[Grades] Grades v. Bulls 12/29/11

[Bricklayer]

Well that was frustrating to watch. So so many young and dumb errors. We could have won this game, but this guy should be our new mascot:

We lost. So in honor of the holiday season the Theme will be Worst Nativity Scenes*

* board rules of course preclude discussions of religion, so plase don't. And please don't consider this an establishment on the board either. Anyone who remotely knows me knows that I would worship The Great Spagetti Monster if I was going to worship any mythological being at all.


Salmons ( C ) -- scruffy play early, but may have gotten off to a better start than any other Kings player...by default. Then he became the first of our guys to start trying to hero the ball repeatedly into the teeth of the defense, and the least talented, and it went about like you'd expect. Able to knock in a few shots in the 2nd as we stumbled to life. At the start of the 3rd hit a three off of the nice play drawn up at halftime to get us within 4, but was rarely seen or heard from thereafter. Was inserted cold in the final two minutes after sitting on the bench for a long stretch of the 4th, but missed the three we needed to stay in range at the 1:20 mark.

The Rubber Ducky Nativity Set

Hayes ( B- ) -- some meat and potatoes finsihes around the hoop in the early going and continued to mix in saavy smart plays with the same rank amateur mistakes common to the rest of the team. Had some good scrappy work snatching a ball out of Noah's hand and laying it in, made a nice pass to Reke for a backdoor cut to get us to 10 just before half, and drew a nice charge in the early 3rd with us down 2 and threatening. Unfortunately also mixed in some silly fouls and displayed his inability to consistently finish inside at 6'6" and stuck to the floor. Not able to have much effect on Boozer posts or jumpers, as despite my pregame assertion, come to think of it Boozer always had more problems with the long frontlines like the Lakers than he did with fellow stumps.

The Troll Doll Nativity Set

Cousins ( C- ) -- an adventuresome game that continued to display Boogie's penchant for putting up big sloppy numbers across the board. You can't say he's not an impact player. Its just a question of an impact for who. Started the game with some good help defense inside, twice sneaking in behind guards to block their shots, but there was sloppiness on the other end from the beginning, he wasn't finishing inside, and there was this one fugly sequence with he and Reke where it looked like neither guy knew where to be or what to do and so they just played hot potato with it as the 24 second clock ran down. Also continued to display one of his other troubling for the future traits, namely his penchant for getting shots smushed back in his face on his post moves. Began to come on as we got dangerous in the third (the two things are not unrelated), had a strong move and dunk around Noah to get it within 2, and was able to face up against Asik and kill him off the dribble. Was special in that he even hit his FTs on anther crappy night for us from the line. But he never stopped missing point blank shots, including several of the just DeMarcus and the rim variety, and was one of the primary offenders in the selfish forced hero shot category as we blew our chances in the 3rd and early 4th. Note: DeMarcus is noticeabley not passing this season. The same guy who we made a major hub of our offense last season and who averaged 4 assists a game after the All Star break, is now not involved as a passer at all and has zero assists in the first three games. That's a huge mistake on our part, and his, and rectifying it could go a long way to fixing many of our woes all by itself.

The Zombie Nativity Set

 

[Bricklayer]

Thornton ( B- ) -- had a hard time getting the ball or his shots in the early going and had no early impact. Of course you know that Marcus is not going to allow that situation to continue indefinitely. Hit two important threes late in the half on Reke kickouts to get us back in it, but then went out and missed a technical freebie that would have made it 6. Helped us catch the rest of the way up in the third. But then made back to back awful plays with us down 1 by the midpoint of the quarter, forcing a one on one hero shot and missing, and then going back the other way and not guarding his man out at the 3pt line as boom, the lead was suddenly 4 again and we'd never get that close for the rest of the game. Just kept on happening all game, and Marcus was a major part of that. Explosive scoring as usual, looking dangerous, and then at the critical moment would get selfish, go on on one, and we'd blow our opportunities.

Cupcake Nativity!

Evans ( C ) -- got off to an awful start, and the fact he only ended up with 1 turnover in th game is more dumb luck than anything else. Was repeatedly awkwardly leaving his feet and throwing passing blindly to where he thought teammates were supposed to be, but they weren't. Made multiple mistakes trying to go for steals in the open court on Rose and missing, just worsening our predicament as the Bulls got numbers. Began to force some fouls as the quarter went along to at least get to the line and slowly steady himself. After he returned looked better forcing a foul and making a good open court defensive play running under a guy, and while he still was not staying in front of Rose he was able to get to the rim for a few layups of his own. Led a late push just before half to get us back in it, cutting backdoor and taking a nice pass from Hayes for a layup and then notching two late assists to Thornton for threes got us back in it. Finally found a way to get the better of Rose in the 3rd by getting his 4th foul, but all of these fouls he was drawing became a story for all the wrong reasons as he continued his early season FT slump, and only hit 5-12 of them. Even an average FT performance gives him 9-12 and has us within one possession in the final two minutes. Started really getting active defensively gambling and cutting off passing lanes along the sidelines and came up with a number of pokeaways and steals. But again the most memorable one came when he made a great steal in the mid 4th up top just reaching over Rip's head and ripping the ball away from him, but then didn't pass it on the break despite having runners on either wing, ended up getting fouled, and missed both FTs. Again another one of those selfish decisions by our best guys that just haunted us all night..

The All Meat Nativity -- kinda classy really

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bench

Hickson ( B- ) -- our shot distribution this game was actually closer to the way it should be every game, which just serves to undrscore the not enough shots to go around problem for a guy like Hickson, whos is a good offensive player who got up all of 4 shots. While he just can't defend the rim at all he helped with a little offense in his first stint, and some solid activity on the boards. Another of our FT woes culprits.

Smores Nativity -- to keep with the food nativity theme, in case you ever wanted to eat baby jesus

Fredette ( B ) -- continuing to figure out what he can and cannot do at this level. In his first stint made a nice crosscourt baseline pass out of the trap to Thornton for a three, and hit a long three of his own in the early 2nd right over the defense. Able to free himself for several shots but did not do a great job of running the team after returning in the late 3rd. Think he's as confused about the offense as everybody else and he's repeatedly getting himself trapped up top or driving in amongst the trees, suddenly stopping when he realizes everybody is 6 inches taller than they were in college, and then trying desperately to find somebody to pass to. No hope against Rose on a few plays on defense, but in general you didn't notice him much on that end, which is enough for now.

Nativity From Spam -- brilliant

 

[Bricklayer]

Thompson ( C- ) -- back to doing nothing in his opportunity in the first half. Airballed a jumper at a bad time after returning int he late 3rd with us down 8.

Shotgun Shell Nativity-- for that special hick in your life

Greene ( INC ) -- got out on the break and took the pass from Thomas for a dunk just before the 1st quarter buzzer

Godzilla Nativity

Outlaw ( INC ) -- nothing except a quickshot 3 in the early going. I would give him a low grade of some sort, except he gave me nothign to grade on. Just used up some air, and sat back down.

Minimalist Nativity -- more brilliance

Thomas ( INC ) -- in for the final possession of the first quarter, and scooped up a loose ball and raced out to hit Donte for the dunk to beat the buzzer

Ok, not a nativity, but rather a pretty amazing Christmas yard decoration, featuring Christ being flogged on the way to his crucifixion. I gotta get me one of those and spread a little Christmas cheer.

 

[Italics]

Why do we keep saying "young" mistakes? I know this is a young team... but the "veterans" have been some of the sloppiest players out there. You can't pin this down to any one individual... the fact is that this "team" is not much of a team right now.

 

[jcwkings]

Evans (D)
Cousins(D)
Thornton(F)
Jimmer (B)
Hayes(B)
Salmons(F)
Westphal(F)

This team is very selfish, we will get nowhere until these guys forget about their individual stats and play simple basketball, our core guys each think they can make the key shot and be heroes. off the top of my head the worst plays of the day was when we were down 2 in the 3rd and Thornton gets the ball, dribbles for 10 seconds and shoots a tough shot. The other one was when Tyreke got a steal in the fourth and had Jimmer open for an easy layup, instead he tries a 360 layup and travel in the proccess, luckily it wasn't called, and he still missed the 2 freethrows. Tyrekes thinking " I have Jimmer open for an easy layup, eff it 360 layup on my own"

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

I'm not one to buy into "moral victories" but honestly, I feel OK about the way they played tonight. The Bulls are just a flat out better team but the Kings were able to keep the game competitive even though the Bulls were playing their A game.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

Evans (D)
Cousins(D)
Thornton(F)
Jimmer (B)
Hayes(B)
Salmons(F)
Westphal(F)

This team is very selfish, we will get nowhere until these guys forget about their individual stats and play simple basketball, our core guys each think they can make the key shot and be heroes. off the top of my head the worst plays of the day was when we were down 2 in the 3rd and Thornton gets the ball, dribbles for 10 seconds and shoots a tough shot. The other one was when Tyreke got a steal in the fourth and had Jimmer open for an easy layup, instead he tries a 360 layup and travel in the proccess, luckily it wasn't called, and he still missed the 2 freethrows. Tyrekes thinking " I have Jimmer open for an easy layup, eff it 360 layup on my own"

I don't see a selfish team. I see a team where most of the players don't know their role and where there's no real offensive structure. Whether you blame that on coaching, youth, too many new players, etc., I don't know. What i do know is that i think Jimmer should be the starting PG on this team and it seems clear as day to me, but what do I know...

 

[swisshh]

Out of all the selfish play, Cousins gets the one pass because he was carrying the team back into the game and he did have the matchup advantage. He was fouling out the entire Bulls frontline. There was also no to the merest of movement on his post up plays, leaving him little to pass to. Overall, Cousins contributed positively on offense and defense. He's the only player I can say that about tonight. His biggest mistake was Shareefing it instead of Shaqing it. If he goes up for dunks, his statline looks much cleaner and far more reflective of the trouble he was causing the Bulls.

Then Thornton and Evans decide they deserve more shots and start calling their own 1on1s. This collapses any chemistry and everyone starts doing this. It all tumbles down from there.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

Out of all the selfish play, Cousins gets the one pass because he was carrying the team back into the game and he did have the matchup advantage. He was fouling out the entire Bulls frontline. There was also no to the merest of movement on his post up plays, leaving him little to pass to. Overall, Cousins contributed positively on offense and defense. He's the only player I can say that about tonight. His biggest mistake was Shareefing it instead of Shaqing it. If he goes up for dunks, his statline looks much cleaner and far more reflective of the trouble he was causing the Bulls.

Then Thornton and Evans decide they deserve more shots and start calling their own 1on1s. This collapses any chemistry and everyone starts doing this. It all tumbles down from there.

Thornton and Evans do seem to be the two worst culprits for stalling the offense. I'm not convinced that having them both in the starting lineup is a good idea. If I were coach I'd start Jimmer and Tyreke and bring either Salmons or Thornton off the bench.

 

[SacTownKid]

Westphal showed some signs of life tonight, still on life support but there's a pulse.

 

[Arkitect]

I am concerned with our guard situation. Jimmer has much to learn, but I definitely think he could start in the NBA. Unfortunately he has two guys ahead of him that are better players. I can see a time in the not so distant future where we have to trade Thorton or Jimmer. I suppose that is a good problem to have. The problem with having an unorthodox guy like Tyreke is there is no real blue print for building a team around him. You want to play him at PG because he has incredible handles and can open things up with his driving ability, but he does not have the floor vision/passing ability to always capitalize on that. And putting him at SG or SF is wasting his talent. This will be an interesting season. Also wanted to point out DMC. He definitely has improved from last season with his defense and rebounding. Obviously he needs to improve his shot selection but I think the weight he lost has improved his defense. He also getting up and down the floor more quickly.

 

[TehSwimGuy]

I am concerned with our guard situation. Jimmer has much to learn, but I definitely think he could start in the NBA. Unfortunately he has two guys ahead of him that are better players. I can see a time in the not so distant future where we have to trade Thorton or Jimmer. I suppose that is a good problem to have. The problem with having an unorthodox guy like Tyreke is there is no real blue print for building a team around him. You want to play him at PG because he has incredible handles and can open things up with his driving ability, but he does not have the floor vision/passing ability to always capitalize on that. And putting him at SG or SF is wasting his talent. This will be an interesting season. Also wanted to point out DMC. He definitely has improved from last season with his defense and rebounding. Obviously he needs to improve his shot selection but I think the weight he lost has improved his defense. He also getting up and down the floor more quickly.

As much as I like Thornton's clutch play and everything...I might pick Jimmer over him. He's starting to get way too selfish for my liking.

 

[Lockehead]

Jimmer needs more help out there. When he's the PG, he's trying to set players up, but rarely does anybody make any moves. They stand around and wait for the ball, while Jimmer gets doubled or tripled teamed.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Whoa. I wasn't around the computer tonight to chime in on the game thread, but I didn't have a huge problem with how we played tonight.

We could have won. Should is a bit too strong a word. We played a top 5 team in the league tonight .. on a night where they actually got something from Carlos Boozer ( who hasn't been great, but was hitting everything tonight ). This team has clear issues, but I think if we are playing 20 other teams tonight this would have been a win. Our schedule has been damn hard so far, its not an excuse its a fact. Lakers/Portland/Chicago are all top 4 seeds in their conferences IMO. We are 1-2 with the Knicks (another tough game) up next.

We need to hit our free throws, we need to improve our ball movement, and we need to get back on defense. TWO of those things (FT's and Transition D) are fixable with hustle and focus. Two things we can improve on this season. The ball movement issue is an issue with the players on the team, and a huge improvement in that area seems unlikely with the players we have right now. I'm not going to panic yet. If we start losing like this to Utah/Toronto/Phoenix THEN I'll scream bloody murder, but these losses right now .. not exactly games we are supposed to win.

Don't get me wrong though, I want the TEAMS mentality to be that they HAVE to win every night. THEY can't be chalking a game against the Bulls up as a loss before tip-off, and I don't think they are. I'm just saying, from an outside observer, we shouldn't beat the Bulls. They are better than us.

 

[Arkitect]

As much as I like Thornton's clutch play and everything...I might pick Jimmer over him. He's starting to get way too selfish for my liking.

Do you remember how terrible we were without Thorton? Guys like him do not grow on trees. He single handedly turned us into a .500 team at the end of last season. Being "selfish" is not always a trait that defines someone as a bad player or even part of a bad team. Part of being a great player is having enough confidence in yourself that you think you are the best guy on the court, better than your teammates. For young guys, it can be hard to develop the trust in your teammates required to play truly unselfish basketball. This is a league where Allen Iverson selfishly carried his team to the ECF. Lebron did the same thing in Cleveland for 4 years.

 

[Dreadnought]

Our team is super good at hitting free throws.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Very winnable game. A few glaringly obvious observations:

1) We are nowhere near as good or talented as we thought we were.
2) We are desperate for a shotblocker, our interior defense is nothing short of absolutely pathetic. It's genuinely hard to watch.
3) Westphal is not going to be here during our next period of even semi-success. He is a disgustingly bad coach. We can't do the simple things right, which is exactly what a young team like ourselves should be thriving on. The Thunder built on energy and hustle, two things we seem utterly incapable of right now.
4) Our team is either selfish, or cannot pass, or has a low IQ. Either way, it's a problem. I could make far better decisions than most of these guys. Obviously without the NBA talent, but some of these players don't appear to know how to play or when to make a pass. It's embarrassing, and much as it pains me to say it, Simmons is spot on with that tweet. Just uncohesive and unorganised, and the blame for that lies with Westphal.
5) Free-throws may as well be half-court blind-folded shots, all taken by a drunk Slamson.
5) I'm going to stop here, as this could xontinue for a further 2000 words, and I've yet to get any sleep after staying up til 7 in the morning to watch the same mistakes be made all over again.

Good night all, hope the new year brings a competent coach and a new team IQ.

 

[king4life89]

no way id choose jimmer over thorton u gota be realistic ever sense thorton came thats ben the go to guy he aint selfish hes just the only one on the team who can hit a shot undr presure do u rather have tyreke or salmos shoot it??? if reake maned up we couldt start jimmer thorton and reake but can reake guard 3s???

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I like The Wizard of Oz. I like the Tin Man.

 

[Aenadin]

thornton and Evans together is like having a smaller kevin martin along side evans, we all know how that went it was frustrating to see them both stall the ball.

 

[kingsfan101]

Well that was frustrating to watch.

placeholder...

Are you planning to grade PW?

 

[TehSwimGuy]

Do you remember how terrible we were without Thorton? Guys like him do not grow on trees. He single handedly turned us into a .500 team at the end of last season. Being "selfish" is not always a trait that defines someone as a bad player or even part of a bad team. Part of being a great player is having enough confidence in yourself that you think you are the best guy on the court, better than your teammates. For young guys, it can be hard to develop the trust in your teammates required to play truly unselfish basketball. This is a league where Allen Iverson selfishly carried his team to the ECF. Lebron did the same thing in Cleveland for 4 years.

Yes, I remember. And I think he's a fantastic player.

Maybe they just haven't meshed yet. I'll see in several games. Maybe it's the lack of a longer training camp with a rookie team. But the Knicks coming up...Carmelo, Stoudemire, Chandler...oh boy. They better get it together quick.

 

[TehSwimGuy]

But also, Thornton played primarily without Tyreke in. Tyreke had his foot injury. So you didn't have both of them stagnating offense. Honestly I think Reke is the main offender.

 

[swisshh]

Do you remember how terrible we were without Thorton? Guys like him do not grow on trees. He single handedly turned us into a .500 team at the end of last season. Being "selfish" is not always a trait that defines someone as a bad player or even part of a bad team. Part of being a great player is having enough confidence in yourself that you think you are the best guy on the court, better than your teammates. For young guys, it can be hard to develop the trust in your teammates required to play truly unselfish basketball. This is a league where Allen Iverson selfishly carried his team to the ECF. Lebron did the same thing in Cleveland for 4 years.

But Thornton may not be the best player on the team. Tonight the best player was Cousins and Marcus iced him out. Salmons, despite his talents, never stuck around anywhere in the league because he thought he was the best player when he was not. Heck, he even takes every shot he can now that he's on the downswing of his career. Thornton was yelling at the coach to get him more shots when he was tied for most shots on the team. You can't have a player doing that. It's embarrassing and bad for chemistry.

 

[rainmaker]

Thornton and Evans do seem to be the two worst culprits for stalling the offense. I'm not convinced that having them both in the starting lineup is a good idea. If I were coach I'd start Jimmer and Tyreke and bring either Salmons or Thornton off the bench.

Been saying that for months. Jimmer/Reke, with Thorton as a 6th man.

Yet just about everyone disagrees with that. Is only a matter of time......

Surprised we agree on something Rookie.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

One thing to remember is that the Kings haven't played any bad teams yet. They've played three playoff teams two of which are title contenders. 1 and 2 isn't too bad considering that. If they'd went 1 and 2 playing the Bobcats, Suns, and Pistons I could see being ready to hit the panic button. That's why i'm waiting to see how they do against the bottom half of the league before i make any judgments.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

If Evans hits 5 more FT's I'd consider this one of his better games. Marcus and Jimmer were decent too. The guards played fine.

Cousins on the other hand (who looked better than the stats would indicate) needs to shoot better than 4-16.

Assist numbers were bad, but we also only had 14 turnovers (Bulls had 18). This wasn't a horrible game. I'd even go so far as to say our set defense was decent! but the transition defense was literally throw-up worthy.

 

[rainmaker]

Do you remember how terrible we were without Thorton? Guys like him do not grow on trees. He single handedly turned us into a .500 team at the end of last season. Being "selfish" is not always a trait that defines someone as a bad player or even part of a bad team. Part of being a great player is having enough confidence in yourself that you think you are the best guy on the court, better than your teammates. For young guys, it can be hard to develop the trust in your teammates required to play truly unselfish basketball. This is a league where Allen Iverson selfishly carried his team to the ECF. Lebron did the same thing in Cleveland for 4 years.

Thorton isn't AI. He's more a gunner, like J Terry or Crawford. People forget AI would get 8-10 assists regularly. Let gunner play their natural role as a 6th man. That doesn't mean Thorton won't be on the floor at the end of the game, just like Terry and Crawford are.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

But Thornton may not be the best player on the team. Tonight the best player was Cousins and Marcus iced him out. Salmons, despite his talents, never stuck around anywhere in the league because he thought he was the best player when he was not. Heck, he even takes every shot he can now that he's on the downswing of his career. Thornton was yelling at the coach to get him more shots when he was tied for most shots on the team. You can't have a player doing that. It's embarrassing and bad for chemistry.

Salmons took 14 shots against the Lakers, 3 against the Blazers, and 10 tonight against the Bulls. I cannot say this enough times .. forget the reputation for a minute. He hasn't been that guy yet.

Right now he is more or less doing what I want him to do. Play solid defense, shoot the 3 at a decent clip, and attack the basket without forcing it. There have been 1-2 forces per game, but overall guys .. he is giving us what we want right now. At least that's how I feel.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

Thorton isn't AI. He's more a gunner, like J Terry or Crawford. People forget AI would get 8-10 assists regularly. Let gunner play their natural role as a 6th man. That doesn't mean Thorton won't be on the floor at the end of the game, just like Terry and Crawford are.

I'm not totally against turning Thornton into that sixth man type guy somewhere down the line if it becomes more obvious that that is the right move .. just not yet. Maybe Its wrong of me, but I believe in giving someone something when they deserve it. I think Thornton truly deserves to start right now based on what he did last season. Jimmer hasn't done enough to take that from him yet.