Loren Woods

[walker60]

GP seems, confident about our front-court question is who can we trade to get value back? Kenny Thomas is highly undervalued in this league and his contract makes teams less-attractive is there possible trading options you see us trading that teams will be interested?

Good analysis. I don't see who we could trade KT for. What we want is a solid role-playing PF who will do the dirty things and block shots and grab boards. Except for the shot-blocking, that's what KT brings to the table. Yes, he pouts when he doesn't play, but I don't recall him ever going public with his discontent.

He has a crappy contract, but like TheJoker said, he's an underrated player. Trading straight across for another PF using KT as trade bait probably won't happen, unless we are willing to take less talent in return. A trade definitley isn't out of the works, but I don't think its very likely at this point.

 

[TheJoker]

Good analysis. I don't see who we could trade KT for. What we want is a solid role-playing PF who will do the dirty things and block shots and grab boards. Except for the shot-blocking, that's what KT brings to the table. Yes, he pouts when he doesn't play, but I don't recall him ever going public with his discontent.

He has a crappy contract, but like TheJoker said, he's an underrated player. Trading straight across for another PF using KT as trade bait probably won't happen, unless we are willing to take less talent in return. A trade definitley isn't out of the works, but I don't think its very likely at this point.

The Kings, need a front-court player who plays consistant down-low.

if we want a talented 4, we need to trade one our core players which seems very unlikely at this point. it's unfortunate this Organization seems to think our front-court is satisfying because it's not.

 

[TheJoker]

I find it peculiar that you think KT is both undervalued and overpaid.

The Kings' offseason, insofar as player movement/additions, is over.

He is undervalued, no one is gonna take on his contract unless we add a good player in the package.

and i do agree that we are done with adding anyone i have no hope for trades we are set IMO . . . .
​

 

[Kings113]

The Kings, need a front-court player who plays consistant down-low.

if we want a talented 4, we need to trade one our core players which seems very unlikely at this point. it's unfortunate this Organization seems to think our front-court is satisfying because it's not.

Everyone says this, but who is that or those "talented 4s"?

 

[walker60]

With the production that we get from SAR and KT, I think we have a very solid rotation at PF.

 

[Sac.Kings]

Aside from a defensive viewpoint, our PF rotation is good plus the defense isn't bad, just undersized. If Williams makes the team, that will help the defense part a lot.

 

[Entity]

Everyone says this, but who is that or those "talented 4s"?

That is the million dollar question. All i see is "superstar PF" Or we need a big name PF. well do you know how many superstart PF's there are that ARE NOT staples on their current team. Be it MVP caliber or hot youngster waiting to be a superstart. Are you ready for the amount




Give up?





ZERO absolutley NO Power Fowards that we can get because Why would the spurs trade Duncan or the wolves trade Garnett or bobcats trade Okafor or Raptors with Bosh Magic with Howard Memphis with Gasol or Dallas with Dirk. But we got a superstar SF and star PG and a star C and soon to be star maybe higher SG. and some nice role playing PF and young talent to boot.

 

[TheJoker]

Everyone says this, but who is that or those "talented 4s"?

We don't need a superstar just a caliber player whos willing to bang consistantly and give us a superior defensive presence until we don't find a true banger down-low i'm afraid to say we will ever be in the level we are going to hope.

 

[Entity]

Thats just it all anyone can say is a player or someone. Name me that person that we can get that will be SUPERIOR????? You got all these adjectives and no proper names.

 

[Kings113]

Thats just it all anyone can say is a player or someone. Name me that person that we can get that will be SUPERIOR????? You got all these adjectives and no proper names.

Indeed.

 

[SacTownKid]

Everyone says this, but who is that or those "talented 4s"?

You can't ask that question, it's against the rules!

 

[TheJoker]

Thats just it all anyone can say is a player or someone. Name me that person that we can get that will be SUPERIOR????? You got all these adjectives and no proper names.

Why mention names? all we have to do is just get someone who has that caliber like i mention it doesn't have to be a superstar of any kind.

we have lacked real inside presense for a long time we just need a consistant banger and a defender and a guy who can play down-low to get to that other level.

 

[Kings113]

We don't need a superstar just a caliber player whos willing to bang consistantly and give us a superior defensive presence until we don't find a true banger down-low i'm afraid to say we will ever be in the level we are going to hope.

So, why are you talking about an addition? Would of course be through trade at this point.

The kind of player you're talking about sounds like Etan Thomas or Jeff Foster. Also, have to keep Justin Williams in mind, he has a good chance to make our team and has already impressed the Kings organization. I think he'll develop into a solid at least, defensive big man.

 

[Entity]

Why mention names? all we have to do is just get someone who has that caliber like i mention it doesn't have to be a superstar of any kind.

we have lacked real inside presense for a long time we just need a consistant banger and a defender and a guy who can play down-low to get to that other level.

you are making my point. Everybody had the ficticious Defensive Banger to solidify our frontcourt. But we can't get him and nobody knows who he is. Just saying somebody is redundant. Name me just one person that perfectly fits that role the we CAN GET.

 

[TheJoker]

So, why are you talking about an addition? Would of course be through trade at this point.

I'm just talking about what we need to get to that other level

 

[Entity]

Shareef is a very good defender in the post. He only started 30 games last year. he played Garnett twice holding him to 11 points one game and 22 the second game in that second game Reef scored 19 points himself and Garnett only had 5 boards in 40 min. He played Okafor twice holding him to 10 and 8 points. He played Duncan once Duncan did score 24 but Reef scored 25. hmm lets see he held K-mart to 13 and 11 points in 2 games. Held Rasheed to 10 points. Held Shawn Marion to 16 while Reef poured in 33. ahh Bosh scored 22 but so did Reef in that game while Reef out rebounded him by 2. I am looking for team with actual good PF's Reef started against he played other like Utah they start Okur and Tag in that game. Tag had nine while Okur had 5.

Damn the more i look at Reefs numbers at the first of the year when he started he looks very good as a low post defender and a good scorer. He could easily get 15 to 20 points any night.

 

[Kings113]

SAR isn't a quality rebounder, but he's capable of getting 8 a game if he starts a full season. Obviously he couldn't last year. SAR's an interior presence in the post offensively and man-to-man, but not an intimidator or shotblocker.

 

[Entity]

yeah he isn't a shot blocker but he isn't going to get backed down. Shot blocking comes from help defense anyway. If everybody plays sound man to man defense shot blocking won't be needed as much.

 

[Rome]

Honestly, I would trade Kenny Thomas or Brad Miller before I try to trade Reef.

 

[Kings113]

yeah he isn't a shot blocker but he isn't going to get backed down. Shot blocking comes from help defense anyway. If everybody plays sound man to man defense shot blocking won't be needed as much.

Yeah. Having a shotblocker is convenient. But, I think we already could have one in Woods, and another potentially in Justin Williams, who is also a banger. Some obviously don't care for Woods much, or at all. Amundson's a banger, but shotblocking is ? mark. He showed he could in the summer league though .

I agree Rome.

 

[SacTownKid]

No question we needed shotblocking.

That's where Woods comes in. Per minute he is one of the best shotblockers in the league. Not the best player by any means but I think if given minutes he can help alleviate some of our desperation of not having a shotblocker. That and I think he fits into everything Musselman has said he is trying to do with this team.

With the way our team is constructed we need someone who can turn shots away at the basket. Hopefully Justin can make the team and we'll have two quality shotblockers.

 

[Kings113]

No question we needed shotblocking.

That's where Woods comes in. Per minute he is one of the best shotblockers in the league. Not the best player by any means but I think if given minutes he can help alleviate some of our desperation of not having a shotblocker. That and I think he fits into everything Musselman has said he is trying to do with this team.

With the way our team is constructed we need someone who can turn shots away at the basket. Hopefully Justin can make the team and we'll have two quality shotblockers.

agreed

 

[TheJoker]

Yeah. Having a shotblocker is convenient. But, I think we already could have one in Woods

Are you joking?

 

[Kings113]

Are you joking?

Absolutely not. C'mon now chap, by now you should know how I feel about Woods from the main thread about him in Kings Rap (post #269 the latest on that).

 

[Bricklayer]

What a bunch of loons.

We could have Bill Russel on the team, but if he's buried behind other bigs and rarely hits the floor, its worth nothing. Having shotblocking 12th men is rouhgly as significant as guys having nipples. Its all for show.

The SF minutes are all claimed -- 35-40min of them by Ron. The PF minutes are all claimed too -- it is almost inconceivable that Kenny and Reef will not average at least 48min combined. That's an average of 24min per player. And frankly at that level one or the other is going to be pissed. Which means that the grand total of our not that special shotblocker's minutes will, at most, be the roughly 10-15 behind Brad.

And yes, shotblocking is more important than a post defender, because the shotblocking makes the other eleven guys better basketball players, and the 12 guys ont he other team worse basketball players. Post defense is, like all defense, valuable. But setting aside Reef being laughably overrated by some on here in that aspect, it doesn't shut down the lane to anybody but the single opponent no doubt shaking in his boots at being bodied up by Shareef Abdur-Rahim.

 

[SacTownKid]

What a bunch of loons.

We could have Bill Russel on the team, but if he's buried behind other bigs and rarely hits the floor, its worth nothing. Having shotblocking 12th men is rouhgly as significant as guys having nipples. Its all for show.

The SF minutes are all claimed -- 35-40min of them by Ron. The PF minutes are all claimed too -- it is almost inconceivable that Kenny and Reef will not average at least 48min combined. That's an average of 24min per player. And frankly at that level one or the other is going to be pissed. Which means that the grand total of our not that special shotblocker's minutes will be the roughly 10-15 behind Brad.

And yes, shotblocking is more important than a post defender, because the shotblocking makes the other eleven guys better basketball players, and the 12 guys ont he other team worse basketball players. Post defense is, like all defense, valuable. But setting aside Reef being laughably overrated by some on here in that aspect, it doesn't shut down the lane to anybody but the single opponent no doubt shaking in his boots at being bodied up by Shareef Abdur-Rahim.

I can understand what you are saying. I just hope that cycle isn't repeated as it has been the last couple of years. Having the ability but it being wasted on the bench.

You are however partly over generalizing and exaggerating shot blocking and it's actual value a tad bit. Still the presence is very important. Marcus Camby, one of the best shotblockers in the league even said the Nuggets gameplan against us was to attack the paint because we had no shotblocking. They, like most teams, succeeded in doing so. Teams know our weakness and I hope Loren gets a chance to come in and help change the culture of this team.

I don't know how the minutes will be distributed so I can't tell you what the rotation will be but 15 minutes a game for Loren sounds good to me. The only thing I don't want to see is 15 minutes one game, and 0 for the next 3 if he can help the team. Other than somewhat consistent minutes I even more so want to see Brad's minutes cut about 3-5 minutes a game. The guy just can't last a full season playing 40 minutes a game.

I also don't know if Muss plans on using Reef at C. Of course if he does that cuts away minutes from Loren or Brad. We'll see.

 

[Rome]

What a bunch of loons.

We could have Bill Russel on the team, but if he's buried behind other bigs and rarely hits the floor, its worth nothing. Having shotblocking 12th men is rouhgly as significant as guys having nipples. Its all for show.

The SF minutes are all claimed -- 35-40min of them by Ron. The PF minutes are all claimed too -- it is almost inconceivable that Kenny and Reef will not average at least 48min combined. That's an average of 24min per player. And frankly at that level one or the other is going to be pissed. Which means that the grand total of our not that special shotblocker's minutes will, at most, be the roughly 10-15 behind Brad.

And yes, shotblocking is more important than a post defender, because the shotblocking makes the other eleven guys better basketball players, and the 12 guys ont he other team worse basketball players. Post defense is, like all defense, valuable. But setting aside Reef being laughably overrated by some on here in that aspect, it doesn't shut down the lane to anybody but the single opponent no doubt shaking in his boots at being bodied up by Shareef Abdur-Rahim.

Not saying Reef is a defensive presence. I'm just simply stating that He plays better defense than Brad Miller and has a nice offensive game plus costs half the price. I think moving Brad Miller for a defensive center would be much wiser and better but the question is which team will bite and trade their defensive center for a soft shooting center like Brad Miller?

 

[Kings113]

I'd still be absolutely all over Brad for Camby.

 

[BMiller52]

Not saying Reef is a defensive presence. I'm just simply stating that He plays better defense than Brad Miller and has a nice offensive game plus costs half the price. I think moving Brad Miller for a defensive center would be much wiser and better but the question is which team will bite and trade their defensive center for a soft shooting center like Brad Miller?

I honestly think that'll change this year. Before he broke his leg Miller was a pretty good defender/rebounder, now he looks great in the WC and he'll be pushed harder by Musselman. The fact that he's like 4 inches taller helps too.

Oh and 82games.com's stats say Reef is a very bad defender: http://www.82games.com/rosenbaum3.htm

 

[BMiller52]

I'd still be absolutely all over Brad for Camby.

Too bad Denver wouldn't be.