ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
I'd be willing to bet at the very least on defense, that he won't give up as many wide open 3 point looks
[Game] Kings @ Lakers - 2/28/14 - 7:30 pm
- Thread starter VF21
- Start date
I'd be willing to bet at the very least on defense, that he won't give up as many wide open 3 point looks
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
That he might be a better all around player
In order to answer your question, I need to know what you think the benefit is in continuing to throw Ben to the wolves. I think it's pretty apparent he's not NBA-ready. Putting him out there and having him continue to struggle every single night can't be better for him than only using him in a limited role. His confidence cannot be very high right now, so saying he'd lose confidence if we quit starting him doesn't pass the smell test.
The real benefit to using OJ over Ben - at least for the 10 days he's signed for - is allowing him a fair chance to show what he can do.
Again, based on what? 13 minutes. Obviously no one thought that as he was a rarely played than waved player in Indiana while Ben is viewed as a raw but high potential youngster.
I repeat, we suck. If we discover the rare guy that goes from not even playing to being a rotation player, great, especially in a season like this. But to not give Ben a chance to grow from this season is shortsighted.
I'd love to see us keep Ben at about 25 minutes tops per game but a lot of the problems are the fact he's paired with a PG that doesn't pass to him and you can't hide him on D since we don't have other good defensive guards. Not saying he would be great if those things weren't true but rather that unless those things change, I don't know what benching him really accomplishes for us or him.
Just to be clear, I hate the fact that the FO forced us to play him big minutes but their weird roster management did what it did and at this point, I say just keep throwing him out there.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
You can't discover that player, if you don't play him. We need to look at him, by playing him. That's why they brought him in. We've looked at Ben for the whole season and...you know where he currently is
Well, you know he's had good defensive teachings starting his career in Indy. He's scrimmaged against Lance, PG, Granger every day in practice for 2 years. So that def counts as a positive for him.
And on the flip side, Ben simply can't handle a 30+ min load. He can barely handle 20 MPG. At some point, you're just going to shred any confidence he has left. Watching Jodie Meeks and Marshon Brooks absolutely have their way with you is an indicator where you are as a player. Just not ready. So while you obviously don't give up on Ben, I think you shoot to get him 20-22 MPG as opposed to 28-30.
So you think going out there night after night and not hitting your shots and not being able to guard a chair is good for Ben's development?
We can figure out what we have in OJ in 15-20 minutes/game. Honestly, how many teams out there grab guys on 10 day deals that were waved and play them 20-30 minutes/game?
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
I really don't care what other teams usually do. To me it's case by case, player by player, depending on the current situation
sdballer - Remember, OJ is on a 10-day contract. Doesn't he deserve a chance to show what he can do? Why should Ben be given a chance and OJ denied his? Ben will be back. He's on a contract. OJ is playing for his life here. If you check the Pacers boards, you'll see most of the fans are glad he's got a shot. He was dropped to make room for someone they needed more for the playoffs.
I say give him a fair chance. If he succeeds, we all win. If he doesn't, we go back to the great McLemore experiment and pray for improvement.
I say give him a fair chance. If he succeeds, we all win. If he doesn't, we go back to the great McLemore experiment and pray for improvement.
How many teams play raw rookies who clearly aren't ready as starters?
Very little about the Kings organization the last 5+ years (including the new regime) has been about successful development of young guys. Honestly, I don't know if losing confidence while playing or losing confidence while being benched would be better for Ben. Again, I'm only suggesting Ben should still play 20-25 minutes (ideally with some thought about how to best use him when he's on the court).
I'm pretty sick of this argument as well. IT hit Ben for 4 open 3's tonight. He bricked em all. So what, do we just keep feeding him, and hope he eventually hits? Would you be happier with 1-7 over 0-4? Ben, since coming back to the starting 5, as averaged a fraction under 8 FGA/game. In which he's shooting under 25% in.
This is getting silly. I've already suggested I'd like to see OJ get 15-20 minutes/game which would also reduce Ben's minutes. Are people really suggesting the only way to handle the next 10 days is to play OJ 30 minutes/game?
A decent number of them, especially when their front office trades away every other option on the team. The minutes/game for rookies the last few years are available.
Name three. And remember, I said RAW ROOKIES who clearly aren't ready. And I said being played as starters.
Fairly certain we're all saying the same thing. Ben 20-25 mpg, OJ 15-20 MPG, and fill in the rest with someone else.
Fair enough. I should clarify I don't think IT always passes to Ben in his most ideal situations. At the beginning of the season, we saw great off ball movement from Ben that often wasn't rewarded. Now he, like a lot of the rest of the team, stands around and I don't know that spot up 3's (without being in rhythm) are the best way to utilize and more importantly develop Ben's offensive skills
Agreed, which is why I don't understand why people keep arguing my posts.
By people do you mean me? If so, I'm arguing because I'm pissed off about how we lost tonight. I'm sorry for being irrational. I'm gonna go get that brandy now.
I like you VF21 and I've learned when you are frustrated with a game (which I totally understand). So not sure this is worth continuing.
By people do you mean me? If so, I'm arguing because I'm pissed off about how we lost tonight. I'm sorry for being irrational. I'm gonna go get that brandy now.
I posted my response at the same time. No worries. Enjoy the brandy.
Well there is the Kings and then.............Well.......I can't think of anyone else.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
I'm not under the impression that he would lose confidence at all, by coming off the bench and playing fewer minutes. He's probably losing more confidence by starting...and then not believing within himself that he deserves to start in the NBA at this point. The truth is, he shouldn't be and he knows it, so it creates an uncomfortable situation for him
K
KingMilz
Guest
Memphis did with James Johnson (this season) and he has been key in there good play, Heat did with Chris Anderson so did Denver. The NBA is about finding a place you can fit in and OJ blend of skills imo can fit in well here with us. DJ Augustine this season as well has saved the Bulls season there's plenty of cases of players being unwanted being pick up on 10 day contracts and thriving as role players. Shanu Livingston is another interesting 10 day case.
OJ has far more all around skills than any SG we have had in recent memory aside from Tyreke, it's just your not going to get playing time behind Lance Stephenson/Granger/George/Hill in the back court already. I mean Tyreke Evans would be coming off the bench there. Sometimes you find a diamond in the rough but most the time you don't.
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HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
solid point. all of those players are playing big roles on playoff teams, especially Augustine
chief bromden
Starter
I'm optimistic with this stat line - we can leave this game knowing that Ben Mac can play some lockdown D (albeit against himself) ... the talent is there!
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