Michael Jordan Hall of Fame - SHAME!
- Thread starter PurpleHaze
- Start date
HATER and spelled out in all caps? That's absurd and if you want to get into name calling (not my style at all) you're a FOOL for injecting that cowardly word without supporting it one bit.
Obviously, MJ was an incredibly great basketball player and I said so. I pointed to the Yahoo article and said I agreed with it. The uninspired HOF speech spoke for itself and has been roundly criticized all over the national media as at a minimum, "controversial." I and several others in this tread agreed that unfortunately came off as, "bitter," "sad," etc. Many simply pointed out that it fell flat by totally or barely mentioned many of the "other greats" who helped MJ get where he eventually got and were shocked how he further felt a need to put down his own kids. Others disagreed in this thread but no one was called a HATER until you dropped that flippant insult.
Those are just facts. You may not like them, you may love MJ no matter what he does, but facts are stubborn things. I stand by my statement that it was probably the worst, most uninspired HOF speech ever - and all you can do is blurt out that I'm at HATER!
Obviously, MJ was an incredibly great basketball player and I said so. I pointed to the Yahoo article and said I agreed with it. The uninspired HOF speech spoke for itself and has been roundly criticized all over the national media as at a minimum, "controversial." I and several others in this tread agreed that unfortunately came off as, "bitter," "sad," etc. Many simply pointed out that it fell flat by totally or barely mentioned many of the "other greats" who helped MJ get where he eventually got and were shocked how he further felt a need to put down his own kids. Others disagreed in this thread but no one was called a HATER until you dropped that flippant insult.
Those are just facts. You may not like them, you may love MJ no matter what he does, but facts are stubborn things. I stand by my statement that it was probably the worst, most uninspired HOF speech ever - and all you can do is blurt out that I'm at HATER!
Here's an article that I totally agree with:
http://msn.foxsports.com/tennis/story/10067418/Serena/'s-a-whiner,-Jordan-was-a-winner
It actually talks about Serena's tantrum incident and MJ's HOF speech so i'll just post Jordan's part:
http://msn.foxsports.com/tennis/story/10067418/Serena/'s-a-whiner,-Jordan-was-a-winner
It actually talks about Serena's tantrum incident and MJ's HOF speech so i'll just post Jordan's part:
That's just Jordan being Jordan. He is very competitive and always wanted to prove others wrong and his strong urge to win. To me, at first i felt a little uncomfortable watching it but overtime during his speech i understood why. He had to conquer each and every challenge along his way and HE DID, that's why he is considered the greatest.
I guess what other people are upset is that he already did made his mark and already proven to everyone what he did and no need for him to call out each of them during this special night.
It can go either way, but to me, it gave me a better picture on what was going on his mind during those challenging years and how he dealt and overcome them. I'm just happy i've witnessed and watched the best basketball player ever lived and happened during my generation.
I guess what other people are upset is that he already did made his mark and already proven to everyone what he did and no need for him to call out each of them during this special night.
It can go either way, but to me, it gave me a better picture on what was going on his mind during those challenging years and how he dealt and overcome them. I'm just happy i've witnessed and watched the best basketball player ever lived and happened during my generation.
Sorry, but this type of attitude, if shared by the NBA, is what's wrong with pro basketball. Superstar players and big market teams being considered bigger than the game and getting calls and favorable treatment so as to perpetuate their "greatness".
My point is not that MJ got this treatment, just that if the NBA brass is thinking the same way you are, it could lead to a situation where a small market, non-superstar team could be cheated out of playoff opportunities because of breaks given to superstars and their big market teams. Not that this has ever happened, but you never know.
My point is not that MJ got this treatment, just that if the NBA brass is thinking the same way you are, it could lead to a situation where a small market, non-superstar team could be cheated out of playoff opportunities because of breaks given to superstars and their big market teams. Not that this has ever happened, but you never know.
Look again...My comment is pretty obvious in that it is primarily concerned with the attempt to raise Reggie Theus - once my favorite all-time King, BTW - to the status of some kind of saint in his dealings with groupies, etc. If someone tries to make similar comments about Kobe, I'll simply throw up in my mouth just a little and move on.
I doubt if it will occur, however. I'm thinking they're not going to have a special section of his HOF presentation devoted to what happened (or didn't happen) in Colorado, you know?
I doubt if it will occur, however. I'm thinking they're not going to have a special section of his HOF presentation devoted to what happened (or didn't happen) in Colorado, you know?
Absolutely hilarious consequences of the speech: Bryon Russell challenges Jordan to 1-on-1 and the Utah Flash owner puts up 100,000$ to host it. Seeing Russell's reaction to being called out, specifically the part where he said that he felt honoured to be in the speech, settled it for me, Jordan's speech was great.
Good distinction. He was a great player, but someone i have never admired. I clearly do not "want to be like Mike." He is chalk full of issues and seems angry and unhappy.
As a sidenote, I do not consider him the GOAT. The best and most dominant player on a great team when the league was at the height of it's popularity, yes - but not the GOAT.
As a sidenote, I do not consider him the GOAT. The best and most dominant player on a great team when the league was at the height of it's popularity, yes - but not the GOAT.
I just don't see how you can think that anyone was better than Jordan. That bulls team was the only team to ever play the game outside-in rather than the traditional inside-out. The 2 pistons teams were kinda like a hybrid but were not just an outside team, they both had decent big post up players. The bulls had neither.
I've never liked the absolutism that "Jordan is the G.O.A.T." He may very well have been, but the notion that it is case closed with no discussion never sat well with me (nor any of the other undisputed kings of the other sports). I agree with your 4 guys plus Jordan are the only ones really worth discussing presently.
I'm usually inclined to put Magic at the top spot (as painful as it is to give that honor to a Laker) because he could play all 5 positions at a championship level and for that reason I think if I were drafting from scratch I'd pick Magic. The one thing I think I can say without question is that if I wanted to sell the most tickets it would be Jordan hands down.
I'm usually inclined to put Magic at the top spot (as painful as it is to give that honor to a Laker) because he could play all 5 positions at a championship level and for that reason I think if I were drafting from scratch I'd pick Magic. The one thing I think I can say without question is that if I wanted to sell the most tickets it would be Jordan hands down.
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I think that sentiment is a little misleading; in the first place, I think that that kind of versatility is a little overrated, at least in terms of this argument. Hell, Boris Diaw can play all five positions, too, and I don't know many people that would even put him among the top fifty players in the league. And, honestly, aside from that one famous game against Philadelphia where he jumped center in place of Abdul-Jabbar, how many games did he really play at a "championship level" at any position other than PG? In the second place, I am disinclined to call anybody the greatest player ever when you could make the case that they aren't even the greatest player to play their position. And, in the third place, as brilliant as Johnson was offensively, he was arguably pretty much a one-way player, at least relative to the other people in that conversation. Personally, I can't call anyone the greatest who wasn't elite on both sides of the ball.
chamberlain was owned by Russell so he's off the list. Great statistical player but not enough rings to merrit GOAT
Robertson was an amazing all around talent but again not enough rings.
Magic Johnson had arguably the most talented team team of all time. And don't get me wrong his teams didn't dissapoint. I believe they had 8-9 finals apperances. That's impressive. Jordan only went 6 times but he won all of them. some can't agree on who was the best player on that team. Towards the late 80's yes but throughout the early runs kareem was unbelievable as well.
Russell is probably the closest to being the GOAT because of rings alone.
But I still stick with Jordan
Robertson was an amazing all around talent but again not enough rings.
Magic Johnson had arguably the most talented team team of all time. And don't get me wrong his teams didn't dissapoint. I believe they had 8-9 finals apperances. That's impressive. Jordan only went 6 times but he won all of them. some can't agree on who was the best player on that team. Towards the late 80's yes but throughout the early runs kareem was unbelievable as well.
Russell is probably the closest to being the GOAT because of rings alone.
But I still stick with Jordan
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While it was only one game it was still a championship game. Would he do it for a whole season, of course not. But he could do it in a pinch. You'd never see Diaw in that spot, nor do I suspect you'd see many others make the jump from 1 to 5 at such a high level. I won't knock his defense because his teams were an offensive highlight reel. Relative to the others he probably played in the highest scoring era of the bunch and for my money the top teams were about as stacked as they would ever get, though the balance of power was definitely in the East. If we were going strictly by best two-way player I'd give the honor to Chamberlain with Robertson nipping at his heels but the fact that Russell's teams were dominating the league at that time makes it hard for me to argue his case. Russell would probably be a shoe-in if he had Jordan's media sense and a bit flashier offensive game. He also probably loses points because unlike the others he would be undersized to play his the position in the modern game, he's commonly listed as the same height as Magic afterall. So there are pluses and minuses in all of their favors. Just while typing this I've almost talked myself into putting Russell at the top of the list.
Jordan is the prototype for all the problems in the current NBA. The more time passes, the more people will realize he was bad for league. Him and Stern ended the NBA as a sport and turned it towards to road of an entertainment business.
Even his achievements are tainted by the officiating. His points are highly inflated by free throws and the fact most players were afraid to play any real defense against him without getting fouled out of the game in a quarter. All he had to do was smile and keep his mouth shut at press conferences, let the jock sniffing Chaucer's of SI speak for him, and just play the role of Mickey Mouse. If twitter existed in his time, the whole scheme would have fallen apart.
Even his achievements are tainted by the officiating. His points are highly inflated by free throws and the fact most players were afraid to play any real defense against him without getting fouled out of the game in a quarter. All he had to do was smile and keep his mouth shut at press conferences, let the jock sniffing Chaucer's of SI speak for him, and just play the role of Mickey Mouse. If twitter existed in his time, the whole scheme would have fallen apart.
holy smokes, I really thought that I was the only person living that thought this way. It is good to know that I am not alone.
There have always been NBA stars. However, the "Jordan era" turned the NBA into a star driven/endorsement driven business that I have never enjoyed as much as the pre-Jordan years.
There have always been NBA stars. However, the "Jordan era" turned the NBA into a star driven/endorsement driven business that I have never enjoyed as much as the pre-Jordan years.
I agree in theory, at least that he paved the way for the star-driven me-first athlete that followed. However I do think there are subtle differences. Among other things, he kept his salary in check for most of his career, including his ill advised comeback and until that point where he had retired he had team loyalty even though he had big issues with management.
I also don't agree that he was bad for the NBA himself, he sold tickets and packed arenas. The marketing machine that followed and the need to make everybody the next "Mike" (or Baby Jordan, lol) was a horrible thing. How much he had a hand in that vs. just allowed it to go on because it stroked his ego I have no idea. But I'm guessing that's more Nike and Stern.
I also don't agree that he was bad for the NBA himself, he sold tickets and packed arenas. The marketing machine that followed and the need to make everybody the next "Mike" (or Baby Jordan, lol) was a horrible thing. How much he had a hand in that vs. just allowed it to go on because it stroked his ego I have no idea. But I'm guessing that's more Nike and Stern.