Is Jimmer in Smart's Doghouse?

[Bricklayer]

Jimmer should be getting playing time right now, regardless of how well Brooks or IT matches with Tyreke because this is another lost season. Brooks is not the answer to the future, and the Kings should throw Jimmer in there and let him fail if need be. What is the worst that can happen? Bad inbounds passes? Turnovers coming up the court? Bad entry passes? Invisible defense? Those things happen every single game with Brooks and IT... so there isn't much to lose at this point. Jimmer was getting around 20 minutes a nice in late Dec, early Jan... wonder what happened? Smart pissed that Jimmer's wife is going to road games?

On a side note, is there anything to IT starting once Cousins came back from the suspension?

A little perspective here on how Jimmer might have lsot Smart's confidence:

Nov: 12gms 10.9min 7.2pts (.508 .435 .882) 0.4reb 1.3ast 0.2stl 0.1blk
Dec: 14gms 17.4min 10.1pts (.425 .400 .927) 1.9reb 1.9ast 0.5stl 0.1blk
Jan: 13gms 14.9min 6.1pts (.329 .438 .867) 0.6reb 0.8ast 0.3stl 0.1blk

 

[sqwalk]

Brick, I agree it hasn't been great, but if I remember correctly, Jimmer's minutes starting getting cut before majority of his shooting slump developed - because of various players in and out of injuries. I could be wrong though, as the lineups and rotations have been so crazy.

 

[bajaden]

Smart shouldn't really have to ask what Brooks does better than Jimmer becuase its pretty obvious -- he can handle the ball.

The rest of it is just, well they're both terrible at most things not involving shooting. They don't rebound, like to gun, can't defend.

Once again, I'm going to disagree with you. Not on the ballhandling of course. There's no doubt that Brooks is a better ballhandler, and if he used that ballhandling to get into the lane, draw the defense to him, and then pass to the open man, I'd be fine with him. Problem is, thats not what he does. The distinct difference between Brooks and Jimmer, is that Jimmer will pass the ball, and if you ask him to play the part of a PG, he'll do that. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Jimmer was a gunner at BYU because thats what they asked him to do. Its almost like he's being blamed for being a good shooter, and for taking shots, which he's good at. Point is, he will share the ball and take what the defense gives him. Brooks will force the issue and as a result, no assists, and more turnovers than necessary.

But more importantly, which player is in the Kings future? Is it Brooks, or Jimmer, or neither? If its Jimmer, then for god sake, let him develop and lets find out if he's worth hanging our caps on. But this merry-go-round has to stop. Were headed for the lottery again, so what the hell do we have to lose by playing our young players and letting them develop. Signing Brooks was a big mistake as far as I'm concerned. All it did was give Brooks more toys to play with. It must take Smart an entire day of shopping to pick out a new shirt to buy.

 

[chief bromden]

A little perspective here on how Jimmer might have lsot Smart's confidence:

Nov: 12gms 10.9min 7.2pts (.508 .435 .882) 0.4reb 1.3ast 0.2stl 0.1blk
Dec: 14gms 17.4min 10.1pts (.425 .400 .927) 1.9reb 1.9ast 0.5stl 0.1blk
Jan: 13gms 14.9min 6.1pts (.329 .438 .867) 0.6reb 0.8ast 0.3stl 0.1blk

I think the interesting thing there is that his 3PT percentage hasn't suffered and his TO/game has trended up from 0.8 to 1.2 during that 3 month span. Why are they giving him more ball handling duties when that doesn't play to his strength? He needs to be a shooter for this team.

The last thing we need paired with Tyreke is a guard that drives the lane. IT's 3pt% in Jan is 23%!!! and he takes over three attempts per game. That is just sad.

Tell Jimmer to sit behind the 3pt line, in the corner or elbow three... and stay there. Tyreke drives and kicks, or he is open from the 2man game with Reke and Cuz...where Cuz can have an outlet when he gets doubled in/near the key.

Before, you would note that Jimmer's defense would kill this team. Our defense is non-existent so I think this is worth a shot... why not give it some run and see what happens?

 

[bajaden]

Brick, I agree it hasn't been great, but if I remember correctly, Jimmer's minutes starting getting cut before majority of his shooting slump developed - because of various players in and out of injuries. I could be wrong though, as the lineups and rotations have been so crazy.

No, your dead right! His minutes went down right after he had his best game of the season. The next game he came into the game in the 2nd quarter, and didn't play very well, and was jerked after around 4 or 5 minutes of play. The next game he didn't play at all. Now you can say he didn't play well in that one game, but do you penalize a player that badly for one bad game. Good way to shatter a players confidence. Personally, I don't think Smart likes Jimmer that much, and was giving him minutes because either management or the Maloofs wanted him to play. As soon as the new ownership with Seattle new's broke, Jimmers minutes have disappeared. Bricky implied as much, saying that Smart knows his clock is running, so he's going to do what he wants to do now. Unfortunately, he's the only one that understands what he wants to do. The players certainly don't.

By the way, did anyone else notice the evil look that Cousins gave Brooks when Brooks came out of the game and sat down next to Cuz? That look spoke volumes!

I guess I should add, I was watching the Denver broadcast, so it might not have been on the sacramento broadcast. Interesting to sit and listen to the other teams announcers though. The most common observation by them, is that the Kings play nothing but one on one basketball, and that most of the players are selfish. Pretty accurate actually!

 

[bajaden]

I think the interesting thing there is that his 3PT percentage hasn't suffered and his TO/game has trended up from 0.8 to 1.2 during that 3 month span. Why are they giving him more ball handling duties when that doesn't play to his strength? He needs to be a shooter for this team.

The last thing we need paired with Tyreke is a guard that drives the lane. IT's 3pt% in Jan is 23%!!! and he takes over three attempts per game. That is just sad.

Tell Jimmer to sit behind the 3pt line, in the corner or elbow three... and stay there. Tyreke drives and kicks, or he is open from the 2man game with Reke and Cuz...where Cuz can have an outlet when he gets doubled in/near the key.

Before, you would note that Jimmer's defense would kill this team. Our defense is non-existent so I think this is worth a shot... why not give it some run and see what happens?

I'm going to disagree with you a little bit. The best ability a PG can have is to get into the lane. All your good PG's drive into the lane, but what they do when they get there is what seperates them from the Brooks of the world. They pass to the open man. You just contradicted yourself when you said Tyreke should drive and kick the ball. Anyway, sorry to nic pic. Also, the reason Jimmers TO'ers went up a little, is because of one really bad game he had where he turned the ball over something like 4 times in a 5 minute span. Take that game away, and he's basicly back where he was before. Even at that, he turns the ball over less than just about anyone else on the team. And his ballhandling has improved quite a bit. Still a ways to go however.

 

[t-rex]

A little perspective here on how Jimmer might have lsot Smart's confidence:

Nov: 12gms 10.9min 7.2pts (.508 .435 .882) 0.4reb 1.3ast 0.2stl 0.1blk
Dec: 14gms 17.4min 10.1pts (.425 .400 .927) 1.9reb 1.9ast 0.5stl 0.1blk
Jan: 13gms 14.9min 6.1pts (.329 .438 .867) 0.6reb 0.8ast 0.3stl 0.1blk

Are you Keith Smart?

 

[Bricklayer]

A little perspective here on how Jimmer might have lsot Smart's confidence:

Nov: 12gms 10.9min 7.2pts (.508 .435 .882) 0.4reb 1.3ast 0.2stl 0.1blk
Dec: 14gms 17.4min 10.1pts (.425 .400 .927) 1.9reb 1.9ast 0.5stl 0.1blk
Jan: 13gms 14.9min 6.1pts (.329 .438 .867) 0.6reb 0.8ast 0.3stl 0.1blk

Are you Keith Smart?

Indeed, because obviously anybody looking at those numbers and saying hmm, the guy shooting .329 this month and not doing anythign else at all may not be the answer, must be Keith Smart.

 

[Section 101]

As soon as the new ownership with Seattle new's broke, Jimmers minutes have disappeared. Bricky implied as much, saying that Smart knows his clock is running, so he's going to do what he wants to do now. Unfortunately, he's the only one that understands what he wants to do. The players certainly don't.

By the way, did anyone else notice the evil look that Cousins gave Brooks when Brooks came out of the game and sat down next to Cuz? That look spoke volumes!

The problem is the players think Smart is gone at the end of the year. It doesn't matter what he tells them at this point. The only thing he has to get his message across is playing time.

 

[t-rex]

Indeed, because obviously anybody looking at those numbers and saying hmm, the guy shooting .329 this month and not doing anythign else at all may not be the answer, must be Keith Smart.

Really, because I could make the same case for every other player on the team yet Jimmer seems to ride the pine more than anyone of them. So Keith, tell me again why you play Aaron Brooks over Jimmer again? His stout defense, his 3 point shooting, his assist to turnover margin? Which is it?

 

[t-rex]

I understand with the team in limbo that trades are highly unlikely. However, with Rondo going down, it sure would be a good time to wheel and deal any of the following player(s) to Boston. Jimmer, IT, Brooks, or Evans

 

[bajaden]

I understand with the team in limbo that trades are highly unlikely. However, with Rondo going down, it sure would be a good time to wheel and deal any of the following player(s) to Boston. Jimmer, IT, Brooks, or Evans

Doubt they would want IT or Jimmer. They'd be looking for someone with experience. So lets trade them Brooks for their 1st round pick. It might end up being a pretty good one..Unfortunately, I don't think Ainge is that stupid.

 

[DesertFox]

Doubt they would want IT or Jimmer. They'd be looking for someone with experience. So lets trade them Brooks for their 1st round pick. It might end up being a pretty good one..Unfortunately, I don't think Ainge is that stupid.

I would take a future 2nd round pick for Brooks.

 

[William Blake]

A little perspective here on how Jimmer might have lsot Smart's confidence:

Nov: 12gms 10.9min 7.2pts (.508 .435 .882) 0.4reb 1.3ast 0.2stl 0.1blk
Dec: 14gms 17.4min 10.1pts (.425 .400 .927) 1.9reb 1.9ast 0.5stl 0.1blk
Jan: 13gms 14.9min 6.1pts (.329 .438 .867) 0.6reb 0.8ast 0.3stl 0.1blk

On top of this, lately I've been crunching some numbers about consistency trying to discover something interesting things this Kings team compared to the rest of the nba. It turns out that Jimmer is by far our most volatile guard, meaning that he either blows up or stinks badly. This might be a byproduct of Smart's inability to draw up decent plays and/or design a sensible gameplan but it might be as well an indicator that Jimmer isn't quite ready to start.
Wonder who's our most consistent guard not name Evans? Aaron Brooks.

Stats apart though, I am in favor of starting Jimmer. He can see the floor, shoot the spot up three and doesn't seem too selfish. This season is halfway down the toilet, it won't hurt to try to develop as much as we can a potential future Evans running mate.

 

[Glenn]

On top of this, lately I've been crunching some numbers about consistency trying to discover something interesting things this Kings team compared to the rest of the nba. It turns out that Jimmer is by far our most volatile guard, meaning that he either blows up or stinks badly. This might be a byproduct of Smart's inability to draw up decent plays and/or design a sensible gameplan but it might be as well an indicator that Jimmer isn't quite ready to start.
Wonder who's our most consistent guard not name Evans? Aaron Brooks.

Stats apart though, I am in favor of starting Jimmer. He can see the floor, shoot the spot up three and doesn't seem too selfish. This season is halfway down the toilet, it won't hurt to try to develop as much as we can a potential future Evans running mate.

I am more inclined to say that if Jimmer doesn't start well, he quickly gets jerked and we don't see him again. This cuts out the opportunity for him to get settled into the game and find his stroke. If he does well, he stays in. He's on a short leash.

 

[Hadlowe]

I am more inclined to say that if Jimmer doesn't start well, he quickly gets jerked and we don't see him again. This cuts out the opportunity for him to get settled into the game and find his stroke. If he does well, he stays in. He's on a short leash.

I put at least part of it on the lineups Jimmer runs with as well. There was a while in late December, early January where Jimmer was playing primarily with Brooks at point, Jimer at the 2, JJ, T-Rob and Hayes. That's just not a good lineup as the only two scoring threats are in the backcourt and don't really create for each other.

Not coincidentally, Jimmer tends to play best when he's on the floor with Tyreke or IT as they both tend to look for the open man on the court and both can work as primary ball-handler.

 

[UK_King]

Still like Jimmer alongside Tyreke.

I really would like to see that backcourt get a proper run.

with IT as the 6th man he gets to do his thing.

obviously that leaves MT on an island. But hey ho.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

remember.. this great coach of ours didn't know how to use the undrafted jeremy lin who is lighting it up in houston.

 

[LWP777]

remember.. this great coach of ours didn't know how to use the undrafted jeremy lin who is lighting it up in houston.

Sorry, but Jeremy Lin is not lighting it up in Houston. He's a nice story for sure but he's not the superstar everybody thinks he is.

 

[Section 101]

remember.. this great coach of ours didn't know how to use the undrafted jeremy lin who is lighting it up in houston.

Better check yourself. Lin has given Smart a ton of credit for teaching him.

 

[Kingster]

The great opportunity for Jimmer occurred when Thornton went down with injury. Jimmer ended up with a lot of pt, but he didn't produce like I (or apparently Smart) thought he would. That's why he's not playing. He had his shot and he didn't make the most of it. Doesn't mean that his future is doomed. It just means he's got to get better and prepare for his next shot at getting pt.

 

[pshn80]

I thought Jimmer showed a lot of good stuff last night. If he string more of these together and against both good and bad opponents - who knows, he may get his wings yet.

 

[UK_King]

someone correct me if I'm wrong but Lin rode the bench in NY until they had absolutely no choice but to play him in a crisis.

It's not like D'antoni immediately recognised this kid was WOWWOWWOW.

It's usually the Jimmer lovers who bring up Lin as some parallell to whats happening to JF but it's just not true.

 

[gatoradeSD]

The great opportunity for Jimmer occurred when Thornton went down with injury. Jimmer ended up with a lot of pt, but he didn't produce like I (or apparently Smart) thought he would. That's why he's not playing. He had his shot and he didn't make the most of it. Doesn't mean that his future is doomed. It just means he's got to get better and prepare for his next shot at getting pt.

Jimmer didnt get any more playing time then he does now when thornton went down

 

[Bricklayer]

Jimmer didnt get any more playing time then he does now when thornton went down

Not what the numbers say -- Jimmer's PT peaked in Dec when both Thornton and Reke were down, but his shooting percentages fell off after the hot start, and they just kept going down this month. He's shooting .415 again.

The thing is, his 3pt shooting has been consistent, and so have his FTs. The rest of his game has gone south though, and some of it may have been as teams readjusted to new and improved Jimmer. And here's the fallout -- early season Jimmer was making an argument that hey, I can be a rotation player. Ever since then Jimmer looks like a shooting situation/foul game specialist.

 

[Npliam]

Not what the numbers say -- Jimmer's PT peaked in Dec when both Thornton and Reke were down, but his shooting percentages fell off after the hot start, and they just kept going down this month. He's shooting .415 again.

The thing is, his 3pt shooting has been consistent, and so have his FTs. The rest of his game has gone south though, and some of it may have been as teams readjusted to new and improved Jimmer. And here's the fallout -- early season Jimmer was making an argument that hey, I can be a rotation player. Ever since then Jimmer looks like a shooting situation/foul game specialist.

Just for fun you should fun some per 36 for Jimmer, Tyreke, Brooks, and IT. Include thing like true shooting percentages and assist to to.

 

[Bricklayer]

Just for fun you should fun some per 36 for Jimmer, Tyreke, Brooks, and IT. Include thing like true shooting percentages and assist to to.

That is classically how per 36 gets abused.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Just for fun you should fun some per 36 for Jimmer, Tyreke, Brooks, and IT. Include thing like true shooting percentages and assist to to.

You're right, this fun IS fun!

Per-36 points: Jimmer (19.6), Tyreke (17.6), Thomas (17.4), Brooks (14.0). Chalk one up for Jimmer.
Per-36 assists: Thomas (4.8), Brooks (4.1), Tyreke (3.7), Jimmer (3.4). Oops. Sad face for Jimmer.
Per-36 rebounds: Tyreke (5.7), Brooks (2.9), Thomas (2.6), Jimmer (2.5). Uh-oh. Another Jimmer sad face.
Per-36 steals: Tyreke (1.6), Brooks (1.0), Thomas (1.0), Jimmer (0.9). The sad faces keep coming!
Assist-to-TO: Thomas (1.85), Brooks (1.78), Tyreke (1.48), Jimmer (1.42). Gee, I sure hope Jimmer can pull himself up at the end!
True Shooting%: Brooks (.571), Jimmer (.559), Thomas (.556), Tyreke (0.551). Well, I guess that's something.

So, per minute Jimmer is basically our worst guard on the season. Hey, I'd like to see him do great but right now it's not really happening.

 

[Section 101]

You're right, this fun IS fun!

Per-36 points: Jimmer (19.6), Tyreke (17.6), Thomas (17.4), Brooks (14.0). Chalk one up for Jimmer.
Per-36 assists: Thomas (4.8), Brooks (4.1), Tyreke (3.7), Jimmer (3.4). Oops. Sad face for Jimmer.
Per-36 rebounds: Tyreke (5.7), Brooks (2.9), Thomas (2.6), Jimmer (2.5). Uh-oh. Another Jimmer sad face.
Per-36 steals: Tyreke (1.6), Brooks (1.0), Thomas (1.0), Jimmer (0.9). The sad faces keep coming!
Assist-to-TO: Thomas (1.85), Brooks (1.78), Tyreke (1.48), Jimmer (1.42). Gee, I sure hope Jimmer can pull himself up at the end!
True Shooting%: Brooks (.571), Jimmer (.559), Thomas (.556), Tyreke (0.551). Well, I guess that's something.

So, per minute Jimmer is basically our worst guard on the season. Hey, I'd like to see him do great but right now it's not really happening.

PER
Tyreke Evans 18.3
Jimmer Fredette 16.5
Isaiah Thomas 15.4
Marcus Thornton 14.5
Aaron Brooks 12.9

 

[treach1976]

You're right, this fun IS fun!

Per-36 points: Jimmer (19.6), Tyreke (17.6), Thomas (17.4), Brooks (14.0). Chalk one up for Jimmer.
Per-36 assists: Thomas (4.8), Brooks (4.1), Tyreke (3.7), Jimmer (3.4). Oops. Sad face for Jimmer.
Per-36 rebounds: Tyreke (5.7), Brooks (2.9), Thomas (2.6), Jimmer (2.5). Uh-oh. Another Jimmer sad face.
Per-36 steals: Tyreke (1.6), Brooks (1.0), Thomas (1.0), Jimmer (0.9). The sad faces keep coming!
Assist-to-TO: Thomas (1.85), Brooks (1.78), Tyreke (1.48), Jimmer (1.42). Gee, I sure hope Jimmer can pull himself up at the end!
True Shooting%: Brooks (.571), Jimmer (.559), Thomas (.556), Tyreke (0.551). Well, I guess that's something.

So, per minute Jimmer is basically our worst guard on the season. Hey, I'd like to see him do great but right now it's not really happening.

This is really just showing you the differences based on the role they play - SG vs PG: 1) Jimmer and Reke are pretty close to AB / Brooks in assists even though they rarely play point... that's a sad face for AB & IT. 2) The Jimmer to AB & IT rebounding discrepancy is hardly enough to get crazy about. 3) Steals, again, .9 to 1? That's a difference of about 1 extra steal about every 10 games. 4) Assist-to-TO. This is similar to my first point - Jimmer and Reke are SG's first. They shouldn't be held accountable to the same standard for assists as the PG, so this is actually another sad face for IT/AB. What this tells me is that Jimmer is our second best SG, and a slightly better scorer than IT or Brooks.