[Game] Kings v. Magic - 3/13/17 - 7:30PT/10:30ET

The_Jamal said:
Buddy numbers with the Kings: 10 games

26.4 MPG
14.2 PPG
3.7 RPG
1.1 APG
0.8 SPG
66.7% TS (For those of you counting at home, this is insanely good)

Buddy as a starter for the Kings: 3 games

32.8 MPG
17.3 PPG
5.7 RPG
2 APG
65.6% TS (For those of you still counting at home, this should give you A LOT of hope on the kind of scorer he can be)

He's progressed so much from the start of the year and he's feeling comfortable using the same moves he used in college to light teams up. Brad Beal type production is starting to look very attainable for him.
Click to expand...

Brad Beal is probably a more explosive player. Think he can become a CJ McCollum-esque guy though.
 
Tetsujin said:
This is important when your center is not the wotld's best rebounder
Click to expand...


True. The thing about Willie is that it's going to be give and take. Him coming out and contesting players on the wing, even switching sometimes, is going to take him away from the basket. Personally I like him coming out and contesting because that's going to be an incredibly useful tool the Kings can use defensively if they use it right.
 
What worries me most about Willie isn't his rebounding, but his rim protection. In order to be successful we still need to play defense and while his ability to stay in front of smaller players and to guard the pick&roll is really nice when he is engaged, he is giving up way too early on a lot of shots, he should be able to contest. I don't care about blocked shots. What I want to see more often than not is Willie making it tough for the opposing guards to finish inside. He has the mobility to cover enough ground. All he needs to do is to become more aggressive and be locked in. I think with Willie it's once again a mindset question - like with IT, Ben, JT, DMC...... Let's hope this time our coaches can find the right buttons to push.

Skal on the other hand is way more aggressive, but also way more inexperienced. He gets to shots were Willie wouldn't even try, but man does he make mistakes on D. To all the guys criticizing Papa for missed rotations and getting lost - Skal isn't any better. He sometimes is able to recover, because he is more mobile, but both our young bigs make plenty of mistakes especially on D.

I think Papa was doing OK. He is big, he is long and he won't be moved out of the way easily. Guards did a poor job finding him on his rolls on offense and I don't think posting him up is the way to go, until he develops some kind of counter move, when the defender is taking away the right side. Rolls to the rim and sealing defenders with his wide body, should be all we need him to do on offense. On D he was moving well for such a big dude and he bothered a couple of shots due to his presence alone.
After all I like the option to have a bigger, stronger guy on the bench to back up Willie.
 
Folsomkingsfan said:
Their a team full of guys playing out of position. 2s are playing the 3. Aaron Gordon who is clearly a 4 plays a lot of 3 and 5 in smaller lineups. Who knows what hezonja is. They play biyomba and vucevic at the same time when they are both 5s. I feel bad for Frank Vogel. They need to get rid of everyone sans Payton and Gordon and start over.
Click to expand...

The Magic have been trying to find themselves a star player since Dwight was shipped out. They have yet to do so and while they have brought along a couple of nice players, they never really meshed together and like the Kings, have had a lot of turnover at the coaching position and til this day, the Magic are in the lottery time and time again trying to find that next player they can truly build around. The Kings will be and are in this same boat unless they strike gold in the draft.
 
gunks said:
I dunno, Papa just looked really slow and awkward out there. He wasn't awful though.

I think people will always hold it against him that he was picked so high, at least until he becomes a rotation player. Not really fair, but it is what it is.

That being said... I'm willing to wait it out on a gigantic 19 year old. He's made progress, so that's something!
Click to expand...

The game is really fast for him right now and understandably so, he needs to continue to work on shedding more body fat and become quicker and lighter on his feet and with time and more guidance from Joerger (hopefully), he will turn out all right.
 
KingsFanGER said:
What worries me most about Willie isn't his rebounding, but his rim protection. In order to be successful we still need to play defense and while his ability to stay in front of smaller players and to guard the pick&roll is really nice when he is engaged, he is giving up way too early on a lot of shots, he should be able to contest. I don't care about blocked shots. What I want to see more often than not is Willie making it tough for the opposing guards to finish inside. He has the mobility to cover enough ground. All he needs to do is to become more aggressive and be locked in. I think with Willie it's once again a mindset question - like with IT, Ben, JT, DMC...... Let's hope this time our coaches can find the right buttons to push.

Skal on the other hand is way more aggressive, but also way more inexperienced. He gets to shots were Willie wouldn't even try, but man does he make mistakes on D. To all the guys criticizing Papa for missed rotations and getting lost - Skal isn't any better. He sometimes is able to recover, because he is more mobile, but both our young bigs make plenty of mistakes especially on D.

I think Papa was doing OK. He is big, he is long and he won't be moved out of the way easily. Guards did a poor job finding him on his rolls on offense and I don't think posting him up is the way to go, until he develops some kind of counter move, when the defender is taking away the right side. Rolls to the rim and sealing defenders with his wide body, should be all we need him to do on offense. On D he was moving well for such a big dude and he bothered a couple of shots due to his presence alone.
After all I like the option to have a bigger, stronger guy on the bench to back up Willie.
Click to expand...

Willies offense is further along his team/help D, which is subpar at this stage, not what he was billed as coming out. He was billed as a weak side shot blocker which hasn't been evident. I hope it can be fixed
 
The_Jamal said:
Buddy numbers with the Kings: 10 games

26.4 MPG
14.2 PPG
3.7 RPG
1.1 APG
0.8 SPG
66.7% TS (For those of you counting at home, this is insanely good)

Buddy as a starter for the Kings: 3 games

32.8 MPG
17.3 PPG
5.7 RPG
2 APG
65.6% TS (For those of you still counting at home, this should give you A LOT of hope on the kind of scorer he can be)

He's progressed so much from the start of the year and he's feeling comfortable using the same moves he used in college to light teams up. Brad Beal type production is starting to look very attainable for him.
Click to expand...

Let's remember one thing about Beal, his first season he wasn't a good ball handler at all and now when you watch him play, it's night and day on how much he has improved in that aspect of his game, opening up so much for him.
 
The_Jamal said:
Buddy numbers with the Kings: 10 games

26.4 MPG
14.2 PPG
3.7 RPG
1.1 APG
0.8 SPG
66.7% TS (For those of you counting at home, this is insanely good)

Buddy as a starter for the Kings: 3 games

32.8 MPG
17.3 PPG
5.7 RPG
2 APG
65.6% TS (For those of you still counting at home, this should give you A LOT of hope on the kind of scorer he can be)

He's progressed so much from the start of the year and he's feeling comfortable using the same moves he used in college to light teams up. Brad Beal type production is starting to look very attainable for him.
Click to expand...

That is what I have been saying for awhile. :)

I think buddy can be a 20ppg scorer in the league, and I think it could happen as early as next year! :cool:

Just watch his release, it is quick and it is picturesque! He just needs a little bit of daylight to get his shot off and he is accurate!

I think he can be a special player! :)
 
Last edited:
The balance last night was incredible. This was a team!

You can make the argument we haven't see a team like that in 6+ years of Boogie. I don't know if that's a criticism, well yes it is :), but also observation that imbalance and shot distribution with Boogie could leave teammates feeling left out on the periphery of the action. It doesn't make team better without him automatically, but ultimately it means you can get more out of the talent you have. When guys are rewarded with scoring opportunities in the flow they are more inclined to stay engaged, make extra effort, and dive to the ground and etc. Its just human nature and it is conducive to synergy. The sum becomes greater than the parts.

In this context there is no room for guys like Tyreke, Affalo or Rudy. These guys have that black hole and ball stopper mentality not to mention other shortcomings like creaky knees and lazy defense. Anyways here is the FGA distribution (points) among the Top 7 shooters and scorers last night:
  • 16 FGAs (18 points)
  • 13 FGAs (17 points)
  • 10 FGAs (14 points)
  • 9 FGAs (19 points)
  • 9 FGAs (19 points)
  • 9 FGAs (14 points)
  • 9 FGAs (11 points)
It doesn't get more balanced than this. This was not possible with Boogie. You still need a star or two and go-to player in the crunch time. Like I said weeks ago the best candidates for stardom are Buddy, Skal, and hopefully BOTH lottery picks. The rest of the season should be dedicated to determining and nurturing this possibility. Seems like this coach will finally be intent on doing so. Starting Willie and Skal from here on out is no-brainer. We know what Koufos can do. We know Papa is a long ways off. We know Tolliver is best as off-the-bench sniper. If this coach trots out anyone not named Willie or Skal over last 15 games at PF and C, he does the team a disservice. I think he'll get it right.
 
Larry89 said:
Good offensive balance but the defense is still god awful
Click to expand...

Between all the young guys, the under sized guys, and the old washed up guys on this team. .... it's not surprising that our defense sucks.

We have a coach who values defense, so at least there is a potential for growth on that end of the floor. It's going to take some roster moves as well.
 
Larry89 said:
Good offensive balance but the defense is still god awful
Click to expand...

It helped playing a team that is 3rd worst in the league in 3 point shooting and it showed last night. Wide open shots all game long, hit some, missed more. They should of continued to attack the paint, Kings had no answer.
 
The_Jamal said:
Buddy numbers with the Kings: 10 games

26.4 MPG
14.2 PPG
3.7 RPG
1.1 APG
0.8 SPG
66.7% TS (For those of you counting at home, this is insanely good)

Buddy as a starter for the Kings: 3 games

32.8 MPG
17.3 PPG
5.7 RPG
2 APG
65.6% TS (For those of you still counting at home, this should give you A LOT of hope on the kind of scorer he can be)

He's progressed so much from the start of the year and he's feeling comfortable using the same moves he used in college to light teams up. Brad Beal type production is starting to look very attainable for him.
Click to expand...

I'd like to know some 2-guards who were this impressive at the end of their rookie season. I can't really think of any off the top of my head.
 
KingsFanGER said:
What worries me most about Willie isn't his rebounding, but his rim protection. In order to be successful we still need to play defense and while his ability to stay in front of smaller players and to guard the pick&roll is really nice when he is engaged, he is giving up way too early on a lot of shots, he should be able to contest. I don't care about blocked shots. What I want to see more often than not is Willie making it tough for the opposing guards to finish inside. He has the mobility to cover enough ground. All he needs to do is to become more aggressive and be locked in. I think with Willie it's once again a mindset question - like with IT, Ben, JT, DMC...... Let's hope this time our coaches can find the right buttons to push.

Skal on the other hand is way more aggressive, but also way more inexperienced. He gets to shots were Willie wouldn't even try, but man does he make mistakes on D. To all the guys criticizing Papa for missed rotations and getting lost - Skal isn't any better. He sometimes is able to recover, because he is more mobile, but both our young bigs make plenty of mistakes especially on D.

I think Papa was doing OK. He is big, he is long and he won't be moved out of the way easily. Guards did a poor job finding him on his rolls on offense and I don't think posting him up is the way to go, until he develops some kind of counter move, when the defender is taking away the right side. Rolls to the rim and sealing defenders with his wide body, should be all we need him to do on offense. On D he was moving well for such a big dude and he bothered a couple of shots due to his presence alone.
After all I like the option to have a bigger, stronger guy on the bench to back up Willie.
Click to expand...

It's really hard to put too much stock into the defense right now. We removed our defensive anchor with a bunch of new guys who weren't getting big minutes now key staples on the team. That's really tough to expect us to gel defensively right off the bat.

I'm fine waiting till next season to really get a sense for where these guys can be defensively. A training-camp/preseason with Buddy/WCS/Skal/Malachi the rookies will do absolute wonders I think.
 
kingsboi said:
seeing 4 blocks out of him is my favorite stat out of all :)
Click to expand...

Seems like, aside from the brief Dalembert rental, that the Kings have had a vacancy at that niche since, oh, Keon maybe? As the owner of a Justin Williams jersey, I like thinking the long drought might be over.
 
The_Jamal said:
It's really hard to put too much stock into the defense right now. We removed our defensive anchor with a bunch of new guys who weren't getting big minutes now key staples on the team. That's really tough to expect us to gel defensively right off the bat.

I'm fine waiting till next season to really get a sense for where these guys can be defensively. A training-camp/preseason with Buddy/WCS/Skal/Malachi the rookies will do absolute wonders I think.
Click to expand...

We never had a defensive anchor....the defense only showed spurts of putting it together before coming back down to earth.
 
kingsboi said:
We never had a defensive anchor....the defense only showed spurts of putting it together before coming back down to earth.
Click to expand...


Agreed. It could be the defensive ideology of Joerger because we know there are weaknesses within his system guarding 3's and pick and roll that might only be correctable via specific personnel, but teams are starting to really hammer Cuz in pick and roll situations. His defensive impact was a lot greater previous to this year, or at least it sure did seem like it.
 
John Galt said:
Quincy Douby and Nik Stauskas come to mind right off the bat
Click to expand...

Nik was nowhere near to Buddy. Hardly impressive except glimpses of passable and token baskets. He played wide eyed and scared. He was overmatched and outclassed. Here's his rookie game log. Not pretty:

http://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/2991042/year/2015/nik-stauskas

In April, his best month, he scored double figures once every 5 games. He didn't have a floor game. He had an allergy to physical contact. Buddy is not afraid of contact or timid or scared. He has scored double digits in 9 of 10 games as a King with a 14 PPG average and stupendous TS%. Buddy can make a case for ROY if he keeps up production at high efficiency (15 PPG 65% TS) or increase production at lower efficiency (20 PPG 60% TS). Embiid has only play 31 games. Saric has been good not great. This rookie class has no stand-outs. But to even suggest Nik and Buddy in the same breath is an insult to Buddy....and the latter is scratching surface of what he can do. Here is the rookie ladder on NBA.com. Buddy is ranked 5th and likely to move up:

http://www.nba.com/rookie-ladder
 
Blob said:
Nik was nowhere near to Buddy. Hardly impressive except glimpses of passable and token baskets. He played wide eyed and scared. He was overmatched and outclassed. Here's his rookie game log. Not pretty:

http://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/2991042/year/2015/nik-stauskas

In April, his best month, he scored double figures once every 5 games. He didn't have a floor game. He had an allergy to physical contact. Buddy is not afraid of contact or timid or scared. He has scored double digits in 9 of 10 games as a King with a 14 PPG average and stupendous TS%. Buddy can make a case for ROY if he keeps up production at high efficiency (15 PPG 65% TS) or increase production at lower efficiency (20 PPG 60% TS). Embiid has only play 31 games. Saric has been good not great. This rookie class has no stand-outs. But to even suggest Nik and Buddy in the same breath is an insult to Buddy....and the latter is scratching surface of what he can do. Here is the rookie ladder on NBA.com. Buddy is ranked 5th and likely to move up:

http://www.nba.com/rookie-ladder
Click to expand...

Okay, this is weird. That post was deleted hours ago. How were you able to quote it?
 
Blob said:
Nik was nowhere near to Buddy. Hardly impressive except glimpses of passable and token baskets. He played wide eyed and scared. He was overmatched and outclassed. Here's his rookie game log. Not pretty:

http://www.espn.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/2991042/year/2015/nik-stauskas

In April, his best month, he scored double figures once every 5 games. He didn't have a floor game. He had an allergy to physical contact. Buddy is not afraid of contact or timid or scared. He has scored double digits in 9 of 10 games as a King with a 14 PPG average and stupendous TS%. Buddy can make a case for ROY if he keeps up production at high efficiency (15 PPG 65% TS) or increase production at lower efficiency (20 PPG 60% TS). Embiid has only play 31 games. Saric has been good not great. This rookie class has no stand-outs. But to even suggest Nik and Buddy in the same breath is an insult to Buddy....and the latter is scratching surface of what he can do. Here is the rookie ladder on NBA.com. Buddy is ranked 5th and likely to move up:

http://www.nba.com/rookie-ladder
Click to expand...

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