Hawes playing time

[Dime Dropper]

I know alot of people are very annoyed over this pick (I was too, but I'm over it now), but it's not that bad. Firstly, we are rebuilding. This pick shows that. We didn't draft for need, we drafted for the future. We picked a good center who is still only 19 years old with plenty of room to improve. Hawes is a nice piece to our puzzle to the future and this enables us to focus on PF, SF and PG next year, where PGs are aplenty. If we suck bad enough we can draft Beasley too!
Although not our biggest need, we are particularly thin at C and I remember all the grumblings about Corliss and SAR playing at center!
So, will we be seeing Hawes play significant minutes this year? I think so. Miller is slowing down even more with his lack of training during the offseason and we have no other center - except for Hawes who is particularly polished on the offensive end for a man his age. I think one thing we can all look forward to next season is a promising rookie getting significant time. Sure, we may not win alot of games, and his defense may be bad but I don't think it could be any worse than Brads. This is just the beginning of the rebuilding phase. We have two solid pieces in place - Hawes and Martin, along with promising youngsters like Price, Williams, Douby and Garcia who could all become good bench players. I can also see GP taking on an undrafted player or two such as Ron Lewis and Brown. Hopefully GP will bring in more youth soon which I think he is trying to do. This will be both fun and painful to watch at times, but when we've finally rebuilt it will be worth it!
So, after I've gone so much off my own topic, heres to hoping Hawes gets time.

 

[tyrant]

i agree with hawes getting playing time. he cant be any worse than brad miller. however i do disagree with your overall post. i feel that this team needs all that it can get RIGHT NOW. no one knows what kind of player hawes will be 3 years from now. no one knows if he is the piece we will need to help this team be contenders again. or be vital to this teams future. all we know is that he was our 10th selection. and with the #10 (which is pretty good) pick we must have faith that we got the best selection possible for our needs. (which is a big man). i understand what you're saying dimedropper, however i just dont agree with your perspetive on this pick.

 

[Tarindel]

I actually hope we see a lot of him. I think one of the mistakes of last year was not playing our inexperienced guys enough towards the end of the seasons when it was obvious we weren't going to the playoffs.

Playing Miller isn't going to gain our team much because everyone knows we're going to suck this year anyway, so let's go ahead and make Hawes the starting C and at least get him some experience, a chance to meet his potential, and enough playing time to fairly evaluate him as a player...

 

[tyrant]

I actually hope we see a lot of him. I think one of the mistakes of last year was not playing our inexperienced guys enough towards the end of the seasons when it was obvious we weren't going to the playoffs.

Playing Miller isn't going to gain our team much because everyone knows we're going to suck this year anyway, so let's go ahead and make Hawes the starting C and at least get him some experience, a chance to meet his potential, and enough playing time to fairly evaluate him as a player...

he's definately gona have to earn that starting spot at center. it wont be handed to him because miller is a veteran and he's been around. hawes is going to have to prove that he's the better player. but i hope he's good. a steal.

 

[pilot305]

I maybe in the minority on this but Spencer was my choice from the beginning (knowing that everyone else was going to go ahead of him anyhow). He was the best choice under the circumstances. He definitely will get alot more playing time then people think. Once Miller goes down with a sore hang-nail and Shareef gets run down as the season goes on (hate to say it but he is getting up there in age), Spencer will get the time.

 

[Bricklayer]

a) he is here
b) we are rebuilding and don't care about wins or losses
c) therefore there is no reaosn not to go ahead and give him the minutes

d) no reason that is except for the presence of a stack of washed up misddling vets with big had to move contracts choking up the place. But hell, kid's got to learn sometime, so I would just assume see Brad and the boys midget all liquidated or sent home and just let Hawes play every minute he can until he could out.

 

[tyrant]

i want him to get minutes to see if he's better than brad miller. if he is then start him at the center and start williams at the pf (spencer guarding the bigger post players and williams being help side defender). we do not need two slow big men in the post.

 

[Gary]

I forsee a seven foot slow white center grabbing 7ppg 4rpg NOT named Brad Miller. If we were building for teh future we would have drafted best available. IF we were drafting for the future wouldn't we draft best available this year? I mean, Law would have been a better pick, Young would have been a better pick. IMO Thorton would have even been a better pick (being 23 yo).. There were much better SF out there than a Brad Miller clone.

OK After sleeping on it I am willnig to give the guy a chance. But if we are to give him minutes this year and he is going to not produce rebounds like his position should dictate than I will call this a wasted pick ala Pervis Ellison.

 

[Spike]

Dude, enough. This post is about playing time, you've made your point about how you feel about Hawes.

As far as PT goes:

If this is the starting unit come the start of the season, I would see Hawes getting limited minutes and easing his way in, unless Theus is a earn your playing time in practice sort of dude. I wouldn't expect him starting.

If contracts are moved, be it KT (which would be AWESOME) or Miller, then time would definitely explode as there wouldn't be vets in front of him chewing minutes away.

At this moment, I don't see Williams starting, as cool as it would be to see what he would do with more time, because of the vets in front. I do hope to see reckless abandon from Williams for the 10-15 minutes he does get.

 

[hiero]

I forsee a seven foot slow white center grabbing 7ppg 4rpg NOT named Brad Miller. If we were building for teh future we would have drafted best available. IF we were drafting for the future wouldn't we draft best available this year? I mean, Law would have been a better pick, Young would have been a better pick. IMO Thorton would have even been a better pick (being 23 yo).. There were much better SF out there than a Brad Miller clone.

OK After sleeping on it I am willnig to give the guy a chance. But if we are to give him minutes this year and he is going to not produce rebounds like his position should dictate than I will call this a wasted pick ala Pervis Ellison.

ya, but we already have 3 guys who can play SF. Artest, Garcia and Salmons. Even if we trade Artest we still have solid depth, because you can evne play Kenny Thomas and or Corliss at SF sometimes too.
Sure we didnt get that athletic swingman everyone wanted, but im glad because id rather win games than see some guy sit on the bench every game, pissed that he never plays and gets like 1 highlight a game.

We didnt need a SF. hopefully we can get a good young PG next year in the Tony Parker mold, who cna distribute and drive to the hole at will. Or at least another shotblocking PF/rebounder type next year.

we arent gonig to be able to fill every single need in one year.

I would hope very much to see Miller ride the pine a lot, and give Hawes 25-30 minutes a game. I dont care how much we are payign Brad, he doesnt deserve to play, hell he doesnt even deserve to be in the NBA at this point. Hawes could easily average 17/7.

 

[Bricklayer]

a) Hawes is not averaging 17 and 7 as a rook. be lucky to average that at his peak. Not at 19.

b) if Brad Miller is still on the team, Unfortunatel yhat means we have to play him, and a lot. Because if we don't, there is no way we will ever move that contract, and we'll be stuck wiht it until 2011. If we can't find any takers this summer, we have to find a way to create some takers next year so we can move on.

 

[Spike]

I'm going with 8/6 in limited PT, 12/8 with more minutes. Decent for a rookie. That's on the optimistic side. Lunch calls, I'm out.

 

[hiero]

a) Hawes is not averaging 17 and 7 as a rook. be lucky to average that at his peak. Not at 19.

b) if Brad Miller is still on the team, Unfortunatel yhat means we have to play him, and a lot. Because if we don't, there is no way we will ever move that contract, and we'll be stuck wiht it until 2011. If we can't find any takers this summer, we have to find a way to create some takers next year so we can move on.

not 17/7 as a rookie that is probably asking too much. However I dont think 7 rebounds is a stretch for him on the Kings roster. hes never going to be a 10 rebound guy probably, but a big body in hte middle to clog the lanes at least, and pair him up with Justin Williams we might actually have this thing called interior defense.

 

[Kingster]

I think Theus should tell both Miller and Hawes at the beginning of the season that they are both competing for the starting position. Let the best man win. Even if the kid doesn't start, he should play A LOT next year. He's no worse than Brad in defense and rebounding and he's much better in the post. If Brad is shooting dingers, yank him and put in the kid.

 

[JJ_Evans]

Hawes is getting a lot of slack from our fans. It's not that hes a bad player. But hes a repetitive player on our team. And he doesn't fix any of our weaknesses from the C position. He is just a really bad fit for what the fans think we were looking for. But you cant really blame anyone because he was the best big left on the board at 10. Even though I would have loved to get Brandan Wright, the cards just didn't fall that way. I think Petrie has a few moves coming soon and things should fall into place.

 

[NoBonus]

Hawes is getting a lot of slack from our fans. It's not that hes a bad player. But hes a repetitive player on our team. And he doesn't fix any of our weaknesses from the C position. He is just a really bad fit for what the fans think we were looking for. But you cant really blame anyone because he was the best big left on the board at 10. Even though I would have loved to get Brandan Wright, the cards just didn't fall that way. I think Petrie has a few moves coming soon and things should fall into place.

I agree with that 100%. He may not fit all the needs, but he was the best combo of size and skill available. I hope he does well and, hey, he plays center!

 

[Sac.Kings]

Personally i'm inclined to think that Miller is now expandable believe it or not. We now have a younger, slightly more athletic version of him and not to mention a solid post game (something miller doesn't have). I can't remember the last time miller was posted down low. I would not be surprised in the least if Miller was traded. If we really want to start all over again, then honestly almost everyone has to go. Miller is slowly becoming slower and older, Bibby i wouldnt mind staying for a leadership role and teaching the new PG that i hope we get, and Artest as well. Artest has to go, i can't watch him hog the ball on offense anymore, he kills the flow and it hurts to watch.

 

[piksi]

rookies PT will depend on how many of those useless flexible pieces we still have left after the summer.

 

[Amory]

Last night I was really pissed off at the draft pick. This morning it is one of the major things on my mind and I am very happy about the draft pick for a couple reasons.

1. We have another C
2. He's 19 years old and already has a good low post game. Give him a little while and he might turn out to be really good.
3. We are rebuilding.....period.
4. Somewhere I heard that he isn't done growing yet? Not sure if that is true but if he added another 2 inches that would put him at 7'2....which is a pretty decent size. That mixed with his added experience makes him the future starting Center for the Kings. I am guessing he will be here for a while.

 

[fnordius]

We didn't draft for need, we drafted for the future.

When you're drafting for the future, you pick an amazing athlete with totally raw skills. You might well pick for size, but you can't be stupid about it -- Barkley was a lot "bigger" than Shawn Bradley ever managed to be, just as Bonzi was "bigger" than Brad. What we picked was a player known for polished offensive skills, whose only real rival for "least athletic player at predraft camp" was Josh McRoberts.

I hope that Hawes gets whatever sort of PT is needed to showcase him for an immediate trade.

 

[Dime Dropper]

When you're drafting for the future, you pick an amazing athlete with totally raw skills. You might well pick for size, but you can't be stupid about it -- Barkley was a lot "bigger" than Shawn Bradley ever managed to be, just as Bonzi was "bigger" than Brad. What we picked was a player known for polished offensive skills, whose only real rival for "least athletic player at predraft camp" was Josh McRoberts.

I hope that Hawes gets whatever sort of PT is needed to showcase him for an immediate trade.

Sorry, but amazing athletes with raw skills don't come along often at center. And the ones that are there are taken no.1 as seen with Oden. Center is the hardest position to get in the NBA, we've got a good young prospect who can help us in the future. Athletes are in every draft. To be honest, I would have been happier with Julian Wright. But look at the bright side, we are rebuilding and have many more exciting prospects to look forward to, hopefully in the near future.

 

[fnordius]

Sorry, but amazing athletes with raw skills don't come along often at center. And the ones that are there are taken no.1 as seen with Oden. Center is the hardest position to get in the NBA, we've got a good young prospect who can help us in the future. Athletes are in every draft. To be honest, I would have been happier with Julian Wright. But look at the bright side, we are rebuilding and have many more exciting prospects to look forward to, hopefully in the near future.

Oden's skills are not raw at all, they are pretty advanced; he has everything, which is why he was not just #1, but the best #1 in years. Size, athleticism and raw skills is more like Saer Sene (last year's #10) or Hibbert, who might have been #10 this year if he hadn't dropped out of the draft. How about we compare Hawes to Jason Smith, a guy with athleticism, size, and unpolished skills who we passed on? Smith wins in every single category except for arm length, and often by a very wide margin. I attach the numbers for the benefit of the sceptical or bored, a few particularly decisive results are highlighted.

-----

Height: 6'10.75 (Smith), 6'10.5" (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Body fat: 7.5% (Smith), 13% (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Weight: 233 (Smith), 244 (Hawes) Winner: Smith, because Hawes has almost 15 pounds more of fat. No credit for extra fat!
Wingspan: 6'10.75" (Smith), 7'0.5" (Hawes). Winner: Hawes
Standing reach: 8'10" (Smith), 9'2" (Hawes). Winner: Hawes
No step vert.: 33.5" (Smith), 26" (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Max vert.: 37.5" (Smith), 29" (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Bench press: 15 (Smith), 9 (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Lane agility: 10.96 sec. (Smith), 11.88 sec. (Hawes). Winner: Smith
3/4 crt sprint: 3.29 (Smith), 3.51 (Hawes). Winner: Smith
Overall ranking on predraft combine tests: #8 (Smith), #72 (Hawes)

(Out of curiousity, I also compared Hawes' measurements and tests with Justin Williams' from last year. Justin made 2 less bench presses, has 1" less standing reach (despite being only 6'7.25") and tied Hawes on lane agility. Other than that, he is faster than Hawes, a better jumper, with a bigger wingspan, and ranked #63 out of 81 for overall athleticism, as opposed to Hawes' #72 out of 80. So even comparison to a semi-athletic undrafted guy is not very flattering to Hawes.)

 

[D-Mass]

Personally i'm inclined to think that Miller is now expandable believe it or not. We now have a younger, slightly more athletic version of him and not to mention a solid post game (something miller doesn't have). I can't remember the last time miller was posted down low. I would not be surprised in the least if Miller was traded. If we really want to start all over again, then honestly almost everyone has to go. Miller is slowly becoming slower and older, Bibby i wouldnt mind staying for a leadership role and teaching the new PG that i hope we get, and Artest as well. Artest has to go, i can't watch him hog the ball on offense anymore, he kills the flow and it hurts to watch.

Miller was expendable way before we picked Hawes.

 

[thatguy]

Overall ranking on predraft combine tests: #8 (Smith), #72 (Hawes)

#78 - Durant; #81 - Jianlian

End result: BFD.

 

[Bricklayer]

#78 - Durant; #81 - Jianlian

End result: BFD.

Difference is that Hawes was legit. He's a Will Perdue level athelete.

 

[thatguy]

Difference is that Hawes was legit. He's a Will Perdue level athelete.

Durant's was legit as well (as far as I know).

DJ Strawberry was ranked number one...the point is these things aren't great indicators of basketball ability. Or in Durant's case, a great indicator of athleticism.

And no, I'm not saying Hawes is "athletic."

 

[fnordius]

#78 - Durant; #81 - Jianlian

End result: BFD.

Jianlian got #81 because he didn't participate, which is rather different from doing badly on the tests. Some have suggested that Oden and Durant didn't even try, since they had nothing to gain. But, regardless, both have already proven that they can play with anybody. Hawes has proven that he can be embarassed not only by Oden, but also by lesser talents like Robin Lopez, Robbie Cowgill and Will Foster. Comparing with Durant or Jianlian is, I think, kind of silly.

 

[thatguy]

Jianlian got #81 because he didn't participate, which is rather different from doing badly on the tests. Some have suggested that Oden and Durant didn't even try, since they had nothing to gain. But, regardless, both have already proven that they can play with anybody. Hawes has proven that he can be embarassed not only by Oden, but also by lesser talents like Robin Lopez, Robbie Cowgill and Will Foster. Comparing with Durant or Jianlian is, I think, kind of silly.

All well and good. The point, like I said above, is these rankings are pretty meaningless. And you apparently concur. So thanks.

 

[fnordius]

All well and good. The point, like I said above, is these rankings are pretty meaningless. And you apparently concur. So thanks.

Concur? No. When people actually take the tests and make an effort to do well at them, they provide a degree of guidance in showing what a candidate's upside is. They aren't a definitive statement about a player's quality, but they do need to be taken into consideration. And they usually are: of the top 10 on athleticism tests this year, 60% got drafted, with an average draft position of 23. Of the bottom 10, even with Durant helping the curve, 50% got drafted, with an average position of 36.

There is also a close correlation with size: the bottom 10 were primarily bigs, 7 out of 10 were over 6'8.5" barefoot, as were 3 of the 5 drafted. Of the top 10, only Jason Smith was over 6'8". The athletic players are being drafted earlier despite being small.

So whether GMs are looking at the scores, or GMs are just looking at who plays like an athlete and who doesn't, there is a relationship between the two.

 

[JoMama]

Hawe's college coach Romar told Grant Napear today not to expect Hawes to score a lot of points, but that he would help the offense with his passing.