They want a big or a vet. I doubt Cisco or Beno will net the 2nd pick. We could offer JT for the pick, but that just creates a hole in our frontline, before we know if Dally is resigning. Now if we got a verbal commitment from Dally, I might consider our pick and JT for the 2nd, and take Williams, but I'd really have to think about that. That's just an idea, nothing I'm serious about, for the record.
Keep it or trade it?
- Thread starter Spike
- Start date
Agreed. We may very well trade the pick, but I don't think it would happen until the #6 pick is off the board - if we decide that we don't like the options available. Until then, there's no hurry and we'll look at our options. And I don't really know who we'll end up taking if we keep the pick, but I'll make the daring prediction that if we do pick at #7, the player we take will have a "K" in his name.
My answer to the poll at this point is 'Keep it'.
But it's contingent on one factor:
If we have to trade or swap picks in order to due a deal with Philly for AI, then I'll make that deal.
I can't think of any player who we realistically have a chance to acquire for mostly cap-space, who can help us as much as I think AI would. So, if Philly plays hard ball, then I'd blink, and use/swap the pick, but barring that scenario, I'd keep the pick.
There are a number of players who are projected to be availabe when we pick, who could turn out to be very good players. It's always a matter of question marks, and if a player will reach their potential, or how well a player will improve their weaknesses.
I have no doubt in my mind that there will be players on the board who can make a significant impact for this team in the coming years, but it will just be a matter of making the right call, and picking the right guy.
Since Petrie has shown a masterful job of selecting the right guy, I'll let him do what he's shown to do best, and make the selection which will have the greatest impact on our team.
As I mentioned, there are always question marks surrounding players, and some fantastic players have been selected at our spot or higher, so I thought I'd throw a couple of players out who have been selected 7th or later. Players who despite initial concerns, put in the time and effort to become great players.
So, when looking at the current draft, think of what these young players 'could' become if they work on their weaknesses, rather than focusing solely on what they can't do at the moment.
A lot of the players in the below list had question marks surrounding their games, which caused them to be selected later in the draft. They worked hard, and proved to everyone who passed them up that they made a mistake. In fact, two of the most highly sought after SFs from this board were picked later than the 7th (Andre Igudala & Danny Granger), so keep that in mind when looking at prospects such as Hamilton, Leonard, Burks, Singleton, & Faried.
I hope that the below list is encouraging to you, as it is very encouraging to me. Almost all of these players, are players I would probably like to have on our team on a rookie contract.
Picks at the 7th Spot
Jason Williams - 1998
Richard Hamilton - 1999
Nene Hilario - 2002
Kirk Hinrich - 2003
Luol Deng - 2004
Eric Gordan - 2008
Picks at the 8th Spot
Andre Miller - 1999
Jamal Crawford - 2000
Rudy Gay - 2006
Picks at the 9th Spot
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998
Shawn Marion - 1999
Amare Stoudemire - 2002
Andre Iguodala - 2004
Joakim Noah - 2007
Picks at the 10th Spot
Paul Pierce - 1998
Jason Terry - 1999
Joe Johnson - 2001
Caron Butler - 2002
Andrew Bynum - 2005
Brook Lopez - 2008
Picks at the 11th Spot
Bonzi Wells - 1998
Mickael Pietrus - 2003
Andris Biendrins - 2004
Picks at 12th - 20th Spots
Nick Collison (12th) - 2003
Keon Clark(13th) - 1998
Corey Maggette(13th) - 1999
Richard Jefferson(13th) - 2001
Matt Harpring(15th) - 1998
Al Jefferson(15th) - 2004
Ron Artest(16th) - 1999
Hidayet Turkoglu(16th) - 2000
Josh Smith(17th) - 2004
Danny Granger(17th) - 2005
James Posey (18th) - 1999
David West(18th) - 2003
Zach Randolph(19th) - 2001
Jameer Nelson(20th) - 2004
Using Danny Granger as an example, if Toronto would have 'reached' and selected Danny Granger in 2005 with the #7 pick, instead of Charlie Villanueva, I think that people would have questioned the decision at the time, though in hindsight it would have been the best picks they could have made.
So I have no problems if Petrie keeps the pick and 'reaches' for a player who we might have listed in the teens, because he's such a good evaluator of talent.
So, unless AI is on the table and we have to use our pick in order to acquire him, I say let Petrie get to work and get us a good player with that 7th pick.
But it's contingent on one factor:
If we have to trade or swap picks in order to due a deal with Philly for AI, then I'll make that deal.
I can't think of any player who we realistically have a chance to acquire for mostly cap-space, who can help us as much as I think AI would. So, if Philly plays hard ball, then I'd blink, and use/swap the pick, but barring that scenario, I'd keep the pick.
There are a number of players who are projected to be availabe when we pick, who could turn out to be very good players. It's always a matter of question marks, and if a player will reach their potential, or how well a player will improve their weaknesses.
I have no doubt in my mind that there will be players on the board who can make a significant impact for this team in the coming years, but it will just be a matter of making the right call, and picking the right guy.
Since Petrie has shown a masterful job of selecting the right guy, I'll let him do what he's shown to do best, and make the selection which will have the greatest impact on our team.
As I mentioned, there are always question marks surrounding players, and some fantastic players have been selected at our spot or higher, so I thought I'd throw a couple of players out who have been selected 7th or later. Players who despite initial concerns, put in the time and effort to become great players.
So, when looking at the current draft, think of what these young players 'could' become if they work on their weaknesses, rather than focusing solely on what they can't do at the moment.
A lot of the players in the below list had question marks surrounding their games, which caused them to be selected later in the draft. They worked hard, and proved to everyone who passed them up that they made a mistake. In fact, two of the most highly sought after SFs from this board were picked later than the 7th (Andre Igudala & Danny Granger), so keep that in mind when looking at prospects such as Hamilton, Leonard, Burks, Singleton, & Faried.
I hope that the below list is encouraging to you, as it is very encouraging to me. Almost all of these players, are players I would probably like to have on our team on a rookie contract.
Picks at the 7th Spot
Jason Williams - 1998
Richard Hamilton - 1999
Nene Hilario - 2002
Kirk Hinrich - 2003
Luol Deng - 2004
Eric Gordan - 2008
Picks at the 8th Spot
Andre Miller - 1999
Jamal Crawford - 2000
Rudy Gay - 2006
Picks at the 9th Spot
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998
Shawn Marion - 1999
Amare Stoudemire - 2002
Andre Iguodala - 2004
Joakim Noah - 2007
Picks at the 10th Spot
Paul Pierce - 1998
Jason Terry - 1999
Joe Johnson - 2001
Caron Butler - 2002
Andrew Bynum - 2005
Brook Lopez - 2008
Picks at the 11th Spot
Bonzi Wells - 1998
Mickael Pietrus - 2003
Andris Biendrins - 2004
Picks at 12th - 20th Spots
Nick Collison (12th) - 2003
Keon Clark(13th) - 1998
Corey Maggette(13th) - 1999
Richard Jefferson(13th) - 2001
Matt Harpring(15th) - 1998
Al Jefferson(15th) - 2004
Ron Artest(16th) - 1999
Hidayet Turkoglu(16th) - 2000
Josh Smith(17th) - 2004
Danny Granger(17th) - 2005
James Posey (18th) - 1999
David West(18th) - 2003
Zach Randolph(19th) - 2001
Jameer Nelson(20th) - 2004
Using Danny Granger as an example, if Toronto would have 'reached' and selected Danny Granger in 2005 with the #7 pick, instead of Charlie Villanueva, I think that people would have questioned the decision at the time, though in hindsight it would have been the best picks they could have made.
So I have no problems if Petrie keeps the pick and 'reaches' for a player who we might have listed in the teens, because he's such a good evaluator of talent.
So, unless AI is on the table and we have to use our pick in order to acquire him, I say let Petrie get to work and get us a good player with that 7th pick.
Uncia,
Many of the guys you listed had a lot more interest and prospective talent at the time of their draft than what you're seeing now at the 7th spot. Some of those guys dropped due to draft day hype for other athletic talents, some just had trouble finding a team needing them. Amare and Bynum dropped due to questions about being too young. Hamilton didn't have the sexy athleticism to be a top five guy. Andre Miller had shown to be a solid, smart PG in college, but again was not top five due to a lack of the "sexy" factor.
I would say this draft lacks in both the solid and in the sexy, and many picks look like the sort of bench help of the mid to late half of previous drafts.
Many of the guys you listed had a lot more interest and prospective talent at the time of their draft than what you're seeing now at the 7th spot. Some of those guys dropped due to draft day hype for other athletic talents, some just had trouble finding a team needing them. Amare and Bynum dropped due to questions about being too young. Hamilton didn't have the sexy athleticism to be a top five guy. Andre Miller had shown to be a solid, smart PG in college, but again was not top five due to a lack of the "sexy" factor.
I would say this draft lacks in both the solid and in the sexy, and many picks look like the sort of bench help of the mid to late half of previous drafts.
There are a lot of reasons why a player will fall in the draft, and it's always easy in hind-sight to say that 'it's obvious that he should have been taken earlier'.
For instance, remember how Joe Alexander jumped to the top of the draft during the offseason and was selected by Milwaukee with the 8th spot?
I remember reading the articles that summer about how he slept in the gym and always had a basketball in his hands. His perceived dedication to gain basketball skills combined with this athleticism caused Milwaukee to pick him, and of course we know he became a bust.
Well, in hindsight I can say that they made a mistake in selecting him that early, but at the time you just don't know.
How about Russell Westbrook being selected with the 4th pick in that same draft? He didn't get to play the PG spot due to Collison being there, and there were severe questions about his game. When OKC selected him, it was a huge reach at that point, and now, 3 years later he's an all-star.
Again, in hindsight, it's perfectly obvious that Miami or Minnesota should have selected Westbrook, even if that would have been a huge reach at the time, but you don't really know what's going to become of these players until they have a chance to either succeed or fail at working on their games.
And that's the point I'm making. You say that the draft lacks both solid and sexy picks, and many of the picks look like potential bench help. It's fine to say that, but the reality is that more than likely there will be some big-time players who are selected from the 7th spot forward. Players who had question marks, but over-came their weaknesses.
What would happen if Chris Singleton worked extensively on his game and became a 40%+ shooter from the 3-pt line? If I knew he was eventually going to take his shooting game to that sort of level, I'd select him with the 7th pick with-out hesitation. What if Jordan Hamilton really is the second coming of Paul Pierce (who's game he reminds me of), people would look back and wonder why Hamilton slipped all the way to 10+.
What if Kenneth Faried ends up being the second coming of the Worm, and helps fuel a team to multiple championships with his hustle, defense, and elite rebounding? Dennis Rodman was the 27th pick in his draft, I think that's good value at that spot.
After watching college basketball all season long, it's easy to look at some of these players and think how good they could be if they shore up some of their weaknesses. It will be up to Petrie to look hard at each of these guys, and select the one who has the best chance of dominating at what they are good at while working hard to fill in the holes of their game.
Hindsight is easy to work with, it's trying to project how a player will respond in regards to working on their game and acomplishing their goals that can be difficult, but I can almost guarantee that their will be some player out there who will 'prove everyone wrong' and end up being a major player. Hopefully that player will be selected by Petrie.
For instance, remember how Joe Alexander jumped to the top of the draft during the offseason and was selected by Milwaukee with the 8th spot?
I remember reading the articles that summer about how he slept in the gym and always had a basketball in his hands. His perceived dedication to gain basketball skills combined with this athleticism caused Milwaukee to pick him, and of course we know he became a bust.
Well, in hindsight I can say that they made a mistake in selecting him that early, but at the time you just don't know.
How about Russell Westbrook being selected with the 4th pick in that same draft? He didn't get to play the PG spot due to Collison being there, and there were severe questions about his game. When OKC selected him, it was a huge reach at that point, and now, 3 years later he's an all-star.
Again, in hindsight, it's perfectly obvious that Miami or Minnesota should have selected Westbrook, even if that would have been a huge reach at the time, but you don't really know what's going to become of these players until they have a chance to either succeed or fail at working on their games.
And that's the point I'm making. You say that the draft lacks both solid and sexy picks, and many of the picks look like potential bench help. It's fine to say that, but the reality is that more than likely there will be some big-time players who are selected from the 7th spot forward. Players who had question marks, but over-came their weaknesses.
What would happen if Chris Singleton worked extensively on his game and became a 40%+ shooter from the 3-pt line? If I knew he was eventually going to take his shooting game to that sort of level, I'd select him with the 7th pick with-out hesitation. What if Jordan Hamilton really is the second coming of Paul Pierce (who's game he reminds me of), people would look back and wonder why Hamilton slipped all the way to 10+.
What if Kenneth Faried ends up being the second coming of the Worm, and helps fuel a team to multiple championships with his hustle, defense, and elite rebounding? Dennis Rodman was the 27th pick in his draft, I think that's good value at that spot.
After watching college basketball all season long, it's easy to look at some of these players and think how good they could be if they shore up some of their weaknesses. It will be up to Petrie to look hard at each of these guys, and select the one who has the best chance of dominating at what they are good at while working hard to fill in the holes of their game.
Hindsight is easy to work with, it's trying to project how a player will respond in regards to working on their game and acomplishing their goals that can be difficult, but I can almost guarantee that their will be some player out there who will 'prove everyone wrong' and end up being a major player. Hopefully that player will be selected by Petrie.
We can always acquire another vet via the free agency, trading our pick right now isn't a good option, lets look at who's available, we never know who might fall... or who we might get.
some teams will be looking for financial flexibility, we can move in and take capspace. or whatever... only way I'd like to do a trade is if were moving up... Beno 7th and 2nd rounder for 4th of CLE and some fillers? dunno.. but if i recall we have 3 picks in this draft 2 in the second round.
some teams will be looking for financial flexibility, we can move in and take capspace. or whatever... only way I'd like to do a trade is if were moving up... Beno 7th and 2nd rounder for 4th of CLE and some fillers? dunno.. but if i recall we have 3 picks in this draft 2 in the second round.
I think if you've come to the finality that you can't sign AK47 or Prince to shore up the SF position, you pull the trigger on the Casspi/#7 for Iggy...the Sixers seem to be pretty high on Geoff's speed dial list it seems. BUT...if you can entice Kirilenko or Prince to sign, I think the focus in trading this pick should be a veteran PG's.
And that's my point. Geoff got Hedo at #16 in the worst draft I can remember. He also landed Gerald Wallace at #25 and Kevin Martin at #26. If this pick had real trade value and could bring back a veteran that could help the Kings win now, I'd be all for it. And if it is part of a package to bring back a stud SF to round out the lineup I'd be okay with it. But in and of itself it has little perceived value and I'd wager nearly anything that Geoff could use it to select a player that would be more talented than what he'd get back in return for trading it.
As I said, if this were a top 3 pick, I'd probably say trade it because it has value to other teams. But the #7 pick? Use it. I'd go so far as to argue that if a talented veteran is what people want Petrie to get in return for this pick that letting him draft a guy would ultimately provide a trade asset with better value than the pick itself has now.
As I said, if this were a top 3 pick, I'd probably say trade it because it has value to other teams. But the #7 pick? Use it. I'd go so far as to argue that if a talented veteran is what people want Petrie to get in return for this pick that letting him draft a guy would ultimately provide a trade asset with better value than the pick itself has now.
I'm totally befuddled where everyone has gotten this idea that Hamilton can't defend, and that he's a selfish player. Neither of which is true. Just ask Harrison Barnes how good a defender Hamilton is. In Hamilton's freshman year, there's no doubt that he was a ballhog that forced up a lot of bad shots in traffic and out beyond the perimiter. But his sophmore year was almost the complete opposite of his freshman year. As one of the announcers said at the combine, he did a 170 degree turn around. Didn't quite make 180, but he was very close.
It seems as though, if one person on this fourm says someone is a bad defender, then it suddenly becomes gospel. In Hamilton's case, its pure BS.
It seems as though, if one person on this fourm says someone is a bad defender, then it suddenly becomes gospel. In Hamilton's case, its pure BS.
I voted to keep the pick. But, if the right deal comes along, then I'm fine with trading it. But I'm not going to trade it just to get rid of it. If I can get Iggy without throwing in the pick, then I'm going to do it. So I'm keeping the pick until I see a deal that makes me want to give it up in order to get the deal done.
I also thnk the draft is going to produce some good players. Even some taken in the second round will look like 1st round picks a few years from now. UNci03 mentioned Chris Singleton, and how he would like him if he could shoot 40% from beyond the 3pt line. Well he shot slightly under 37% last season, and was up at 39% for most of the year until he was injured. When he came back he was obviously rusty and his shooting showed it. Since everyone here seems to be a defensive freak at the moment, I'll say it again. Singleton is probably the best defensive player in the entire draft. He's also a terrific athlete with outstanding lateral quickness. He can guard 4 positions. He also averaged 1.5 blocks a game from the SF position along with 2 steals a game. And, he's 6'9" and not 6'7". And for someone that mentioned earlier that he though Hamilton was a little to short for the SF position. He measured out to be 6'8.5" in shoes at the combine. So his height is just fine.
I also thnk the draft is going to produce some good players. Even some taken in the second round will look like 1st round picks a few years from now. UNci03 mentioned Chris Singleton, and how he would like him if he could shoot 40% from beyond the 3pt line. Well he shot slightly under 37% last season, and was up at 39% for most of the year until he was injured. When he came back he was obviously rusty and his shooting showed it. Since everyone here seems to be a defensive freak at the moment, I'll say it again. Singleton is probably the best defensive player in the entire draft. He's also a terrific athlete with outstanding lateral quickness. He can guard 4 positions. He also averaged 1.5 blocks a game from the SF position along with 2 steals a game. And, he's 6'9" and not 6'7". And for someone that mentioned earlier that he though Hamilton was a little to short for the SF position. He measured out to be 6'8.5" in shoes at the combine. So his height is just fine.
Its probably been mentioned several times already. But remember, one of the reasons Philly is trying to move Iggy is to rid themselves of some salary. That means they are limited to dealing with teams that can take on salary in an uneven exchange. That limits them to just a few teams, Kings included. So to some extent, that puts the team taking on more salary in the drivers seat, and gives that team more control in dictating the terms of the deal. The Kings would be trading capspace, and there aren't many teams that can, or will be able to do that.
Same... Someone questioned his defense, and that has never been an issue at Texas at any time in his college career. Plus he compares himself to a Danny Granger which isn't what we all want?! He's not selfish either. Never has been. He's also the best ball handling, best passing SF, and arguably the best shooting SF in the draft.
Listen to his interview.. If you saw him during his freshman year then you might get the wrong idea about him. Coach gave him a tape of all his shots and sat with him and watched it. It had an effect on him because in his sophomore year he became a great all around player. The kid listens and he's not dumb at all. Even if we have to reach for him I would be happy to have a guy like Hamilton on the team.
Listen to his interview.. If you saw him during his freshman year then you might get the wrong idea about him. Coach gave him a tape of all his shots and sat with him and watched it. It had an effect on him because in his sophomore year he became a great all around player. The kid listens and he's not dumb at all. Even if we have to reach for him I would be happy to have a guy like Hamilton on the team.
That's the thing.. Hamilton doesn't need shots. He doesn't get a pass and sit there trying to create his own shot like all our other SFs. He's a spot up player with a quick as hell shot that will not get blocked much (if at all). He's a great bailout player for a penetrating guards that need to pass back out.
Not to mention Hamilton is the best SF passer in the draft, and arguably the best shooter.
Not to mention Hamilton is the best SF passer in the draft, and arguably the best shooter.
Last year as a freshman he was competing with 3 other players, and he felt (at least according to interviews) that he needed to showcase his skills when he had the chance so basically he would put up shot after shot. The coach went over every single shot he took last year with Hamilton, and worked on his game from there into his sophomore year. It seemed to help.
Personally I don't know why draft boards have him so far back.. In this draft he should be about 10th or so. As for his size that someone brought up he is almost 6'9 in shoes which isn't bad for a SF at all and a solid 225. He's working on his nutrition, and working out. Wish school he was saying that a lot of times he had to grab a quick snack whatever was available and go to class. Now he can focus more on proper nutrition, and exercise.
He was also saying that everything he has done up to this point was to get into the NBA and that once there he will be able to fit into a role and not try to do things he can't do. I really believe he's a smart kid, and I think he will be a good player. Probably not a great player, but a good player that can give you what we thought Donte Greene could have gave us.
Personally I don't know why draft boards have him so far back.. In this draft he should be about 10th or so. As for his size that someone brought up he is almost 6'9 in shoes which isn't bad for a SF at all and a solid 225. He's working on his nutrition, and working out. Wish school he was saying that a lot of times he had to grab a quick snack whatever was available and go to class. Now he can focus more on proper nutrition, and exercise.
He was also saying that everything he has done up to this point was to get into the NBA and that once there he will be able to fit into a role and not try to do things he can't do. I really believe he's a smart kid, and I think he will be a good player. Probably not a great player, but a good player that can give you what we thought Donte Greene could have gave us.
Not sure what they mean by that, but its probably a reference to his becoming the leader of the team, mostly by default. All the seniors and previous stars left after his freshman year, which was a disastor. So while just being a sophmore, he was also the seasoned vet on the team to some extent. And yes, he scored a lot, but they had hardly anyone else on the team that could score. His growth from his freshman year to his sophmore year was astonishing. It was as if I was watching an entirely different player. He's a very good passer, and as Gary said, he's definitely the best ballhandler of all the possible SF's. He almost led his team in rebounding every game He's tough, and plays with intensity. And offensively he's more than just a spot up shooter. He's great at running the pick and roll or just plain coming off screens and shooting. He also has a great post up game, and a very good pull up mid-range game, especially along the baseline.
What I don't understand, is people on one hand are hoping that Leonard can develop a good jumpshot, but at the same time they criticize Hamilton because he already has a good offensive game. Where's the logic in that. Hamilton is a very coachable kid, and he'll do what you ask him to do. He's very good at playing off the ball. I agree with Gary. I don't know why he's currently ranked as low as he is. I expect him to start rising up the boards after some of the team workouts.
What I don't understand, is people on one hand are hoping that Leonard can develop a good jumpshot, but at the same time they criticize Hamilton because he already has a good offensive game. Where's the logic in that. Hamilton is a very coachable kid, and he'll do what you ask him to do. He's very good at playing off the ball. I agree with Gary. I don't know why he's currently ranked as low as he is. I expect him to start rising up the boards after some of the team workouts.