Ranking the last 2 drafts

Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
From Brick's favorite ESPN guy David Thorpe.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=thorpe_david&page=RooksSophs-110216

This is a ranking of right now. Not last year, not future.

1. Griffen
2. Curry
3. Blair
4. Ibaka
5. Holiday
6. Collison
7. Lawson
8. Mathews
9. Wall.
10. Cousins

He still has a lot of growing up to do, but he's the biggest beast of these two classes after Griffin. Try these numbers on for size:


He averaged 21.7 ppg and 11.5 rpg in a recent string of games against the Lakers, Celtics, Jazz, Mavs, Hornets and Thunder. That's a lot of lottery picks and All-Stars he battled against. And he made 50 of his 101 shots in that stretch, too.

11. Evans

Evans has been on a tear lately, but there is no way to ignore his horrible start and his inability to help the Kings win. The Kings are 24-78 since Jan. 1, 2010, and only Cleveland's Mo Williams has a usage rate of 25 or more and has lost more games than Evans this season.


Evans still scores in bunches and he's a much improved defender, but among starting point guards he ranks in the bottom five in true shooting percentage and is dead last in assist rate. His talent is undeniable, but he hasn't figured out how to use it within a team concept yet.

12. DeRozen
13. Fields
14. Monroe
15. Harden
16. Gibson
17. Neal
18. Jennings
19. Williams
20. George
 
That is the biggest crock of s*** I have ever seen in my life. Not surprised you'd be the one to post it up, though.
 
Lawson, Matthews...really?


Let's talk about fit. I think Evans/Cousins is a duo built for the playoffs...all we need to do is get there.
 
I read that earlier. What a crock if s***. Thorpe got #1 right, and immediately screwed up from that point on. He said Curry was GS's best player. Please, I watch GS all the time living in their backyard, and Monta is the life and soul of that team, not to mention a much better defender than Curry. Curry has been pulled multiple times in the 4th because he's such a defensive liability against larger backcourts.

But to put guys like Ibaka, Blair, Holiday, Collison, and Lawson, ahead of Wall, Cousin, Tyreke, and Fields is rediculous. Those guys aren't even one of the 3 best players on their teams. Ibaka, Blair, and lawson definitely aren't. Collison might, although Granger and Hibbert are #1 and #2. None of those have opposing defenses geared towards them on a nightly basis, or are looked to to carry their teams in the 4th.

It might help Thorpe to spend a little more time on this continent. His brain is baking on those Hawaiin beaches.
 
Clearly is biased and has an agenda, and is a stats geek. Doesn't factor in team defenses geared toward Tyreke, or that he's been injured for half the season. He just looks at scoring percentages and discounts defense, not surprising since he's Kevin Martins trainer.
 
Section 101 said:
only Cleveland's Mo Williams has a usage rate of 25 or more and has lost more games than Evans this season.
Click to expand...

This is a blatantly useless stat. This is the equivalent of saying that neither Toronto nor Minnesota have a dedicated star player with a usage rate over 25. Duh.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
This is a blatantly useless stat. This is the equivalent of saying that neither Toronto nor Minnesota have a dedicated star player with a usage rate over 25. Duh.
Click to expand...

Clearly that means that both Toronto and Minnesota are better teams, in every sense of the word.
 
Tis a reason why he's my "favorite" ESPN guy -- he really is a tool. And in his case I have long suspected its got the extra ick of just being agenda driven. Like a younger Charlie Rosen or something. If it weren't for my concern some poor basketball neophyte would read this kind of crap and actually believe it, I could completely ignore David Thorpe's existence when it came to basketball analysis.
 
This epidemic of fantasy basketball ranking somehow equating to real life skill level has gotten beyond ridiculous. Blair the third best player of the last two drafts? Because he's a beast of a rebounder? Curry is number 2 and Evans is number 11? Even though Evans had a better season last year and he's still having a better season this year despite his injury issues? Guess shooting percentages are all that matter. And Wesley Matthews was undrafted so he's technically not eligible for the list anyway.
 
Moron. Ibaka, a bench player that gets spot minutes? Blair, the 5th option on a team loaded from top to bottom? Curry? Curry? CURRY? Lol. Moron.
 
Thorpe is always biased and its primarily based on his personal agenda, especially when it comes to players that train or have trained with him. Almost worthless to read, he's so bad.
 
hrdboild said:
This epidemic of fantasy basketball ranking somehow equating to real life skill level has gotten beyond ridiculous. Blair the third best player of the last two drafts? Because he's a beast of a rebounder? Curry is number 2 and Evans is number 11? Even though Evans had a better season last year and he's still having a better season this year despite his injury issues? Guess shooting percentages are all that matter. And Wesley Matthews was undrafted so he's technically not eligible for the list anyway.
Click to expand...

Now this is a blinders on post. This ranking was only about this year. You think Evans is having a better year this year than Curry?
 
hrdboild said:
This epidemic of fantasy basketball ranking somehow equating to real life skill level has gotten beyond ridiculous. Blair the third best player of the last two drafts? Because he's a beast of a rebounder? Curry is number 2 and Evans is number 11? Even though Evans had a better season last year and he's still having a better season this year despite his injury issues? Guess shooting percentages are all that matter. And Wesley Matthews was undrafted so he's technically not eligible for the list anyway.
Click to expand...

You touched no something not many bring up. It appears a lot of so called analysts don't differeniate between fantasy stats, and what a given player is actually doing on the court. Sure stats are relevant, and have a place in sports, but they're not the be all end all of a players performance. This really goes across the board, with a lot of player rankings. I've seen Kobe ranked below the top 5 sg's, because his fantasy stats apparently aren't where they should be. My biggest problem is a lot of these player ranking we see nowadays fail to take into account intangibles, opposing defenses, or leadership.
 
Section 101 said:
Now this is a blinders on post. This ranking was only about this year. You think Evans is having a better year this year than Curry?
Click to expand...
Not this year, but given both players healthy, I'd still take Evans future over Curry's. Or has Curry been playing on injured ankles and plantar fasciitis since last summer and I missed that news?
 
Last edited:
kennadog said:
Not this year, but given both players healthy, I'd still take Evans future over Curry's. Or has Curry been playing on injured ankles and plantar faciitis since last summer I missed that news?
Click to expand...

Curry's been playing well of late. Not taking anything away from him because he's a very good player. But Monta makes that backcourt go, and that team go. When things are getting rough, GS looks to Monta, not Curry. When they are getting burned by a larger backcourt, Curry goes to the bench, not Monta. Different situations. Curry doesn't have the same amount of pressure, or responsibilities as Tyreke has. He also has a 25ppg vet playing alongside him, and an all star pf, as well as the league leader in 3pt' makes.

I would hands down take Tyreke over Curry, as he'll be a game changing force on both ends for years to come, and isn't the liability on defense Curry is. However, at this point in their careers, Curry is definitely smarter with the ball, although with the game on the line, Monta's usually the one with the ball making the decisions.
 
rainmaker said:
You touched no something not many bring up. It appears a lot of so called analysts don't differeniate between fantasy stats, and what a given player is actually doing on the court. Sure stats are relevant, and have a place in sports, but they're not the be all end all of a players performance. This really goes across the board, with a lot of player rankings. I've seen Kobe ranked below the top 5 sg's, because his fantasy stats apparently aren't where they should be. My biggest problem is a lot of these player ranking we see nowadays fail to take into account intangibles, opposing defenses, or leadership.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I hear people constantly talking about fantasy ranking as if it actually correlates to anything significant. Does it matter if Curry is a top 20 fantasy player? Does that really make him a top 20 player or is it just that he has high percentages and low turnovers so he's good at every fantasy category? All the top awards discussions tend to be too stat-driven anyway. If you watch the games it's pretty clear that Dwight Howard's impact as a defender, for instance, goes way beyond his block and rebound totals. I quit fantasy basketball a few years ago after two seasons of playing because I could sense myself drifting towards stats-obsession instead of just enjoying the games with my eyes.

As for Tyreke having a better year than Curry, it's a subjective judgement. I think Tyreke's year (so far) is better because he's the leading scorer on the team and he's also been one of our best 2 or 3 defenders. Curry is a more efficient scorer but he's a liability defensively and he's not being asked to lead his team on offense. It's also significant, I think, that Tyreke had an awful first two months and his numbers are still almost identical to Curry's. He's been the better player for a full two months now.
 
hrdboild said:
Yeah, I hear people constantly talking about fantasy ranking as if it actually correlates to anything significant. Does it matter if Curry is a top 20 fantasy player? Does that really make him a top 20 player or is it just that he has high percentages and low turnovers so he's good at every fantasy category? All the top awards discussions tend to be too stat-driven anyway. If you watch the games it's pretty clear that Dwight Howard's impact as a defender, for instance, goes way beyond his block and rebound totals. I quit fantasy basketball a few years ago after two seasons of playing because I could sense myself drifting towards stats-obsession instead of just enjoying the games with my eyes.

As for Tyreke having a better year than Curry, it's a subjective judgement. I think Tyreke's year (so far) is better because he's the leading scorer on the team and he's also been one of our best 2 or 3 defenders. Curry is a more efficient scorer but he's a liability defensively and he's not being asked to lead his team on offense. It's also significant, I think, that Tyreke had an awful first two months and his numbers are still almost identical to Curry's. He's been the better player for a full two months now.
Click to expand...

Yup.
 
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