NBA Lottery Thread

[KingsFanSince85]

LOL no need to get offended because I think your trade is funny lol buddy Bagley is the start of every delusional kings trade we come up with cause we want them off our team but you never stop to ask yourself: does the team im trying to trade with have any interest or find any value in these players? Again sorry if you got a little ups triggered by me laughing but it’s moreso about how all of us kings fans think the recipe to every trade proposal is Buddy + Bagley

I never said I was offended. I’m not. I simply asked for clarification because you offered zero context as to what you found laughable.

As I already explained, I answered the question that was posed. Just an honest opinion on what I’d be willing to surrender. Only the Rockets know what they’d be willing to accept. But that wasn’t the question that was posed.

Furthermore, pretending that Buddy Hield has little to no value is silly. While he‘s no franchise player, he has a skillset that is highly coveted in today’s NBA.

In 5 NBA seasons, he’s never shot worse than 39% from 3 and his career number is closer to 41%. All while shooting around 9-10 per game the past couple seasons and usually only being bested by Steph Curry in terms of volume of makes.

A guard that can average 20 ppg and shoot 3’s and FT’s super efficiently while also securing 5 rebounds per game has good value.

While his contract limits that value, it is a de-escalating contract. As it stands this season, his salary barely places him in the top 50 highest paid players. He makes 10-20M less than the top 15 salaries. And over the next couple seasons will dip to the level Bogdan Bogdanovic and Harrison Barnes make. And by the end of the contract he’ll make the same as Joe Harris and be only slightly above Davis Bertans, who are more limited players than Buddy.

Again, to believe he has little value and can’t be traded is silly.

Now, Marvin Bagley is different. His health and production likely doesn’t bring much value right now. However, he is only 22 years old, his contract is very affordable and he’s under team control for 2 more seasons (including his QO). When healthy, he’s displayed above average athleticism for a player his size and the ability to stretch the floor.

Pairing Buddy and Bagley in trade, along with a lottery pick, is going to hold more than just a little value. How much value is debatable.

 

[SacTownKid]

Vecenie has us taking Keon Johnson in his new mock, which is errr interesting.

Yeah, another 6'5" 180 pound SG. That will work smashingly!

 

[SacTownKid]

I realize it's only a 9 pick but I am overly wary of picking Duke players even from our limited sample size.

To their credit, it's the players that fit the mold of Johnson you probably want out of Duke. The bigs, eh, different story although historically Bagley isn't their typical big type either.

 

[SLAB]

so is this one SLAB is projecting in round 2 the one that was supposed to be even better than Marvin a few years ago?

I remember elementary one was a GOAT level adorable sideline interviewer or something a few years ago.

 

[SacTownKid]

Thoughts on Giddey? His passing and ball handling for a guy that size is intriguing. Seems to finish well at the rim with both hands. But he’d also most likely have to play the 3 here and he has a slight build, so not sure that works. I think Johnson makes sense too

I think Giddey will be OK guarding most 3's but his ability to run your offense could make it possible that you stagger his minutes so he's running backup PG too. Not a perfect fit but I think it's not unworkable. And while he has to get better shooting wise him dribbling at opposing wings will make it tough on them too. He's very skilled with the ball and particularly adept deep in the muck at the rim area which is super valuable. Players will continuously reach in on him and pick up fouls in the process.

 

[SacTownKid]

I just can’t get onboard with Giddey. The only thing he does well is pass and rebound. He would likely be the third facilitator here so I’m not sure it’s the best place to maximize his skill set.

His ball handling is elite and in control.

 

[SacTownKid]

Mitchell is such a "We wanna make a run at the 8th 10th seed playin next year" pick...

So is Franz Wagner mind you.

And be an eternal bencher. He's rugged but too small. He's a 6" PG basically. Next to Fox and Haliburton he won't work to his full potential. He just won't. Anyone able to play defense can help but my goodness, they've boxed themselves in taking a combo G in the last draft and that has to be considered since there are no guarantees about universal talent at 9. Don't mess this up Monte.

 

[SacTownKid]

Mitchell is such a "We wanna make a run at the 8th 10th seed playin next year" pick...

So is Franz Wagner mind you.

Franz Wagner plays a position of need though.

 

[hrdboild]

I never said I was offended. I’m not. I simply asked for clarification because you offered zero context as to what you found laughable.

As I already explained, I answered the question that was posed. Just an honest opinion on what I’d be willing to surrender. Only the Rockets know what they’d be willing to accept. But that wasn’t the question that was posed.

Furthermore, pretending that Buddy Hield has little to no value is silly. While he‘s no franchise player, he has a skillset that is highly coveted in today’s NBA.

In 5 NBA seasons, he’s never shot worse than 39% from 3 and his career number is closer to 41%. All while shooting around 9-10 per game the past couple seasons and usually only being bested by Steph Curry in terms of volume of makes.

A guard that can average 20 ppg and shoot 3’s and FT’s super efficiently while also securing 5 rebounds per game has good value.

While his contract limits that value, it is a de-escalating contract. As it stands this season, his salary barely places him in the top 50 highest paid players. He makes 10-20M less than the top 15 salaries. And over the next couple seasons will dip to the level Bogdan Bogdanovic and Harrison Barnes make.

Again, to believe he has little value and can’t be traded is silly.

Now, Marvin Bagley is different. His health and production likely doesn’t bring much value right now. However, he is only 22 years old, his contract is very affordable and he’s under team control for 3 more seasons (including his QO). When healthy, he’s displayed above average athleticism for a player his size and the ability to stretch the floor.

Pairing Buddy and Bagley in trade, along with a lottery pick, is going to hold more than just a little value. How much value is debatable.

You're a year off on the Bagley contract. He's been in the league 3 years already so he has one year left for about $11 million and then 1 qualifying offer year before he becomes unrestricted.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

To their credit, it's the players that fit the mold of Johnson you probably want out of Duke. The bigs, eh, different story although historically Bagley isn't their typical big type either.

You may be right. It also seems like the further away they get from the top of the draft the less disappointing they become.

 

[jiimbob]

Fox-Haliburton-Moody would be a solid young core from 1-3. Think they complement each other well too.

Agree. Barring any fancy trades and assuming S. Barnes is off the board, Moody is the player I most hope is sitting there at 9.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

You're a year off on the Bagley contract. He's been in the league 3 years already so he has one year left for about $11 million and then 1 qualifying offer year before he becomes unrestricted.

You’re right. I was mistakenly including this current season, which of course has ended for the KINGS.

Thanks for the heads up.

 

[iowamcnabb]

His ball handling is elite and in control.

he would still have the ball in his hands a lot less on this roster. I’d prefer someone’s primary skill to fill a need unless the talent is too great to pass up. Maybe it is with him but I personally don’t feel that way.

 

[hrdboild]

And be an eternal bencher. He's rugged but too small. He's a 6" PG basically. Next to Fox and Haliburton he won't work to his full potential. He just won't. Anyone able to play defense can help but my goodness, they've boxed themselves in taking a combo G in the last draft and that has to be considered since there are no guarantees about universal talent at 9. Don't mess this up Monte.

The argument for Davion Mitchell is that we need a third guard in the rotation, Buddy Hield is probably trade bait if we're building around a younger core and need salary cap flexibility to improve the team, and Mitchell is one of the best perimeter defenders in the draft. No he doesn't fill another spot in the starting lineup nor is he going to play alongside Fox and Haliburton for long stretches but you can't fix your entire roster with one player. Focusing on filling positions of immediate need and valuing star potential more than strong fundamentals are two of the fatal flaws which have led us to missing on more picks than we've hit on over the years. If he's a productive player who becomes a key part of the team and helps us become at least average defensively that's a worthwhile use of a #9 pick I think. He's not my first choice there, but there's far far worse decisions we could make.

 

[Hoovtrain]

I think Giddey will be OK guarding most 3's but his ability to run your offense could make it possible that you stagger his minutes so he's running backup PG too. Not a perfect fit but I think it's not unworkable. And while he has to get better shooting wise him dribbling at opposing wings will make it tough on them too. He's very skilled with the ball and particularly adept deep in the muck at the rim area which is super valuable. Players will continuously reach in on him and pick up fouls in the process.

yeah agree on everything you said, Was watching some of his scouting videos and love his passing , ball handling and overall BBIQ. His jumper is more like a set shot, but seems like there is room for improvement . Would you take him at 9? Who’s your guy again?

 

[SacTownKid]

The argument for Davion Mitchell is that we need a third guard in the rotation, Buddy Hield is probably trade bait if we're building around a younger core and need salary cap flexibility to improve the team, and Mitchell is one of the best perimeter defenders in the draft. No he doesn't fill another spot in the starting lineup nor is he going to play alongside Fox and Haliburton for long stretches but you can't fix your entire roster with one player. Focusing on filling positions of immediate need and star potential are two of the fatal flaws which have led us to missing on more picks than we've hit on over the years. If he's a productive player who becomes a key part of the team and helps us become at least average defensively that's a worthwhile use of a #9 pick I think. He's not my first choice there, but there's far far worse decisions we could make.

He can get minutes for sure next to two 180 pounds G's but how many? Getting a backup PG that can D up is doable on the FA market or via trade if that's what you are essentially going to get out of him. He could be the next Chris Paul for all we know but if he is he's got to find a team that can allow him to be that. This is an extremely light PG draft so I would think someone in that top 8 will need someone like him far more than the Kings do.

 

[Tetsujin]

Yeah, another 6'5" 180 pound SG. That will work smashingly!

we will be to 6’5/6’4’ guards what the Clippers are to 6’7”/6’8” wings

 

[SacTownKid]

we will be to 6’5/6’4’ guards what the Clippers are to 6’7”/6’8” wings

Yep, and it worked so well last year for Sac already. And look at all those team this deep running dudes that size at the 1-4, lol. I guess they'd get their Terrence Davis replacement though. ha ha.

 

[Tetsujin]

PG: Fox
SG: Delon
SF: Tyrese
PF: Buddy
C: Keon Johnson

make it happen Monte

 

[hrdboild]

D. Wright is on a 1 year contract, T. Davis is a free agent, Buddy is the best (only?) trade asset we have and probably doesn't fit our timeline or our need to be better than awful on defense. I know we all want the Kings to add a bigger wing in the draft this year if they can but the reality of our situation is that we have 2 guards and a couple of young bigs. Everything else is wide open. There's room in our rotation for a top line talent at any position right now and picking at #9 there's not a lot of wiggle room for us to start factoring need into our evaluation.

I think Mitchell is likely to rise up the draft board since he has skills which should translate right away but the same qualities which make him desirable to successful teams like Golden State who are looking to reinforce rather than rebuild should also make him a prospect we don't dismiss out of hand because he doesn't easily slot in next to Fox and Haliburton. GS has Curry and Thompson already but I think Mitchell is still a strong possibility for them. And there's a lesson in that. Fox needs to step up and apply defensive pressure more often but I also think having a strong point of attack defender off the bench to keep that momentum going for the full 48 is more significant than most people here are acknowledging. And if his attitude can rub off on our team leaders and get them to up their defensive intensity too, even better.

 

[Section 101]

The argument for Davion Mitchell is that we need a third guard in the rotation, Buddy Hield is probably trade bait if we're building around a younger core and need salary cap flexibility to improve the team, and Mitchell is one of the best perimeter defenders in the draft. No he doesn't fill another spot in the starting lineup nor is he going to play alongside Fox and Haliburton for long stretches but you can't fix your entire roster with one player. Focusing on filling positions of immediate need and valuing star potential more than strong fundamentals are two of the fatal flaws which have led us to missing on more picks than we've hit on over the years. If he's a productive player who becomes a key part of the team and helps us become at least average defensively that's a worthwhile use of a #9 pick I think. He's not my first choice there, but there's far far worse decisions we could make.

If he was turning 20 instead of 23 then yes.

 

[sactowndog]

The argument for Davion Mitchell is that we need a third guard in the rotation, Buddy Hield is probably trade bait if we're building around a younger core and need salary cap flexibility to improve the team, and Mitchell is one of the best perimeter defenders in the draft. No he doesn't fill another spot in the starting lineup nor is he going to play alongside Fox and Haliburton for long stretches but you can't fix your entire roster with one player. Focusing on filling positions of immediate need and valuing star potential more than strong fundamentals are two of the fatal flaws which have led us to missing on more picks than we've hit on over the years. If he's a productive player who becomes a key part of the team and helps us become at least average defensively that's a worthwhile use of a #9 pick I think. He's not my first choice there, but there's far far worse decisions we could make.

if anyone thinks we need a third guard over TD and Delon than one has to question wtf Monte was doing at the trade deadline.

 

[sactowndog]

D. Wright is on a 1 year contract, T. Davis is a free agent, Buddy is the best (only?) trade asset we have and probably doesn't fit our timeline or our need to be better than awful on defense. I know we all want the Kings to add a bigger wing in the draft this year if they can but the reality of our situation is that we have 2 guards and a couple of young bigs. Everything else is wide open. There's room in our rotation for a top line talent at any position right now and picking at #9 there's not a lot of wiggle room for us to start factoring need into our evaluation.

I think Mitchell is likely to rise up the draft board since he has skills which should translate right away but the same qualities which make him desirable to successful teams like Golden State who are looking to reinforce rather than rebuild should also make him a prospect we don't dismiss out of hand because he doesn't easily slot in next to Fox and Haliburton. GS has Curry and Thompson already but I think Mitchell is still a strong possibility for them. And there's a lesson in that. Fox needs to step up and apply defensive pressure more often but I also think having a strong point of attack defender off the bench to keep that momentum going for the full 48 is more significant than most people here are acknowledging. And if his attitude can rub off on our team leaders and get them to up their defensive intensity too, even better.

Mitchell measured 6’ 0” at the combine. If anything he is going to fall.

 

[sactowndog]

PG: Fox
SG: Delon
SF: Tyrese
PF: Buddy
C: Keon Johnson

make it happen Monte

Keon Johnson is a 6’ 5” guard. Did you mean Kai Jones? Never mind ..... scrolling up through the thread and get the context.

 

[kb02]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1407538195412271105

theoretical question, how much would you be willing to give up to pick Cade with the second overall pick?

Not much. I don’t think the difference between Cade and Barnes or Jalen Johnson is that large. In fact, I rate Barnes higher than Cade.

 

[sactowndog]

Franz Wagner plays a position of need though.

I think GS will draft Franz. He is a hi IQ move the ball kind of player that plays a position of need.

 

[kb02]

The argument for Davion Mitchell is that we need a third guard in the rotation, Buddy Hield is probably trade bait if we're building around a younger core and need salary cap flexibility to improve the team, and Mitchell is one of the best perimeter defenders in the draft. No he doesn't fill another spot in the starting lineup nor is he going to play alongside Fox and Haliburton for long stretches but you can't fix your entire roster with one player. Focusing on filling positions of immediate need and valuing star potential more than strong fundamentals are two of the fatal flaws which have led us to missing on more picks than we've hit on over the years. If he's a productive player who becomes a key part of the team and helps us become at least average defensively that's a worthwhile use of a #9 pick I think. He's not my first choice there, but there's far far worse decisions we could make.

i love Mitchell. Reminds me of Bobby J with a splash of Pat Bev. He’s going to be a stud.

 

[Section 101]

Keon Johnson is a 6’ 5” guard. Did you mean Kai Jones?

sar·casm
/ˈsärˌkazəm/

noun

1. the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

 

[Tetsujin]

sar·casm
/ˈsärˌkazəm/

noun

1. the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

I thought it was pretty obvious when I put 6'4" shooting guard Buddy Hield in the starting PF slot but I guess that's just an indicator of how wild Luke Walton's actual rotations have been.

 

[sactowndog]

sar·casm
/ˈsärˌkazəm/

noun

1. the use of irony to mock or convey contempt.

Yep was reading from the bottom and missed the context.