorrow.

Welcome to the team Donte.
 
Mostly it is addition by subtraction for the Kings. DiVincenzo I heard is the centerpiece of the trade, he looks defensively fundamentally sound, a strong help defender and not foul prone which are skills the Kings have perpetually lacked for many years.

It's not that Bogi is useless, but I've never been a big fan of his, his reputation as a shooter is greater than what he's actually shown on the court. I was mostly concerned that the Kings would throw big money his way, that would have been a surefire way to clog our cap with mediocre talent for years to come.

No way was a Bogi Buddy combo on the roster going to even come close to working out. As much as Buddy irks me I would rather have him on the court and try to make it work out with him. He's the defending 3 point challenge champ, and King with most 3 pointers in a single season, and that counts for something. Nowhere near a flashy trade, but a clever one from the legitimate new FO I like it.
Bring this post back to the thread because it aligns with my views lol
 
The trade overall seems to be the best you are going to get for Bogdan, especially when considering Atl was willing to massively overpay for him, far beyond what the Kings should ever entertain. With that said, a guy like robert Covington commanded a 1st rounder in an albeit weak draft so I hope a deep due diligence was done for it. That being said it brings you Marcus Smart Jr. (DD).

That said, i hope they dont stop with this trade which frankly is not really setting the team up for any future improvement with the pieces it involves but to create flexibility (a total of nearly 21M coming off the books in 2021 (ersan, bjeli, parker)) while getting a player nearly as good as Bogdan for far cheaper. I would hope they could target a big time player going forward like a Beal, Haywood or Jaylen Brown. I would be down to move buddy and change (pick or players or cap relief) for any of them (including adding Bagley if it would net me Beal). I just want some sense of the front office getting either better through trade if they aren't going to get good draft assets.
 
You just made the a great argument for tanking this season, and I'm slowly coming around to the idea (or rather the realization that the Kings may choose to go that direction). I can't wait for all the supermax jokes for DJ Wilson after he posts 20 and 10 in garbage time of a blowout
We’re tanking and it’s not by choice
 
We’re tanking and it’s not by choice
We have to see (if it's still possible) if they were just tanking via misuse and over indulging on marginal role players that stole minutes from what should be this teams core or because they really do just suck. Straight up, last season might have been one of the most wasteful the franchise has seen since the days of sticking with Artest/Salmons when everybody new it was over. I can't think of anything that was really even in the realm of team or player building. Everything that remotely worked was used at odd intervals and repeatedly ditched at the worst times, none of the young players other than the ones who likely won't be here next year got a real chance at any point, and the SG the now lameduck/holdover coach picked his poison with in the bubble is now gone. I mean, hahaha, what a total cluster F. If it turns out that Walton is really a Vivek guy and things don't turn a 180 this is going to get really sticky. This FO has all the makings of one that was thrown together much in the same ways the first one was. If so when the boat starts a rockin' we'll see where those bonds lie. Lets just not hope for another Nik rocks! moment in the draft. I can see it now, Tyrell rocks! He looks like a Curry, might be a Jimmer but since we're going down memory lane! haha.
 
Is he? Now we find out. There's a reason Bogdan and the Bucks liked eachother. That's a franchise that will know how to use his abilities. They finally replace Brogdon with Bogdan. Heck, they've already taken a Kings blunder in George Hill and revived him, Bogdan could be another reclamation project in the making.
Well you literally just quoted a post that says why Bogdan makes sense for the Bucks. That’s it. Slightly above average roleplayer that’ll give them an offensive boost and maybe help them win a couple more regular season games. He ain’t putting them over the top but he certainly wasn’t about to help turn this franchise around and make a playoff run in the western conference
 
So if your scenario of matching the big Atl offer sheet happened and Bogi stayed healthy what would you prognosticate the return for him would be?
We'll, consider it from this standpoint: If the Hawks were willing to pay more than any other team with caproom for Bogi, I'd have to imagine most teams in the NBA would view it as an overpay, and Bogi as a good player on an inflated contract.

If Harrison Barnes were making $8 million or so over the next three seasons, he'd likely be viewed as a great trade chip. But at $22 million for the next three years, he's widely seen as a roleplayer on a bad contract.

It's possible that the Kings could have gotten a better return for a re-signed Bogi if they chose to match any offer sheet, but I don't know. Especially if they had to go into the season with both he and Buddy wanting to start and only one guy getting to. Somebody is losing trade value in that scenario.
 
Donte’s age fits with Kings timetable. I like his skill and commitment to defense with ability to be an excellent help defender which Kings need. He looks like a “glue guy”with tenacity and toughness. Donte was on championship teams in a row high school and college. Winners win at every level.

Bogi is not that tough and does disappear for stretches of games with no elite skill. Bogi is a good piece on a championship caliber team but not a NBA team building block. Yes, he was on a European League championship team. Props for that.

Buddy is an elite shooter. Add an above average 3 & D tough minded player then Buddy can catch and shoot and run fast breaks with Fox. I’d like to see the Kings move on from Harrison Barnes if there are any takers.
 
Personally, that's all i can think about. Not sure tanking and losing game after game is the culture we need to be cementing with a new guy in the front office and i'll never understand why that's the goal with a young team. No thanks
Agreed. I realize this is an unpopular opinion, but I don't get the big rush to tank and rebuild yet again. And for what? Who says making the playoffs has to be the holy grail of meaning for a basketball team? Sure it's a goal but I'm not interested in sitting through any more years of suckitude in blind pursuit of that goal, while we rebuild-and-rebuild-and-then-rebuild again, just to get a ticket to a dance before everyone ages out. Thanks, but I'll take an entertaining, fast, unselfish team of guys I like rooting for over the joy of watching entire seasons wash down the drain. That's what drew me to the Kings in the first place, and that group ended up surprising a lot of people.
 
Buddy is an elite shooter. Add an above average 3 & D tough minded player then Buddy can catch and shoot and run fast breaks with Fox. I’d like to see the Kings move on from Harrison Barnes if there are any takers.
I am still holding out hope that the heavy analytics approach of the new McNair front office will not only (hopefully) benefit in our approach to talent acquisition, but also will be used to support/influence Walton's use of his existing roster. If that's the case, I would fully expect Buddy to be better utilized and to potentially have a big bounce back year. I do not think Buddy's contract is out of line if we get the Buddy from two years ago, with some natural improvement. Walton just had no clue last year.