SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Eh, almost all the former pieces of what was were leaving. The writing was on the wall. Loucks was a Fox/Brown guy. Wes left probably because he knew he wasn't getting the gig when Monte was canned.
McNair gone
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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Eh, almost all the former pieces of what was were leaving. The writing was on the wall. Loucks was a Fox/Brown guy. Wes left probably because he knew he wasn't getting the gig when Monte was canned.
Well, back to irrelevancy and horrible management. As expected the meddling owner is death for a good basketball organization.
This ONLY makes sense if we firesale. And if the new regime gets to pick the coach. We won't, but I don't expect competence from this organization anymore.
Doug remaining this teams HC would be a true deathblow to this organization. Means vivek has been truly calling all the shots
This ONLY makes sense if we firesale. And if the new regime gets to pick the coach. We won't, but I don't expect competence from this organization anymore.
Doug remaining this teams HC would be a true deathblow to this organization. Means vivek has been truly calling all the shots
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Livinthedream
All-Star
Are we sure Vivek is to blame, or is it easy for anyone leaving to save face by saying it was Vivek's fault because of the past history/rumors?
Are we even sure Monte could do the job without Wilcox? Anyways, it was all over once Fox started the season by being noncommittal and the Kings got off to a slow start. There were high expectations after the lone playoff appearance and some hefty player contracts. Rumblings of player dissatisfaction with Brown. If I was the owner, that might be the time I start asking questions of my GM and losing some faith.
Denver's owner dropped the hammer on a playoff team for less.
Are we even sure Monte could do the job without Wilcox? Anyways, it was all over once Fox started the season by being noncommittal and the Kings got off to a slow start. There were high expectations after the lone playoff appearance and some hefty player contracts. Rumblings of player dissatisfaction with Brown. If I was the owner, that might be the time I start asking questions of my GM and losing some faith.
Denver's owner dropped the hammer on a playoff team for less.
Padrino
All-Star
Nobody's truly sure of anything right now. That said, Vivek has owned the Kings for twelve years. In that span, there were exactly two winning seasons and one single playoff appearance, along with three GMs and, like, eight head coaches. Vivek's a Silicon Valley type with that classic techbro philosophy of "move fast and break stuff", and I think the bloom is decidedly off that particular rose in 2025. The culture and philosophy of Big Tech isn't being warmly embraced at the moment, and that's largely because so many in that realm have been exposed as hacks. Hacks with "big ideas", sure, but hacks nonetheless. Success in one arena does not necessarily equate to success in an entirely different arena, yet that doesn't stop tech executives from imagining they can reshape the rest of the world in their image. NBA ownership is as good an example as any of what happens when hubris crashes headlong into reality.
Did Monte McNair deserve to keep his job? Perhaps not. It gets harder to argue so after another play-in flameout. But at a certain point, it doesn't really matter, does it? Vivek owns the team, and Vivek is going to keep cycling through GMs, head coaches, and "advisors" like he's on a carnival ride to nowhere. NBA franchises thrive in environments of stability, and Vivek's value system and philosophy simply do not account for the necessity of stability to long-term success.
So where does that leave Kings fans? Well, I'd say it leaves us hoping for luck. The original Beam Team probably represented a bit of luck. They were remarkably healthy during a season in which the rest of the West was broken and hobbled. They were hitting everything from deep. They were cresting the high and novelty of a strong marketing gimmick. They possessed a clear identity as a result of these factors and it helped them achieve a playoff berth and compete for seven games against the reigning champs. I remain a little surprised that they couldn't ride the wave for a couple more seasons, but that's the league. Sustained success is never guaranteed.
Maybe we'll get lucky again, though. A proper and committed rebuild is almost certainly off the table, because Vivek doesn't seem to recognize the value in such a strategy, for whatever reason. Hopefully that encumbered first rounder gets conveyed this off-season so that the Kings upcoming pick slate is clean. Hopefully some competency gets hired into the front office and onto the sideline. And hopefully some duplicative talent on the roster gets swapped out for some complementary talent. Maybe the 2025-2026 roster stumbles into chemistry and an identity. I suppose we'll see.
But I wouldn't be surprised if Kings fans continue to tune out. I've lived on the East Coast for a couple of years now, and I stayed up far past my bed time on a Wednesday night to watch a team that could barely be fussed to put forth an effort in a win-or-go-home scenario. I don't really get angry at sports at this stage of my life, but that sh*t pissed me off. I wouldn't shed a single tear if everyone but Keegan, Keon, and Carter were dumped in the off-season, for pennies on the dollar if need be.
fansinceday1
Starter
“I would bet my house that monte wasn’t making all of these moves”
I’m thinking Dave knows way more than he’s telling us. He knows who’s really pulling the levers, he just can’t say anything. Firing monte will do nothing to right this ship.
I’m thinking Dave knows way more than he’s telling us. He knows who’s really pulling the levers, he just can’t say anything. Firing monte will do nothing to right this ship.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
I find it difficult to assess Doug. As he himself said, he has had to coach about 3 different teams in half a season. Having alignment between the GM and coach is almost as important as having a good owner so Monte wanting to open up the search while still considering Doug makes sense.
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bball_nomad
Bench
He made some good decisions, he made equal amount of not so good decisions. Maybe some bad decisions were forced on him? Or maybe good decisions were done by somebody else. Right now Kings squad have potential, but pieces don't fit.
Can someone sort it out? We have to cling to the hope.
Domas has 5-6+ good seasons left in him. We need tall, long, healthy starting PF. DDR has to be benched or traded. Otherwise - shop Domas around and try to get max return. Good luck to pull anything like that. The way I see now - the best we can hope is for Kings to have a winning record during the regular season. Current team can't compete after 82 games.
Can someone sort it out? We have to cling to the hope.
Domas has 5-6+ good seasons left in him. We need tall, long, healthy starting PF. DDR has to be benched or traded. Otherwise - shop Domas around and try to get max return. Good luck to pull anything like that. The way I see now - the best we can hope is for Kings to have a winning record during the regular season. Current team can't compete after 82 games.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
If Vivek insists on being Jerry Jones Jr, then our best path to “luck” is to hire an excellent talent evaluator/drafter. Stauskas aside (which was blown out of proportion imo) it seems like Monte and Vlade were allowed to make the picks they wanted. IMO we let a good one go in Monte, here’s hoping we can replaced him with someone just as good or better.
Jdbraver137
Bench
So glad I didn’t renew my season tickets. Frankly, I have reached the point where I don’t care if they move to Seattle. The team iwould have been far more successful there.
sactowndog
All-Star
Aaron Nesmith and a 1st.
And that's what some are insisting should be the case here. SMFH.
Remember, it can always get worse. Be careful what you wish for as far as new GMs and coaches.
Look, Vivek saved the team. I'll always be thankful for that. But he really needs to just hire a competent GM and get out of the freaking way.
Jdbraver137
Bench
I’m tired of Vivek saved the team. Honeymoon is long over. he has repeatedly hired, ex-Kings to appease fans. I like Christie and blade as people and former player but it ends there.
Man...another blow. That would have been a good haul for HB.
TaxMan
Starter
Looking back, we love to crap on them as “haters”, but it does seem like a lot of the nba analysts were right. That team was one of the feel-good NBA moments over the past decade, but the Fox/Sabonis pairing just wasn’t good enough to have a much higher ceiling. Domas IS a skilled offensive hub that likely does lack consistent shooting and defense to anchor a championship winning team. Fox is an elite PG scorer, and can be a great defender in stretches, but isn’t quite good enough to be a number 1 on a championship team. Clutch shooting and injury luck DOES come back to the mean in general. Mike Brown‘s effectiveness and style DOES have a limited staying power.
It’s going to be a tough next three years at a minimum. I’m sure I will pay close attention over the offseason and come back with some level of interest next year, but things could get very very dark with the prospects of this team. I would much rather see a fresh rebuild that gives me a terrible win percentage next year, but with some feeling of direction and optimism. I would move Domas if I can get a “B” level package for him. Move Deebo and Monk for whatever (assuming neither is excited about a rebuild). Maybe hold onto Zach and see if he can be attractive at the trade deadline with only one more year on his contract.
However all thy said, I am questioning more and more why I havent lived in Sac for 30 years yet still follow this team as a die hard. That’s likely to change over the next couple years.
No it doesn't. Aside from, perhaps, your Personal Record Book™, the amount of hope is the same as it was twenty-four hours ago. If Vivek Ranadivé is half the meddlesome governor that Kings Fans appear to have made up their minds that he is, then there's no incoming general manager who will do any better, because any potential general manager who would have the quote-unquote "balls" to stand up to Vivek would either a) not be offered the job in the first place, or b) refuse to accept it.
Kings Fans' only hope is that, somewhere out there, there is some sort of Long Feng type. Someone who has the sort of cloying, manipulative 'win the press conference' charisma, but is also secretly hyper-competent at their job. Somebody who can make the personnel moves they want while also manipulating Vivek into thinking that it was his idea all along.
And, personally, I don't think that GM candidate exists.
TaxMan
Starter
You forgot to add that not only do we need a GM that can play the mind games with Vivek to get what he wants, but that GM needs to also be good enough at GMing to make successful decisions to build a winner. Honestly, perhaps this was Monte for a couple years. He never seemed overly thrilled to be in front of the media or trying to build up his reputation. He probably was actually good at Vivek manipulation….up until the play on the court stalled out.
Livinthedream
All-Star
This is all fair. Not absolving Vivek of any of his history.
In the context of Monte's tenure, there didn't appear to be the wild extremes. Just an implosion at the end, which is usually what happens when a GM fails and is let go. Hired a consulting firm to get Monte. Everyone thought it was great. Was allowed to trade Haliburton. Monte got credit for the bold move and how it worked out with Sabonis. Most agreed Brown was the right hire. Beam team happens and we're all happy. After no significant off season moves, the team underperformed the following year. The next season Fox does his emo thing and hedges on returning. Team is losing and appears to be underperforming again and then here we are.
Was there a lack of patience? Maybe. Was there light at the end of the tunnel if nothing was done? No one saw that light, which is why Fox hedged and Sabonis was unhappy.
Was Vivek all the way out of the picture? Probably not. But no owner is. This team just has a continuous leak of information that other teams don't seem to have.
Hope they go through the same process of hiring a consulting firm to pick the GM, etc. Time will tell.
fansinceday1
Starter
“If Vivek Ranadivé is half the meddlesome governor that Kings Fans appear to have made up their minds that he is,”
——————————————————————
Are you suggesting that those of Us who think Vivek is probably the worst owner in the NBA have just come to this conclusion out of thin air? That we don’t have 12 years of example after example that he is a meddlesome owner who doesn’t learn from his mistakes? That Sam Amick has just made up the last couple of articles he’s written about this?
That’s how that little shot came across . Maybe I’m wrong.
I didn't forget that, I literally said that. That's what " ...but is also secretly hyper-competent at their job" means.
What I am "suggesting" is that I don't accept reading between the lines as proof. Nobody whom would have the ability to definitely confirm or deny whether or not Ranadivé meddled in McNair's ability to do his job has been willing to put their name on the record as saying so. All Kings Fans really have are second and third-hand accounts from unnamed sources and a decade or so of circumstantial evidence.
fansinceday1
Starter
Well, if I had to choose who to beleive, I’m believing Sam Amick.
You can call what he’s putting out whatever you want and accept whatever you choose.
Section 101
All-Star
So it sounds like McNair had the trade all setup to get Cam Johnson or another wing and it was vetoed by Vivek.
I really thought Vivek had learned to get out of the way with Monte, with all the "Monte didn't want to do..." I can see for sure Vivek being the one to make the call on Mike. I am sure that the way the contract extension played out and then the record and losing streak caused that. I don't think Brown should have demanded the extension through the media how he did. But hey now he gets paid to coach from his couch.
Vivek certainly forced the Zach trade, possibly not Zach or nobody else, but I imagine Monte wanted a trade that would build around the players we have with more incoming draft capital where Vivek wanted another star back to win now. Fit be damned. That's always been my chief complaint with Vivek - the inability to take a step or two back for a huge leap forward, but at least the guy has some integrity on that front. Unfortunately fans who bought tickets for next season at inflated prices are now going to pay dearly for this stubbornness.
DDR though, was that Vivek? Or someone else? A player? Wes? That's really the move that put the proverbial stick in the spokes. As some folks said when it happened it was going to be a terrible fit and it was.
As for Christie, I don't know if he's the best coach long term but I thought he did all that he could be asked. This is one where I think Monte could be working from self-preservation vs. anything else. Unfortunately I think in order to attract a top GM the decision has to belong to the new GM and so Doug will wind up a casualty. And then where do we go with the coach?
I don't know, maybe Vivek just got impatient or lost trust because of decisions he viewed as wrong by Monte and Wes? Even if that's the case right now it's looking really bad and I don't trust his ability to attract a top notch GM to the Kings. I don't trust his ability to get the right assistants in to help Doug succeed next year if he's retained and I don't trust anyone's ability to bring in a decent coach based on our recent track record.
Thankfully in the end it's all about money and egos and those shoes will get filled I just hope we haven't set ourselves back a decade.
Vivek certainly forced the Zach trade, possibly not Zach or nobody else, but I imagine Monte wanted a trade that would build around the players we have with more incoming draft capital where Vivek wanted another star back to win now. Fit be damned. That's always been my chief complaint with Vivek - the inability to take a step or two back for a huge leap forward, but at least the guy has some integrity on that front. Unfortunately fans who bought tickets for next season at inflated prices are now going to pay dearly for this stubbornness.
DDR though, was that Vivek? Or someone else? A player? Wes? That's really the move that put the proverbial stick in the spokes. As some folks said when it happened it was going to be a terrible fit and it was.
As for Christie, I don't know if he's the best coach long term but I thought he did all that he could be asked. This is one where I think Monte could be working from self-preservation vs. anything else. Unfortunately I think in order to attract a top GM the decision has to belong to the new GM and so Doug will wind up a casualty. And then where do we go with the coach?
I don't know, maybe Vivek just got impatient or lost trust because of decisions he viewed as wrong by Monte and Wes? Even if that's the case right now it's looking really bad and I don't trust his ability to attract a top notch GM to the Kings. I don't trust his ability to get the right assistants in to help Doug succeed next year if he's retained and I don't trust anyone's ability to bring in a decent coach based on our recent track record.
Thankfully in the end it's all about money and egos and those shoes will get filled I just hope we haven't set ourselves back a decade.
The biggest mistakes Monte made prior to this season were mistakes of inaction. There was a moment of opportunity in the 2023 off-season with a 48 win team that had come within 1 game of winning a playoff series and he did almost nothing to build on that. Typically when someone wins Executive of the Year they earn themselves more leeway and maybe he would have if the Western Conference weren't so stacked with end-of-career star players all looking to make one last run at the same time.
I hated the Mike Brown firing and hated trading for LaVine even more. If those were moves that he was induced into by other influences in the front office than my overall impression of his tenure as GM improves significantly. He did well in the draft, managed the cap effectively, and built a roster of players who complimented each other. The original Beam Team was a special group, I'm not going to retroactively dismiss them as a fluke. They were talented, they had a common goal that they believed in, and they kept the pedal on the gas for the full 82 games and then some. Monte gets credit for putting that team together and I hope it's enough to earn him another shot at being the lead guy in a front office at some point because he's good at it.
Looking forward, the situation appears to be so bad right now (winning coach abruptly fired mid-season, star player gives vote of no confidence and promptly gets traded, GM steps down the second the season ends just 2 years after winning an Executive of the Year award) that whoever wants the job is already starting out with a 6 foot hole dug that they'll need to climb out of. I like to end the season by finding the silver lining though and in the NBA hope is always a lottery bounce away, so we just keep grinding. For all his faults, I have no doubts about Vivek's desire to win. That separates him from the Donald Sterling category of meddling owners at least and means there's a chance if we hit upon a star player to ride that momentum to another long playoff run.
I hated the Mike Brown firing and hated trading for LaVine even more. If those were moves that he was induced into by other influences in the front office than my overall impression of his tenure as GM improves significantly. He did well in the draft, managed the cap effectively, and built a roster of players who complimented each other. The original Beam Team was a special group, I'm not going to retroactively dismiss them as a fluke. They were talented, they had a common goal that they believed in, and they kept the pedal on the gas for the full 82 games and then some. Monte gets credit for putting that team together and I hope it's enough to earn him another shot at being the lead guy in a front office at some point because he's good at it.
Looking forward, the situation appears to be so bad right now (winning coach abruptly fired mid-season, star player gives vote of no confidence and promptly gets traded, GM steps down the second the season ends just 2 years after winning an Executive of the Year award) that whoever wants the job is already starting out with a 6 foot hole dug that they'll need to climb out of. I like to end the season by finding the silver lining though and in the NBA hope is always a lottery bounce away, so we just keep grinding. For all his faults, I have no doubts about Vivek's desire to win. That separates him from the Donald Sterling category of meddling owners at least and means there's a chance if we hit upon a star player to ride that momentum to another long playoff run.
LPKingsFan
All-Star
Where’s this from, radio reports?
sactowndog
All-Star
yeah and well if you remember we tied Chicago in the standings and Orlando (who had Chicago’s pick) won the coin flip. They took Franz Wagner and we took Davion Mitchell. Had we traded HB chances are good we lose 1 additional game and likely draft Wagner.
And what I'm saying is that I don't have to choose to believe anybody. I consider myself agnostic on the subject: maybe it's true, maybe it isn't.
You will, if you are so inclined, notice that at no point have I ever said that it wasn't true. I just don't care to run with it like it's fact. And, if it is true, I don't believe that there is a candidate that exists who will succeed where McNair failed, barring the aforementioned Long Feng type.
There's a lot of folks out to get their proverbial pound of flesh and show they were the smart one and nobody is going to challenge them so I do agree with Slim on "we don't have to believe anybody". Everyone leaking has their own agenda to get out in front of.
We just seem to be an organization with no direction and no plan right now. I don't think the Beam Team was a fluke. And even if it was it was a magical season that deserved more than where we stand today.
We just seem to be an organization with no direction and no plan right now. I don't think the Beam Team was a fluke. And even if it was it was a magical season that deserved more than where we stand today.
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