[Grades] Grades v. Wolves 3/1/2014

[Glenn]

IT had 8 assists. Get off of it. It has no bearing to reality.

MT was not scoring as a King. Did he have a 25 pt game this year? As you are so good at attacking others and offering no information, take some time and tell me why MT couldn't score when he was a King this year. You get off it and offer more than pot shots at people who, in your slanted perception, criticize IT. No SG has had a success this year including Ben, Jimmer, and Thornton. Ben's production is dropping month by month. See brick's stats. Ben started at about 40% shooting and now is around 30%. The entire Kings organization and I would no doubt breathlessly await your explanation. If you have no more than personal digs, don't bother being part of what I would hope could be a give and take discussion.

I have been called stupid and now I have no bearing to reality. Brilliant comments and so insightful. Some of you are hard to stomach. Discuss basketball, please.

In another note I said that with a PG like IT, the SG has no role in the offense. That should seem obvious. If we want SGs to have a bigger role, than we need a different type of PG than IT. That isn't a criticism if you read it calmly. I was called stupid for that. I don't mind having a PG who scores 20 ppg. I thought it was a rational statement and merely a comment about the team as it is and a way out of it IF a way out of it was a goal IF!!! Quit paying SGs any significant money as they are useless or get a different PG.

 

[Glenn]

Let me suggest that there might be a very good reason for a Kin g not passing to our starting SG.

Well, for ****'s sake tell me what it is. Don't join the pot shot crowd. You are much smarter than that. Then explain how MT hit 25 pts last night.

 

[Glenn]

Exactly. Next thing you'll hear is that McLemore isn't playing well because of IT. Oh wait, I've already heard that one. IT is the guy holding McLemore back. Sure bet.

Do you predict the future to get into a lather?

 

[Glenn]

We're witnessing a tank. (No pun intended off of above post). The FO has turned the roster over so much with trades and the last minute acquisition of OJ that it's no wonder there is no cohesiveness to the team. It puts the coach in a very difficult situation; it's not like there is a training camp to get everyone up to speed on offensive and defensive assignments. Everybody is playing hard. The coach is coaching hard. It's just that he's just got a new team and now has to put it together on the fly. Sure, you can point to an individual player here (McLemore) or a particular play (the Gay non-pass) there, but the context of all of it is huge roster turnover that induces a tank.

I agree with this and posted a not to this effect yesterday. I presume you read it.

 

[Glenn]

On a side note, it still appears the Moute is lost near the end of the bench with no room to contribute in that system. It looks like he's a defensive specialist, stuck on an offensive focused team.

I have to question the Wolves thinking that he had more potential for them, than D-Will.

I hope he can find a spot to play somewhere. He's one of, if not the most versatile defenders I've ever seen in this league

Mbah a Moute could be a SG on our team as they are not part of the offense and we sure as hell need some defense.

 

[Chubbs]

Exactly. Next thing you'll hear is that McLemore isn't playing well because of IT. Oh wait, I've already heard that one. IT is the guy holding McLemore back. Sure bet.

No, but the reality is, if I'm interpreting the grader correctly, his 8 assists were divided between Cousins and Rudy. 6 to cousins, 2 to rudy. And 4 of those in the first quarter.

There remains very little ball distribution on this team. And it's the circular chicken and egg argument.

I wasn't agreeing with you. You were using Isaiah's 8 assists last night as if it proved he'd been passing to Thornton while he was a king. The two things aren't related.

 

[Chubbs]

The one overwhelming positive was Cousins.

Looks like whatever needed to be done (and I think the NBA's suspension was enough) worked. He looked like pre all star break cousins. Whatever funk had been building was unleashed in that ejection, and now he's ok. For a game anyway.

Hopefully the team can figure out whatever triggered that 2-4 weeks of bad body language and play, and find a way to get through that without a meltdown on full display for the world to see.

 

[Glenn]

Cousins always returns from a suspension with good playing. I was waiting for people to criticize him for the lack of emotion on his face.

 

[peacelate]

MT was not scoring as a King. Did he have a 25 pt game this year? As you are so good at attacking others and offering no information, take some time and tell me why MT couldn't score when he was a King this year. You get off it and offer more than pot shots at people who, in your slanted perception, criticize IT. No SG has had a success this year including Ben, Jimmer, and Thornton. Ben's production is dropping month by month. See brick's stats. Ben started at about 40% shooting and now is around 30%. The entire Kings organization and I would no doubt breathlessly await your explanation. If you have no more than personal digs, don't bother being part of what I would hope could be a give and take discussion.

I have been called stupid and now I have no bearing to reality. Brilliant comments and so insightful. Some of you are hard to stomach. Discuss basketball, please.

In another note I said that with a PG like IT, the SG has no role in the offense. That should seem obvious. If we want SGs to have a bigger role, than we need a different type of PG than IT. That isn't a criticism if you read it calmly. I was called stupid for that. I don't mind having a PG who scores 20 ppg. I thought it was a rational statement and merely a comment about the team as it is and a way out of it IF a way out of it was a goal IF!!! Quit paying SGs any significant money as they are useless or get a different PG.

He actually had a 42 PT game this year, but whatever. Thornton has played in exactly 3 games for the Nets scoring 9, 10, and 25 respectively. Too small a sample size. We all knew he could score, but we all agreed scoring is not what this team needs, so why the fuss over Thornton?

 

[peacelate]

No, but the reality is, if I'm interpreting the grader correctly, his 8 assists were divided between Cousins and Rudy. 6 to cousins, 2 to rudy. And 4 of those in the first quarter.

There remains very little ball distribution on this team. And it's the circular chicken and egg argument.

I wasn't agreeing with you. You were using Isaiah's 8 assists last night as if it proved he'd been passing to Thornton while he was a king. The two things aren't related.

It would be interesting to see how many potential assists IT has to McLemore who only throws up bricks. He's had good looks but can't even hit an open jumper.

 

[Glenn]

He actually had a 42 PT game this year, but whatever. Thornton has played in exactly 3 games for the Nets scoring 9, 10, and 25 respectively. Too small a sample size. We all knew he could score, but we all agreed scoring is not what this team needs, so why the fuss over Thornton?

It was primarily to point out that we shouldn't spend money on offense minded SGs. They are of no use in this offense.

 

[peacelate]

It was primarily to point out that we shouldn't spend money on offense minded SGs. They are of no use in this offense.

Perhaps they took your advice. Thornton who was making a significant amount of money was traded.

 

[Chubbs]

It would be interesting to see how many potential assists IT has to McLemore who only throws up bricks. He's had good looks but can't even hit an open jumper.

I'd be interested as well. Although having a lack of facts and declaring Isaiah has never set up Ben is more fun.

The thing is, Ben is a high flyer who never gets to use it. That starts on defense, and in a lot of cases, Ben's. But Isaiah as well. We just don't force a lot of turnovers. In the half court, Ben gets few looks. The best thing he can do is force turnovers and get out and run and hope Isaiah sees him. Unfortunately, the D for both of them is the teams primary problem.

I wonder, if Keven Martin had be thrown to the wolves (an adelman offense, Rubio passing, Ben had no chance whatsoever) like this his rookie year, would he have been like Ben is now? Because Kmart wasn't exactly great at that point.

 

[enigma99a]

Brick, I give you an A for the photo selection and captions.

 

[kupman]

How badly did we **** up our backcourt future when we blew up the Beno/Reke/Thornton trio to go chase lottery pick rainbows with Jimmer and Ben?

Because the Beno, Reke, Thornton trio was doing so well? I lose no sleep having those 3 gone. Also, not signing Reke lead to us to signing Rudy giving us the SF we desperately needed. I think we need a #2 as our top priority. But I also think that having that trio gone has lead us is the correct direction overall.

 

[IfAt1st]

Stats: 33min 24pts (8-14, 4-7, 4-4) 6reb 1ast 2stl 1blk 3TO
Gay ( B ) -- this sort of game is very hard to grade, as you basically have 2 entirely different players wearing the same jersey in different halves.
With 3 min left in the game he had taken ONE shot in the entire second half.
To cap off the utterly puzzling disappearing act, at the 1:45 mark, with us down only 2 and on a run to get back into it, Rudy got out on the break, did not pass it to the trailing IT, tried to swoop in a layup...and blew it. And that completely killed us mentally. The air just went completely out of our sails, all the momentum was gone, and Minnesota just bang bang bang finished us off. Very strange. You would have thought he was hurt or something. But if he was I did not see it and it wasn't reported. --Brick

"puzzling disappearing act"?
I find it hard to believe that experienced, savvy Kings fans actually still believe that the Kings are trying to win every game this season.
It's not puzzling at all for Rudy to have a bad second half, once you accept that the Kings don't want to win every game. It's not rocket science - there are many teams in the league that are actively trying to get a bad record for this loaded draft next season. Does anyone think the Lakers' injury woes have nothing to do with next season's draft prospects?
If Rudy had a 2nd half remotely like the 1st half, the Kings would have won. What would that get them?
I think it's much more important to have a good 1st half than 2nd in this situation, since it shows how well they can play before putting your foot OFF the gas and coasting, letting the other team catch up.

And I applaud Brick on the informative, well-researched, and insightful theme once again (as he does year after year after year). They are really top-notch!

 

[pshn80]

He actually had a 42 PT game this year, but whatever. Thornton has played in exactly 3 games for the Nets scoring 9, 10, and 25 respectively. Too small a sample size. We all knew he could score, but we all agreed scoring is not what this team needs, so why the fuss over Thornton?

I dunno, I'm overjoyed that the FO could pill off a deal to send him on his way. And may he score an average of 25 pts per game. I,d be happy for him. I suspect that by season's end I will want to see the back side of Ben going out the door. I hope he fools me bit I don't think so. His absence from last nights game might have put us in the win column. We should fine IT fifty bucks every time throws Ben the ball.

 

[IfAt1st]

How badly did we **** up our backcourt future when we blew up the Beno/Reke/Thornton trio to go chase lottery pick rainbows with Jimmer and Ben?

Because the Beno, Reke, Thornton trio was doing so well? I lose no sleep having those 3 gone.

1) We didn't technically dump Beno for Jimmer - we dumped him for John Salmons - we of course GAVE UP draft position to get Jimmer (which is still just an absurdly baffling move I don't see almost ever in the NBA, for no tangible benefit).

2) If Brick is saying that the Kings FO dumped Beno because they believed that Jimmer was such a sure thing that he just needed to be plugged into a starting PG position and Beno was going to hinder Jimmer's ascension into NBA starter, then I'd have to put that up as one of the dumber draft decisions in recent history.
I wasn't aware this was the leading consensus opinion.

3) Dumping a solid, consistent producing starting PG for the unknown and dismissing their productivity and consistency has proven to be a horribly destructive act, in hindsight with the dumping of Beno.
Kings fans are destined to continue this mistake, with the dismissing of IT's consistency and production.
If IT is not retained, the Kings FO had BETTER get someone who is PROVEN in this league to take over.
They have no more chances left to get this right. They are up against the clock with the need for the Kings to be competitive and "relevant in the NBA again" before the new arena opens up.

 

[Glenn]

I dunno, I'm overjoyed that the FO could pill off a deal to send him on his way. And may he score an average of 25 pts per game. I,d be happy for him. I suspect that by season's end I will want to see the back side of Ben going out the door. I hope he fools me bit I don't think so. His absence from last nights game might have put us in the win column. We should fine IT fifty bucks every time throws Ben the ball.

That good old team spirit new culture at work, I presume. If that's the attitude get of of him just as we have two other SGs this year. It's amazing how lousy we are at picking SGs. I wonder why that is? Actually, I REALLY wonder why that is.

And when you have a sure fire that guy is leading you out of the doldrums, don't let him go. That would be awful. How many teams go over the luxury tax and not make the playoffs not from New York or Brooklyn?

I hope we find a cure for our putrid defense as no matter how great any individual is at offense, if we can't outscore the opponent, it does no good.

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Kevin Love and Boogie were very friendly with each other last night. Maybe he can talk Love into coming here instead of LA

 

[Kingsfan23]

That good old team spirit new culture at work, I presume. If that's the attitude get of of him just as we have two other SGs this year. It's amazing how lousy we are at picking SGs. I wonder why that is? Actually, I REALLY wonder why that is.

And when you have a sure fire that guy is leading you out of the doldrums, don't let him go. That would be awful. How many teams go over the luxury tax and not make the playoffs not from New York or Brooklyn?

I hope we find a cure for our putrid defense as no matter how great any individual is at offense, if we can't outscore the opponent, it does no good.

IT is an extension of Malone and is executing the gameplay Malone sets forth. The SGs we have had wouldn't have been nba calibre with a prime John Stockton this year. You are right though that we just need a quality role playing sg

 

[peacelate]

It seems as though blaming IT for everybody's struggles is the popular thing right now.

McLemore is struggling because of McLemore. He wasn't that much better with Vasquez. 40% shooting is still bad guys. He just happened to go from bad to worse. His struggles could be due to opposition making adjustments, McLemore not making adjustments, not used to the long season, being a bust etc.

He can't even make wide open jump shots. I guess we can blame it on the PG though because he is passing it too high, too soft, too low, too hard, with too much spin...

 

[gunks]

For real. McLemore sucks because he sucks. Will he suck forever? Only time will tell...

MT scored 25 last night. Who cares? He's streaky as hell and probably wont hit 20+ for another month. And if you look at the boxscore ALL he did was score 25 points (well, he had 2 rebounds). He remains the one dimensional streaky player he was on the Kings.


We dont even need scoring from the SG, we need defense and the ability to hit an open 3.

 

[Padrino]

It seems as though blaming IT for everybody's struggles is the popular thing right now.

whether or not that's true, whether or not thomas' biggest supporters consider it some kind of trend amongst the fans to blame IT for the team's struggles as a whole, a trio of ball dominant scorers in demarcus cousins, rudy gay, and isaiah thomas is still problematic to a balanced rotation, in my opinion. if the kings decide to roll the dice on this "big three" of cousins/gay/thomas in the starting lineup, then it's not any kind of stretch to say that the rest of the players in the rotation will be very minimally involved on offense regardless of how much the front office improves the kings' talent level across the board...

honestly, it wouldn't matter much if ben was hitting his shots on a consistent basis; he's still a horrifying liability on defense, he's still a poor ballhandler, and cousins/gay/thomas are going to eat up about 60% of the team's total field goal attempts, anyway. that said, the overall impact of mclemore meeting expectations on offense would be rather slight. there simply aren't enough shots to go around. when you consider the idiosyncrasies and weaknesses of the kings' "big three," just about the only way to make it work is to acquire defensive specialists at starting PF and starting SG, respectively, players who wouldn't mind being largely ignored on offense. it's a tall order to find a couple of guys like that, though certainly not impossible...

however, i remain skeptical of such a top-heavy strategy that risks both team chemistry and balance with an over-reliance on scorers who are not strong two-way players. i don't see it leading to a winning culture that consistently values the defensive end. fortunately, if isaiah thomas can be retained at a reasonable salary, then he can easily be shifted back to a sixth man's role if the "big three" is determined to be a bit too one-note, or he could be traded in a future deal to better balance the team's rotation...

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Yea i really don't understand why people are making a big deal about Thornton scoring 25 last night. he does that from time to time. Remember how many big scoring games he had the year he was traded here?

he also scored 42 earlier this year. He will have his occasional scoring outburst, why is anyone surprised by this?

 

[Kingsfan23]

Personally with Marcus I have the impression that the issue is his motor. Never questioned that he had some talent but to me he radiated laziness and disinterest as his numbers declined since getting paid. Perhaps the losing culture further dampened his spirits. Getting traded to a playoff team and the honeymoon phase of being on another team might give him a kick in the pants

 

[mac]

Personally with Marcus I have the impression that the issue is his motor. Never questioned that he had some talent but to me he radiated laziness and disinterest as his numbers declined since getting paid. Perhaps the losing culture further dampened his spirits. Getting traded to a playoff team and the honeymoon phase of being on another team might give him a kick in the pants

Players are human after all. Everybody likes it when they're in a situation where their strengths are utilized and weaknesses covered. Marcus had the unfortunate circumstance of going from our leading scorer to a guy who was barely getting any touches in Malone's offense, on a team that was losing. He went from volume scorer to a guy we basically wanted to simply play D and take 4-5 shots a game. That doesn't excuse his play but it does make it reasonable for him to not want to put in effort after a while.

 

[King-Da-Yah]

Was there, Ben sucked. Acy and Ray got us back in it, Big Cuz was a beast but Love+Pekovic= Bad news. I mean wtf Ben, he is ALWAYS searching on fast breaks, it is painful to watch.

 

[Kingster]

MT was not scoring as a King. Did he have a 25 pt game this year? As you are so good at attacking others and offering no information, take some time and tell me why MT couldn't score when he was a King this year. You get off it and offer more than pot shots at people who, in your slanted perception, criticize IT. No SG has had a success this year including Ben, Jimmer, and Thornton. Ben's production is dropping month by month. See brick's stats. Ben started at about 40% shooting and now is around 30%. The entire Kings organization and I would no doubt breathlessly await your explanation. If you have no more than personal digs, don't bother being part of what I would hope could be a give and take discussion.

I have been called stupid and now I have no bearing to reality. Brilliant comments and so insightful. Some of you are hard to stomach. Discuss basketball, please.

In another note I said that with a PG like IT, the SG has no role in the offense. That should seem obvious. If we want SGs to have a bigger role, than we need a different type of PG than IT. That isn't a criticism if you read it calmly. I was called stupid for that. I don't mind having a PG who scores 20 ppg. I thought it was a rational statement and merely a comment about the team as it is and a way out of it IF a way out of it was a goal IF!!! Quit paying SGs any significant money as they are useless or get a different PG.

You actually think IT affected Thornton's shooting? As if Thornton would still be a Kings if only IT was not the pg? And how does Vasquez fit into it all? Did Thornton somehow show his old shooting self when playing with Vasquez? Hardly. The pass first assist maker didn't have much of an effect on Thornton and McLemore, did he? But maybe IT caused Jimmer's poor defense and ballhandling, but he certainly had nothing to do with Jimmer's shooting. The fact that we have had urine-poor two-guard production leads you to the inescable conclusion that IT must be the reason. If only Vasquez were back and all of our 2-guards would miraculously find their shooting prowess. No, it just couldn't be that our two guards can't shoot. Your criticism of IT is pathologically absurd.

 

[Chubbs]

Since some of you believe Isaiah is already the perfect pg, here's Michael Malone discussing ways he needs to improve. Nothing that hasn't been said here, but here it is from the coach.

1. "Kings coach Michael Malone often talks about calling plays for players who aren’t primary options on offense to highlight where his team might have an advantage.
   
   Malone would like his players to do that on their own more. That’s where the development of point guards Isaiah Thomas and Ray McCallumbecomes essential. Their improved ability to understand matchups and situations will allow Malone to trust them more to put the offense in the right position.
   
   “I think that’s part of the process for Isaiah, going from a scoring guard to a starting point guard,” Malone said. “That’s part of the process for Ray McCallum as a rookie point guard trying to learn the league and his teammates coming in the game.”
   
   Malone regularly mentions guard Ben McLemore and forward Derrick Williams as players who need to have more plays called for them. The coach wants his point guards to continue making strides in setting them up while having a better overall awareness of what works for their teammates.
   
   “Understand who has the hot hand and how you can get them the ball where they are most effective – that’s what being a point guard is,” Malone said. “Understanding your teammates, where they’re most effective, who’s got the matchup, whose player is in foul trouble, all the things that go into running your team as a point guard. I think Ray and Isaiah are continuing to get better in those areas.”
   
   
   Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/2014/03/01/6201111/kings-notes-malone-wants-his-point.html#storylink=cpy