[Game] Kings @ Mavericks, 3/05/2022 2pm Pacific 5pm Eastern

[kb02]

44 points on 31 shots is good dude, jesus christ. You can't pretend to be a math guy and still have a take like this.

Nah. I’ve been saying it for a long time, the only way to build around Fox is the Al, Russ model. Giving him 31 shots leads the Kings down that road and to more losses than wins. This team needs balance not a team built around a dude, who’s one dimensional.

And when yhall going to stop celebrating fools gold games against second rate teams like OKC and a Mavs team missing its star?

 

[kb02]

Also, go ahead and tell the class why Fox lost the Kings this game.

Don’t need to. In a must win game, where the opponent is missing its superstar, the Kings find a way to lose. But you seem to think the Kings have a two yr window when they’re bleeding money and both McNair and Vivek publicly stated they’re going for the play-in. Guess you’re right and they’re lying, so they’ll just be good with a close loss.

 

[Tetsujin]

Don’t need to. In a must win game, where the opponent is missing its superstar, the Kings find a way to lose. But you seem to think the Kings have a two yr window when they’re bleeding money and both McNair and Vivek publicly stated they’re going for the play-in. Guess you’re right and they’re lying, so they’ll just be good with a close loss.

They haven't though? They said getting to it would be nice but that the Sabonis move was made in the service of the future.

 

[Turgenev]

Why the bicker? The games are watchable again and the Kings will still have a lottery pick and likely a new coach next year. Let's rejoice.

 

[The_Jamal]

Don’t need to. In a must win game, where the opponent is missing its superstar, the Kings find a way to lose. But you seem to think the Kings have a two yr window when they’re bleeding money and both McNair and Vivek publicly stated they’re going for the play-in. Guess you’re right and they’re lying, so they’ll just be good with a close loss.

McNair has pretty clearly stated this is a move for the future. If they were all-in on the play-in, they would have mortgaged future picks. Other than that, you're totally right!

 

[miltonap]

Why the bicker? The games are watchable again and the Kings will still have a lottery pick and likely a new coach next year. Let's rejoice.

I agree. I'm optimistic for the first time in a LONG time.

 

[The_Jamal]

Especially when you factor in the fact he somehow only had 6 free throws all game.

18-31
3-4 from 3
5-6 from FT

If that's not elite scoring/efficiency, literally nothing is.

 

[captain bill]

Nah. I’ve been saying it for a long time, the only way to build around Fox is the Al, Russ model. Giving him 31 shots leads the Kings down that road and to more losses than wins. This team needs balance not a team built around a dude, who’s one dimensional.

And when yhall going to stop celebrating fools gold games against second rate teams like OKC and a Mavs team missing its star?

Ummmm Dinwiddie played and had a pretty good game….

 

[SLAB]

Ummmm Dinwiddie played and had a pretty good game….

So we’re supposed to feel … good? Optimistic? That our fully healthy Fox / Sabonis / Whoever core lost to Spencer Dinwiddie?

Idk, I’m not feeling the optimism. We still stink. Just maybe a little less that before but also with less future team control of one of its good pieces. Lmao whatever, I’ve expected to never be good again so I’m at salty sarcastic peace with everything.

 

[kb02]

McNair has pretty clearly stated this is a move for the future. If they were all-in on the play-in, they would have mortgaged future picks. Other than that, you're totally right!

Keeping Barnes was definitely a win now move. These moving goal posts about the play-in this year is just hilarious.

CD: Are these moves “win now” or “win longterm”?

McNair:

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs and continued success in the playoffs, so through that lens, Dave, we want to make the playoffs as quickly as we can, but in a sustainable way, and in a way that we can not just get there, but build from there.”

https://khtk.com/17828/mcnair-deadline-cds/

 

[kb02]

Ummmm Dinwiddie played and had a pretty good game….

He’s a good player, but as we’ve seen over and over and over again, the Kings tend to give career nights to a random NBA player each night.

 

[kb02]

18-31
3-4 from 3
5-6 from FT

If that's not elite scoring/efficiency, literally nothing is.

Scoring on volume. When yhall going to focus on winning? Assists, secondary assists, controlling pace, defense, hustle points, running for each other, leading, balance…

 

[The_Jamal]

Keeping Barnes was definitely a win now move. These moving goal posts about the play-in this year is just hilarious.

CD: Are these moves “win now” or “win longterm”?

McNair:

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs and continued success in the playoffs, so through that lens, Dave, we want to make the playoffs as quickly as we can, but in a sustainable way, and in a way that we can not just get there, but build from there.”

https://khtk.com/17828/mcnair-deadline-cds/

Ok? Nice self-own? "Make the playoffs quickly, but in a sustainable way" Soooooo, in other words, building a long-term winner, not selling out all-in this year?

I swear we're speaking 2 different languages. You just have the strangest way of interpreting everything so so wrong.

 

[steelevt]

18-31
3-4 from 3
5-6 from FT

If that's not elite scoring/efficiency, literally nothing is.

That looks like the reason we lost right there. Not holiday going 4/12 and 1/7 from the 3 in 29 mins and leaving DFS on the last play. Not DDV shooting 3/10 in 33 mins and taking an ill advised 26 footer with plenty of time left on the clock. Not Davion going 2/9 and 0/3 from the in 23 mins. It's not the free throw disparity despite the kings scoring way more points in the paint. It's definitely the guy scoring 44pt with a 58fg%, 75ft% and 83ft% and 6:1 assist/TO ratio.

 

[hgut]

That looks like the reason we lost right there. Not holiday going 4/12 and 1/7 from the 3 in 29 mins and leaving DFS on the last play. Not DDV shooting 3/10 in 33 mins and taking an ill advised 26 footer with plenty of time left on the clock. Not Davion going 2/9 and 0/3 from the in 23 mins. It's not the free throw disparity despite the kings scoring way more points in the paint. It's definitely the guy scoring 44pt with a 58fg%, 75ft% and 83ft% and 6:1 assist/TO ratio.

That's the problem. In this team it seems that every player needs to play a good game to win. Even against a Mavs team without Doncic.

That's not realistic.

 

[Rain man]

Keeping Barnes was definitely a win now move. These moving goal posts about the play-in this year is just hilarious.

CD: Are these moves “win now” or “win longterm”?

McNair:

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs and continued success in the playoffs, so through that lens, Dave, we want to make the playoffs as quickly as we can, but in a sustainable way, and in a way that we can not just get there, but build from there.”

https://khtk.com/17828/mcnair-deadline-cds/

I mean did you actually read the quote? Our stated goal is making the playoffs as quickly as we can, but in a sustainable way. That is the opposite of “all in, playoffs or bust, mortgage the future for the 8 seed.” I think you owned yourself.

 

[kb02]

I mean did you actually read the quote? Our stated goal is making the playoffs as quickly as we can, but in a sustainable way. That is the opposite of “all in, playoffs or bust, mortgage the future for the 8 seed.” I think you owned yourself.

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs“

 

[kb02]

Ok? Nice self-own? "Make the playoffs quickly, but in a sustainable way" Soooooo, in other words, building a long-term winner, not selling out all-in this year?

I swear we're speaking 2 different languages. You just have the strangest way of interpreting everything so so wrong.

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs“

 

[Rain man]

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs“

So you are one of those guys that reads the article title, and not the article, and then argues vociferously that your interpretation of the actual article is correct.

 

[kb02]

Ok? Nice self-own? "Make the playoffs quickly, but in a sustainable way" Soooooo, in other words, building a long-term winner, not selling out all-in this year?

I swear we're speaking 2 different languages. You just have the strangest way of interpreting everything so so wrong.

That’s actually pretty funny. I mean, my weak signals were right, and the Kings only kept Fox after shopping him and not getting any decent return. And I’m certainly comfortable in the choices that I’ve made in life. They seem to have been quite right.

 

[kb02]

So you are one of those guys that reads the article title, and not the article, and then argues vociferously that your interpretation of the actual article is correct.

It’s in the q&a.


CD: Are these moves “win now” or “win longterm”?

McNair:

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs and continued success in the playoffs, so through that lens…”

Citing his hedging after that comment doesn’t change the fact that their goal was to make the playoffs.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Scoring on volume.

Dude, he had a .667 TS% for the day on that volume. It's not like he took 52 shots to get 44 points, it was 31 shots (and fouled twice not counting the and-1s, for 33 total "possessions ending in a scoring attempt") .667 is ridiculous efficiency, particularly at that volume, for a guard. League average TS% is about .560. Volume-shooting guards that aren't great at threes don't come close to .667. Kobe never touched .600 for a season. Jordan snuck past .600 four times, never crossed .620. And those guys were averaging low-to-mid 20s in FGA per game - that's high enough volume to start bringing down your efficiency. Your classic volume scoring guard - Allen Iverson - was at .518 TS% for his career. There may be others, but the only guard I can find who has put up .667 TS% for a season is Steph Curry, who has edged past that mark twice (both times he led the whole league in TS%) and that was on 20 or fewer FGA.

Dismissing Fox's DAY - not his season, not his career, but THIS DAY - as "volume scoring" is absolutely comical. Not unexpected, but comical.

When yhall going to focus on winning? Assists, secondary assists, controlling pace, defense, hustle points, running for each other, leading, balance…

You didn't watch the game, did you?

 

[Rain man]

It’s in the q&a.


CD: Are these moves “win now” or “win longterm”?

McNair:

“I would say, our stated goal is the playoffs and continued success in the playoffs, so through that lens…”

Citing his hedging after that comment doesn’t change the fact that they’re goal was to make the playoffs.

You picked the first thing he said, rather than his full in context answer. But whatever…

 

[captain bill]

So we’re supposed to feel … good? Optimistic? That our fully healthy Fox / Sabonis / Whoever core lost to Spencer Dinwiddie?

Idk, I’m not feeling the optimism. We still stink. Just maybe a little less that before but also with less future team control of one of its good pieces. Lmao whatever, I’ve expected to never be good again so I’m at salty sarcastic peace with everything.

Was being sarcastic implying that Dinwiddie is their star, but yeah I agree we stink. But at least it was an entertaining game and we maybe get super sayan Fox for the rest of the year. Maybe if we win the lotto and get someone who’s an immediate major impact player we can crawl into the playoffs but I’m not super optimistic. My initial take on the trade that we might not make the playoffs til 2030 still stands but at least the team is entertaining

 

[kb02]

Dude, he had a .667 TS% for the day on that volume. It's not like he took 52 shots to get 44 points, it was 31 shots (and fouled twice not counting the and-1s, for 33 total "possessions ending in a scoring attempt") .667 is ridiculous efficiency, particularly at that volume, for a guard. League average TS% is about .560. Volume-shooting guards that aren't great at threes don't come close to .667. Kobe never touched .600 for a season. Jordan snuck past .600 four times, never crossed .620. And those guys were averaging low-to-mid 20s in FGA per game - that's high enough volume to start bringing down your efficiency. Your classic volume scoring guard - Allen Iverson - was at .518 TS% for his career. There may be others, but the only guard I can find who has put up .667 TS% for a season is Steph Curry, who has edged past that mark twice (both times he led the whole league in TS%) and that was on 20 or fewer FGA.

Dismissing Fox's DAY - not his season, not his career, but THIS DAY - as "volume scoring" is absolutely comical. Not unexpected, but comical.



You didn't watch the game, did you?

I’ve said it before, a team that relies on Fox taking 31 shots is a road that this team should never be going down.

As for watching the game, I watched a decent amount. I didn’t post during the game, because I had company over.

 

[kb02]

You picked the first thing he said, rather than his full in context answer. But whatever…

The first thing he said was the direct response to the question. The other stuff was hedging.

 

[captain bill]

Worth noting that today was loss 42, clinching our 15th straight losing season. Go Kings!

 

[hrdboild]

I’ve said it before, a team that relies on Fox taking 31 shots is a road that this team should never be going down.

As for watching the game, I watched a decent amount. I didn’t post during the game, because I had company over.

Some of us are optimistic because the team we have right now with Fox/Barnes/Sabonis is better then the team we had for the first 2/3 of the season and it didn't cost Monte any future draft picks or dead weight contracts to make that happen. Sure, Barnes is somewhat miscast as the third pillar of that core because he has games like this too often where he's basically invisible. If Barnes had taken 6 or 7 more shots in this game at his usual efficiency than Fox wouldn't have needed to shoot as much. I'm not going to fault Fox for stepping up and answering the bell on a night when his scoring was needed. This team obviously needs to acquire more consistent wing scorers/defenders in the off-season if we're hoping for a big improvement next season.

We're also currently 6th in the lottery with just over a month of season left. Yes, obviously the goal has changed because obviously we're not good enough to make the play-in. We're 24-42 right now. I would have been happy if we made it and I'll still be happy if we don't. For over a decade we've been begging this team to make a big move and they finally did -- they traded a young player who might one day lead a team for an All Star big man who can lead a team right now. It took guts to make a trade like that. You're out to prove a point which is fine too. But criticizing other fans for adapting their mood to fit the current situation is kindof petty. "Moving the goal posts" is an idiomatic expression generally used when people change their argument repeatedly to ensure that they never have to admit when they're wrong. I don't think that applies to fans accepting that the play-in is probably out of reach who are now looking forward to progress next season instead. That's just accepting reality.

 

[Spike]

That's the problem. In this team it seems that every player needs to play a good game to win. Even against a Mavs team without Doncic.

That's not realistic.

It doesn't have to be a good game. A mediocre game gets the win here. A coach who knows how to stop the bleeding at crucial moments gets a win here.

I can't believe that we're using THIS game to talk about Fox. He's the reason the lead was built, and he's the reason we were still in it after the lead was pissed away. He had a great night, and if anyone else shows up, this game isn't close.

DDV doesn't bomb from Yuba City if the coach draws up something better. Fox should get the last shot, or at least be a decoy, if the coach knows what he's doing. How many times have we lost a game in the third because the other bench makes an adjustment? It's not just that the players "play harder."

It just goes to show that coaching is just as important as who you have lacing up their shoes.

 

[Spike]

The first thing he said was the direct response to the question. The other stuff was hedging.

No GM in their right mind would tell fans to "trust the process." It was no hedge; he said that he's building something sustainable, meaning long term, not short term.