It breaks my heart a little but...

[VF21]

A new blog entry has been added:

[drupal=38]It breaks my heart a little but...[/drupal]

I don't want Mike Bibby (or Ron Artest) back. I will always remember the good times with Bibby BUT what I saw tonight was so reminiscent of "The Year of the Suckage" that I couldn't even finish the PBP.

Reggie Theus and the "scrubs" have done wonders this year. They've put excitement and energy back into Arco and the fans. They've given us heart and hustle and they've really put it all out there on the court.

Tonight, however, was ugly - and I don't want to see any more of it. Sam Amick quoted Brad as saying something I thought was not only truthful but almost scary if you think about what happened when Webber came back. Miller said that the team we saw beat the Mavericks had been playing almost the whole time without them (meaning Bibby and Artest, I think) and building a bond together. And I think we loved seeing the revitalized Miller, along with an incredibly improved Salmons, a Garcia who could take your breath away OR give you a heart attack (or both), a defensive force off the bench in Dahntay Jones, the pure point guard play of Beno Udrih and the potential of Spencer and even Justin Williams.

I want to see more of that team, the one Brad is talking about. I do NOT want to sit through three months of what I saw tonight. Been there, done that. Read the box, saw the movie, but passed on the t-shirt. And I'm passing on a replay of TYOTS. It was horrible the first time and there's no way we - the Kings fans - can or should be expected to sit through it again.

 

[piksi]

until they get traded - there isn't much we can do - unfortunately

And nice to see some players admitting even if indirectly that bringing Webber back was a mistake but then again we already know that for a long time now

 

[creAtivetfh]

a truer post has never been typed

 

[Showtime]

I can only hope Mike is moved before the deadline, and if not, I hope Reggie can realise what is going on and not let Mike play more than 20 minutes a game.

 

[piksi]

I can only hope Mike is moved before the deadline, and if not, I hope Reggie can realise what is going on and not let Mike play more than 20 minutes a game.

never going to happen

 

[GoGoGadget]

Miek + Ron hasn't worked since Adelman left, and I didn't expect that to have changed.

Both of them should be traded, one of them MUST be traded, and I'd make Ron top priority.

 

[BMiller52]

I can only hope Mike is moved before the deadline, and if not, I hope Reggie can realise what is going on and not let Mike play more than 20 minutes a game.

Yeah, unfortunately we'll need to showcase him for a couple weeks to show he's still got it. But he shouldn't be back next year, heck he shouldn't be back after the trade deadline. He might but he shouldn't. The guy needs to go, he doesn't make anyone on this team easier. He doesn't do the stuff that makes it possible for THIS team to win(defend, pass, slash to the basket), he would do something for a guy like Bron or Wade but not here. He doesn't help us. He had 0 assists. He just doesn't fit with the other guys we have. Hopefully he plays well and we can get a good trade for him.

 

[Superman]

I can only hope Mike is moved before the deadline, and if not, I hope Reggie can realise what is going on and not let Mike play more than 20 minutes a game.

What needs to happen is we need to go ahead and let Mike do what he did tonight for a few weeks, let him show that he can still score, let him handle the ball, and build his trade stock.

Then we can package him and KT or Mikki for a youngster or a pick, put Beno back in the starting lineup, and run Spenser and Justin the rest of the way. Yeah, we lose a bunch of games, but we gain in the long run, not only with an additional pick, but we get a higher pick by virtue of the fact that we finish lower in the standings.

Do the same thing with Ron.

 

[jon e]

after one game?

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

It will probably be hard to get equal value in return for someone like Mike, despite his impressive resume, but his lasting impressions are his career low averages last year and his injury problems this year. Nonetheless, he's still perceived as a top tier starting PG, but just not worth as much in return.

Isaiah apparently won't budge with David Lee, a top flight rebounder but still considered a role player, atlhough a very good one. Cleveland apparently believes Drew Gooden is enough for Bibby, and given Gooden's proven himself to be a role player and a relative bust for the 4th pick overall, it's definitely not equal value. The ship may have sailed with Bibby, but the best we might expect (and that might not be a bad thing) is to get a hard-working contributing role player and future draft picks.

 

[piksi]

after one game?

make that 83 games

 

[VF21]

after one game?

How long does it take to recognize something you've seen and cringed about before?

Bibby, Martin, Artest, Moore and Miller isn't going to go anywhere. And the fans aren't going to get excited about their product. How do we know? Because, with the exception of Mikki, we've seen it all before - ad nauseum.

Udrih, Salmons, Garcia, Moore (or Jones) and Miller are at least fun to watch. With Martin coming off the bench, they still generate excitement. Bibby and Artest doesn't work. They didn't work last year, they won't work this year and I'll poke my eyes out with dull sticks if they're together next year.

So, to answer your question... Yes, I came to these conclusions after one game. It was one game, but it was also the never-ending game. The game without end. The Groundhog Day of games.

 

[Superman]

The ship may have sailed with Bibby, but the best we might expect (and that might not be a bad thing) is to get a hard-working contributing role player and future draft picks.

That's not so bad. I mean, he's not going to yield a superstar of course. What we need - besides a superstar - is a hard-working contributor and draft picks. Someone like Drew Gooden would be fine, if not for his contract. I'd be more than happy to take a lesser player and protected first rounder.

Edit: Gooden's contract isn't as bad as I thought it was; must have confused him with someone else. I'd take Gooden and a lottery-protected first for Bibby, at the deadline. I'd rather package Bibby with either KT or Mikki, but the money wouldn't work with Cleveland. They'd have to package a deal together to make it work.

 

[jon e]

its bibbys first game back and i want him gone just as badly as everyone else seems to want him gone but i havent popped the bottle of scotch yet tonite so im trying to reason as best as i can

 

[Gary]

I agree with you VF.. BUT, this team w/o Bibby, and Artest can only grow so much. Unless we get an injection (meaning a PF) into the lineup than we will be a bad team.

Bibby and Artest though don't fit with our style, and should be traded.. just not quite sure for who though.

 

[VF21]

I agree with you VF.. BUT, this team w/o Bibby, and Artest can only grow so much. Unless we get an injection (meaning a PF) into the lineup than we will be a bad team.

Yes, but we're already a bad team.

Bibby and Artest though don't fit with our style, and should be traded.. just not quite sure for who though.

I don't think anyone has the perfect answer to whom; my point was just that I finally realized that we're better off without Bibby and Artest than with them if we do, in fact, want to think seriously about the future.

Trading Mike and Ron will at least bring more new blood to the team, be it new players, expiring contracts, draft picks or a combination. I didn't want to believe it - as I really had wanted to see Bibby retire a a King - but after tonight's debacle I knew it was past time.

 

[diggining]

I was impressed that Theus has the guts to keep Martin/Bibby/Artest on the bench at the start of the game, but also disappointed that Bibby and Artest both got 29 minutes--especially the woeful Artest.

I really would like to see Salmons and Martin on the court for the majority of the minutes, especially to see how they would play together. Together, they produced the most enjoyable game for a Kings fan so far this season against the Mavs. It's just so much more fun seeing the likes of Salmons, Garcia, Douby, Udrih, and even Dahntay Jones play together, show what they can do, and develop some chemistry. It just feels like Artest and Bibby crashed the party tonight.

 

[Jechtsphere]

I agree.

The positive with mike is the teams that were interested but wondering if his injury would hold him back or stop them from trading for him should know now if not soon that he's ready...that's what I like.

He needs to go, move on and such.

I love the young guys we have and watching them play.

 

[HighFlyingMonkey]

Mike is not the problem. IMO, our 2/3 logjam MUST be resolved. This team was actually fun to watch with Salmons as our starting 3, and I really do believe that life without Ron Artest will be better for the Sacramento Kings from now on out.

 

[Fear the Putin]

but, have some of you guys noticed that when Artest is out the Martin + Bibby tandem suddenly becomes that run and gun high octane fun?

It happened many times last season. Artest would be out and suddenly Bibby would break out of his season long shooting slump and hit shots from all over the place while Martin was streaming freely like a gazelle. Young guns were hitting shots and everything was clicking.


First things first. This is ONE game since we had everybody back. But, I as always will stick by my belief that Artest does however stall the offense. Bibby is capable of performing and thriving in a high octane run and gun offense. Artest however is the complete opposite. Dont get me wrong. Hes a great player, great talent, but what I saw last season through the Muss-infested dilemma is just far too obvious.

 

[BMiller52]

but, have some of you guys noticed that when Artest is out the Martin + Bibby tandem suddenly becomes that run and gun high octane fun?

It happened many times last season. Artest would be out and suddenly Bibby would break out of his season long shooting slump and hit shots from all over the place while Martin was streaming freely like a gazelle. Young guns were hitting shots and everything was clicking.


First things first. This is ONE game since we had everybody back. But, I as always will stick by my belief that Artest does however stall the offense. Bibby is capable of performing and thriving in a high octane run and gun offense. Artest however is the complete opposite. Dont get me wrong. Hes a great player, great talent, but what I saw last season through the Muss-infested dilemma is just far too obvious.

Bibby is too slow, it's not Ron's fault here man. Bibby just walks the ball up the court. Bibby thrived tonight with Ron but nobody else on the team played well. Not Ron, not Kevin, nobody. Ron, Kevin, and the rest of the "young guns" showed earlier this season they can play together. Bibby hasn't shown that. I'm not saying Ron's not the problem but come on man, it's time for Mike to go for sure.

 

[VF21]

Oh don't put it all on Bibby. Ron needs to go, too.

 

[Showtime]

Mike is not the problem. IMO, our 2/3 logjam MUST be resolved. This team was actually fun to watch with Salmons as our starting 3, and I really do believe that life without Ron Artest will be better for the Sacramento Kings from now on out.

Even when Artest was on the floor at times during the season, they were still better than with Mike tonight. Hitting 3's doesn't make him have a good game. He didn't try to do anything but shoot. He had ZERO dimes and 4 TO's. Beno isn't in love with his own shot, and previously in the season, the team with this lineup:

Beno
Martin/Garcia
Salmons
Artest/Moore
Miller

was actually playing well and playing hard. Tonight, there was no team play because nobody could get the ball when Bibby had it. Ron was bad too, but he's been like this for a while. Bibby looked for a shot, and if he didn't see a shot for himself, he dumped it off instead of trying to create like Beno does. I see Mike as a bigger stumbling block to this offense because of the contrast of how Beno plays at that position, than any 'logjam' at the wing positions. I do agree though, that the team will be better off without Ron, but I also believe that Mike doesn't do anything for the offense other than shooting, and that's what Martin is for. The team needs a passing PG, not a shooting one. They both need to go IMO.

 

[BMiller52]

Oh don't put it all on Bibby. Ron needs to go, too.

I know that though, which is why I said "I'm not saying Ron's not the problem". But we are talking about Bibby right now. And we are a crappy team with parts that don't fit together. So there's more than 1 big problem. But Mike is 1 of those big problems, as he just doesn't fit with our mismatched roster and what we are "trying to do"(I'm honestly not sure what we're trying to do however). I mean you could say similar things about Ron. But as far as Bibby goes we need to go in a different direction, and it's not like Ron is holding Mike back or anything. As far as I'm concerned Mike proved that tonight and many times last season. Ron needs to go too but so does Bibby and that's not Ron's fault.

 

[Showtime]

Anybody notice the team took 27 three point shots tonight, and only 15 FT's?

 

[Mr.King]

First of all, I think Ron Artest shouldn't have been activated today. It is kind of strange that Ron suddenly pops from nowhere saying that he is ready to play, when he is supposed to be two weeks away from his projected day of return. Moreover, he chooses the same day to come back when Bibby is being activated.
I mean what is he trying to do here? Is he feeling insecure about being the only guy along with Shareef to be on the disabled list? Or can he not wait to screw up the team chemistry. I think Theus should have activated Artest one week from Today so that team was comfortable enough with the integration of Bibby. Two starters being activated on the same day, who have a proven track record of not playing well together is completely suicidal.
And I whole heartedly agree with some of the comments posted here that Bibby and Artest need to go! On game day, I can't wait to see our "oh not so STAR" players giving there all out and making the team fun and exciting, but today I went into the same depression as last season. The team was unbearable to watch after 1st half. Kevin Martin, John Salmons all reacted differently than what I have been accustomed of watching.
"It was as if Something was in the Air" and not in a good way.

 

[Packt]

Team been broken for the past two, three years. Only one game but the team should have been broken up last year. It cost us a lot in one of the better draft years. The mistake was bringing back the same losing squad. So much for putting fans in the seats. We've had our moments, and some individuals have played well but Bibby coming back continues the heralded tradition of losing with nice stats. I'm not sure why he's getting all the blame when the team was losing before he suited up. Did anyone think we'd go on a tear because we beat Dallas by two points?

 

[VF21]

This wasn't intended to be a thread about blame. It was intended to be a thread about looking forward, saying goodbye to the past and wanting to see the team that beat the Mavericks instead of the team that lost to the Raptors.

 

[Heuge]

Well, whether it is Bibby or Ron or Salmon or Martin...a few people need to be traded. Now, will our GM do anything aggressive?

 

[Sluggah]

i agree both should go. but i think artest grinds the offense to a halt much more than bibby.