[Game] Nets @ Kings - Tuesday, March 19 - 7PT/10ET

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If you told me 3 weeks ago that by the time the season was over I would be ambivalent about Joerger, I would have called you crazy. But there it is.

I've been up Willie's ass about "not hating to lose" enough. Well coach??? Smash a clipboard or something. wtf?

Lets see the last 12 games. But I'm starting to put it on coach because everything is "good learning experience" and it's getting about as bad as WCS talking about his love for KAT after a loss. Maybe the culture needs another boost.
This is why I'm very glad fans do not have a say in running the team. Bunch of emotional wrecks that don't think long-term and only care what's happening in the moment.

Firing Joerger now with a flawed roster after a very likely 10+ win improvement season(just assuming we win at least 3 more games this year) would be... well vintage #KANGZ. And honestly, we were much closer to a 20 win team last season than we were a 27 win team; more or less just got insanely lucky in the last 3 minutes of games and hit a bunch of game winners that's not normal.

This team is FINALLY building something. FINALLY getting some continuity with a system and not having to start new every season. FINALLY know who the core is we're building that will be back next season and not having to bring in a new slew of guys who haven't played together before. We're FINALLY at a point where we can compete with any team in the NBA and make them give us their best shot to win the game. I think easily you'd have to go back 10+ years to find the last Kings team that wasn't a complete pushover that just crumbled at the first sign of adversity.

Now in 2 years, if we're still on the outside looking in of the playoffs when the young core is all grown up? Then you look to make the change. Now is just pure stupidity.
 
That game had an unreal performance by Oubre Jr too. Not as unreal as Russel’s tonight but still. He was all around amazing on that day, not only offensively but defensively too.
IDK, to me, that PHX game was like we were ambushed, and countered, and they had a great gameplan and the personell to execute it... The Kings had soooo many turnovers that game that were like the Suns saw it coming.. That was like a war of attrition or a big grind...

This was more like a mortal wound that quickly bleeds out... Or we rubbernecked in traffic and got steamrolled by a 16-wheeler. This was more like a lapse that quickly compounded, more like the game vs Portland where Lillard stole the show in OT....

I just can't get super worked up about a loss where Buddy plays so poorly, because when Buddy plays poorly, I expect us to lose.. This team in its current form is just not setup to withstand bad nights from Buddy vs good teams..
 
If you told me 3 weeks ago that by the time the season was over I would be ambivalent about Joerger, I would have called you crazy. But there it is.

I've been up Willie's ass about "not hating to lose" enough. Well coach??? Smash a clipboard or something. wtf?

Lets see the last 12 games. But I'm starting to put it on coach because everything is "good learning experience" and it's getting about as bad as WCS talking about his love for KAT after a loss. Maybe the culture needs another boost.

I just re-watched the 4th quarter up until about the 4:43 mark when the Nets were well into their run. They ran 4 pick and rolls, or 4 half ATTEMPTS at best. Every one involving a big was a no contact or a slip (which I don't think we've seen work once all year) so in other words, not a pick and roll. Even one of them was designed to get post position for a big. Also a few were run with a big in the paint underneath the play which means all lanes are shut anyway. The entirety of the offense was predicated on post play, high post action, or drives. That's bad offensive system stuff right there when the defense has figured you out. How many times can you point to huge deficits and play calls? Almost every time. No more guessing about that. If the players were going against the system or desired play calls Joerger would have done something about it and as you said, he didn't.
 
All things considered Joerger has done an excellent job this season. There's an old adage about coaches should be judged on their plays after time-outs and in late game situations, and im not gonna say Dave has been bad, but i'm unimpressed with what I've seen, he had the opportunity to manuever us to a few more wins that were left on the table --- Luckily he's set the bar pretty low for next season, I imagine a great deal of improvements on next years squad, Joerger included.
 
...I called this team about a month ago. We were neck and neck with the Spurs and Clippers. I forget which game it was, but I remember the players starting that game completely flat. It wasn't the fact that they were missing shots, but that they had a horrible body language out there. There was no sense of urgency. Complete lack of focus. And then out of nowhere in the 4th quarter we tried to come marching back only to come short. That game disgusted me because we saw exactly what this team was capable of in the 1st half of the season, but it just didn't seem like the players wanted to win. We are 4-9 since the All-Star break. Please don't give this team any BS excuses about how we had to play difficult teams. Every team in the NBA plays difficult teams. But we can get specific, we lost by 7pts to the T-Wolves, a lotto team. We lost in OT to the Bucks with Giannis playing injured. We lost to the Celtics AT HOME without Kyrie AND with the Celtics coming off a game the previous night. We lost to the Wizards by 6pts, another lotto team. An add-on bonus, we beat OKC by 3pts off a phantom offensive charge by Westbrook. 4-9 in that stretch while we could've easily gone 3-10.

I really don't think this team was focused enough. Maybe it's too much pressure on an inexperienced team, but I said this before.. I won't be sad to see this roster get shaken up in the offseason. There's been a lot of fun moments in this season, but something just feels off about the energy and intensity of this team.
 
I don't think this happens with Shump still around, he'd of died on the court from a heart attack before he let Russell go off like that. I'm sure eventually he'd of been on him too.
Glad you said this because I was going to bring up the same point. I realize that Shump isn’t the greatest player, but this game is a prime example of how much he’s missed. Nobody knows for sure whether a collapse line this would have happened with Iman on the team, but I’d bet a lot of $$ that it wouldn’t have.

Even if Shump wasn’t able to actively participate by playing, his influence, leadership, experience and intensity would have kept this from happening. The kids listen to him.

This team is lacking the type of veteran leadership Iman brought to the table. Kosta’s been around and seen a lot but he’s not like Shump.
 
This is why I'm very glad fans do not have a say in running the team. Bunch of emotional wrecks that don't think long-term and only care what's happening in the moment.

Firing Joerger now with a flawed roster after a very likely 10+ win improvement season(just assuming we win at least 3 more games this year) would be... well vintage #KANGZ. And honestly, we were much closer to a 20 win team last season than we were a 27 win team; more or less just got insanely lucky in the last 3 minutes of games and hit a bunch of game winners that's not normal.

This team is FINALLY building something. FINALLY getting some continuity with a system and not having to start new every season. FINALLY know who the core is we're building that will be back next season and not having to bring in a new slew of guys who haven't played together before. We're FINALLY at a point where we can compete with any team in the NBA and make them give us their best shot to win the game. I think easily you'd have to go back 10+ years to find the last Kings team that wasn't a complete pushover that just crumbled at the first sign of adversity.

Now in 2 years, if we're still on the outside looking in of the playoffs when the young core is all grown up? Then you look to make the change. Now is just pure stupidity.
I would have basically written your same post a couple weeks ago. I'm not despondent over not making the playoffs. I'm down on Joerger because he is complacent with losing - all sunshine and rainbows - and he has been doing a crap job lately. The plays in late game situations are not working... we're dribbling out the shot clock, turning it over, not getting a shot off. over and over again. that last play today at the 20 second mark was trash.

I know the season was good. But... I am getting frustrated with Joerger's demeanor after all these losses. I'm not even saying fire him - just that I've gone from die hard fervent supporter to ambivalent. Maybe there is a coach who can keep his team's head in the game better. We don't know how much Joerger has the locker room honestly. And... I've seen his plays out of timeout suck a lot lately. a lot.
 
From ESPN... Teams trailing by 25 or more points entering the fourth quarter were 3-3,028 in the shot-clock era entering Tuesday

Well, at least there were 2 other teams that essentially blew a game they had a 99.99% likelihood of winning with 12 mins to go. Making history!
 
I would have basically written your same post a couple weeks ago. I'm not despondent over not making the playoffs. I'm down on Joerger because he is complacent with losing - all sunshine and rainbows - and he has been doing a crap job lately. The plays in late game situations are not working... we're dribbling out the shot clock, turning it over, not getting a shot off. over and over again. that last play today at the 20 second mark was trash.

I know the season was good. But... I am getting frustrated with Joerger's demeanor after all these losses. I'm not even saying fire him - just that I've gone from die hard fervent supporter to ambivalent. Maybe there is a coach who can keep his team's head in the game better. We don't know how much Joerger has the locker room honestly. And... I've seen his plays out of timeout suck a lot lately. a lot.
3 weeks ago after being really frustrated with all the close losses and the consistent inability to close out key games, I was ambivalent. The team has played with a deer in the headlights look when the other team clamps down in the 4th. I still support for another year for DJ, but if we stumble out of the gates early next season, I would support a change.
 
Well, at least there were 2 other teams that essentially blew a game they had a 99.99% likelihood of winning with 12 mins to go. Making history!
I might be wrong, but I think the KINGS are one of those ‘other’ 2 teams thus have done it twice.

I recall them losing a 25-point 4th quarter lead in Boston back in the 90’s (I believe). I just don’t remember if it was 25 to begin the quarter or if it just got up to 25 at one point.
 
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Ok moving on the coaches should realize what’s going on after this one as if they didn’t know before.

Pick the culprits from the 4th quarter film and let them know that our playoff hopes are done for this year and we are going to give some of our fringe players like burks and the guys from Stockton a run to evaluate what we have moving forward.

I would not mind not seeing WCS, Bogi and Beli regulated to end of the bench for the rest of the season. The coach needs to send a message that the last 10 games or so is not acceptable.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
Ok moving on the coaches should realize what’s going on after this one as if they didn’t know before.

Pick the culprits from the 4th quarter film and let them know that our playoff hopes are done for this year and we are going to give some of our fringe players like burks and the guys from Stockton a run to evaluate what we have moving forward.

I would not mind not seeing WCS, Bogi and Beli regulated to end of the bench for the rest of the season. The coach needs to send a message that the last 10 games or so is not acceptable.
Bogi and Bjeli, yes absolutely.

Willie, nah. But continue an even split with Giles, and maybe let Giles close a few games.
 
Value? Have u seen what the Kings pay Willie? He's literally a great value on a per dollar basis.... U might wanna choose a better word than that LOL. That list of 20 C's u make, I bet their average salary is triple what the Kings pay Willie...



U guys watched Jason Thompson for all those years, he completely sucks compared to Willie --- No? The Kings paid Jason Thompson in the earlier part of this decade mroe than they pay Willie.......


The Kings played 10 guys in ths game, Willie was easily one of our top-5 players of the 10..




Buddy was atrocious and get punked effectively. When Buddy plays like that the Kings aren't a very good team..

Buddy had plenty of time--- the entire 4th q--- to get his crap togehter and couldnt..... but here we are talking about Willie, whos having his best month of the season...

In the face of calamity, Buddy's aim wasn't true.. and we lose.. It shouldnt really be all that shocking, I mentioned bout halfway thru the 4th if we are gonna hope Buddy matches Russell, this is gonna be a loss... and it was..


The SG position (Buddy and Bogdan) go 8/24 and combine for 1 3pt make, but yeah Willie sabotaged us once again.. He should've easily had 19 rebounds in 19 minutes.
Yep people have their whipping boys regardless of what actually happened in the game.
 
Ok moving on the coaches should realize what’s going on after this one as if they didn’t know before.

Pick the culprits from the 4th quarter film and let them know that our playoff hopes are done for this year and we are going to give some of our fringe players like burks and the guys from Stockton a run to evaluate what we have moving forward.

I would not mind not seeing WCS, Bogi and Beli regulated to end of the bench for the rest of the season. The coach needs to send a message that the last 10 games or so is not acceptable.
I really think if you're being objective; Willie has been pretty damn good in the last 10 games... There's a case to be made that this has been his best month....


For example ---- In 238 minutes this month willie has 6 turnovers and 26 assists.... and FWIW I know for sure at least 2 of those turnovers he hustled right back down the other end and got it back without the kings losing any points...
 
We just made DeAngelo Russell some kinda rock star. Good job guys. Somebody should be in the hotseat tomorrow. I don't care if year is over. We are supposed to be a pro sports team... act like it.
Take a deep breath KIngs fan. The NBA has a long season. No reason for fickle fans to turn on their team like a pack of hungry wolves. We had no answer for Russell. How many left hand layups did he make? No adjustment to slowing him down.

I liked Giles, Bagley and Fox last night with the exception of the Fox turnovers. Barnes is playing great. Buddy needs a vacation. Bogi is playing hurt and needs to rest. Belli played fine. Now is the time get a grip and look at the team objectively. Young players have to learn to deal with the physical and mental fatigue by this point in the season.
 

Mr. S£im Citrus

Doryphore of KingsFans.com
Staff member
So embarrassing. Lmao are they trying to pee on all of the good will we’ve built up?

I’m sure the national media can’t wait to give their “Kangz” hot takes along with that Rachel Nichols person.

I’m so disgusted and not watching another damn game this season
"That Rachel Nichols person"? Man, townies stay steady going that extra mile.
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
From ESPN... Teams trailing by 25 or more points entering the fourth quarter were 3-3,028 in the shot-clock era entering Tuesday

Well, at least there were 2 other teams that essentially blew a game they had a 99.99% likelihood of winning with 12 mins to go. Making history!
who was the last team to blow a 25 point 4th quarter lead?
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
I keep seeing this bogi is hurt narrative, being spoken with such certainty. What's this injury and how come I can't find any info on this injury from kings officials?
just you wait until the season is over, there will be mystery reports coming out that Bogs was "secretly" playing hurt for a good portion of the season
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
Divac & Co is going to have to make a decision on Joerger during the summer. Either extend the contract, or fire him and hire a new coach. Divac can't wait until the end of next year because it's very important for a developing team to know whether the coach has the confidence of management or not; otherwise, if there is a rough patch during the season it could all go to hell. Vlade has been around a long time and experienced several coaches first-hand. I'll trust his judgment about whether Joerger is the right man for the job.

Part of last night's fiasco I attribute to not having a legit back-up point guard. Because we don't know what was behind Fox's miscues in the 4th quarter, let's just assume that part of it was due to inexperience and part of it was due to his injury to his right hand. Whatever it was, we needed an experienced legit point guard to right the ship. We didn't have one. Bogs, Yogi and Hield can't do that job. If anybody had any belief whatsoever about any of those guys being able to run a team, last night should have banished those thoughts. Joerger is not to blame for the lack of depth at pg. We've talked about that quite a bit; management knows it's a need for this team; they couldn't get it done at the trade deadline. Imagine if Fox went out a stretch of say 20 games during the season. We've all lucked out with the health of Fox this year.

Why wasn't WCS in the game to protect the basket from the repeated layups of Russell? If Russell was blocked/stopped at the basket a couple of times at the basket it could easily have changed the entire tenor of the game. Players don't go to the basket much after being stuffed/stopped and then having the other team capitalize on it by running up their back for a layup or easy open shot. It doesn't take a eight blocks at the rim, just a couple to make the difference. With the layup drill gone, Russell would have been left to his one option - 3 pointers. I'll take a chance on 3 pointers over a layup drill. So why wasn't WCS in the game? WCS wasn't getting back on defense. He was oh so passionately arguing with the refs. It's a great device by lazy players - just make like you're really passionate about the game by arguing with the refs in the backcourt, but don't run like heck to get back on D. Joerger took him out because of that and maybe other stuff WCS did, or more likely, didn't do. But this is where I question Joerger. Is taking WCS out of the game the *only* lever you have for getting him to play the right way? Aren't you sacrificing the rest of the team to take minutes from WCS? Can't you motivate some other way than a minutes reduction? Yeah, you made a great teachable moment for WCS, a guy who is probably not going to be on the Kings next year, but look at the cost.

There have been other irritant-producing things I've seen from this team that reflect on Joerger. Simple things like knowing how to pass with two hands instead of one, or on defense keeping your head on a swivel to see man and ball. And why is it that Joerger can't get through to the high-BBIQ Bogs not to dribble so much, especially into traffic? Joerger is either complicit in the idiocy or he's powerless to do anything about it. But maybe my greatest criticism is that I sense Joerger's style is to fatalistically just accept that there will be numerous errors done by this team, and then he will coach them up about their mistakes It's a sense that he is just not pro-active enough to try to instill good habits in this team to prevent miscues on the floor going forward. Like I said, I'm willing to defer to Vlade's judgment on Joerger.
 
I keep seeing this bogi is hurt narrative, being spoken with such certainty. What's this injury and how come I can't find any info on this injury from kings officials?
I doubt there's an injury. It's an excuse. His poor play can be attributed to his change in play style which in turn can be attributed to his poorer decision making. Full stop.
 
Take a deep breath KIngs fan. The NBA has a long season. No reason for fickle fans to turn on their team like a pack of hungry wolves. We had no answer for Russell. How many left hand layups did he make? No adjustment to slowing him down.

I liked Giles, Bagley and Fox last night with the exception of the Fox turnovers. Barnes is playing great. Buddy needs a vacation. Bogi is playing hurt and needs to rest. Belli played fine. Now is the time get a grip and look at the team objectively. Young players have to learn to deal with the physical and mental fatigue by this point in the season.
Nothing fickle going on here my friend. I've been a fan for 30 years. Thru the good and lots of bad. Spent my money and spent my time caring about this team. This was embarrassing as a fan, and yes I'm angry... and tired of excuses.
 

gunks

Hall of Famer
Whew, glad I missed this one!

Silver lining: The Lakers traded D-Lo for cap space!

I dunno if any of y'all lurk or post on Realgm, but on the main board they have a thread on the Nets comeback last night, it's pretty funny! Everyone going in on Magic and the Lakers, crying Lakers fans going in on Magic... it's great.

I missed the game, so I'm not all incensed over it (I'm sure I'd be livid if I actually watched it), so I just see it as one loss that will HOPEFULLY put some hair on this team's chest. But the Lakers ditching Russell and getting nothing for it? That's way more franchise damaging than one night's embarassing choke job.
 
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There seems to be this suddenly widely accepted idea that Bogdan is playing hurt this year. I don't know where this idea came from or how it became so widely supported.

What evidence is there of this?
 
There has been discussion nationally about whether Bagley could’ve done more to block that last shot. Rim protection is still an item from him that needs to get better

An unheralded dumb play from last nights 4th quarter is Barnes fouling Russell behind the line for three foul shots when the momentum was turning at its zenith. More consistency from him
 
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