NBA suspends, fines Cousins

Point taken about the technicals Mr. Slim.

I guess what I object to is the very simplistic way of looking at the Ts as the one barometer of Cousins progress as a man. I read an article (wish I could find it) that basically concluded Cousins is worse than ever based on the technicals. Basically, he's not just the same guy that he was the first 3 years, but he's in fact worse. That simply hasn't been true. The last couple, three weeks have been disappointing to say the least. But he showed tremendous growth this season on the whole.

Sadly, the growth as a player and man has all been forgotten at this point. Sad for fans, the man himself, the NBA, and USA basketball. True basketball fans know Cousins is a unique talent. I root for those guys, whatever team they are on. I watch Durant, I watch Lebron, CP3. And yes, Demarcus Cousins. He's in extreme rarified air talent wise. Only Cwebb in Sac history is anywhere close and I think we can all see Cousins being even better. I want to see greatness.

I just can't jump off the bandwagon. I'm riding this bad boy till the end. Knew the day he got here he'd either be an all time great, or he'd be out of the league before his time. Well, right now he's in between, and the growing pains suck, but he's making progress. But as a lot of people have said, this won't be a straight progression. And frankly, he will always be near the league lead in Ts. It's not a good thing, and there's really no excuse, but I see hoping he cuts those down tremendously on the scale of hoping someone like Rick Barry would stop being an butthead and Jim Harbaugh stop being so competitive. Guess what? That won't happen. And Cousins isn't going to become a giant teddy bear. And we shouldn't want that either. Part of what makes some of these guys great is that they are a little crazy. Does he need to control it? Of course. But some of this zero tolerance talk is just absurd.
 
bajaden said:
I agree, and to further expand on what your saying, you can't on one hand ask someone to be the leader of the team, and on the other hand, have a public flogging of that same player. How can you expect players to follow someone your making a public example of. That's not to say that you can't discipline him. You just don't do it publicly. Maintaining public support and confidence in him is important if you really want him to be the leader of the team. Supporting him and supporting his actions are two entirely different things. He needs to have the appearance of a man that made a mistake, and not the appearance of a child throwing a tantrum. One can still be a leader, while the other looks like he needs a pacifier. Not an easy task for the Kings, but a very important one if your placing the future in Cousins hands.
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Sort of a chicken and egg thing though, don't you think? At some point you also have to wonder whether Cousins can be the leader of this team. Every coach after Westphal has come in and specifically targeted supporting him. At what point do we say that there's just no point in giving the guy more and more opportunities to prove he can be an effective leader? You can't be publicly flogging your leader, but your leader also shouldn't be "regularly" putting himself in a position where you even have to make a tough decision about how to handle him.

Guy with HOF potential who comes around once in a decade or two, guy you decide to build your team around, and he just HAS to have "issues" of sorts. Just another day in the life of the Sacramento Kings.
 
I don't think Cousins can be a leader of this team. I think it was a mistake laying this tag on his immature rear end. In the end, it may have hurt him. I also don't think IT is a leader no matter what he says. Does the team need a leader or can we add talent and see who comes out of the ooze? Heck, Reggie Evans sounds like a great leader for what it's worth.
 
i've said it before and i'll say it again: demarcus cousins does not necessarily need to be declared "the leader" of this team. he's young. he's immature. he's volatile. i think he's capable of further developing his leadership abilities, but becoming "the leader" is a tall order for him to live up to, given the many personal obstacles he needs to overcome on his path to success. such a role is much better suited to a veteran with considerable experience, someone more capable of commanding respect in the locker room...

chris webber had vlade divac to hold the golden era kings together. in three-and-a-half years with the kings, demarcus cousins has had... john salmons? samuel dalembert? beno udrih? chuck hayes? carl landry? these names don't exactly inspire confidence. rudy gay seems like a quality locker room presence, but he doesn't strike me as a natural motivator. reggie evans may actually be the closest thing the kings have had to a hard-nosed veteran leader in many years. so here's to hoping that evans can offer the kind of guidance across the remainder of this season that helps to stabilize demarcus in the long run...
 
Kingster said:
I used to train dogs. Does anyone have a shock collar handy? It does help for the untrainable barkers. What neck size is Cousins, by the way?:p
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Nope, no longer have any shock collars. Anyone that's used one knows that you can't over use them. Matter of fact, I seldom had to push the button more than two, maybe three times with the really stubborn one's. We loaned our collar to a guy with two Gordon Setters once, and I thought he was going to electrocute the poor bastards.
 
Glenn said:
I don't think Cousins can be a leader of this team. I think it was a mistake laying this tag on his immature rear end. In the end, it may have hurt him. I also don't think IT is a leader no matter what he says. Does the team need a leader or can we add talent and see who comes out of the ooze? Heck, Reggie Evans sounds like a great leader for what it's worth.
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The truth is, you can't just name a person the leader of anything. Well, you can, but that doesn't mean anyone will follow him or her. The old saying is, that leaders are born, not made, and I think there's a lot of truth to that statement. I had some leaders in the Marine Corps that I wouldn't have followed around the block much less into battle. However, I also had some that I would have followed into hell. Some people are inspiring, and some aren't. Some invoke confidence, and some don't. One thing I know for sure. You don't become a leader just because someone says you should be. Good test is to yell follow me. Then look back and see if anyone is there.
 
Padrino said:
chris webber had vlade divac to hold the golden era kings together. in three-and-a-half years with the kings, demarcus cousins has had...
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The big difference in that comparison, is that Chris Webber never had the issues in Sacramanto that Cousins continues to have. So with that said, Chris was able to team up with Vlade, with the both of them being captains and leaders
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
The big difference in that comparison, is that Chris Webber never had the issues in Sacramanto that Cousins continues to have. So with that said, Chris was able to team up with Vlade, with the both of them being captains and leaders
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Yes, however perhaps that's because he already went through growing pains with the warriors and wizards. I found the following article a fascinating look back in time. Do you really want this to be about Sac giving up on Cousins in a similar manner?

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/05/15/sports/nba-webber-traded-to-sacramento.html
 
TaxMan said:
Yes, however perhaps that's because he already went through growing pains with the warriors and wizards. I found the following article a fascinating look back in time. Do you really want this to be about Sac giving up on Cousins in a similar manner?

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/05/15/sports/nba-webber-traded-to-sacramento.html
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I don't think you give up on Cousins in the sense of trading him or anything. Regardless of his "issues" the guy has insane talent and can dominate on any given night. The real problem is whether you can depend on him and make him your leader/ go-to guy. What if he gets himself thrown out in a crucial playoff game, or even just picks up a cheap T and gives away a critical point? We've given him a max extension so it's a little late for second thoughts though
 
mac said:
I don't think you give up on Cousins in the sense of trading him or anything. Regardless of his "issues" the guy has insane talent and can dominate on any given night. The real problem is whether you can depend on him and make him your leader/ go-to guy. What if he gets himself thrown out in a crucial playoff game, or even just picks up a cheap T and gives away a critical point? We've given him a max extension so it's a little late for second thoughts though
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So what if you can't depend on him all the time? IT scored 12 points on 4-12 shooting last game. Is that dependable? I swear there is a real fan thing here that demands perfection of its stars that is unrealistic. I would rather have DMC with an occasional crap fit than most other players in the NBA.
 
Glenn said:
So what if you can't depend on him all the time? IT scored 12 points on 4-12 shooting last game. Is that dependable? I swear there is a real fan thing here that demands perfection of its stars that is unrealistic. I would rather have DMC with an occasional poopoo fit than most other players in the NBA.
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The reason an organization would consider it, is if they determined that his behavior was counterproductive to the "culture" that they placed as a highest priority and were striving to change
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
The reason an organization would consider it, is if they determined that his behavior was counterproductive to the "culture" that they placed as a highest priority and were striving to change
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In other words, they will need to decide whether this crap fit, this is the only one of this severity, may mean he should move on down the road because he disrupts our culture. I want this damn team to win. The culture I want is a winning culture.
 
Demarcus needs to get his act together. He is not beating his dog or his girl-friend or fighting in bars or anything else that would indicate a real problem. He's frustrated with losing and he's frustrated with what he - and a lot of us - perceive to be unfair treatment by the officials. In addition, he's become the league punching bag because players (and coaches) know about his short fuse.

Is that what we want or need from our franchise center? Hell no. Is it terminal? Also, hell no. What ails Demarcus is fixable and I have no doubt the front office will do whatever it takes to get our DFC any and all help he needs.

Some of you are making it sound as though he's a combination of Dennis Rodman and Ron Artest. He's not.

He's made some mistakes and he's going to have to work hard to correct them and change how he's viewed by many. I think he'll do it and I'm going to do whatever I can as one fan to show my support.
 
What is the most concerning is not so much the excessive technical fouls from arguing with the refs,...it's the dirty plays and regular negative interaction with players. Both are not good, but the dirty play is very negative for the effort to change the "culture"

At some point, lets hope he decides to just 'talk' with his play and the scoreboard. It would be entertaining and a sign of progress, if he could at some point say to another player...."scoreboard"
 
Glenn said:
In other words, they will need to decide whether this poopoo fit, this is the only one of this severity, may mean he should move on down the road because he disrupts our culture. I want this damn team to win. The culture I want is a winning culture.
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Part of a winning culture, is not allowing anyone to distract you and your team, from the focal point of where your focus needs to be for productive play. Distractions include officiating and referees
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
What is the most concerning is not so much the excessive technical fouls from arguing with the refs,...it's the dirty plays and regular negative interaction with players. Both are not good, but the dirty play is very negative for the effort to change the "culture"

At some point, lets hope he decides to just 'talk' with his play and the scoreboard. It would be entertaining and a sign of progress, if he could at some point say to another player...."scoreboard"
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How many dirty plays have you seen from Cousins this year?
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
Several and also lots of 'extra' stuff that wasn't mentioned at the time. I'll leave it at that for now
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I saw a punch in the last game. I don't know what you are talking about. I'll leave it at that. At least you won't be burdened by this poor culture guy tonight. I've seem him get grabbed in the balls.
 
For those of you saying DMC does not get any foul calls he's currently 3rd in the L in FTA ahead of James Harden, LeBron James, the only guys in front of him are Dwight who gets hacked on purpose so he get's a lot off FTA's and the best scorer in basketball KD.
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
Part of a winning culture, is not allowing anyone to distract you and your team, from the focal point of where your focus needs to be for productive play. Distractions include officiating and referees
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And that's what we have to get Cousins to understand. But, in all honesty, he hasn't seen a winning culture yet in Sacramento. He's seen discord, uncertainty, confusion, complacency, etc. I think as we continue to rotate out the least productive players on the roster, things will slowly change. It's just going to take time...and time isn't really something we have a lot of unless we can get DMC to understand that what he's doing is not only nonproductive, it's destructive - both to the team and to him.
 
Glenn said:
So what if you can't depend on him all the time? IT scored 12 points on 4-12 shooting last game. Is that dependable? I swear there is a real fan thing here that demands perfection of its stars that is unrealistic. I would rather have DMC with an occasional poopoo fit than most other players in the NBA.
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Oh please Glenn, let's not pretend that Cousins getting so easily aggravated that it throws his game off and picking up Ts left and right isn't going to be a problem when you want to be a championship caliber team. It's a different issue altogether from simply having a bad shooting night (not that I would ever even consider IT to be our dependable leader). You want to be the leader of a championship team you better be sure that your team can depend on you when it matters, that you aren't getting suspended and giving away free points. Or have you already forgotten how one bad bounce of a ball can make such a big difference?

If you had read my post you'd see that I too said that Cousins could dominate on any given night. The problem is his "antics" kinda point toward him having a higher probability of him not being dependable when you need him, which in my humble opinion is something a team that aspires to win should be a little concerned about.
 
mac said:
Oh please Glenn, let's not pretend that Cousins getting so easily aggravated that it throws his game off and picking up Ts left and right isn't going to be a problem when you want to be a championship caliber team. It's a different issue altogether from simply having a bad shooting night (not that I would ever even consider IT to be our dependable leader). You want to be the leader of a championship team you better be sure that your team can depend on you when it matters, that you aren't getting suspended and giving away free points. Or have you already forgotten how one bad bounce of a ball can make such a big difference?

If you had read my post you'd see that I too said that Cousins could dominate on any given night. The problem is his "antics" kinda point toward him having a higher probability of him not being dependable when you need him, which in my humble opinion is something a team that aspires to win should be a little concerned about.
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You are bringing me to years. What is your solution?
 
mac said:
Oh please Glenn, let's not pretend that Cousins getting so easily aggravated that it throws his game off and picking up Ts left and right isn't going to be a problem when you want to be a championship caliber team. It's a different issue altogether from simply having a bad shooting night (not that I would ever even consider IT to be our dependable leader). You want to be the leader of a championship team you better be sure that your team can depend on you when it matters, that you aren't getting suspended and giving away free points. Or have you already forgotten how one bad bounce of a ball can make such a big difference?

If you had read my post you'd see that I too said that Cousins could dominate on any given night. The problem is his "antics" kinda point toward him having a higher probability of him not being dependable when you need him, which in my humble opinion is something a team that aspires to win should be a little concerned about.
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If Ron-Ron Tru Warier Metta World Peace Artest can find a way to deal with his issues, there is no reason to assume DMC cannot and will not do the same.
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
What is the most concerning is not so much the excessive technical fouls from arguing with the refs,...it's the dirty plays and regular negative interaction with players. Both are not good, but the dirty play is very negative for the effort to change the "culture"
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Haha. Haha. Jeesh kids these days. :p

HOFer

HOFer

HOFer

and just etc. Must have needed some culture change.

A great many of the best players and best teams over the years have flat out been dirty players/teams. Intimidators. Its not an accident. Its not to say you can't win without being dirty. It is to say that being dirty is often a symptom of why you win: you burn a little brighter. You love physical play. You despise losing a little more than they do. You're tough, you're nasty, and you don't let anyone mess with you. I've probably just described half the players in the HOFs of every contact sport ever invented.
 
Unfortunately the 80's and 90's are long gone and they will never be back again. These are different times we live in, with different circumstances and technology as well
 
ShastaKingsFan said:
Unfortunately the 80's and 90's are long gone and they will never be back again. These are different times we live in, with different circumstances and technology as well
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That's missing the point. Winners are winners no matter the technology (technology? What's that got to do with it?). They share the same traits they always have, in every field of endeavor. Being "nice" is rarely part of the package. Just being an over aggressive jerk doesn't make you a winner. But it certainly doesn't prove you're not. Every winner from Alexander the Great to Bill Gates has stepped on a few throats getting tot he top.
 
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