Kings find their Boogie
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
NewArena
All-Star
Maybe i'm delusional but i think we're gonna make another trade
non guaranteed minimum I would think
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Keon’s 6’5” (rounding up from the official combine measurement of 6’4.75”). Not sure why you chose to put some of these guys in their shoe measurements and other guys barefoot?
this is also how the game is trending for the most part so I’m not sure this Kings lineup is particularly smaller than most other teams in the league? If anything they’re probably functionally bigger than they were last season since Duarte was pretty much exclusively a guard and DDR is a legit wing whose minute are probably going to lead to less three ‘guard’ lineups. Also all of the guys we brought in are bigger than Davion.
The Celtics just won a ship running out three point guards, Tatum or Brown, and Horford lineups for most of their post season run.
Just used heights listed from kings.com.
Boston has great defensive players and are an exception.
I don't think we got bigger because all of Barnes mins now go to Derozan.
I don't see the 2-way players getting many mins.
Draft pick is guard and injured.
Too guard heavy. Is McDaniels going to play mins? Our wing is depleted and that's without any injuries.
sono
Starter
gulp.!
To anyone who watched Summer League, giving Boogie Ellis a chance to sign a minimum contract and come to training camp was a no-brainer. Why are we making mountains out of mole hills?
[insert snarky quip here about our roster resembling a bunch of mole hills]
[insert snarky quip here about our roster resembling a bunch of mole hills]
sactowndog
All-Star
Let’s hope
sactowndog
All-Star
haha. Well put
sactowndog
All-Star
come on. By most measures we are among the smaller teams in the league
kingsfan101
Starter
Just thinking aloud here. Perhaps folks are not against this decision in itself, but were hoping that we'll make a play for a forward instead.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Derozan has averaged more rebounds per game than HB for like the last five seasons.
Also our best defensive lineups at the end of last season when we wound up being a top five defense in the league were pretty much all three guard lineups where our ‘small’ guys just pretty much blitzed the hell out of everything and created sheer chaos on the floor.
I feel like people are letting the trauma of the six Pels losses affect them more than actually thinking about who’s getting minutes where.
twslam07
All-Star
DeRozan and Barnes are similar from a strength & length standpoint so we didn’t really give up size by making that swap. But as you pointed out, DeRozan at least isn’t a sieve when it comes to rebounding like Barnes was last season.
I like Boogie.
He's tenacious, picks up the length of the court (like Christie wanted), got a great shot, nice wingspan, etc.
I am just saying as a roster we are very guard heavy.
sactowndog
All-Star
it wasn’t just the Pels. We struggled with any team that had length on the wing. We also got swept by the Rockets, Celtics blew us out.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Obvious signing for camp since Ellis was one of the best on the SL team. It'll be interesting to see which of this crop of end of bench guards make it out of camp.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Is it Monte or just Brown carrying over some of that Warriors guard ball? I can't remember what he said on draft night exactly but on draft night I flipped over to the coverage with former Warriors GM Bob Myers and in relation to the Devin Carter pick he said something about how they loved shorter but longer players like him because of what they brought physically. A lower center of gravity can sometimes make a huge difference defensively as seen with the Crowder, Hart, Dort types. The issue with the Kings guard ball of recent years, prior to Keon and a player like Carter coming in, is that the Kings only had Davion as that defender and he wasn't athletic and smallish even for a PG. The Kings guard ball was almost all offense with little defense or physicality. Once Carter comes back, that's not necessarily the case anymore. Also, I think people need to realize that Carter isn't just a good athlete, he is the type that could probably play safety in the NFL if he wanted to. I can't remember the Kings ever having that combination of elite athletic ability and physicality.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
The Celtics are smaller on the wings than the Kings are and the blowout loss against them happened with Tatum sitting out and replaced in the lineup by Sam Hauser, who may be 6'8" in height but is 6'0" in playing style since he is literally just around to hit open threes and be sorta bad on defense. The Rocket sweep is probably still a bit flukey in that two out of those three losses came over the span of three nights in which De'Aaron didn't play and Keegan and Keon were mired in their absolutely awful slumps to start the season. Also the Rockets started one of the collectively smaller starting lineups in the league all season (Brooks/FVV/Sengun all pretty much below average size for their positions with Jalen and Jabari both pretty much being average for the 2 and 4 slots) so I'm not quite sure it was the Rockets length that hurt the Kings more than playing down their best player did.
You're also ignoring all the 'long' teams that the Kings did have success against like the Lakers (D-Lo the only guy in their starting five last season under 6'5"), Clippers, T-Wolves, Nuggets, Hawks, Nets, or Magic.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
We have to see what adding DeRozan does to the pace for the Sacramento. A lot of the Kings problems with relying on DHO was also relying on quick shooting. When the DHO didn't hit and defenses were set the Kings would get trounced in transition for stretches. The only answer was for Fox to save the day time and time again which was the definition of one dimensional. If the Kings can control more clock and still get good shots without DHO's then teams exploding offensively for multiple possessions in a row might decrease. Also, we have to see if the defense turning into more pressure, on ball, man to man and switching into pressure was a Doug Christie thing. If he's the new coordinator for the teams defensive scheme and that was his call, this might be a much different look defensively.
Sure, I get that and I'm also hoping Monte makes more moves to improve our frontcourt and forward depth but signing another guard doesn't prevent that from happening.
There's a tendency for folks to analyze each roster move as if it's the last one Monte is going to make. So the Devin Carter draft pick gets criticized because we didn't need another guard, the DeRozan signing gets docked a couple grades because he doesn't help our defense, and now when one of the best guys on the summer league team gets a deal it feels like a let down to some because they wanted that roster spot to go to a taller player. I understand why this happens -- what else is there to talk about in Kings basketball news right now -- but I still feel like it's a little silly.
Monte's job isn't just to improve the roster by filling immediate needs, it's to improve the overall quality of the roster period. The guard position may not be an area of need right now but that shouldn't stop Monte from trying to put together a better guard rotation than we had last year. I would argue that Boogie Ellis outplayed Colby Jones in Summer League. That's reason enough to keep him around and see if he grows into a quality depth piece for us in the future. As for the roster as a whole, any of our bench guys is available for trade to re-balance the roster either over the summer, mid-season, next summer, etc. As an example of how quickly roster composition can change, last summer Monte had 4 backup centers signed to contracts at one point (Len, Queta, Noel, McGee). Half of them were gone before the season even started.
And we lost one of our two games against the Celtics on the road by 1 point, on a non-call to Colby’s face. Hardly a blow out.
sactowndog
All-Star
You keep arguing that. My Rockets bet to beat the spread was free money last year.
kingsfan101
Starter
Oh, I don't disagree. Just saying what might have triggered some folks.
It's nice of 'SC to let our guys use their arena to work out in during the off-season. Where's JMac though? Since it's an 'SC party it seems like he should be there too.
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