King Keegan

twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#571
#571
Tetsujin said:
https://twitter.com/statuses/1658332395978870784

Kris's combine measurements came in and since he and Keegan are identical twins, you'd think we'd finally have a pretty good sense of Keegan's measurements now but even back in their Iowa days, it always felt like Keegan was a bit longer and bigger than his brother so who knows?

(Also did not expect the Murray twins to have a bigger wingspan than Paul George.)
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This is super interesting. I always hated how the top prospects skipped the combine measurements but we basically get this insight because his replica decided to get measured.

If Keegan is around these numbers, he has solid PF size. Maybe he can be our ideal PF fit next to Sabonis. He definitely needs another couple years to add his “grown man strength,” but after he’s done that, his length should be able to compete at the PF spot.

In college, he showed ideal skills to put next to Sabonis (which was a huge reason why I wanted him):
  • We already know about his shooting, but he may be one of the best (if not the best) shooters in the game at the PF spot
  • He averaged 2.4 BLK per 40 minutes in college (88th among all players and 24th among all PFs)
  • He averaged 10.9 REB per 40 min in college (156th among all players and 43rd among all PFs)
  • He was a very effective/efficient post player in college (might have more opportunities doing this if he’s playing the 4 vs. the 3)
 
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The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#572
#572
twslam07 said:
This is super interesting. I always hated how the top prospects skipped the combine measurements but we basically get this insight because his replica decided to get measured.

If Keegan is around these numbers, he has solid PF size. Maybe he can be our ideal PF fit next to Sabonis. He definitely needs another couple years to add his “grown man strength,” but after he’s done that, his length should be able to compete at the PF spot.

In college, he showed ideal skills to put next to Sabonis (which was a huge reason why I wanted him):
  • We already know about his shooting, but he may be one of the best (if not the best) shooters in the game at the PF spot
  • He averaged 2.4 BLK per 40 minutes in college (88th among all players and 24th among all PFs)
  • He averaged 10.9 REB per 40 min in college (156th among all players and 43rd among all PFs)
  • He was a very effective/efficient post player in college (might have more opportunities doing this if he’s playing the 4 vs. the 3)
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To add on to this, his defense in game 6 at the 4 with Lyles at the 5 was one of the main reasons we won that game.

Just overall very interesting usage of him this year, basically as a strictly perimeter player and not utilizing a lot of his strengths he showed at Iowa that got him drafted at 4. I'm hoping we get a little more balanced approach next season to where he's put on the floor. Maybe it was due to Barnes needing to operate in that slot for most of the year.
 
funkykingston

funkykingston

Super Moderator
Staff member
#573
#573
The_Jamal said:
To add on to this, his defense in game 6 at the 4 with Lyles at the 5 was one of the main reasons we won that game.

Just overall very interesting usage of him this year, basically as a strictly perimeter player and not utilizing a lot of his strengths he showed at Iowa that got him drafted at 4. I'm hoping we get a little more balanced approach next season to where he's put on the floor. Maybe it was due to Barnes needing to operate in that slot for most of the year.
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That and Sasha potentially coming over is why I think Lyles is more important to re-sign than Barnes. He gives positional and scheme flexibility as a 4/5 that can unlock a lot of 2nd team offensive firepower. It means you still need a big body at C for certain matchups, but I hope we see more of Lyles at the five with Keegan and or Vezenkov.
 
LPKingsFan

LPKingsFan

All-Star
#574
#574
funkykingston said:
That and Sasha potentially coming over is why I think Lyles is more important to re-sign than Barnes. He gives positional and scheme flexibility as a 4/5 that can unlock a lot of 2nd team offensive firepower. It means you still need a big body at C for certain matchups, but I hope we see more of Lyles at the five with Keegan and or Vezenkov.
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I agree, but I think it also shows the need to replace Barnes with a similar 4/3 type (if you aren’t re-signing him), especially if Vezenkov is strictly a 4. That’s what gives me pause about Naz Reid, since he’s a 4/5 at best. Otherwise you are locked in to Keegan strictly at the 3, and are using all your salary space on 4s and 5s when wings are at a premium.
 
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The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#575
#575
funkykingston said:
That and Sasha potentially coming over is why I think Lyles is more important to re-sign than Barnes. He gives positional and scheme flexibility as a 4/5 that can unlock a lot of 2nd team offensive firepower. It means you still need a big body at C for certain matchups, but I hope we see more of Lyles at the five with Keegan and or Vezenkov.
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I think that's where Queta should hopefully come into play to be that big body C off the bench (if needed). We've spent 2 years developing him, he was one of the best players in the G-League last season. I don't think he has anything left to prove at that level, it's time to give him a shot to see if he can stick as a rotation guy up at the NBA level.
 
funkykingston

funkykingston

Super Moderator
Staff member
#576
#576
The_Jamal said:
I think that's where Queta should hopefully come into play to be that big body C off the bench (if needed). We've spent 2 years developing him, he was one of the best players in the G-League last season. I don't think he has anything left to prove at that level, it's time to give him a shot to see if he can stick as a rotation guy up at the NBA level.
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That would be the hope. That you can essentially replace Len with Queta and TD with Ellis. That's how good teams stay good - by keeping their core intact but also developing guys to replace the players they'll inevitably lose as free agents.
 
funkykingston

funkykingston

Super Moderator
Staff member
#577
#577
LPKingsFan said:
I agree, but I think it also shows the need to replace Barnes with a similar 4/3 type (if you aren’t re-signing him), especially if Vezenkov is strictly a 4. That’s what gives me pause about Naz Reid, since he’s a 4/5 at best. Otherwise you are locked in to Keegan strictly at the 3, and are using all your salary space on 4s and 5s when wings are at a premium.
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If Barnes does leave as a FA I think there's two choices:

Try and find a versatile defending 4 that offers some rim protection (Jarred Vanderbilt etc) or move Keegan to that spot and sign and/or draft more of a 3 or 2/3 wing. Which is why Max Lewis (who Baja loves) has a fair amount of appeal. I don't see anybody in the draft that gives you that stretch/defending 4 that will be available at 24. I was hoping early in the year that Taylor Hendricks would stay under the radar for the Kings to nab, but that ship has long since sailed.

If the Kings came out of this draft (assuming they keep their picks) with a haul of guys like Max Lewis, Brandin Podziemski, and Jordan Walsh I wouldn't be upset. You can never have too many wings.
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#578
#578
The_Jamal said:
I think that's where Queta should hopefully come into play to be that big body C off the bench (if needed). We've spent 2 years developing him, he was one of the best players in the G-League last season. I don't think he has anything left to prove at that level, it's time to give him a shot to see if he can stick as a rotation guy up at the NBA level.
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I watched a handful of Stockton games last year and I just don't think he's consistent enough to get minutes on an NBA floor.

He has way more good moments than bad moments but I don't see many NBA players that look as bad as he can at times. I certainly wouldn't go into the season relying on his minutes in any meaningful way. He'll look like superman and get 2 blocks in one sequence and then look like he forgot he was playing basketball on the next.
 
PorchSurfin

PorchSurfin

Starter
#579
#579
funkykingston said:
That and Sasha potentially coming over is why I think Lyles is more important to re-sign than Barnes. He gives positional and scheme flexibility as a 4/5 that can unlock a lot of 2nd team offensive firepower. It means you still need a big body at C for certain matchups, but I hope we see more of Lyles at the five with Keegan and or Vezenkov.
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I would absolutely NOT factor Vezenkov being in the Kings. Or any NBA team, ever.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#592
#592
bajaden said:
If you watched Keegan his freshman year at Iowa, he played a very similar role that he played with the Kings his past season. He was just fitting in and trying to do what the team needed him to do. However, in his Sophomore year at Iowa, he was asked to be the star of the team, and he was. He scored from everywhere on the floor. 3 pointers, mid-range, post ups and attacking downhill at the basket. I suspect you'll see a similar jump with him next season.

He wants to be great, and he's a very hard worker. He knows where he needs to improve, and I love the fact that he said he was going to spend the summer working out with Sabonis. I'd love to see him run a two man game similar to what Huerter and Sabonis do. He does need to tighten his handle and get a little stronger. But I'm not worried about him. I think he'll eventually be an all star. He has that kind of upside.
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Curious, how do you compare Kris to Keegan?

Clearly Kris isn’t considered the prospect that Keegan was and won’t go top 4 in this upcoming draft, but listening to stories from Kris and their father Kenyon, Kris has gotten the better of his brother on more than a few occasions.

Do you see Kris having anywhere near the same upside? It’s easy to surmise that he would since they’re twins, but it rarely works out that way. They don’t even shoot with the same dominant hand. But there are some similarities.
 
Hawkmi

Hawkmi

Prospect
#595
#595
KingsFanSince85 said:
Curious, how do you compare Kris to Keegan?

Clearly Kris isn’t considered the prospect that Keegan was and won’t go top 4 in this upcoming draft, but listening to stories from Kris and their father Kenyon, Kris has gotten the better of his brother on more than a few occasions.

Do you see Kris having anywhere near the same upside? It’s easy to surmise that he would since they’re twins, but it rarely works out that way. They don’t even shoot with the same dominant hand. But there are some similarities.
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Pretty sure they are actually both left handed, Keegan just learned to shoot with this right.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#596
#596
Hawkmi said:
Pretty sure they are actually both left handed, Keegan just learned to shoot with this right.
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I'm aware of this. But it's still a notable difference in their games, among others. That's all I was getting at.

Apparently, Kenyon Murray taught both Keegan and Kris to shoot right-handed. Keegan clearly just felt more comfortable sticking with it while Kris did not.
 
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The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#597
#597
KingsFanSince85 said:
Curious, how do you compare Kris to Keegan?

Clearly Kris isn’t considered the prospect that Keegan was and won’t go top 4 in this upcoming draft, but listening to stories from Kris and their father Kenyon, Kris has gotten the better of his brother on more than a few occasions.

Do you see Kris having anywhere near the same upside? It’s easy to surmise that he would since they’re twins, but it rarely works out that way. They don’t even shoot with the same dominant hand. But there are some similarities.
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From what I've surmised, Kris is a little smaller weight wise, not quite as athletic and doesn't have the same scoring moves that Keegan does. A lot of the same traits, but just worse? I guess.

Basically, I think most people would say Kris's median outcome is kind of what Keegan was this season as a rookie. Good 3/4 flex wing that can be an elite spacer and give you defensive versatility. Elite role player type on a good team. We obviously have higher hopes that Keegan continues to develop as a franchise pillar, but Kris likely doesn't have that same upside.
 
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