Chubbs
Starter
.
Me too. Serve it up.
I reserve the right to make snap judgements and be wrong. Often.
Me too. Serve it up.
I reserve the right to make snap judgements and be wrong. Often.
IT Gay and DMC not a good combination
- Thread starter morsatun
- Start date
Chubbs
Starter
Gay has been the problem in Toronto. You saw what they took for him. We got rid of salmons, but to Toronto fans, Gay is a like a mega salmons. More talent, but he was outta control in Toronto. A lot of people think we are suckers for making this move. I don't, but it's out there.
I'll let Malone figure that out, but the reason people think it was a bad trade is because of Gay and how he played in Toronto. Of course, I don't believe he can't be a team player, and I think the way Toronto used him was the worst way possible.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
I'm wondering if a trade in the near future is going to bring us a servicable back-up point guard. I don't see Thornton, Jimmer or Ray being up to the job right now. Teams are going to be attacking that weakness on our second unit. Or possibly they may have Gay play some minutes with the second unit and have him bring the ball up?
But for real, the big challenge will be to see if IT can do the same thing with Gay added to the mix. I said from day 1 he could be a #2 to Cousins effectively. Last night, even though we got 31 from Williams, most of it came in transition or throw the flow of the offense. IT and Cousins controlled the ball most of the game.
It's going to take sacrifice from Cousins, IT, and Gay to make that trio work. All 3 are extremely capable passers when they want to be. All 3 are also hero-ball players when they want to be. I hope Malone has last nights game on loop for everyone on the bench. That is exactly what we should be striving to do every game
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
I actually think last nights game is a pretty solid indication of what things will look like WITH Rudy Gay.
If you think about it, Williams pretty much played the Rudy Gay role. Gay averages 18 shots per game, Williams took 16. Pretty close. We had 3 guys in the starting lineup with over 16 shots, and 2 with 7. That sort of shot distribution is what we should expect.
Obviously Williams was awesome last night. You aren't going to get that sort of production out of Gay (or anyone) every game, so there is that.
This has a higher likelyhood of working with JT at the 4, obviously, because if Williams is going to be a player in this league .. a real player, he's going to need shots too.
If you think about it, Williams pretty much played the Rudy Gay role. Gay averages 18 shots per game, Williams took 16. Pretty close. We had 3 guys in the starting lineup with over 16 shots, and 2 with 7. That sort of shot distribution is what we should expect.
Obviously Williams was awesome last night. You aren't going to get that sort of production out of Gay (or anyone) every game, so there is that.
This has a higher likelyhood of working with JT at the 4, obviously, because if Williams is going to be a player in this league .. a real player, he's going to need shots too.
OnYouLikeGlue
Bench
The, Isaiah will stifle Cousins' offensive production argument, will hopefully fade away.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-b...ing-lineup-bang-kings-112-152111225--nba.html
"For the time being, the Kings will probably be happy enough with Thomas mopping the floor with the competition — especially when sharing the floor with Cousins. The Kings have bested the opposition by 13.6 points per 100 possessions with that duo on the floor this season, according to NBA.com's lineup data, scoring at a rate that outstrips even the Portland Trail Blazers' league-leading offense."
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-b...ing-lineup-bang-kings-112-152111225--nba.html
"For the time being, the Kings will probably be happy enough with Thomas mopping the floor with the competition — especially when sharing the floor with Cousins. The Kings have bested the opposition by 13.6 points per 100 possessions with that duo on the floor this season, according to NBA.com's lineup data, scoring at a rate that outstrips even the Portland Trail Blazers' league-leading offense."
We'll see.
Quiet as it's kept (and, let's get it straight, Thomas had a great game; don't even front, and try to act like I'm saying otherwise), that game didn't show us anything about Isaiah Thomas that we didn't already know. Of his twelve assists:
- 4 came off penetration
- 3 came in transition
- 2 came off a pick and pop
- 1 came on a baseline cut, where the cutter pulled up, rather than go all the way to the basket.
(Cite: http://stats.nba.com/gameDetail.html?GameID=0021300309)
We already knew he could do that. Nobody questioned whether he could do that. That's how he gets most of his assists. The question was, and remains, whether or not Thomas can consistently and reliably get Cousins the ball where he needs it in the post. Only two of his twelve came on successful entry passes.
Now, last night, he didn't have to, because Cousins was getting the ball inside from his teammates; if that keeps up, then everything is Kool and the Gang. We'll have to see what happens against a team that isn't as soft inside. But, as far as the question of whether Thomas can get Cousins the ball... well, unfortunately, NBA.com does not provide replays of personal fouls (and I am not currently in a position where I can review the unabridged game footage), so I can't verify whether or not any of Cousins' free throw attempts came after post feeds from Thomas. What I can verify is that Cousins converted ten field goals: three were jumpers, and the other seven came in the paint. And, of those seven paint buckets:
- 2 were on offensive rebounds
- 2 were on post feeds from McLemore
- 1 was on a post feed from Thompson
- 1 was on a fast break from Thompson
Only one was on a post feed from Thomas. So, that was, and will continue to be the question. I take nothing away from what Thomas can do on the court, but I didn't come to how I feel about him because of one game, and one game isn't going to change my mind. Did he have a great game last night? Absolutely. Was Cousins still able to get his? Yes, he was. Does it mean that they can successfully start together, in the long term? That remains to be seen. At the very least, I think that we have to wait until NTTAWWT suits up, before we can even consider that question answerable.
Chubbs
Starter
I think last night showed what some of us have been saying, if IT can't get it to cuz in the post, then literally any of the other starters can. And should. Don't make It do what he doesn't do well. JT can even do it as we saw,
Smart play and coaching can take care of this problem. Not Keith Smart, actually intelligent play.
But just one night, minus gay.
This team is so much more interesting. Can't get over that.
Smart play and coaching can take care of this problem. Not Keith Smart, actually intelligent play.
But just one night, minus gay.
This team is so much more interesting. Can't get over that.
That's a completely fair rebuttal; I'll feel much more comfortable about it when it happens with Gay, though.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Pretty far fetched all at once actually.
I'll make an image of the boxscore last night and post it here in a bit. People need to study it, because if we go ahead with Cousins/Gay/IT there's a good chance that's the way it would work. Not in everybody shooting 50+%, but in shots. 3 guys getting 15+. Nobody else getting more than 7. Willaiims and McLemore be largely squeezed back. The rest just almost nothing.
Entity
Hall of Famer
well there was 6-7 min in the 4th that the big 3 didn't play. unless its a blowout every night you could realistically add a few attepts to each. and if you can avoid 21 turnovers you could pull a few extra possesions there also.
probably is alot for one game. rotations really make the difference.
Hadlowe
Starter
Utah will also give us something we didn't see in Dallas, a bruising frontline. That team is not a good defensive team, but they are tall and bang hard down low, certainly harder than Dirk Nowitzki and friends.
If Favors plays.
Exactly. Who cares who gets Cousins the ball as long as he gets his touches? It was almost comical how many easy looks and 1on1 match-ups Cousins got last night. Why? Because the Mavericks couldn't afford to double him with IT and Williams being threats on the floor. A big reason I've been "team start Isaiah" is just his presence on the floor makes teams account for him. If you double Cousins, he can make you pay. At the beginning of the season, teams would just throw double and triple teams at Cuz and watch everyone else brick shots. Now, we're starting to stack up guys who can punish opposing defenses if you decide to double Cuz.
OnYouLikeGlue
Bench
To me it's bit a question with just a one game sample (in regards to IT and Cuz). That stat was for the season. While those two are on the floor together the kings are scoring 13.6 more points/100 possessions than the opponent, and Cousins usage% is actually higher than when IT is off the floor.
So I'm just saying 20 games this year appears to show IT playing with Cuz doesn't stifle our franchise centers production.
I too am curious to see how Gay fits in, but am entirely confident Malone will still have most things running through Cousins.
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