[Game] Kings vs. Pelicans, 11/03/21 7pm Pacific, 10pm Eastern

[Kingster]

Not to nitpick, but I never really understood why some people refer to scoring more on less field goal attempts as efficiency, when the bulk of free throws are going to come from getting fouled while attempting a shot. Efficiency should be measured by FG% or EFG% or something closer to those stats than just shot attempts. If player X scores 20 points on 10/10 layups, why should he be considered less efficient than player Y who scores 20 points on 1 layup and 18 FTs that he drew attempting 9 layups? Or let's say in this case, if Barnes happened to be 1-8 FG, but took 10 more attempts and got fouled on them leading to 20 free throws, would we still say that was efficient?

Yeah, I'd say it's efficient because he got the other team into the penalty and probably foul trouble. A guy who is getting 20 free throws is causing havoc for the opposition. I like the points to shot ratio a lot. It also typically seems congruent with the eye-ball test, which is #1 in my book because of my excellent X-ray vision.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

The Pels were 1-7 (worst record in the league) coming in and were minus their top 2 players.

I know the Pels are all in on Zion but this guy already has one foot out of the league if he can't keep his weight in check his best years are behind him.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

I know the Pels are all in on Zion but this guy already has one foot out of the league if he can't keep his weight in check his best years are behind him.

You don’t have to tell me. The record will show that I predicted Ja Morant to be the best player from that draft.

Not only did I believe Zion was being vastly overrated (similarly to Blake Griffin) largely because so many are overly impressed by power dunkers — but I also subscribe to the notion that players from Duke tend to be injury prone. Even though there‘s no real good reason to believe in it other than looking at history. Which doesn’t necessarily accurately predict future events.

I’m also a Carolina fan, so there’s that too

In fairness to Zion, he did have a super good season last year. But as you said, health is and has been an issue and his weight likely plays a part in that.

 

[mac]

Yeah, I'd say it's efficient because he got the other team into the penalty and probably foul trouble. A guy who is getting 20 free throws is causing havoc for the opposition. I like the points to shot ratio a lot. It also typically seems congruent with the eye-ball test, which is #1 in my book because of my excellent X-ray vision.

Getting the other team into foul trouble is quite different from scoring efficiency though. It's impactful, productive, and valuable. Efficient? Not exactly.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

You don’t have to tell me. The record will show that I predicted Ja Morant to be the best player from that draft.

Not only did I believe Zion was being vastly overrated (similarly to Blake Griffin) largely because so many are overly impressed by power dunkers — but I also subscribe to the notion that players from Duke tend to be injury prone. Even though there‘s no real good reason to believe in it other than looking at history. Which doesn’t necessarily accurately predict future events.

I’m also a Carolina fan, so there’s that too

In fairness to Zion, he did have a super good season last year. But as you said, health is and has been an issue and his weight likely plays a part in that.

yeah there is no denying that when he plays he puts up some ridiculous stats and well the dunks give him star power that gets him on tv and that usually brings favorable officiating. He definitely seemed to be the beneficiary of manufactured hype following the 2018 class that was so huge - his class needed a star and they pushed him for all the highlight reel stuff. The shoe incident was a bit of a warning that maybe something was off with his body and mechanics but they managed to play it down. We knew the weight was a concern but they just shot out Barkley comps or what have you, I don't think I ever thought he'd be over 300lbs 2 years into his career though.

and yeah, I am never onboard with drafting a Dukie.

 

[Livinthedream]

Harkless defense has been extremely important to start the year. It's plugged the giant hole that Bagley was in for most of last year. The numbers aren't there, sure and he's better suited as an 8-9 man, but he's the best option we got

There have been too many changes across the board to simply say Harkless is a difference maker over Bagley. New coaches, new players, new lineup/rotation.

 

[EIM86]

I really~~| liked that 5-out offense we ran towards the end of the game. We should play that here and there

 

[Woot!]

Why not both?

View attachment 10727

+17 wins!

Make it so, Monte!

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Well I was simply picking on the logic of the argument, not saying that Barnes wasn't efficient.

I mean, I'm the last person on the message board to pass judgment on random pedantry; I was just amused by the timing.

 

[SacTownKid]

There have been too many changes across the board to simply say Harkless is a difference maker over Bagley. New coaches, new players, new lineup/rotation.

That is true, and Harkless should be upgraded at the first opportunity if Monte is smart, but it single handedly puts Barnes in Bagleys spot, so even though they'd be better off playing Buddy at SF according to the 5 man net ratings, Barnes at PF has been the key difference. It will be far from enough though if they don't start playing the right sets on both ends. Guards going over screens and bigs playing back off the pick and roll on defense and not owning the middle on drives offensively won't work long term and it will keep them down in the pack of playoff contenders unless Barnes/Fox/Buddy can keep trading off bailing out the team on a nightly basis.

 

[EIM86]

One nice little tidbit I heard from Fox’s post game interview was when things get stagnant they have to run the pick n roll.

 

[Das_Boot]

One nice little tidbit I heard from Fox’s post game interview was when things get stagnant they have to run the pick n roll.

Or they could not wait till things get stagnant?

Also, we're not getting Tatum for Fox without attaching some serious assets.

 

[EIM86]

Or they could not wait till things get stagnant?

Also, we're not getting Tatum for Fox without attaching some serious assets.

that trade is never happening lol. Why do Kings fans think these mega deals will ever happen

 

[Tetsujin]

Tatum slumping hard this season. Only reason he has better scoring numbers than Fox right now is that he doesn't have the good sense to stop shooting. Fairly certain Kingsfans.com would implode if that happened here.

 

[Telemachus]

Tatum slumping hard this season. Only reason he has better scoring numbers than Fox right now is that he doesn't have the good sense to stop shooting. Fairly certain Kingsfans.com would implode if that happened here.

38% from field & 26% from 3 doesn't do it for you?

 

[Woot!]

Tatum slumping hard this season. Only reason he has better scoring numbers than Fox right now is that he doesn't have the good sense to stop shooting. Fairly certain Kingsfans.com would implode if that happened here.

It was great to see Fox NOT start gunning simply because he was finally hitting some shots. In fact, his best shooting game of the season was also the one in which he took the fewest shots; maybe not coincidental. Do we want DFox to stop shooting when he's off? No. But if he's off there's a lot to be said for his being more judicious w/his shooting.

Even when he's on, this team is best served by a relatively balanced, move-the-ball, share-the wealth approach to scoring. Fox, HB, Buddy, Richaun, Tyrese, even Mitchell (!) - turns out the Kings have a bunch of guys capable of 20+ any given night. Gotta protect the ball and share the wealth, DFox. And in that regard, his 14 assists against only 4 turnovers the last couple games have also been great to see.

 

[kingsboi]

Tatum slumping hard this season. Only reason he has better scoring numbers than Fox right now is that he doesn't have the good sense to stop shooting. Fairly certain Kingsfans.com would implode if that happened here.

according to Regular season P, it's all Spaldings fault

 

[Sac.Kings]

Tatum has always been overrated to me. He’s a great player but people talk him up like he’s an all time great. He isn’t. I don’t think he’s even the best player on his team. He’s a chucker. Great when the shots go in but there have been many games where he is 5-19 from the field or even worse.

 

[Tetsujin]

according to Regular season P, it's all Spaldings fault

It's weird to see him say that because he's like the one wing whose shooting numbers aren't down.

 

[Rob-The-Great]

This is a star driven league. Teams needs starts to take over at end of games. Fox cannot be regulated down to a role player like some are suggesting. He's the closest thing we have to a star. If he doesn't take the leap neither will the kings. Barnes will fall back to his normal self just like last year. We need fox to be at least as good as last year to stand a chance. And he doesn't need to facilitate the offense to do it. And I've given up on the harkless isn't better argument. The hate for Bagley is too hard to overcome. If Bagley was playing like harkless people would be screaming for his head. I can't wait till he's off this team tho, so the debate can be over. I thought giles would he great too tho so what do I know lol. #bringbackgiles

 

[kingsboi]

It's weird to see him say that because he's like the one wing whose shooting numbers are down.

in his last three games he's had 42, 32 and 32...don't know the efficiency on those shots but he seems to be scoring the same

 

[Tetsujin]

in his last three games he's had 42, 32 and 32...don't know the efficiency on those shots but he seems to be scoring the same

Yeah, had a major typo there lmao

meant to say he's the one guy whose numbers AREN'T down.

 

[kingsboi]

Yeah, had a major typo there lmao

meant to say he's the one guy whose numbers AREN'T down.

are you catching enough shut eye?