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Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#61
I appreciate your long post referring to what I am saying and disagreeing with my views as such, but I think to call them nonsense is unfair. You say I have no proof of the Kings not growing as a team and I that is incorrect. I don't think that only having 6 wins more than last year is much of an improvement. Sure, the Kings play harder than last year and don't go into "give up" mode like they used to, but to that point, they do make millions of dollars to play a kids game. If we all gave the same lack of effort at our slightly better than average paying jobs, most would be fired. I am 29 and have been involved in BMX racing, baseball, basketball, football and track, so I have a descent amount of knowledge when it comes to sport. I look at my favorite sports teams with an open outlook of what could be done better from a personel and coaching standpoint just as you senoir members. I am glad you guys are "rah rah" types, but I find it embarassing for the Kings to get blown out at home by a team like the Pistons or the GSW on the road. I am fully aware that the talent is pretty balanced across the board as far as athletically, but it is the mental part of sports that really doesn't get addressed like it should. From watching the Kings over the years, you all would have to agree that they have been mentally soft and still are...except for maybe Reke, Noc, Landry and Garcia. I hope the Kings can mesh as a collective group mentally and maturity wise over the summer and make a playoff run, but I think they are 2 years away. What do you guys think?:)
Every team has those types of losses. Toronto got the living snot pounded out of them by us despite the fact that they had played the Lakers to a standstill a few nights before. Chicago suffered one of the greatest collapses in modern NBA history against us and then suddenly began to play very good for a while (Now's another story). Every team has those games where nothing goes right and the victory just isn't there. This isn't the NFL where undefeated seasons are not impossible. There will always be losses and of those losses, some will undoubtedly be worse than others.

There's a distinct difference between being mentally soft and mentally stupid. JT may have the basketball IQ of a walnut but he had heart and hustle. Donte makes stupid mistakes but you can't question his love for the game. Noce likes to put our team in massive holes by chucking up shots that should have no business being taken but you can't question his heart.


The bottom line is this: We're a young team. Our stud superstar of the future is 20 years old. We have the fourth youngest team in the NBA. We are improving. We are building for the FUTURE. It may not be pretty, but, when its all said and done, it's the end result that matters.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#62
I appreciate your long post referring to what I am saying and disagreeing with my views as such, but I think to call them nonsense is unfair.
Nope, it's his opinion and he pretty much backs it up with logical support.

You say I have no proof of the Kings not growing as a team and I that is incorrect. I don't think that only having 6 wins more than last year is much of an improvement. Sure, the Kings play harder than last year and don't go into "give up" mode like they used to, but to that point, they do make millions of dollars to play a kids game. If we all gave the same lack of effort at our slightly better than average paying jobs, most would be fired.
Sorry, but once again I'm struck by how closely your comments resemble those of someone who is not actually a fan. And, for the record, how we do in our jobs is totally irrelevant unless you're comparing similar situations, such as having a job that only a little over 400 young men are called on to do every year.

I am 29 and have been involved in BMX racing, baseball, basketball, football and track, so I have a descent amount of knowledge when it comes to sport.
While that apparently is important to you, it doesn't matter a rat's patoot to most who post here. It's not what you know that matters, it's how you decide to interact with the other fans on the board.

I look at my favorite sports teams with an open outlook of what could be done better from a personel and coaching standpoint just as you senoir members. I am glad you guys are "rah rah" types, but I find it embarassing for the Kings to get blown out at home by a team like the Pistons or the GSW on the road. I am fully aware that the talent is pretty balanced across the board as far as athletically, but it is the mental part of sports that really doesn't get addressed like it should.
Hogwash, drivel, etc.

People who have to toss the "rah, rah" label out to try and prove they are the better fan are ... wait for it ... trolls.

There are a myriad of different types of fans. None are better than the other. What again is important is that ALL types of fans should feel free to post their opinions, thoughts, etc. without encountering difficulty simply because of which category you've decided they belong in.

From watching the Kings over the years, you all would have to agree that they have been mentally soft and still are...except for maybe Reke, Noc, Landry and Garcia. I hope the Kings can mesh as a collective group mentally and maturity wise over the summer and make a playoff run, but I think they are 2 years away. What do you guys think?:)
NO, I will not agree that the Kings have been and are mentally soft. Again, that's something generally tossed out by someone just looking for more dissent, etc.

If you truly want to show that all the accusations and allegations are false, here's a couple of suggestions:

1. Drop the whole debate about whether or not you are or resemble a troll. If you aren't, your posts should be the proof. If you are, you'll ignore my suggestion or find a way to argue with it. It's really that simple and it's been the modus operandi of many trolls before you.

2. Quit touting your skills as a writer and your knowledge of sports. People don't care. Make your arguments and have them stand on their own merits.

Here's the deal... We welcome new posters who come here to contribute to the overall discussions. We love new members who add to our already considerable wealth of knowledgeable posters and it doesn't take long for our pretty savvy group of regulars to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Here's hoping a word to the wise will suffice...
 
#63
I appreciate the time you take to explain how you all feel that I am a troll since I am new to posting on the boards, but am not new in reguards to reading them over the years. I am confused why people confuse constructive views on how the team should improve....with posing as a troll. You tell me that you enjoy people with diversified views of the team, but if I post something most on here feel is negative, it is automatically wrong. I am sorry if I offended some of you here. I thought you all wouldn't be so uptight about things around here. I find it funny how seriously you all take the NBA anyway......the stars controll the refs and the refs control the game. may game 7, 2002, RIP. :cool:
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#64
I appreciate the time you take to explain how you all feel that I am a troll since I am new to posting on the boards, but am not new in reguards to reading them over the years. I am confused why people confuse constructive views on how the team should improve....with posing as a troll. You tell me that you enjoy people with diversified views of the team, but if I post something most on here feel is negative, it is automatically wrong. I am sorry if I offended some of you here. I thought you all wouldn't be so uptight about things around here. I find it funny how seriously you all take the NBA anyway......the stars controll the refs and the refs control the game. may game 7, 2002, RIP. :cool:
That's because your "constructive criticism" to this point has consisted of claims that the Kings are soft and that we need to build exclusively to beat the Lakers since the Warriors played them even better and we lost to the Warriors and so on and so on. I'd be remiss if I neglected to mention the steady stream of "I'm not a troll".
 
#65
The only reason I bring the troll thing up is because you guys bring it up first.....I don't know why.....maybe if I had posted on here 3000 times and critisized the team, perhaps then I would be taken more seriously, but I am cool with it. I think you guys on here are pretty cool. I am gonna go to some Kings games next year....I live in Far Nor-Cal.:cool:
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#66
The only reason I bring the troll thing up is because you guys bring it up first.....I don't know why.....maybe if I had posted on here 3000 times and critisized the team, perhaps then I would be taken more seriously, but I am cool with it. I think you guys on here are pretty cool. I am gonna go to some Kings games next year....I live in Far Nor-Cal.:cool:
I'll try once more - you've come across to a number long-time members as being somewhat smug and superior. It's kind of off-putting.

You're like the rookie on the team. You may have more talent in your little finger than all the veterans combined, but you've got to earn your stripes.

We "guys" bring up the troll thing for a variety of reasons, all of which have been pretty well explained.

You'll be taken more seriously if you quit trying so hard.

Peace.
 

Spike

Subsidiary Intermediary
Staff member
#67
I am not a troll...

[yt=Nothing to see here]rSjK2Oqrgic[/yt]


I don't know why it came to mind, but it did.

Dude, it's early. You can always bounce back. Hell, I've been guilty of many a deleted message. You learn to the social norms of the board, and things go better. A little tip - we like our facts to be grounded in, well, facts.

Welcome to the board.
 
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#68
clcdmb, try not take it personally. The team gets criticized plenty around here and not just by "oldies." You're particular criticism got picked apart, it's true, but you've got to defend the opinion.

I personally, don't see "troll" as much as some. Maybe people are misunderstanding your point of view, but considering how many disagree, you need to at least consider whether your argumants are, in fact, valid or just weak.

What Lakers team are we going to "match up" against? The current bunch of Lakers will be on the downsides of their careers before the Kings are likely to be relevant again (hopefully). Plus, I think you should develop a team you think can compete for a championship period. Hopefully, GP and PW have a vision for that.

As for the Warriors, they just flat out are not better than the Kings. At least I've seen nothing that clearly supports that idea yet.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#69
I appreciate your long post referring to what I am saying and disagreeing with my views as such, but I think to call them nonsense is unfair. You say I have no proof of the Kings not growing as a team and I that is incorrect. I don't think that only having 6 wins more than last year is much of an improvement. Sure, the Kings play harder than last year and don't go into "give up" mode like they used to, but to that point, they do make millions of dollars to play a kids game. If we all gave the same lack of effort at our slightly better than average paying jobs, most would be fired. I am 29 and have been involved in BMX racing, baseball, basketball, football and track, so I have a descent amount of knowledge when it comes to sport. I look at my favorite sports teams with an open outlook of what could be done better from a personel and coaching standpoint just as you senoir members. I am glad you guys are "rah rah" types, but I find it embarassing for the Kings to get blown out at home by a team like the Pistons or the GSW on the road. I am fully aware that the talent is pretty balanced across the board as far as athletically, but it is the mental part of sports that really doesn't get addressed like it should. From watching the Kings over the years, you all would have to agree that they have been mentally soft and still are...except for maybe Reke, Noc, Landry and Garcia. I hope the Kings can mesh as a collective group mentally and maturity wise over the summer and make a playoff run, but I think they are 2 years away. What do you guys think?:)
Well, let me respectfully disagree with you on some, if not all of your points. But first let me say that you are a shotgun thinker. By that I mean your all over the place, and that is part of what causes you trouble. Do you ever go back and reread your posts, or are they just continuious streaming of thought. Let me ask you another question. You said that your 29 years of age. Do you think you've learned anything between 21 and 29? One would hope so, right? In my case I probably learned more about life between the ages of 30 and 40. And I'm not just saying that to exclude you from that particular club. It just happens to be the truth. Point being though, that the Kings are a very young team and have time to learn from their mistakes.

But I digress. So lets just take one of your last statements.
" From watching the Kings over the years, you all would have to agree that they have been mentally soft and still are...except for maybe Reke, Noc, Landry and Garcia." Over the years implies a long period of time. Somewhat vague, but non the less 5 to 10 years springs to mind. But the only three exceptions you mention are Garcia, Landry, and Tyreke. Two of which are in their first year with the Kings. So that statement doesn't make sense.

"You say I have no proof of the Kings not growing as a team and I that is incorrect. I don't think that only having 6 wins more than last year is much of an improvement. Sure, the Kings play harder than last year and don't go into "give up" mode like they used to, but to that point, they do make millions of dollars to play a kids game."

Here's another one. On one hand you say that 6 more wins than last year is no sign of improvement, but in the same breath you point out that they don't give up like they used to and that their playing harder. Which sounds like an acknowledgement of improvement. Once again it doesn't make any sense.

You say that your very knowledgeable in sports, including basketball. Well this isn't a contest, so I'm not going to grill you to test your knowledge. But if you know anything about basketball you should know that any team, good or bad, can get blown out by any other team on any given night if they don't come in ready to play. Now if its happening every night, thats a different story. But I think that I can safely say that the Kings have been competitive almost every night except for a few occasions. No, they haven't won, but they were in the games to the end.

Now here's where we may part company, and its entirely up to you. Am I happy the Kings are losing? Of course not. Do I see problems with the team that need to be addressed? Yes, I do. But do I think the team is generally on the right track? Yes, I do. Now if that difference of opinion makes me a RAH RAH guy, then so be it. Not sure I see the logic, nor do I understand why you almost imply that being a so called rah rah guy is a bad thing. Do I support the Kings? Yes!!!!! But at the same time it doesn't stop me from criticizing the play of players when I think its necessary. What I don't so is say the whole team sucks. And thats kind of what you do. I mean how does one logicly respond to that. Its like saying that a cruise liner sucks without saying why. Or saying it sucked because it came into port a half hour late, which has nothing to do with the ship.

You don't break anything down into specifics. You make statements like the Kings should design their team to be able to defeat the Lakers. Now while that probably a popular thought around here, it doesn't make for any long term sense. I don't think you can just ignore the other 28 teams you have to play. You reasoning is that the Lakers are the champs, so their the one's you have to beat. Well what happens if their not the champs this year? What happens to our plan then? Do we then switch our plan on building, to beat the next world champ? And what happens the year after that if there's yet another and different champion? Are you following the logic here? Words mean something!! And if you don't explain yourself well enough, then you leave yourself open to interpretation, and perhaps ridicule.

People have pointed out to you that this is a very young team. You responded saying that being young wasn't an excuse. I agree with you, its not an excuse. Its a fact! And if you honestly believe in your heart of hearts that this young team is capable of much more than they've accomplished, then I don't think you really do know much about sports and basketball. And being you qualified yourself by saying you played a lot of sports, I'll do the same by saying I played professional baseball. Now that doesn't mean I know more than you or anyone else on this fourm, especially when it comes to basketball. In the end all we have is our opinion. And, at this moment in time, there are a lot of other opinions on this fourm that I value more than yours. And a lot of them are people that disagree with me. But, they make sense!
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#70
The only reason I bring the troll thing up is because you guys bring it up first.....I don't know why.....maybe if I had posted on here 3000 times and critisized the team, perhaps then I would be taken more seriously, but I am cool with it. I think you guys on here are pretty cool. I am gonna go to some Kings games next year....I live in Far Nor-Cal.:cool:
NO! Actually your wrong there. There have been people that have had 3000 plus posts on this fourm that I've called a troll. They shall remain nameless. Now we may be a bit sensitve when it comes to trolls, but thats because this fourm gets occasionally infested with these low life creatures, whose only desire is to provoke arguments. If the shoe doesn't fit, then I apologize. I'm still giving you the benefit of the doubt. Not that it carries any weight. I'll enlighten you to one thing though. People don't respect you because you have 3000 or 5000 or even 10,000 posts. They respect you because of what you say and how you say it. You'll find two posters with 5000 posts each duking it out just as often as you'll have two newbies duking it out. My having 5000 plus posts doesn't prove anything other than I was stupid enough to sit here and make that many posts. :eek:
 
#71
Gee, I have over 10,000 posts, but I doubt anyone takes my posts seriously. :p

(I don't have near the basketball knowledge a lot of people here do. I'm a Kings fan and I spend time here, because its about one of my favorite subjects and because there are people I can learn from or just enjoy.)
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#72
You'll find two posters with 5000 posts each duking it out just as often as you'll have two newbies duking it out.
And not to mention any names, but two posters whose total posts approach 90,000 have also been known to duke it out on occasion.

:p
 
#73
I appreciate the time you take to explain how you all feel that I am a troll since I am new to posting on the boards, but am not new in reguards to reading them over the years. I am confused why people confuse constructive views on how the team should improve....with posing as a troll. You tell me that you enjoy people with diversified views of the team, but if I post something most on here feel is negative, it is automatically wrong. I am sorry if I offended some of you here. I thought you all wouldn't be so uptight about things around here. I find it funny how seriously you all take the NBA anyway......the stars controll the refs and the refs control the game. may game 7, 2002, RIP. :cool:
You obviously have a very very different definition of "constructive views". The logic of posting is really simple, and I think you don't need to be a writer or have lots of knowledge to understand this. If your point follows that of the masses, it's likely that you don't need much supporting evidence - it's probably been supported by someone else before. But if you're going to post something "negative" as you mentioned yourself, then you better be prepared to substantiate your point. Frankly speaking, losing to the warriors by a large margin is not sufficient substantiation, when you consider that our record is actually better.

It's also hard to understand how you can possibly not see a difference or improvement in our current team. No one promised that we were going to go from a 17-win team to a contender within 2 or 3 seasons. Does that mean we haven't improved? If you had made your complaint last season it would actually have some sort of credibility, but since then the organization has taken numerous big steps in getting us back towards contending.

You mentioned that if we couldn't win in 02 then we probably can't win ever. Maybe that's true, but any fan who thinks that way and gives up on the team is not a fan at all. You may then argue with me and say that you haven't given up on the team, to which I will tell you that you're a moron if you're wasting your time rooting for a team that you don't think will ever be a serious contender. Going back to the 02 thing, why does our success (or lack thereof) in 2002 affect our chances in say 2014? Will Shaq still be playing against us? Will Robert Horry still play against us? Is Peja still gonna airball 3's for us? What happened in 2002 has absolutely ZERO to do with our current team and the team that we are building. The only remaining guys since then are like ... Geoff Petrie, Grant, Jerry etc. Unless you're insinuating that we need them to win a championship or that we can't win a championship with
Jerry as our color analyst.

I am by far a new member compared to some of the (dinosaurs:D) on this board, who although may seem to act slightly superior at times really do put in alot of effort into their posts, which I've come to respect tremendously since joining the board. Put it this way, if you haven't built up a good credit score, don't expect the board to cut you any slack

EDIT: I also realised that you need an avatar to be truly senior. That's the whole difference between Gary and AM27 right there - the avatar. :p
EDIT: GARY WHAT HAPPENED TO YOUR AVATAR!!! (dang I'm slow)
 
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L

Lafayette

Guest
#76
I am not a troll......I am saying that Don Nelson knows how to coach "small ball" per say and have better spacing and 3pt shooters while the Kings O seems stagnant at times. I don't think Westphal is a great offensive mind unless he has the right pieces like Sir Charles, KJ, AC Green and Ainge in the line up. If the Kings address the logjam at SF and get a more balance roster I think it will work out for the better. I also think we need a true PG at times to set up the O as opposed to Beno or Reke.
Are about 3 1/2 feet tall, hairy, bad teeth, live under a bridge and try to scare people on here with your WARRIOR talk, they don't like your kind around these parts, not allowed to talk anything but Kings talk, so, IS YA A TROLL?
 
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