[Grades] Grades v. Spurs 10/27/2016

[Blob]

Lots of thoughts on game last night will save for game preview vs. Wolves tomorrow...

 

[Blob]

Thanks Pop for the kind comments. I've waited 10 years to see an opposing coach complement us and actually mean it....

...And on the defensive end to boot. Kings and defense in the same sentence and it's not a joke? Pinch me!

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't. We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

 

[whoopdeedoo]

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't.

We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

So you think a teams reputation has no impact on getting free agents to come and play for a team? Interesting.

 

[kingsboi]

guy Rudy was going against is pretty good you know

That's not the point I'm trying to make here. Gay and Cousins just does not work long term or in the present IMO.

 

[kingsboi]

That was supposed to be Afflalo this year. Afflalo from an offensive perspective has been underwhelming. Just not making his shots. Did Ben steal his powers on that end?

I think once we get DC back, it'll help a ton. The Kings have lots of solid role players, but the problem arises when you realize that none of those role players can create their own shots consistently.
Barnes, Ben, WCS, and Tolliver struggle extremely if asked to create their own shots. Temple struggles less, because he's a better ball handler than them.

Can't win games unless our role players step up. They'll be the biggest factor. You already know that Cousins-Gay will probably give you at least 40pts total, you just need the rest of the guys to step up on offense.

Never once has Afflalo been labeled as a "competent" scorer IMO. He is a defensive role player, or at least was coming into the league, that worked on his game and can give you points in spurts but nothing consistent. If Afflalo is supposed to be that guy, we will continue to see the scoring drought such as we have last night, versus the Spurs or not.

 

[kingsboi]

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't.

We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

Preach. Too many of us around here want to get giddy because the Kings are finally committing to defense. That's dandy and all but let's wait a whole season and further evaluate if this team can sustain it through out 82 games and not just the first month or two of the season.

 

[Blob]

So you think a teams reputation has no impact on getting free agents to come and play for a team? Interesting.

I didn't say that.

 

[Suicide King]

Preach. Too many of us around here want to get giddy because the Kings are finally committing to defense. That's dandy and all but let's wait a whole season and further evaluate if this team can sustain it through out 82 games and not just the first month or two of the season.

The thing is,it isn't just this season. Not for me anyway. It is about letting the league, and more importantly future acquisitions know, this is how we're gonna play here. I am happy to have an identity shaping that I can get behind for once. Not to pick on you or anything Kingsboi. Just want to add another perspective.

 

[206Fan]

Never once has Afflalo been labeled as a "competent" scorer IMO. He is a defensive role player, or at least was coming into the league, that worked on his game and can give you points in spurts but nothing consistent. If Afflalo is supposed to be that guy, we will continue to see the scoring drought such as we have last night, versus the Spurs or not.

Afflalo was a 18ppg scorer about 4 years ago in Orlando. Afflalo definitely has the skills to be a good 15ppg scorer today.

Last year, Afflalo was known as more of a black hole scorer who didn't play defense. This year, the tides have changed. His offense has been underwhelming.

 

[Blob]

Preach. Too many of us around here want to get giddy because the Kings are finally committing to defense. That's dandy and all but let's wait a whole season and further evaluate if this team can sustain it through out 82 games and not just the first month or two of the season.

I think sustainability is likely with a coach who dictates playing time based on meeting standards of performance and effort. We have already seen one casualty of said standard, at least for those paying attention, and that is Omri getting a DNP last night for being too casual with the rock vs the Suns. Our coach is like "be serious every second you are on the floor and if you are less than serious have a seat". After 10 years of futility, who's any Kings fan in their right mind to argue with that?

 

[ESP47]

That's not the point I'm trying to make here. Gay and Cousins just does not work long term or in the present IMO.

Never once has Afflalo been labeled as a "competent" scorer IMO. He is a defensive role player, or at least was coming into the league, that worked on his game and can give you points in spurts but nothing consistent. If Afflalo is supposed to be that guy, we will continue to see the scoring drought such as we have last night, versus the Spurs or not.

Preach. Too many of us around here want to get giddy because the Kings are finally committing to defense. That's dandy and all but let's wait a whole season and further evaluate if this team can sustain it through out 82 games and not just the first month or two of the season.

I like how you assume that we will continue to see the scoring drought that we had last night and then you go and tell people to wait a whole season before evaluating the kind of play the team can sustain. So people can't get excited over a possible change of culture but you're correct to assume that our whole season will follow our second half played against one of the best teams in the league?

Yeah lets forget that we played the best defensive team with the best defensive player. Lets forget the fact that for about 3 quarters we outplayed a veteran team with many players who have been in the same system for years when our players have been in the current system for 2 games. Lets forget all the years Afflalo put up those non competent 12-18ppg seasons. Lets forget the fact that Gay has played well during the opening two games despite going against the best defensive player in the game today. Lets forget that they went 9-6 the last time Cousins and Gay had a competent coach who actually coached defense. Lets just forget all of that and assume that the rest of the season will be like the 2nd half of the Spurs game. But don't anyone dare jump to conclusions and get excited about the newfound defensive culture that Joerger is bringing. It's way too early for anything positive like that.

 

[Telemachus]

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't. We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

I think it is important to hear those sediments from a respected outside source. It is easy for fans to want to believe something so much that you grasp at every straw that supports those beliefs. To hear Popovich say it, helps to show you aren't fooling yourself.

 

[Bricklayer]

Never once has Afflalo been labeled as a "competent" scorer IMO. He is a defensive role player, or at least was coming into the league, that worked on his game and can give you points in spurts but nothing consistent. If Afflalo is supposed to be that guy, we will continue to see the scoring drought such as we have last night, versus the Spurs or not.

He was a solid 15-18ppg scorer through his late Denver and Orlando years. Always been a good 3pt shooter of the classic catch and shoot rather than modern dribble and chuck off your own dribble variety, and he's got a good post game for a guard. He's not a star, but he's got enough offensive game to be a third weapon in a lineup, especially for a defensive team that hods scores down. And amongst our starters he's really more of a #4 with Lawson/Collison both there.

 

[Sac.Kings]

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't. We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

If you think compliments like that from a coach like Pop doesn't get heard by players in the league, then you my friend have no clue how the NBA works. The perception of a player or team is absolutely essential to acquiring good players and having a chance to keep them once you have them. When someone like Pop comes out and says something like that, then you know you're doing something right. Our perception of being a terrible franchise can only change if others start saying so. That's how this works.

Also, I absolutely hold the right to care what others think about the only team I care about. That's called an opinion and frankly I couldn't care less what you think on the topic. Go preach to someone else because it ain't happening with me.

 

[kingsboi]

He was a solid 15-18ppg scorer through his late Denver and Orlando years. Always been a good 3pt shooter of the classic catch and shoot rather than modern dribble and chuck off your own dribble variety, and he's got a good post game for a guard. He's not a star, but he's got enough offensive game to be a third weapon in a lineup, especially for a defensive team that hods scores down. And amongst our starters he's really more of a #4 with Lawson/Collison both there.

He is nobodies number three...if we are talking 4th or 5th option, then so be it.

 

[kingsboi]

I like how you assume that we will continue to see the scoring drought that we had last night and then you go and tell people to wait a whole season before evaluating the kind of play the team can sustain. So people can't get excited over a possible change of culture but you're correct to assume that our whole season will follow our second half played against one of the best teams in the league?

Yeah lets forget that we played the best defensive team with the best defensive player. Lets forget the fact that for about 3 quarters we outplayed a veteran team with many players who have been in the same system for years when our players have been in the current system for 2 games. Lets forget all the years Afflalo put up those non competent 12-18ppg seasons. Lets forget the fact that Gay has played well during the opening two games despite going against the best defensive player in the game today. Lets forget that they went 9-6 the last time Cousins and Gay had a competent coach who actually coached defense. Lets just forget all of that and assume that the rest of the season will be like the 2nd half of the Spurs game. But don't anyone dare jump to conclusions and get excited about the newfound defensive culture that Joerger is bringing. It's way too early for anything positive like that.

Have your optimism. You are more than entitled to do so. Don't bag on me for being a realist. Tell me, those 12-18 PPG seasons for Afflalo, how did his teams perform overall in terms of wins and losses? did he help contribute to that or was it a negative impact? I'm not jumping to conclusions based off of one second half against the Spurs, I'm calling it out the way I see it with the naked eye...there will be a lot of times where this team struggles to score if Boogie isn't bringing it and Gay's chucking ways don't drop.

 

[kingsboi]

I think sustainability is likely with a coach who dictates playing time based on meeting standards of performance and effort. We have already seen one casualty of said standard, at least for those paying attention, and that is Omri getting a DNP last night for being too casual with the rock vs the Suns. Our coach is like "be serious every second you are on the floor and if you are less than serious have a seat". After 10 years of futility, who's any Kings fan in their right mind to argue with that?

If that's the standard then Ben McLemore will be sitting out tomorrow nights game for getting stripped twice by the DPOY in consecutive possessions and therefore changing the momentum of the game in Kawhi's favor.

 

[kingsboi]

Afflalo was a 18ppg scorer about 4 years ago in Orlando. Afflalo definitely has the skills to be a good 15ppg scorer today.

Last year, Afflalo was known as more of a black hole scorer who didn't play defense. This year, the tides have changed. His offense has been underwhelming.

I mean sure he was a 18 PPG scorer for Orlando....tell me, did that help them in anyway? I mean what he has shown me if anything, is that he can put up points on a team that isn't successful in terms of wins.

 

[kingsboi]

The thing is,it isn't just this season. Not for me anyway. It is about letting the league, and more importantly future acquisitions know, this is how we're gonna play here. I am happy to have an identity shaping that I can get behind for once. Not to pick on you or anything Kingsboi. Just want to add another perspective.

Establishing a culture, a identity should be priority number one and it is. The rest of the team, franchise player included, need to abide by these standards, and so far they have. The questions that I want to ask will be asked when the seasons end nears upon us.

 

[Bricklayer]

I mean sure he was a 18 PPG scorer for Orlando....tell me, did that help them in anyway? I mean what he has shown me if anything, is that he can put up points on a team that isn't successful in terms of wins.

that's all Andrew Wiggins has shown, or Kyrie Irving had shown before Lebron arrived too.

Quite obviously Afflalo is not those players, but that whole line of reasoning is dramatically overused. All it showed is that if you have a lack of scorers, he's capable of mid teen level scoring on fair efficiency (his TS% during his highest scoring years was .584, .527, .574). he can score some. He can create in the post. He's a solid and then some offensive SG. No star, but you can run a play for him, and you can count on him to execute a play run for somebody else. That's really all that is needed. We won't be facing the Spurs every night, and if we do, it was apparent last night they weren't going to beat us unless they got serious. They aren't our benchmark or our concern. Our targets are Phoenix and Minny and Memphis and New Orleans and Dallas and Houston and Portland and Utah and Denver and the Lakers.

 

[SacTownKid]

It was just a few seasons ago that Afflalo was considered one of the better 2-way players in the league. Is he still that player? Maybe not, but if he plays defense again he'll be a great pick up.

 

[ESP47]

Have your optimism. You are more than entitled to do so. Don't bag on me for being a realist. Tell me, those 12-18 PPG seasons for Afflalo, how did his teams perform overall in terms of wins and losses? did he help contribute to that or was it a negative impact? I'm not jumping to conclusions based off of one second half against the Spurs, I'm calling it out the way I see it with the naked eye...there will be a lot of times where this team struggles to score if Boogie isn't bringing it and Gay's chucking ways don't drop.

I'm not bagging on you for being a realist. I'm a realist as well. I'm excited about this season and I like what I've seen so far, but like you, I want to see a lot more of it before I declare anything about the team. I'm just allowing myself to be happy about the team like a lot of people here are.

Afflalo has been to the playoffs about a half dozen times so he's at least helped his teams in some manner. His best scoring years were in Orlando and those teams were terrible. They weren't terrible because Afflalo was on them. They were terrible because Afflalo was their best player. Right now I'd put him 5th on our team behind Cousins, Gay, Collison and Lawson.

Saying that they're going to struggle to score if Boogie isn't bringing it and Gay's "chucking" ways don't drop is like saying the Blazers are going to struggle to score if both Lillard and McCollum are off. Well no duh. The Thunder probably didn't win too many games that Westbrook and Durant both struggled in. But you know what, they're going to be in a heck of a lot more games this year regardless of how the offense is as long as they keep playing defense the way they have to start this year.

Maybe we have different definitions of chucking. I think of high volume/low percentage shooters as chuckers. Guys like Nick Young and a young Jamal Crawford. Usually if you chuck the ball up a bunch and a large percentage of them go in....you're just a good player.

 

[John Galt]

Thanks Pop for the kind comments. I've waited 10 years to see an opposing coach complement us and actually mean it....

...And on the defensive end to boot. Kings and defense in the same sentence and it's not a joke? Pinch me!

Popovic also said when the Kings fired Malone "well that's one fewer well prepared team in the league to worry about" or something very close to it.

 

[dude12]

Who cares what the opposing coach thinks...regardless of how esteemed or qualified said coach may be....as if the approval of some outside source makes tangible difference. It doesn't. We have games to win, and it has nothing to do with Pop.

Yeah......but put your thoughts down in the game preview and totally dismiss Popovich. Oh ok.

 

[ParniValjak]

I think our troubles to score against the Spurs in that 3rd quarter is not really a huge concern because

a) We are not going to play the Spurs every night
b) Rudy won't we up against a defensive stud like Leonard
c) With Collison back that is one extra player we have that can score
d) Players just missed a bunch of wide open shots that they would normally hit

Really, if we play the rest of the season with this sort of intensity at the defensive end, ball sharing and movement on the offense we will be fine. Aginst the Spurs, out of every timeout we hada great set play that we converted on. Good coach. akes the world of difference. Last year we are losing that game by 30 easily.

 

[Gilles]

that's all Andrew Wiggins has shown, or Kyrie Irving had shown before Lebron arrived too.

Quite obviously Afflalo is not those players, but that whole line of reasoning is dramatically overused. All it showed is that if you have a lack of scorers, he's capable of mid teen level scoring on fair efficiency (his TS% during his highest scoring years was .584, .527, .574). he can score some. He can create in the post. He's a solid and then some offensive SG. No star, but you can run a play for him, and you can count on him to execute a play run for somebody else. That's really all that is needed. We won't be facing the Spurs every night, and if we do, it was apparent last night they weren't going to beat us unless they got serious. They aren't our benchmark or our concern. Our targets are Phoenix and Minny and Memphis and New Orleans and Dallas and Houston and Portland and Utah and Denver and the Lakers.

Forgot OKC They barely got past 2 kiddie corps'. They will fight for #8, and only if Westy gives them 80 games.

 

[Gilles]

I think, Benny deserves a pass on his second half mishaps, given what happens at 2:23 here:

In fact, I think, a lot of the blame should go to the coach: when you have Kawhi on Ben, BMac should be nowhere near the ball; you should just make Ben run around as a decoy, including runs to Kings' own basket

 

[Joshoua]

Man we dodged a bullet not Gertie g Anderson or C.Lee both look bad

 

[Bricklayer]

Forgot OKC They barely got past 2 kiddie corps'. They will fight for #8, and only if Westy gives them 80 games.

I wouldn't bet against it:

"Westbrook's averages through two games are 41.5 points, 12.5 rebounds and 9.5 assists."

 

[Tetsujin]

I wouldn't bet against it:

Although that could just mean that if Russ cools down a little or god forbid gets hurt, OKC simply falls apart