How good do you think the currently constructed team can be?
- Thread starter K F Jay
- Start date
chief bromden
Starter
I think the Kings' win total will equal the number of polls that K F Jay starts this year.
Darth Divac
Bench
I've got this funny feeling that Wiggins is going to the Raptors.
twslam07
All-Star
Lowry/Augustin/Buycks
Derozan/Ross/Richardson
Gay/Fields/Novak
Johnson/Hansbrough/Acy
Valanciunas/Gray
I don't think a team that features this type of talent has any shot at Wiggins. Hell this team has a good chance of making the playoffs next year.
upinsmoke
All-Star
Cold as ice bro lol.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
2 giant unknowns make this impossible.
1) the coach. If he can coach, defense especially, that's worth 6-8 wins right there, even with the roster no better and possibly even weaker.
2) Cousins. 4th year. Whichever year it is that he steps forward as a major star, you can get another +8-10 wins just out of that.
Our offseason nearly exactly mirrors last year. We drafted an overhyped Kansas rookie who slid in the draft, possibly for good reason. We signed a duplicative free agent we didn't need. We swapped a 2nd round pick for a platoon player to bring some defense at SF. Except this year we threw away our 2nd best player to bring back a slow footed PG. Its another 25-30 win roster EXCEPT for Cousins and the coach. If both are for real, Malone squeezes some defense out of a crew of bad defenders, Cousins goes 20+ 11+ as a true anchor, then we can dream of chasing .500 again. If only one of those things is true maybe 35 wins. If neither is true, back to the crap and more praying for lottery luck.
1) the coach. If he can coach, defense especially, that's worth 6-8 wins right there, even with the roster no better and possibly even weaker.
2) Cousins. 4th year. Whichever year it is that he steps forward as a major star, you can get another +8-10 wins just out of that.
Our offseason nearly exactly mirrors last year. We drafted an overhyped Kansas rookie who slid in the draft, possibly for good reason. We signed a duplicative free agent we didn't need. We swapped a 2nd round pick for a platoon player to bring some defense at SF. Except this year we threw away our 2nd best player to bring back a slow footed PG. Its another 25-30 win roster EXCEPT for Cousins and the coach. If both are for real, Malone squeezes some defense out of a crew of bad defenders, Cousins goes 20+ 11+ as a true anchor, then we can dream of chasing .500 again. If only one of those things is true maybe 35 wins. If neither is true, back to the crap and more praying for lottery luck.
kupman
Starter
I don't know how many wins we get this year, but man, this a "glass half empty" perspective. This off-season we were freed from owners who had no money to run an NBA franchise. The new owner is turning things over with a new GM and a new coach. We are in the beginning of new day in Sacramento. We are like 2 months into this new thing. IMHO, this off-season is dramatically different than last off-season.
True and extremely exciting for the fanbase but nothing you stated changes the fact that the on court personnel moves are very similar to last years.
To add to the concerns we continued to allow the huge interior defense problem to remain while getting far worse in our backcourt d. We also removed the one player we could count on to ISO and penetrate which is one of the most important offensive skills in today's nba. We added more redundant pieces and didn't create salary space.
As negative as that sounds I do think there is reason for hope but the next 12 months of FO moves need to be a lot better than the first 2.
I think a 5-10 game improvement is possible.
I voted with the majority but I don't believe the FO is done in it's preseason moves. We are going to lose at least two and gain at least one. Won't be an earth shaker but it will help. Won't be a star but it will be a useful piece. Also, the two players we lose will also help us at least marginally. May not cause me to change my vote here. Onward and upward.
Agent23
Starter
Such a negative nancy. I was thinking 13, tops.
HndsmCelt
Hall of Famer
I agree with 1/2 of that. Lets face it free agency was never our friend, it is a process by which we hope to NOT loose talent. We let the "moveable pieces" from Houston go, and turned Evans into Vasquez and Landry. BUT we are working out an extension for Cousins, so it could be worse. The BEST hope we have to bring in talent is by trade (this is true every season) so now we wait and see what happens.
Kingsfan23
All-Star
I think we'll be better mainly because I respect the coaching prowess of Malone more than what we have had over the last many years, and I haven't seen him coach yet. I think in the right situation guys like Thornton, Hayes, possibly even Salmons can put forth something better than what they have when the organization was stagnant. I see some natural improvement from within. When you go from a situation where there is a bad coach, the threat of relocation, bad owners etc. etc., and you replace that with energy, pulse and accountability it can go along way in helping players play better. The team will still not be good but I expect this year that they will compete and win a lot of home games in front of a reinvigorated Power Balance home crowd
TyFreak Evans
Bench
I realistically see us somewhere in the range of 25-30 wins, actually. BUT, even if we do not increase our win total by that much, I will settle with it as long as the play on the court is improved, and the effort is there. I don't expect miracles overnight, I never do. Nor do I expect anyone else to expect the same. Those who are predicting playoffs are just being super delusional, and are probably way more optimistic about the season than the most optimistic fan base out there (whichever fan base that may be).
Right now, I look more for improved play and more effort than I do for wins and playoff berths. One step at a time.
Right now, I look more for improved play and more effort than I do for wins and playoff berths. One step at a time.
gunks
Hall of Famer
I voted 10 more wins (maybe), just based on the coaching alone. I think Malone is going to be a huge upgrade from Smart. But lets face it, a turd with a smiley face drawn on would be a huge upgrade from Smart.
Roster wise....Meh. I think we're worse off than last year.
-Vasquez is a way better PG than IT or Jimmer....But that's because they arnt even really PGs.
-Mbah a Moute is an upgrade over James Johnson. But then again, if the turd with a smiley face would have preferred to play the 3 as opposed to being head coach, it would be a huge upgrade from James Johnson.
-Landry was a horrible signing. We already have that exact same player, his name is Marcus Thornton. MT is a better fit, because unlike Landry he doesnt play a position where you need to do other things besides be a black hole. Plus MT is a better rebounder. Hey, we should just let Thornton play the 4!
-Losing Reke is huge
We've addressed one weakness (passing), but we are still iffy at the 3 and we need a defensive big.
Roster wise....Meh. I think we're worse off than last year.
-Vasquez is a way better PG than IT or Jimmer....But that's because they arnt even really PGs.
-Mbah a Moute is an upgrade over James Johnson. But then again, if the turd with a smiley face would have preferred to play the 3 as opposed to being head coach, it would be a huge upgrade from James Johnson.
-Landry was a horrible signing. We already have that exact same player, his name is Marcus Thornton. MT is a better fit, because unlike Landry he doesnt play a position where you need to do other things besides be a black hole. Plus MT is a better rebounder. Hey, we should just let Thornton play the 4!
-Losing Reke is huge
We've addressed one weakness (passing), but we are still iffy at the 3 and we need a defensive big.
LPKingsFan
All-Star
I'm still hoping at some point Morey caves and makes Asik available, and is interested in re-acquiring a certain former Rocket stretch 4. They just signed Camby, who, although old and not worthy of many minutes, did have some options in where to go. I'm wondering if they gave him some indications he'd get minutes backing up Howard.
Padrino
All-Star
i desperately want to believe that "the currently constructed team" won't look exactly as it is to begin the season, but i'm skeptical of the kings' ability to make any kind of worthwhile upgrades, given that most of the rest of the nba has already made its splashes...
beyond that, i remain wholly unconvinced that the roster has actually improved thus far, both talent-wise and balance-wise. more to the point, i see little in the way of a "plan." now, the new front office might very well have a plan, but the personnel decisions made this offseason look quite a bit like the rudderless flailing about of the previous regime, and i am not encouraged by that rather startling resemblance...
like many, i expect the kings to win a few more games than last season by virtue of improved coaching and a [hopefully] bought-in demarcus cousins, but i am not optimistic about opportunities to further reshape the roster into a winner. the kings still need a legitimate #2, and preferably one that plays both ways, given the glaring defensive weaknesses that still run rampant across both the starting five and the bench. that said, they're unlikely to win enough games to build the kind of upward momentum we want to see. and, unfortunately, if DMC continues to improve, and if mike malone can squeeze just a bit of effort out of these kings on the defensive side of the ball, they're unlikely to lose enough games to score a top-five pick, unless this franchise's horrific streak in the draft lottery ends with a #1 pick in 2014. but that's just a hope and a prayer...
if you want to see a successful offseason by a small market franchise, just look at how the pacers are improving upon their weaknesses, offloading redundancies and dead weight, and remaining below the luxury tax threshold while they do it. their turnaround the last few seasons has been impressive, and it's tough to see so many former lottery teams lapping the kings while we keep hoping and praying over here in sacramento. the new regime has plenty of time to step up its game in the long term, but as training camp nears in their first offseason operating this franchise, much of the league is gonna want its rosters set, and teams are going to be less willing to deal for the kings' scraps...
beyond that, i remain wholly unconvinced that the roster has actually improved thus far, both talent-wise and balance-wise. more to the point, i see little in the way of a "plan." now, the new front office might very well have a plan, but the personnel decisions made this offseason look quite a bit like the rudderless flailing about of the previous regime, and i am not encouraged by that rather startling resemblance...
like many, i expect the kings to win a few more games than last season by virtue of improved coaching and a [hopefully] bought-in demarcus cousins, but i am not optimistic about opportunities to further reshape the roster into a winner. the kings still need a legitimate #2, and preferably one that plays both ways, given the glaring defensive weaknesses that still run rampant across both the starting five and the bench. that said, they're unlikely to win enough games to build the kind of upward momentum we want to see. and, unfortunately, if DMC continues to improve, and if mike malone can squeeze just a bit of effort out of these kings on the defensive side of the ball, they're unlikely to lose enough games to score a top-five pick, unless this franchise's horrific streak in the draft lottery ends with a #1 pick in 2014. but that's just a hope and a prayer...
if you want to see a successful offseason by a small market franchise, just look at how the pacers are improving upon their weaknesses, offloading redundancies and dead weight, and remaining below the luxury tax threshold while they do it. their turnaround the last few seasons has been impressive, and it's tough to see so many former lottery teams lapping the kings while we keep hoping and praying over here in sacramento. the new regime has plenty of time to step up its game in the long term, but as training camp nears in their first offseason operating this franchise, much of the league is gonna want its rosters set, and teams are going to be less willing to deal for the kings' scraps...
And for me, the idea that the Kings now have a chance to accomplish the same kind of thing is reason for total and complete optimism. I fully understand your lack of appreciation for true optimism, so I don't expect you to buy in...yet. I think Vivek and Co. will do what they've committed themselves to doing and I'm looking forward to the time when they are used as an example of how a small market franchise can turn around.
Padrino
All-Star
And for me, the idea that the Kings now have a chance to accomplish the same kind of thing is reason for total and complete optimism. I fully understand your lack of appreciation for true optimism, so I don't expect you to buy in...yet. I think Vivek and Co. will do what they've committed themselves to doing and I'm looking forward to the time when they are used as an example of how a small market franchise can turn around.
there's certainly reason for optimism, but such is the nature of low expectations. it's hard to imagine a franchise being more poorly owned, managed, and coached than the sacramento kings across the last seven seasons, and it's nearly impossible to imagine the previous regime's replacements doing any worse...
that said, i honestly believe that vivek ranadive wants to build a winner in sacramento, intends to build a winner in sacramento, and will eventually build a winner in sacramento, but this offseason has shown me that the new regime is going to have to adapt to a rather steep learning curve on the way to achieving that goal. i think they've made crucial errors so far this offseason, and it very well may burden them with a more difficult climb than they initially signed up for...
as far as this season is concerned, i have not yet bought in, and i'm waiting to place my faith in the collective prowess of these highly-touted but relatively inexperienced individuals (relative to the positions they occupy). now, if they prove me wrong and toss up 40 wins in '13-'14 without batting an eyelash, i'll be the first to eat crow, and i'll do so happily. but i don't see that ceiling with this roster, nor do i see salvation on the other side of any hypothetical upcoming trade...
the western conference is brutal. that factor has not changed, even though the major players have. and i am not one who believes that a team like the lakers is going to sit idly by while the kings move up the standings in the coming seasons. if the kings don't luck out in next year's draft, "aggressive" doesn't even sufficiently describe the kind of strategy they'll need to build a winner around demarcus cousins...
again, i have never wanted to eat my fair share of crow more badly than i do right now. if it gets to that point, i'll gladly chase it with a chorus of "rah-rah"s along with everybody else who manages to adopt an optimist's stance at this fragile moment in the franchise's contemporary history. i'm just tired of the losing, and i don't want to see this franchise looking to the lottery every offseason for the next great hope, after squandering an opportunity with tyreke evans and after wasting demarcus' developmental years. they need to get things done from within...
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I think you have touched the important element - basketball is a team sport not a Cousins/whoever sport. Good team guys can make a good team.
Darth Divac
Bench
With a starting lineup of
Grievis Vasquez
Marcus Thornton
Luc Richard Mbah a Moute
Patrick Patterson
DeMarcus Cousins
you really can't expect much unless Cousins blows up and becomes an All-Star, and Malone turns around the defense. If both of those things happen, and Mclemore plays well, we can reach an absolute maximum of maybe, maybe 40 wins. I expect around a 4-5 game improvement, unless Coach Mike hits the tank when he knows we can't make the playoffs.
Grievis Vasquez
Marcus Thornton
Luc Richard Mbah a Moute
Patrick Patterson
DeMarcus Cousins
you really can't expect much unless Cousins blows up and becomes an All-Star, and Malone turns around the defense. If both of those things happen, and Mclemore plays well, we can reach an absolute maximum of maybe, maybe 40 wins. I expect around a 4-5 game improvement, unless Coach Mike hits the tank when he knows we can't make the playoffs.
Agree to an extent but why do all the best teams feature 2-3 superstars plus role players? You need your best 2-3 to shine and the others to mostly stay out of the way and play d, hit shots.
If LeBron suddenly sucks next year, they won't advance far due to Udonis Haslem being a good team guy.
Padrino
All-Star
that's a nice sentiment until you look at the names on the backs of the jerseys of the various playoff teams in each conference. every once in awhile a team like the nuggets will ride their chemistry into the first round without a legitimate superstar, and swiftly exit thereafter. a team like the '04 champion pistons is even rarer. they're the exception that proves the rule...
as has been the case for half a century now, NBA basketball is most often won with impact players surrounded by lesser talents who understand their roles. a good coach who can manage those roles is usually an important ingredient, as well...
Where I think the disconnect comes from is Kings fans are tired of losing and want a winner now. I know I do and 100% of Kings fans support that notion. But the FO has different plans. They might want to have a few strong drafts around Cousins and then proceed to build your winner that way (the way every small-market super power does it). As stated before, we're not a team like the Nets who can go buy every huge contract off teams and instantly become a contender.
Someone will bring up Reke, but he's a non-issue. If the FO viewed him as a franchise player, then they would have matched. Simple as that. And clearly, no one else around the league did either. He's going to be in a super 6th man role in NO. I think he'll be great at it, but hardly a role of someone who a franchise views as a building block.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
That's so far from true in the NBA as to be completely backwards.
There is no other sport, and no other professional sports league where great individual players have a larger impact than in the NBA. "Consumate team sport" sells well to middle schoolers who's mommies want to make sure they all get minutes. In the NBA context it means "Mario Chalmers, know your place, give the ball to LeBron, and get the hell out of the way". There is certainly an importance to your great players playing for the team, not themselves, but great players make the team. And we now only have one with that potential on the whole roster. If you want to continue to buy into the Mac hype that's fine, but even if you do, that's years down the line.
People will of course twist themselves in knots trying to deny the truth of that situation, they will throw out Denver, or Chicago last year or whatever. But the parity on those teams is not the parity of mediocrity. Its the parity of HOF coaches and tough veterans and stacks of talents above anything we have outside of DeMarcus. If you stack our projected lineup up against Denver's from last year, the only king who starts is DeMarcus Cousins. If we're even going to pretend to play with serious teams, he has to be great nearly every night, same as Dwight or Yao or Hakeem or any other great center stuck with not so great teammates. He has to be the centerpiece of everything we do and make everybody better. And if he doesn't seem quite ready for such a Herculean task...well there is our boggle. There is noone else now.
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